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Topic: Bir Tawil nation - page 2. (Read 6380 times)

sr. member
Activity: 294
Merit: 250
April 19, 2014, 06:43:01 AM
why not?

if we become self sufficient we could still pay our workers in bitcoin and they would purchase stuff in bitcoin Smiley

we could still grow weed in greenhouses Cheesy

besides we should start a project of terraformation on Mars, slowly but once it would be filled with oxygen Smiley
But what exactly would they buy with the bitcoins they earn? It's not that easy to trade with the earth. And those that don't earn enough, will they starve, with no other option to just leave and find something better?
And if they don't wanna work anymore, what happens then? Will we just kick them outside the base and let them die?

It also takes a very long time to terraform a planet. Extremely long time. It's also extremely expensive.
This whole project would cost very many billion dollars. And that is money that very few countries and companies can pay, and I'd guess they are not that interested in building a bitcoin paradise (with that delay) and keep it funded when the public has lost interest.
Sad to see the discussion drifting away to the dream zone.

The Bir Tawil nation is theoretically possible. If the Egypt and Sudan reaches an understanding about selling the disputed property, then it can be purchased by bitcoiners.

On the other hand, Antarctica should remain outside human interference according to the international treaties. There is no way on earth that the UN is allowing someone to settle there.
Yeah, but it's very unlikely that they would reach that agreement with todays situation. Also, then we'd have problems with water and food. And to keep the miners cold would be a problem.

I however, would also prefer to see Antarctica untouched.
UN would probably not accept it, but since military is illegal on Antarctica it would be very interesting to see what they would do! Tongue
legendary
Activity: 3752
Merit: 1217
April 19, 2014, 06:34:23 AM
Sad to see the discussion drifting away to the dream zone.

The Bir Tawil nation is theoretically possible. If the Egypt and Sudan reaches an understanding about selling the disputed property, then it can be purchased by bitcoiners.

On the other hand, Antarctica should remain outside human interference according to the international treaties. There is no way on earth that the UN is allowing someone to settle there.
newbie
Activity: 28
Merit: 0
April 19, 2014, 06:27:11 AM
Upset? for what? I just provided prof that it is not easy as he claims and you claim it is, scientific facts, actual data, not just opinions and in our conversation there was not a single mention of BirTawil so I don't understand why you are adding that here, Or rather I do but I'll let you explain your self on that matter

But let's answer the thing you are mentioning here.

1-Planes ? what kind of planes? helicopters on the fishing boats? light planes? heavy planes ?
a-Helicopters, if you assume the best conditions possible a helicopter range would 300-400Km that's no where reaching the base, if you consider the cargo weight, the windy cold conditions and lack of visibility on winter that range is way shorter and I'm sure I mentioned that the ice cap reaches over a thousands KM from the limite of the shore So no.
b-light plane: No for similar reasons once you have your heavy cargo they are going no where
c-Heavy plane: where are going to land it on tiny ice near the water where you are fishing? not happening, also ocean/sea ice doesn't make a smooth surface when frozen you can have ice blocks of several meters everywhere around
Ice vehicles? there are no Ice vehicles that can do such trip, and just to put things into perspective, Top gear prepared a vehicle to reach the 1996 North magnetic pole (which is no where near the physical north pole)  in Summer in perfect weather, took them 3 days to cover 320miles, with no cargo or anything they had a very flexible vehicle yet it took them that long. Winter is another story, for reference of ice cap grow by hundreds and thousands of KM during winter I'll let you image what that power can do to the rest of the environment and how things change on a daily basis

2-Most Sweden win farms are located south of the country proof : http://www.thewindpower.net/country_maps_en_17_sweden.php, Sweden is no where as cold as Antarctica heck there is no room for comparison here, the coldest part in Sweden are hotter in average than the hottest areas in Antarctica.
Here you go average temperature of Sweden cities http://www.sweden.climatemps.com/ the coldest average temperature in the most northern coldest city in Sweden is -2°C you are no where close the -20 -30 -40°C averages you get Antarctica
and for reference here are Stockholm temperature through the year : http://www.holiday-weather.com/stockholm/averages/

3- Yeah sure, you can heat it that's not the problem, the problem is lepirate claims he can be energy sufficient, your fishing boats, planes vehicles heating energy will come from what.....? and Just a reminder in winter (night) you are basically in total isolation due to the harsh conditions.

4-America does not claim any territory true, I think there was a confusion with Australia which claims almost half Antarctica.

Like I said before if it is to challenge once self with almost impossible technical problems why bother with Antarctica, aim high, aim better, and Mars is a much better target.

realistically speaking as I said from the beginning, if you want an unclaimed territory, it would be building an artificial island in international water! that's the only logical solution.
Of course there are other options like direct negotiation with a poor country to have a small slice of the land, but that's another argument which is politically tied, and I'm only discussing the technical stand point here
To be fair, lepirate repeatedly said that it would be easier to build on Antarctica than it would be to claim Bir Tawil or colonize Mars. He never claimed that it would be easy though. In fact, he claimed that it would be hard.

I'm not at all interested in discussing all technical details (basically because I'm not really read in on all technicalities), but the fact remains, it would be cheaper and easier to: Build the base, make it inhabitable, find the people willing to live there, make it self-sufficient.
Also, I think lepirate agreed on the artificial island thing earlier in this thread.

all of this is true but after all the hassle we need to compare positive sides of Mars and Antartica

both need a lot of work, Mars of course needs more since we would need to be self sufficient

but if we put a colony on Mars, we would be on every news on every television, for months, years

updates would be broadcasted worldwide, if we were to establish our own channel and broadcast it on Earth it would be one of the most watched channels

we would bring exposure to bitcoin like no one has ever saw

best advertising there could be!

just think about it..

we would be the first to put man on Mars, the first to establish a colony in outter space Cheesy

we would be famous, we would skyrocket not only our bitcoinauts but the bitcoins price too Cheesy
Yeah, but remember that once on Mars there's no way back (unless we develop return crafts as well, which would raise the price with a few more billions). Most people running from NSA and IRS will not be willing to do that.
Also, we would not have any use for bitcoins whilst on Mars anyway. There's nothing to buy there, so there would be no use of bitcoins, not even money (depends on the size of the colony).

With those things even the original idea is gone, with its freedom for bitcoiners and weed.
It would be cool with a colony on mars though.

why not?

if we become self sufficient we could still pay our workers in bitcoin and they would purchase stuff in bitcoin Smiley

we could still grow weed in greenhouses Cheesy

besides we should start a project of terraformation on Mars, slowly but once it would be filled with oxygen Smiley

about the gravity issue on humans

Quote
Carbon dioxide sublimation
There is presently enough carbon dioxide (CO2) as ice in the Martian south pole and absorbed by regolith (soil) on Mars that, if sublimated to gas by a climate warming of only a few degrees, would increase the atmospheric pressure to 30 kilopascals (0.30 atm), comparable to the altitude of the peak of Mount Everest, where the atmospheric pressure is 33.7 kilopascals (0.333 atm). Although this would not be breathable by humans, it is above the Armstrong limit and would eliminate the present need for pressure suits. Phytoplankton can also convert dissolved CO2 into oxygen, which is important because Mars's low temperature will, by Henry's law, lead to a high ratio of dissolved CO2 to atmospheric CO2 in the flooded[clarification needed] northern basin.

just warming the planet up a few degrees would make it's pressure same as Mt.Everest making us lose the space suits and walking around with only oxygen bags, something like scooba-diving without water Cheesy
sr. member
Activity: 294
Merit: 250
April 19, 2014, 06:01:12 AM
Upset? for what? I just provided prof that it is not easy as he claims and you claim it is, scientific facts, actual data, not just opinions and in our conversation there was not a single mention of BirTawil so I don't understand why you are adding that here, Or rather I do but I'll let you explain your self on that matter

But let's answer the thing you are mentioning here.

1-Planes ? what kind of planes? helicopters on the fishing boats? light planes? heavy planes ?
a-Helicopters, if you assume the best conditions possible a helicopter range would 300-400Km that's no where reaching the base, if you consider the cargo weight, the windy cold conditions and lack of visibility on winter that range is way shorter and I'm sure I mentioned that the ice cap reaches over a thousands KM from the limite of the shore So no.
b-light plane: No for similar reasons once you have your heavy cargo they are going no where
c-Heavy plane: where are going to land it on tiny ice near the water where you are fishing? not happening, also ocean/sea ice doesn't make a smooth surface when frozen you can have ice blocks of several meters everywhere around
Ice vehicles? there are no Ice vehicles that can do such trip, and just to put things into perspective, Top gear prepared a vehicle to reach the 1996 North magnetic pole (which is no where near the physical north pole)  in Summer in perfect weather, took them 3 days to cover 320miles, with no cargo or anything they had a very flexible vehicle yet it took them that long. Winter is another story, for reference of ice cap grow by hundreds and thousands of KM during winter I'll let you image what that power can do to the rest of the environment and how things change on a daily basis

2-Most Sweden win farms are located south of the country proof : http://www.thewindpower.net/country_maps_en_17_sweden.php, Sweden is no where as cold as Antarctica heck there is no room for comparison here, the coldest part in Sweden are hotter in average than the hottest areas in Antarctica.
Here you go average temperature of Sweden cities http://www.sweden.climatemps.com/ the coldest average temperature in the most northern coldest city in Sweden is -2°C you are no where close the -20 -30 -40°C averages you get Antarctica
and for reference here are Stockholm temperature through the year : http://www.holiday-weather.com/stockholm/averages/

3- Yeah sure, you can heat it that's not the problem, the problem is lepirate claims he can be energy sufficient, your fishing boats, planes vehicles heating energy will come from what.....? and Just a reminder in winter (night) you are basically in total isolation due to the harsh conditions.

4-America does not claim any territory true, I think there was a confusion with Australia which claims almost half Antarctica.

Like I said before if it is to challenge once self with almost impossible technical problems why bother with Antarctica, aim high, aim better, and Mars is a much better target.

realistically speaking as I said from the beginning, if you want an unclaimed territory, it would be building an artificial island in international water! that's the only logical solution.
Of course there are other options like direct negotiation with a poor country to have a small slice of the land, but that's another argument which is politically tied, and I'm only discussing the technical stand point here
To be fair, lepirate repeatedly said that it would be easier to build on Antarctica than it would be to claim Bir Tawil or colonize Mars. He never claimed that it would be easy though. In fact, he claimed that it would be hard.

I'm not at all interested in discussing all technical details (basically because I'm not really read in on all technicalities), but the fact remains, it would be cheaper and easier to: Build the base, make it inhabitable, find the people willing to live there, make it self-sufficient.
Also, I think lepirate agreed on the artificial island thing earlier in this thread.

all of this is true but after all the hassle we need to compare positive sides of Mars and Antartica

both need a lot of work, Mars of course needs more since we would need to be self sufficient

but if we put a colony on Mars, we would be on every news on every television, for months, years

updates would be broadcasted worldwide, if we were to establish our own channel and broadcast it on Earth it would be one of the most watched channels

we would bring exposure to bitcoin like no one has ever saw

best advertising there could be!

just think about it..

we would be the first to put man on Mars, the first to establish a colony in outter space Cheesy

we would be famous, we would skyrocket not only our bitcoinauts but the bitcoins price too Cheesy
Yeah, but remember that once on Mars there's no way back (unless we develop return crafts as well, which would raise the price with a few more billions). Most people running from NSA and IRS will not be willing to do that.
Also, we would not have any use for bitcoins whilst on Mars anyway. There's nothing to buy there, so there would be no use of bitcoins, not even money (depends on the size of the colony).

With those things even the original idea is gone, with its freedom for bitcoiners and weed.
It would be cool with a colony on mars though.
hero member
Activity: 588
Merit: 501
April 18, 2014, 08:30:20 PM
Good! you'll move the fleet you are just forgetting the thousand of KM of ice forming to get your fish from the edge of water to your station ? using trucks? not happening I'll tell you why with proof if you want to argue about this.

Wind power? your wind tubines won't last a day in the middle of winter it will be completely frozen!, your wave power infrastructure will be destroyed when winter comes (what does happen to water when it freeze? or let me simplify my question what does happen to full bottle of water if you put it in the freezer ?) Biogas, I'm telling you it's not an option I explained this with data, the only logical solution is to get and make huge fuel supply and resupply every summer

The average temperature in winter is around -26° in one of the hottest area there, right, but you build your station to cope with the worst situation or to cope with the average temperature? if you have 2 days of -60° what are you going to do? that's bad design and bad planing. You'll just remove ice? if only it was easy as that....you'll have ice all over the winter remember you have -26° degree average....

Cows can live just fine at 18°C I don't recall saying the opposite, but heating and keeping the temperature at 18 from -40 -30 -20°C is another story, I don't how you still believe that you can create a totally adiabatic isolated system, something if it was possible we would be doing for ages in our northen cities, cities in some of the richest countries in the world like Sweden or Norway, and countries like Canada or Russia where condition are no where as harsh as in  Antarctica and this is not the issue like I said if you want to create biogas, you need bacterial fermentation that beed 35°C.
And btw the only unclaimed area in south pole is this

Which is not as warm as the other areas and very harsh to reach and work on

Ground? what ground ? maybe you missed the part that in winter the ground is under meters dozens of meters in some areas the soil is hundrend of meters and kilometers deep and under ice as hard as rock?
I have to be on lepirates side in this one. All he was saying was that it would be easier to build a base on antarctica than Mars and Bir Tawil. And guess what? He's right! I've never seen him claim that he had all details. And you just seem to be upset that he criticized your Mars plan IMO.

Here are some solutions to all the problems you mention:
1. You can fly the fish over the ice. Also it can be transported over the ice with good machines. Another possibility is to have enough food stored for the winter months.

2. Wind turbines works just fine in cold, as long as they don't get covered in ice. The biggest wind power parks in Sweden is placed in the far north of this northern country. Winters there get extremely cold as well. All that needs to be done are some adjustments for the climate. Wave power generators though will break if they're still in the water when the ice comes. A solution would be to take them up for the winter. Bio gas can absolutely work, placed deep under the ground with some heavy isolation. Add some heat and it will produce. Remember that it's not as cold under the ground. And you came up with a solution as well, to save up a lot of fuel during the summers! That is also a good idea.

3. If it gets to cold it would just be to evacuate the top floor or heat it up even more. Not that complicated.

4. If I understand lepirates posts right his suggestion is to build it in the dry valleys. Which would not be in the unclaimed territory though.



Btw, America does not claim any parts of Antarctica, and doesn't recognize any other countries claims either.

Upset? for what? I just provided prof that it is not easy as he claims and you claim it is, scientific facts, actual data, not just opinions and in our conversation there was not a single mention of BirTawil so I don't understand why you are adding that here, Or rather I do but I'll let you explain your self on that matter

But let's answer the thing you are mentioning here.

1-Planes ? what kind of planes? helicopters on the fishing boats? light planes? heavy planes ?
a-Helicopters, if you assume the best conditions possible a helicopter range would 300-400Km that's no where reaching the base, if you consider the cargo weight, the windy cold conditions and lack of visibility on winter that range is way shorter and I'm sure I mentioned that the ice cap reaches over a thousands KM from the limite of the shore So no.
b-light plane: No for similar reasons once you have your heavy cargo they are going no where
c-Heavy plane: where are going to land it on tiny ice near the water where you are fishing? not happening, also ocean/sea ice doesn't make a smooth surface when frozen you can have ice blocks of several meters everywhere around
Ice vehicles? there are no Ice vehicles that can do such trip, and just to put things into perspective, Top gear prepared a vehicle to reach the 1996 North magnetic pole (which is no where near the physical north pole)  in Summer in perfect weather, took them 3 days to cover 320miles, with no cargo or anything they had a very flexible vehicle yet it took them that long. Winter is another story, for reference of ice cap grow by hundreds and thousands of KM during winter I'll let you image what that power can do to the rest of the environment and how things change on a daily basis

2-Most Sweden win farms are located south of the country proof : http://www.thewindpower.net/country_maps_en_17_sweden.php, Sweden is no where as cold as Antarctica heck there is no room for comparison here, the coldest part in Sweden are hotter in average than the hottest areas in Antarctica.
Here you go average temperature of Sweden cities http://www.sweden.climatemps.com/ the coldest average temperature in the most northern coldest city in Sweden is -2°C you are no where close the -20 -30 -40°C averages you get Antarctica
and for reference here are Stockholm temperature through the year : http://www.holiday-weather.com/stockholm/averages/

3- Yeah sure, you can heat it that's not the problem, the problem is lepirate claims he can be energy sufficient, your fishing boats, planes vehicles heating energy will come from what.....? and Just a reminder in winter (night) you are basically in total isolation due to the harsh conditions.

4-America does not claim any territory true, I think there was a confusion with Australia which claims almost half Antarctica.

Like I said before if it is to challenge once self with almost impossible technical problems why bother with Antarctica, aim high, aim better, and Mars is a much better target.

realistically speaking as I said from the beginning, if you want an unclaimed territory, it would be building an artificial island in international water! that's the only logical solution.
Of course there are other options like direct negotiation with a poor country to have a small slice of the land, but that's another argument which is politically tied, and I'm only discussing the technical stand point here
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 101
April 18, 2014, 07:06:18 PM
Good! you'll move the fleet you are just forgetting the thousand of KM of ice forming to get your fish from the edge of water to your station ? using trucks? not happening I'll tell you why with proof if you want to argue about this.

Wind power? your wind tubines won't last a day in the middle of winter it will be completely frozen!, your wave power infrastructure will be destroyed when winter comes (what does happen to water when it freeze? or let me simplify my question what does happen to full bottle of water if you put it in the freezer ?) Biogas, I'm telling you it's not an option I explained this with data, the only logical solution is to get and make huge fuel supply and resupply every summer

The average temperature in winter is around -26° in one of the hottest area there, right, but you build your station to cope with the worst situation or to cope with the average temperature? if you have 2 days of -60° what are you going to do? that's bad design and bad planing. You'll just remove ice? if only it was easy as that....you'll have ice all over the winter remember you have -26° degree average....

Cows can live just fine at 18°C I don't recall saying the opposite, but heating and keeping the temperature at 18 from -40 -30 -20°C is another story, I don't how you still believe that you can create a totally adiabatic isolated system, something if it was possible we would be doing for ages in our northen cities, cities in some of the richest countries in the world like Sweden or Norway, and countries like Canada or Russia where condition are no where as harsh as in  Antarctica and this is not the issue like I said if you want to create biogas, you need bacterial fermentation that beed 35°C.
And btw the only unclaimed area in south pole is this

Which is not as warm as the other areas and very harsh to reach and work on

Ground? what ground ? maybe you missed the part that in winter the ground is under meters dozens of meters in some areas the soil is hundrend of meters and kilometers deep and under ice as hard as rock?
I have to be on lepirates side in this one. All he was saying was that it would be easier to build a base on antarctica than Mars and Bir Tawil. And guess what? He's right! I've never seen him claim that he had all details. And you just seem to be upset that he criticized your Mars plan IMO.

Here are some solutions to all the problems you mention:
1. You can fly the fish over the ice. Also it can be transported over the ice with good machines. Another possibility is to have enough food stored for the winter months.

2. Wind turbines works just fine in cold, as long as they don't get covered in ice. The biggest wind power parks in Sweden is placed in the far north of this northern country. Winters there get extremely cold as well. All that needs to be done are some adjustments for the climate. Wave power generators though will break if they're still in the water when the ice comes. A solution would be to take them up for the winter. Bio gas can absolutely work, placed deep under the ground with some heavy isolation. Add some heat and it will produce. Remember that it's not as cold under the ground. And you came up with a solution as well, to save up a lot of fuel during the summers! That is also a good idea.

3. If it gets to cold it would just be to evacuate the top floor or heat it up even more. Not that complicated.

4. If I understand lepirates posts right his suggestion is to build it in the dry valleys. Which would not be in the unclaimed territory though.



Btw, America does not claim any parts of Antarctica, and doesn't recognize any other countries claims either.

all of this is true but after all the hassle we need to compare positive sides of Mars and Antartica

both need a lot of work, Mars of course needs more since we would need to be self sufficient

but if we put a colony on Mars, we would be on every news on every television, for months, years

updates would be broadcasted worldwide, if we were to establish our own channel and broadcast it on Earth it would be one of the most watched channels

we would bring exposure to bitcoin like no one has ever saw

best advertising there could be!

just think about it..

we would be the first to put man on Mars, the first to establish a colony in outter space Cheesy

we would be famous, we would skyrocket not only our bitcoinauts but the bitcoins price too Cheesy
sr. member
Activity: 294
Merit: 250
April 18, 2014, 06:49:58 PM
Good! you'll move the fleet you are just forgetting the thousand of KM of ice forming to get your fish from the edge of water to your station ? using trucks? not happening I'll tell you why with proof if you want to argue about this.

Wind power? your wind tubines won't last a day in the middle of winter it will be completely frozen!, your wave power infrastructure will be destroyed when winter comes (what does happen to water when it freeze? or let me simplify my question what does happen to full bottle of water if you put it in the freezer ?) Biogas, I'm telling you it's not an option I explained this with data, the only logical solution is to get and make huge fuel supply and resupply every summer

The average temperature in winter is around -26° in one of the hottest area there, right, but you build your station to cope with the worst situation or to cope with the average temperature? if you have 2 days of -60° what are you going to do? that's bad design and bad planing. You'll just remove ice? if only it was easy as that....you'll have ice all over the winter remember you have -26° degree average....

Cows can live just fine at 18°C I don't recall saying the opposite, but heating and keeping the temperature at 18 from -40 -30 -20°C is another story, I don't how you still believe that you can create a totally adiabatic isolated system, something if it was possible we would be doing for ages in our northen cities, cities in some of the richest countries in the world like Sweden or Norway, and countries like Canada or Russia where condition are no where as harsh as in  Antarctica and this is not the issue like I said if you want to create biogas, you need bacterial fermentation that beed 35°C.
And btw the only unclaimed area in south pole is this

Which is not as warm as the other areas and very harsh to reach and work on

Ground? what ground ? maybe you missed the part that in winter the ground is under meters dozens of meters in some areas the soil is hundrend of meters and kilometers deep and under ice as hard as rock?
I have to be on lepirates side in this one. All he was saying was that it would be easier to build a base on antarctica than Mars and Bir Tawil. And guess what? He's right! I've never seen him claim that he had all details. And you just seem to be upset that he criticized your Mars plan IMO.

Here are some solutions to all the problems you mention:
1. You can fly the fish over the ice. Also it can be transported over the ice with good machines. Another possibility is to have enough food stored for the winter months.

2. Wind turbines works just fine in cold, as long as they don't get covered in ice. The biggest wind power parks in Sweden is placed in the far north of this northern country. Winters there get extremely cold as well. All that needs to be done are some adjustments for the climate. Wave power generators though will break if they're still in the water when the ice comes. A solution would be to take them up for the winter. Bio gas can absolutely work, placed deep under the ground with some heavy isolation. Add some heat and it will produce. Remember that it's not as cold under the ground. And you came up with a solution as well, to save up a lot of fuel during the summers! That is also a good idea.

3. If it gets to cold it would just be to evacuate the top floor or heat it up even more. Not that complicated.

4. If I understand lepirates posts right his suggestion is to build it in the dry valleys. Which would not be in the unclaimed territory though.



Btw, America does not claim any parts of Antarctica, and doesn't recognize any other countries claims either.
hero member
Activity: 588
Merit: 501
April 18, 2014, 02:30:37 PM
bitcoin of course but not only bitcoin Cheesy

lol okey you agree then ^.^ so Island in international waters?
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 101
April 18, 2014, 01:10:53 PM
#99
lol, I'm the original poster, how can you tell me what was my mission? Cheesy

Maybe I misinterpreted something but reading this
So I'v seen a few threads about building a bitcoin island

But the only territory that is unclaimed except for Antartica territories is Bir Tawil

It's basically sand, nothing else

Then reading the Island thread which is talking about an independent country or are where bitcoin will be the currency of choice.

but if it is not the case, let me ask something why anyone would go trough the hassle to get somewhere unclaimed to produce bitcoin? there is no country in the world that prevents you for doing so, I fail to see the point -.- if it is to have an independent territory free to make dah bitcoin country



because of no taxes Cheesy

you seem not to understand how much money you actually lose due to paying taxes Cheesy

tax havens? many countries regions, don't tax bitcoin and don't taxes on properties and stuff like that
We want absolutely no taxes and bitcoin as official currency

Horray ! so we agree that this is the whole point here right ! but you said no -.-
when did I say no? Cheesy

hmm
Quote
no it's not only bitcoin, is own country on which you can have your legislation, where bitcoin will be the currency of choice I suppose ^^

lol, I'm the original poster, how can you tell me what was my mission? Cheesy

lol -.-

bitcoin of course but not only bitcoin Cheesy
legendary
Activity: 3752
Merit: 1217
April 18, 2014, 01:07:40 PM
#98
The Sudanese won't risk war for a bunch of sand

May be you could make that sure by bribing them. The problem is you need at least one of the neighbors to be in friendly terms. There is no sea coast. So you will have to depend on the two neighbors to get all the stuff you need.
hero member
Activity: 588
Merit: 501
April 18, 2014, 12:49:51 PM
#97
lol, I'm the original poster, how can you tell me what was my mission? Cheesy

Maybe I misinterpreted something but reading this
So I'v seen a few threads about building a bitcoin island

But the only territory that is unclaimed except for Antartica territories is Bir Tawil

It's basically sand, nothing else

Then reading the Island thread which is talking about an independent country or are where bitcoin will be the currency of choice.

but if it is not the case, let me ask something why anyone would go trough the hassle to get somewhere unclaimed to produce bitcoin? there is no country in the world that prevents you for doing so, I fail to see the point -.- if it is to have an independent territory free to make dah bitcoin country



because of no taxes Cheesy

you seem not to understand how much money you actually lose due to paying taxes Cheesy

tax havens? many countries regions, don't tax bitcoin and don't taxes on properties and stuff like that
We want absolutely no taxes and bitcoin as official currency

Horray ! so we agree that this is the whole point here right ! but you said no -.-
when did I say no? Cheesy

hmm
Quote
no it's not only bitcoin, is own country on which you can have your legislation, where bitcoin will be the currency of choice I suppose ^^

lol, I'm the original poster, how can you tell me what was my mission? Cheesy

lol -.-
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 101
April 18, 2014, 12:15:56 PM
#96
lol, I'm the original poster, how can you tell me what was my mission? Cheesy

Maybe I misinterpreted something but reading this
So I'v seen a few threads about building a bitcoin island

But the only territory that is unclaimed except for Antartica territories is Bir Tawil

It's basically sand, nothing else

Then reading the Island thread which is talking about an independent country or are where bitcoin will be the currency of choice.

but if it is not the case, let me ask something why anyone would go trough the hassle to get somewhere unclaimed to produce bitcoin? there is no country in the world that prevents you for doing so, I fail to see the point -.- if it is to have an independent territory free to make dah bitcoin country



because of no taxes Cheesy

you seem not to understand how much money you actually lose due to paying taxes Cheesy

tax havens? many countries regions, don't tax bitcoin and don't taxes on properties and stuff like that
We want absolutely no taxes and bitcoin as official currency

Horray ! so we agree that this is the whole point here right ! but you said no -.-

when did I say no? Cheesy

I think he said we should go on the american part since soldiers are forbidden here they couldn't do anything about it

Army is forbidden on Antarctica, doesn't mean the US will let you do whatever you want there and won't bring the right people to get of there, not to mention that the American is legally under US juridiction and US laws apply there or did I miss something here

tell it to lepirate, he's the one supporting the theory Cheesy
hero member
Activity: 588
Merit: 501
April 18, 2014, 12:03:02 PM
#95
I think he said we should go on the american part since soldiers are forbidden here they couldn't do anything about it

Army is forbidden on Antarctica, doesn't mean the US will let you do whatever you want there and won't bring the right people to get you of there, not to mention that the American is legally under US juridiction and US laws apply there or did I miss something here
hero member
Activity: 588
Merit: 501
April 18, 2014, 12:00:47 PM
#94
lol, I'm the original poster, how can you tell me what was my mission? Cheesy

Maybe I misinterpreted something but reading this
So I'v seen a few threads about building a bitcoin island

But the only territory that is unclaimed except for Antartica territories is Bir Tawil

It's basically sand, nothing else

Then reading the Island thread which is talking about an independent country or are where bitcoin will be the currency of choice.

but if it is not the case, let me ask something why anyone would go trough the hassle to get somewhere unclaimed to produce bitcoin? there is no country in the world that prevents you for doing so, I fail to see the point -.- if it is to have an independent territory free to make dah bitcoin country



because of no taxes Cheesy

you seem not to understand how much money you actually lose due to paying taxes Cheesy

tax havens? many countries regions, don't tax bitcoin and don't taxes on properties and stuff like that
We want absolutely no taxes and bitcoin as official currency

Horray ! so we agree that this is the whole point here right ! but you said no -.-
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 101
April 18, 2014, 11:59:59 AM
#93
Coastal area ? what coast are you speaking about you do understand that in winter the land scape changes completely with icecaps growing by hundred of miles and that the supposed cost area becomes hundreds if not thousands of miles away of the liquid water? so anything related to fishing or tyde energy is impossible not only you aren't answering the energy issue we are talking about here I have the feeling that you are really underestimating Antarctica (and why scientist are having a hard time there despite the millions of dollars budgets)
here you go :



Also when it comes to temperatures, McMurdo antarctic base which is coastal and located in one of the warmest if not the warmest area in Antarctica  the temperature can reach -50°C -60°C, the winter doesn't hit in one go, hence the mean temperature is as high as -28°C but that doesn't mean that there aren't days where the temperatures as low -60°C, as for winds blizzards and such, please, .... Antarctica is very windy place, since there aren't much mountains to block the wind(the continent mountains are under ice)

As for biogas.....let's discuss some facts so you know what you are talking about.....You need a 35°C in the digester to decompose waste into biogas.
Biogas is very hard to store as it is very hard to liquify but more importantly 50Cows, would produce the equivalent of 50L of fuel everyday, I don't know if you can put it in perspective, the amount of space and energy needed to give 50 cows a living environnement in Antartica would use more than those 50L of fuel per day I'm not even talking about feeding them (you can also use human waste and organic food waste but it's no where near what cows produce) so no biogas is not an option here. maybe you have other solution you didn't present yet so feel free to share


While you do have a point that the ice expands during the winters, but then, that just means that our fishing fleet will have to move further away from land. Pretty simple as well.
Wave power might be a problem in the winters, but we'd just have to compensate that with more wind power and biogas.

I can neither see the point that on that "some days it can go as low as -50°C to -60°C". The average temprature is mid winter −26°C. That's what we have to start from.
Thanks to all that wind we can get energy btw. The turbines could become covered in snow and ice during these blizzards, but when that happens we'd just have to go on our backup system with stored energy. When the blizzard is over we'd just have to remove the ice. The population needs to do something anyway.

Cows don't need very high temperatures, if we can keep the place on about 18°C it will work. And keeping something about 18°C under ground, especially with cows that themselves emit heat, is not that hard.
And then we'd just need to build the digester deep under the ground, heat it up, and there, no problems.
Good! you'll move the fleet you are just forgetting the thousand of KM of ice forming to get your fish from the edge of water to your station ? using trucks? not happening I'll tell you why with proof if you want to argue about this.

Wind power? your wind tubines won't last a day in the middle of winter it will be completely frozen!, your wave power infrastructure will be destroyed when winter comes (what does happen to water when it freeze? or let me simplify my question what does happen to full bottle of water if you put it in the freezer ?) Biogas, I'm telling you it's not an option I explained this with data, the only logical solution is to get and make huge fuel supply and resupply every summer

The average temperature in winter is around -26° in one of the hottest area there, right, but you build your station to cope with the worst situation or to cope with the average temperature? if you have 2 days of -60° what are you going to do? that's bad design and bad planing. You'll just remove ice? if only it was easy as that....you'll have ice all over the winter remember you have -26° degree average....

Cows can live just fine at 18°C I don't recall saying the opposite, but heating and keeping the temperature at 18 from -40 -30 -20°C is another story, I don't how you still believe that you can create a totally adiabatic isolated system, something if it was possible we would be doing for ages in our northen cities, cities in some of the richest countries in the world like Sweden or Norway, and countries like Canada or Russia where condition are no where as harsh as in  Antarctica and this is not the issue like I said if you want to create biogas, you need bacterial fermentation that beed 35°C.
And btw the only unclaimed area in south pole is this

Which is not as warm as the other areas and very harsh to reach and work on

Ground? what ground ? maybe you missed the part that in winter the ground is under meters dozens of meters in some areas the soil is hundrend of meters and kilometers deep and under ice as hard as rock?

I think he said we should go on the american part since soldiers are forbidden here they couldn't do anything about it
hero member
Activity: 588
Merit: 501
April 18, 2014, 11:48:52 AM
#92
Coastal area ? what coast are you speaking about you do understand that in winter the land scape changes completely with icecaps growing by hundred of miles and that the supposed cost area becomes hundreds if not thousands of miles away of the liquid water? so anything related to fishing or tyde energy is impossible not only you aren't answering the energy issue we are talking about here I have the feeling that you are really underestimating Antarctica (and why scientist are having a hard time there despite the millions of dollars budgets)
here you go :



Also when it comes to temperatures, McMurdo antarctic base which is coastal and located in one of the warmest if not the warmest area in Antarctica  the temperature can reach -50°C -60°C, the winter doesn't hit in one go, hence the mean temperature is as high as -28°C but that doesn't mean that there aren't days where the temperatures as low -60°C, as for winds blizzards and such, please, .... Antarctica is very windy place, since there aren't much mountains to block the wind(the continent mountains are under ice)

As for biogas.....let's discuss some facts so you know what you are talking about.....You need a 35°C in the digester to decompose waste into biogas.
Biogas is very hard to store as it is very hard to liquify but more importantly 50Cows, would produce the equivalent of 50L of fuel everyday, I don't know if you can put it in perspective, the amount of space and energy needed to give 50 cows a living environnement in Antartica would use more than those 50L of fuel per day I'm not even talking about feeding them (you can also use human waste and organic food waste but it's no where near what cows produce) so no biogas is not an option here. maybe you have other solution you didn't present yet so feel free to share


While you do have a point that the ice expands during the winters, but then, that just means that our fishing fleet will have to move further away from land. Pretty simple as well.
Wave power might be a problem in the winters, but we'd just have to compensate that with more wind power and biogas.

I can neither see the point that on that "some days it can go as low as -50°C to -60°C". The average temprature is mid winter −26°C. That's what we have to start from.
Thanks to all that wind we can get energy btw. The turbines could become covered in snow and ice during these blizzards, but when that happens we'd just have to go on our backup system with stored energy. When the blizzard is over we'd just have to remove the ice. The population needs to do something anyway.

Cows don't need very high temperatures, if we can keep the place on about 18°C it will work. And keeping something about 18°C under ground, especially with cows that themselves emit heat, is not that hard.
And then we'd just need to build the digester deep under the ground, heat it up, and there, no problems.
Good! you'll move the fleet you are just forgetting the thousand of KM of ice forming to get your fish from the edge of water to your station ? using trucks? not happening I'll tell you why with proof if you want to argue about this.

Wind power? your wind tubines won't last a day in the middle of winter it will be completely frozen!, your wave power infrastructure will be destroyed when winter comes (what does happen to water when it freeze? or let me simplify my question what does happen to full bottle of water if you put it in the freezer ?) Biogas, I'm telling you it's not an option I explained this with data, the only logical solution is to get and make huge fuel supply and resupply every summer

The average temperature in winter is around -26° in one of the hottest area there, right, but you build your station to cope with the worst situation or to cope with the average temperature? if you have 2 days of -60° what are you going to do? that's bad design and bad planing. You'll just remove ice? if only it was easy as that....you'll have ice all over the winter remember you have -26° degree average....

Cows can live just fine at 18°C I don't recall saying the opposite, but heating and keeping the temperature at 18 from -40 -30 -20°C is another story, I don't how you still believe that you can create a totally adiabatic isolated system, something if it was possible we would be doing for ages in our northen cities, cities in some of the richest countries in the world like Sweden or Norway, and countries like Canada or Russia where condition are no where as harsh as in  Antarctica and this is not the issue like I said if you want to create biogas, you need bacterial fermentation that beed 35°C.
And btw the only unclaimed area in south pole is this

Which is not as warm as the other areas and very harsh to reach and work on

Ground? what ground ? maybe you missed the part that in winter the ground is under meters dozens of meters in some areas the soil is hundrend of meters and kilometers deep and under ice as hard as rock?
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 101
April 18, 2014, 11:19:17 AM
#91
lol, I'm the original poster, how can you tell me what was my mission? Cheesy

Maybe I misinterpreted something but reading this
So I'v seen a few threads about building a bitcoin island

But the only territory that is unclaimed except for Antartica territories is Bir Tawil

It's basically sand, nothing else

Then reading the Island thread which is talking about an independent country or are where bitcoin will be the currency of choice.

but if it is not the case, let me ask something why anyone would go trough the hassle to get somewhere unclaimed to produce bitcoin? there is no country in the world that prevents you for doing so, I fail to see the point -.- if it is to have an independant terrertory free to make dah bitcoin country



because of no taxes Cheesy

you seem not to understand how much money you actually lose due to paying taxes Cheesy

tax havens? many countries regions, don't tax bitcoin and don't taxes on properties and stuff like that
We want absolutely no taxes and bitcoin as official currency
hero member
Activity: 588
Merit: 501
April 18, 2014, 11:14:51 AM
#90
lol, I'm the original poster, how can you tell me what was my mission? Cheesy

Maybe I misinterpreted something but reading this
So I'v seen a few threads about building a bitcoin island

But the only territory that is unclaimed except for Antartica territories is Bir Tawil

It's basically sand, nothing else

Then reading the Island thread which is talking about an independent country or are where bitcoin will be the currency of choice.

but if it is not the case, let me ask something why anyone would go trough the hassle to get somewhere unclaimed to produce bitcoin? there is no country in the world that prevents you for doing so, I fail to see the point -.- if it is to have an independant terrertory free to make dah bitcoin country



because of no taxes Cheesy

you seem not to understand how much money you actually lose due to paying taxes Cheesy

tax havens? many countries regions, don't tax bitcoin and don't taxes on properties and stuff like that
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 101
April 18, 2014, 11:10:52 AM
#89
Coastal area ? what coast are you speaking about you do understand that in winter the land scape changes completely with icecaps growing by hundred of miles and that the supposed cost area becomes hundreds if not thousands of miles away of the liquid water? so anything related to fishing or tyde energy is impossible not only you aren't answering the energy issue we are talking about here I have the feeling that you are really underestimating Antarctica (and why scientist are having a hard time there despite the millions of dollars budgets)
here you go :



Also when it comes to temperatures, McMurdo antarctic base which is coastal and located in one of the warmest if not the warmest area in Antarctica  the temperature can reach -50°C -60°C, the winter doesn't hit in one go, hence the mean temperature is as high as -28°C but that doesn't mean that there aren't days where the temperatures as low -60°C, as for winds blizzards and such, please, .... Antarctica is very windy place, since there aren't much mountains to block the wind(the continent mountains are under ice)

As for biogas.....let's discuss some facts so you know what you are talking about.....You need a 35°C in the digester to decompose waste into biogas.
Biogas is very hard to store as it is very hard to liquify but more importantly 50Cows, would produce the equivalent of 50L of fuel everyday, I don't know if you can put it in perspective, the amount of space and energy needed to give 50 cows a living environnement in Antartica would use more than those 50L of fuel per day I'm not even talking about feeding them (you can also use human waste and organic food waste but it's no where near what cows produce) so no biogas is not an option here. maybe you have other solution you didn't present yet so feel free to share


While you do have a point that the ice expands during the winters, but then, that just means that our fishing fleet will have to move further away from land. Pretty simple as well.
Wave power might be a problem in the winters, but we'd just have to compensate that with more wind power and biogas.

I can neither see the point that on that "some days it can go as low as -50°C to -60°C". The average temprature is mid winter −26°C. That's what we have to start from.
Thanks to all that wind we can get energy btw. The turbines could become covered in snow and ice during these blizzards, but when that happens we'd just have to go on our backup system with stored energy. When the blizzard is over we'd just have to remove the ice. The population needs to do something anyway.

Cows don't need very high temperatures, if we can keep the place on about 18°C it will work. And keeping something about 18°C under ground, especially with cows that themselves emit heat, is not that hard.
And then we'd just need to build the digester deep under the ground, heat it up, and there, no problems.


By undrground you mean under ice?
We won't be able to reach the ground
It's several kilometers deep
If we do it on the no ice areas as you say, we will get
trapped when the winter comes
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 101
April 18, 2014, 11:05:47 AM
#88
the region is filled with Egyptian soldiers
so our plan is to persuade the Egyptian goverment to let us form a country that will be under complete authority of Egypt
points I have made are a few pages back from importing their products to tourist benefits..

The last time I heard, Sudan and Egypt were not in good terms with each other. So even if you somehow persuade Egypt, I don't think the Sudanese will agree to cede the territory.  Grin

The Sudanese won't risk war for a bunch of sand
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