Topic: [Boxing] Nonito Donaire vs Alejandro Santiago for WBC bantamweight title - page 11. (Read 4344 times)

Quote from: Kelvinid on July 07, 2023, 07:10:46 AM

And to think, maybe Moloney can indeed evade Donaire for good because there are other vacant belts that needs to be possessed and given the latter's situation, he might not last that long in the industry where he can fight Moloney and be the undisputed champion while there are no boxers that are much stronger than him.

That doesn't sound good; a champion evading his fellow champion gives the impression that he doesn't want to achieve the ultimate success of being the best of the best. If only champions were required for a unification fight, we would certainly witness an entertaining matchup. As it stands, Moloney can cherry-pick opponents to maintain his championship status.

If only that is how this industry works, we probably had some champions who are only the best of their divisions and are truly strong compared to the others who failed in climbing the ladder because they will no longer have the choice to select an opponent as they will have to fight anybody who are trying to replace them in their own throne. But that's just too good to be true because we all know that it's not how the industry works, the leverage gives them an advantage to maintain their status even without fighting somebody who is indeed a lot more stronger than them and by now, it's not that new as we have know some of them.

It's business now and they are looking for a fight that can give them more money, and then less risk high rewards. Maybe for Moloney this is high risk for them and his team will have to find excuses to stay away from Donaire which they did and then go on easy fight to win the vacated belt. So good strategy by his camp for this one. Unlike in the 80's, maybe the era for most of us here who started to watch boxing. And then we see those legendary fights, even trilogy just to settle the score. Now it's a totally different era. And we really don't know who is really the best in the division unless they face each other.

Now it's more on the business side and somehow, we can say that most of these boxers got their books and lessons from Mayweather Jr. because the renowned boxing champion maintained his glory days while also executing some of the tricks to retain his status and be undefeated until the day he retired, but the trouble is, we cannot say that he was really unstoppable during his time because he evaded some of them and then fought some boxers when they are already approaching the retirement phase.

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Quote from: btc_angela on July 06, 2023, 05:49:49 PM

Unlike in the 80's, maybe the era for most of us here who started to watch boxing. And then we see those legendary fights, even trilogy just to settle the score. Now it's a totally different era. And we really don't know who is really the best in the division unless they face each other.

The world has really changed; everything now is only about the money. Well, boxing is a form of entertainment, and those who entertain the people get paid. So, it's understandable that some boxers would evade opponents they think are hard to beat. That way, they can stay in the business for a long time and continue to make money. Nowadays, pride has already been replaced with price.

And because of it, many people branded boxing as a dying sport. I for one have been disappointed a lot of times especially when fights are not being made of some fighters waited too much until their rivals are out of their prime. And yet, it is a fact that the purse involved in boxing is growing bigger than ever which means the sport is very much alive although it is becoming more of a business aspect. There were even years when Manny Pacquiao and Floyd Mayweather Jr. became the highest-paid athletes. And prior to Ronaldo's insane offer from Saudi, boxing's biggest superstars can easily become the highest-paid athletes if they fight 3 to 4 times per year.

In this division, I am confident that WBA Takuma Inoue and WBO Jason Moloney are willing to unify the belts to determine the next undisputed champion. The same with Donaire if he wins against Santiago for the WBC diadem. Not sure about the IBF though, Rodriguez is expected to become champion again and he is with PBC.

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Quote from: Kelvinid on July 07, 2023, 07:10:46 AM

Quote from: btc_angela on July 06, 2023, 05:49:49 PM

Unlike in the 80's, maybe the era for most of us here who started to watch boxing. And then we see those legendary fights, even trilogy just to settle the score. Now it's a totally different era. And we really don't know who is really the best in the division unless they face each other.

The world has really changed; everything now is only about the money. Well, boxing is a form of entertainment, and those who entertain the people get paid. So, it's understandable that some boxers would evade opponents they think are hard to beat. That way, they can stay in the business for a long time and continue to make money. Nowadays, pride has already been replaced with price.

You have to accept the reality because it's the promoter that is dictating the fight now, and there have been some kind of politics happening, as even the governing bodies are not independent enough. There are still financial aspects involved with promoters. Let's just hope that Moloney will be forced to fight a challenger who has the capability of beating him. It would be a shame for him to lose to a fighter who isn't even a champion. That's the kind of price he would pay if he continues to evade Donaire.

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Quote from: btc_angela on July 06, 2023, 05:49:49 PM

Unlike in the 80's, maybe the era for most of us here who started to watch boxing. And then we see those legendary fights, even trilogy just to settle the score. Now it's a totally different era. And we really don't know who is really the best in the division unless they face each other.

The world has really changed; everything now is only about the money. Well, boxing is a form of entertainment, and those who entertain the people get paid. So, it's understandable that some boxers would evade opponents they think are hard to beat. That way, they can stay in the business for a long time and continue to make money. Nowadays, pride has already been replaced with price.

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Quote from: Kasabus on July 05, 2023, 09:59:44 AM

Quote from: Kasabus on July 05, 2023, 09:59:44 AM

And to think, maybe Moloney can indeed evade Donaire for good because there are other vacant belts that needs to be possessed and given the latter's situation, he might not last that long in the industry where he can fight Moloney and be the undisputed champion while there are no boxers that are much stronger than him.

That doesn't sound good; a champion evading his fellow champion gives the impression that he doesn't want to achieve the ultimate success of being the best of the best. If only champions were required for a unification fight, we would certainly witness an entertaining matchup. As it stands, Moloney can cherry-pick opponents to maintain his championship status.

If only that is how this industry works, we probably had some champions who are only the best of their divisions and are truly strong compared to the others who failed in climbing the ladder because they will no longer have the choice to select an opponent as they will have to fight anybody who are trying to replace them in their own throne. But that's just too good to be true because we all know that it's not how the industry works, the leverage gives them an advantage to maintain their status even without fighting somebody who is indeed a lot more stronger than them and by now, it's not that new as we have know some of them.

It's business now and they are looking for a fight that can give them more money, and then less risk high rewards. Maybe for Moloney this is high risk for them and his team will have to find excuses to stay away from Donaire which they did and then go on easy fight to win the vacated belt. So good strategy by his camp for this one. Unlike in the 80's, maybe the era for most of us here who started to watch boxing. And then we see those legendary fights, even trilogy just to settle the score. Now it's a totally different era. And we really don't know who is really the best in the division unless they face each other.

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Quote from: Sanitough on July 05, 2023, 07:54:00 AM

And to think, maybe Moloney can indeed evade Donaire for good because there are other vacant belts that needs to be possessed and given the latter's situation, he might not last that long in the industry where he can fight Moloney and be the undisputed champion while there are no boxers that are much stronger than him.

That doesn't sound good; a champion evading his fellow champion gives the impression that he doesn't want to achieve the ultimate success of being the best of the best. If only champions were required for a unification fight, we would certainly witness an entertaining matchup. As it stands, Moloney can cherry-pick opponents to maintain his championship status.

If only that is how this industry works, we probably had some champions who are only the best of their divisions and are truly strong compared to the others who failed in climbing the ladder because they will no longer have the choice to select an opponent as they will have to fight anybody who are trying to replace them in their own throne. But that's just too good to be true because we all know that it's not how the industry works, the leverage gives them an advantage to maintain their status even without fighting somebody who is indeed a lot more stronger than them and by now, it's not that new as we have know some of them.

More on the money that involves and how the handler will keep the edge of his fighter, if there's a certain rule that will require
champion to unify every belt from each division, then we might see the greatness of each title holder.

But it's not on our hands, it's on the organization and as how we are witnessing them handling the situation, they are giving the edge
to whoever generated a good amount of money.

As to the point that they allow to cherry-pick for a fight and continue making more money from this sport.

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Quote from: btc_angela on July 05, 2023, 07:44:28 AM

Quote from: Sanitough on July 04, 2023, 09:24:39 AM

That's how favored he is to win this fight. If we could aim for a KO victory, I believe the odds would be even higher, so we shouldn't hesitate to take that opportunity. It's rare to see Donaire face a boxer whom he could clearly dominate. The odds may not be attractive, but I have great confidence in Donaire winning the fight, perhaps within the first three rounds. Who would dare to risk betting on that?

Maybe because right now, he is not the kind of boxer he was in his prime, and obviously Santiago is the only boxer he can dominate and not the other contenders in the high rank anymore. Let's just see how the old Donaire will handle this fight after coming from a devastating loss against Inoue and what kinds of skills he still has to show Santiago in this fight because if he hasn't been training some new skills, then Santiago will easily win this fight because of knowing all his moves already unless Donaire is fully ready and have the plan to knock him out.

Bookies would not make him a heavy favorite if people didn't believe in Donaire's capability anymore. While he did suffer a TKO against Inoue, it's important to note that Inoue has been dominating anyone who dares to challenge him. This is a fresh start for Donaire since the belts have all been vacated with Inoue moving up to the super bantamweight division.

Yes, I like that term, 'fresh start' for Nonito and hopefully this is just the beginning for another of his reign as Inoue is no longer here.
So we will see how far Donaire can go, if he beats Santiago then he will have to defend it sooner or later against another young guys in the division. And there is a potential as well as it could be against another Filipino in Reymart Gaballo.

But let's not get ahead of ourselves, not a couple of weeks and we will see again Nonito and for sure he will be up to the challenge once more.

I hope we don't witness another Filipino boxer suffering at the hands of Donaire. If he wins this fight, it would be great to see a unification match next. Considering that Donaire is not getting any younger, he cannot afford to waste time. He needs to pursue more achievements, and a unification fight would be a great start.

Hopefully we will not witness that while Donaire is still active in the sport but considering the situation of the division now, it is kind of blurry to see another Filipino boxer along the way because among all four belts in the weight class, only the IBF is vacant and as far as I know it doesn't have any upcoming fights.

Now if Donaire will pursue a unification fight, he got two choices, the WBO who belongs to Moloney or the WBA who belongs to Takuma Inoue (Naoya's younger brother).

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Quote from: btc_angela on July 05, 2023, 07:44:28 AM

And to think, maybe Moloney can indeed evade Donaire for good because there are other vacant belts that needs to be possessed and given the latter's situation, he might not last that long in the industry where he can fight Moloney and be the undisputed champion while there are no boxers that are much stronger than him.

That doesn't sound good; a champion evading his fellow champion gives the impression that he doesn't want to achieve the ultimate success of being the best of the best. If only champions were required for a unification fight, we would certainly witness an entertaining matchup. As it stands, Moloney can cherry-pick opponents to maintain his championship status.

If only that is how this industry works, we probably had some champions who are only the best of their divisions and are truly strong compared to the others who failed in climbing the ladder because they will no longer have the choice to select an opponent as they will have to fight anybody who are trying to replace them in their own throne. But that's just too good to be true because we all know that it's not how the industry works, the leverage gives them an advantage to maintain their status even without fighting somebody who is indeed a lot more stronger than them and by now, it's not that new as we have know some of them.

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Quote from: Sanitough on July 04, 2023, 09:24:39 AM

Quote from: Sanitough on July 04, 2023, 09:24:39 AM

That's how favored he is to win this fight. If we could aim for a KO victory, I believe the odds would be even higher, so we shouldn't hesitate to take that opportunity. It's rare to see Donaire face a boxer whom he could clearly dominate. The odds may not be attractive, but I have great confidence in Donaire winning the fight, perhaps within the first three rounds. Who would dare to risk betting on that?

Maybe because right now, he is not the kind of boxer he was in his prime, and obviously Santiago is the only boxer he can dominate and not the other contenders in the high rank anymore. Let's just see how the old Donaire will handle this fight after coming from a devastating loss against Inoue and what kinds of skills he still has to show Santiago in this fight because if he hasn't been training some new skills, then Santiago will easily win this fight because of knowing all his moves already unless Donaire is fully ready and have the plan to knock him out.

Bookies would not make him a heavy favorite if people didn't believe in Donaire's capability anymore. While he did suffer a TKO against Inoue, it's important to note that Inoue has been dominating anyone who dares to challenge him. This is a fresh start for Donaire since the belts have all been vacated with Inoue moving up to the super bantamweight division.

Yes, I like that term, 'fresh start' for Nonito and hopefully this is just the beginning for another of his reign as Inoue is no longer here.
So we will see how far Donaire can go, if he beats Santiago then he will have to defend it sooner or later against another young guys in the division. And there is a potential as well as it could be against another Filipino in Reymart Gaballo.

But let's not get ahead of ourselves, not a couple of weeks and we will see again Nonito and for sure he will be up to the challenge once more.

I hope we don't witness another Filipino boxer suffering at the hands of Donaire. If he wins this fight, it would be great to see a unification match next. Considering that Donaire is not getting any younger, he cannot afford to waste time. He needs to pursue more achievements, and a unification fight would be a great start.

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Quote from: Sanitough on July 04, 2023, 09:24:39 AM

That's how favored he is to win this fight. If we could aim for a KO victory, I believe the odds would be even higher, so we shouldn't hesitate to take that opportunity. It's rare to see Donaire face a boxer whom he could clearly dominate. The odds may not be attractive, but I have great confidence in Donaire winning the fight, perhaps within the first three rounds. Who would dare to risk betting on that?

Maybe because right now, he is not the kind of boxer he was in his prime, and obviously Santiago is the only boxer he can dominate and not the other contenders in the high rank anymore. Let's just see how the old Donaire will handle this fight after coming from a devastating loss against Inoue and what kinds of skills he still has to show Santiago in this fight because if he hasn't been training some new skills, then Santiago will easily win this fight because of knowing all his moves already unless Donaire is fully ready and have the plan to knock him out.

Bookies would not make him a heavy favorite if people didn't believe in Donaire's capability anymore. While he did suffer a TKO against Inoue, it's important to note that Inoue has been dominating anyone who dares to challenge him. This is a fresh start for Donaire since the belts have all been vacated with Inoue moving up to the super bantamweight division.

Yes, I like that term, 'fresh start' for Nonito and hopefully this is just the beginning for another of his reign as Inoue is no longer here.
So we will see how far Donaire can go, if he beats Santiago then he will have to defend it sooner or later against another young guys in the division. And there is a potential as well as it could be against another Filipino in Reymart Gaballo.

But let's not get ahead of ourselves, not a couple of weeks and we will see again Nonito and for sure he will be up to the challenge once more.

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That's how favored he is to win this fight. If we could aim for a KO victory, I believe the odds would be even higher, so we shouldn't hesitate to take that opportunity. It's rare to see Donaire face a boxer whom he could clearly dominate. The odds may not be attractive, but I have great confidence in Donaire winning the fight, perhaps within the first three rounds. Who would dare to risk betting on that?

Maybe because right now, he is not the kind of boxer he was in his prime, and obviously Santiago is the only boxer he can dominate and not the other contenders in the high rank anymore. Let's just see how the old Donaire will handle this fight after coming from a devastating loss against Inoue and what kinds of skills he still has to show Santiago in this fight because if he hasn't been training some new skills, then Santiago will easily win this fight because of knowing all his moves already unless Donaire is fully ready and have the plan to knock him out.

Bookies would not make him a heavy favorite if people didn't believe in Donaire's capability anymore. While he did suffer a TKO against Inoue, it's important to note that Inoue has been dominating anyone who dares to challenge him. This is a fresh start for Donaire since the belts have all been vacated with Inoue moving up to the super bantamweight division.

Yup, bookies most of the time based on the odd with how they believe with the capabilities of the favorite,

Some adjustment especially if fans continue to pick the fighter against his opponents, I still believe that Donaire has
that good edge against Santiago. Like what you believe, it's a good timing for Donaire to take the belt back and reclaim
his name from this division, that last TKO lost against Inoue, will be part of his past now and reclaiming the belt will give
him more chances to make more money.

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That's how favored he is to win this fight. If we could aim for a KO victory, I believe the odds would be even higher, so we shouldn't hesitate to take that opportunity. It's rare to see Donaire face a boxer whom he could clearly dominate. The odds may not be attractive, but I have great confidence in Donaire winning the fight, perhaps within the first three rounds. Who would dare to risk betting on that?

Maybe because right now, he is not the kind of boxer he was in his prime, and obviously Santiago is the only boxer he can dominate and not the other contenders in the high rank anymore. Let's just see how the old Donaire will handle this fight after coming from a devastating loss against Inoue and what kinds of skills he still has to show Santiago in this fight because if he hasn't been training some new skills, then Santiago will easily win this fight because of knowing all his moves already unless Donaire is fully ready and have the plan to knock him out.

Bookies would not make him a heavy favorite if people didn't believe in Donaire's capability anymore. While he did suffer a TKO against Inoue, it's important to note that Inoue has been dominating anyone who dares to challenge him. This is a fresh start for Donaire since the belts have all been vacated with Inoue moving up to the super bantamweight division.

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Quote from: bisdak40 on July 04, 2023, 06:20:55 AM

That's how favored he is to win this fight. If we could aim for a KO victory, I believe the odds would be even higher, so we shouldn't hesitate to take that opportunity. It's rare to see Donaire face a boxer whom he could clearly dominate. The odds may not be attractive, but I have great confidence in Donaire winning the fight, perhaps within the first three rounds. Who would dare to risk betting on that?

Maybe because right now, he is not the kind of boxer he was in his prime, and obviously Santiago is the only boxer he can dominate and not the other contenders in the high rank anymore. Let's just see how the old Donaire will handle this fight after coming from a devastating loss against Inoue and what kinds of skills he still has to show Santiago in this fight because if he hasn't been training some new skills, then Santiago will easily win this fight because of knowing all his moves already unless Donaire is fully ready and have the plan to knock him out.

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Quote from: bisdak40 on July 04, 2023, 06:20:55 AM

And to think, maybe Moloney can indeed evade Donaire for good because there are other vacant belts that needs to be possessed and given the latter's situation, he might not last that long in the industry where he can fight Moloney and be the undisputed champion while there are no boxers that are much stronger than him.

That doesn't sound good; a champion evading his fellow champion gives the impression that he doesn't want to achieve the ultimate success of being the best of the best. If only champions were required for a unification fight, we would certainly witness an entertaining matchup. As it stands, Moloney can cherry-pick opponents to maintain his championship status.

That's how dangerous Donaire in the eyes of other boxers in this division, if given the chance to evade/avoid him, they will as that lethal left hook could still do some damage if timed properly. I do agree that Moloney would not last long as a champion because his talent is just average and one day he could fight someone that can knock him out with just one punch like what happened to him in the Inoue fight.

Two weeks to go and it seems that there is some movement on the ML odds if i'm not wrong as last week it was Donaire ML @1.37 but not it goes high @1.53, more money poured on to Santiago i guess.

Yes, maybe there are fans who poured money on Santiago who thinks that he has a good chance against Donaire here, so we can't blame them for that. But as fans of Donaire, I do agree that he might be avoided at all cost because those who tested him really felt the power of his patented left hook.

So I'm still seeing that Donaire will go in and out and dart himself out of danger in this fight and then going to let go of that left hook and see if Santiago has a good chin or he can't simply stand the power of Nonito and lay down on the canvass.

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And to think, maybe Moloney can indeed evade Donaire for good because there are other vacant belts that needs to be possessed and given the latter's situation, he might not last that long in the industry where he can fight Moloney and be the undisputed champion while there are no boxers that are much stronger than him.

That doesn't sound good; a champion evading his fellow champion gives the impression that he doesn't want to achieve the ultimate success of being the best of the best. If only champions were required for a unification fight, we would certainly witness an entertaining matchup. As it stands, Moloney can cherry-pick opponents to maintain his championship status.

That's how dangerous Donaire in the eyes of other boxers in this division, if given the chance to evade/avoid him, they will as that lethal left hook could still do some damage if timed properly. I do agree that Moloney would not last long as a champion because his talent is just average and one day he could fight someone that can knock him out with just one punch like what happened to him in the Inoue fight.

Two weeks to go and it seems that there is some movement on the ML odds if i'm not wrong as last week it was Donaire ML @1.37 but not it goes high @1.53, more money poured on to Santiago i guess.

That's how favored he is to win this fight. If we could aim for a KO victory, I believe the odds would be even higher, so we shouldn't hesitate to take that opportunity. It's rare to see Donaire face a boxer whom he could clearly dominate. The odds may not be attractive, but I have great confidence in Donaire winning the fight, perhaps within the first three rounds. Who would dare to risk betting on that?

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And to think, maybe Moloney can indeed evade Donaire for good because there are other vacant belts that needs to be possessed and given the latter's situation, he might not last that long in the industry where he can fight Moloney and be the undisputed champion while there are no boxers that are much stronger than him.

That doesn't sound good; a champion evading his fellow champion gives the impression that he doesn't want to achieve the ultimate success of being the best of the best. If only champions were required for a unification fight, we would certainly witness an entertaining matchup. As it stands, Moloney can cherry-pick opponents to maintain his championship status.

That's how dangerous Donaire in the eyes of other boxers in this division, if given the chance to evade/avoid him, they will as that lethal left hook could still do some damage if timed properly. I do agree that Moloney would not last long as a champion because his talent is just average and one day he could fight someone that can knock him out with just one punch like what happened to him in the Inoue fight.

Two weeks to go and it seems that there is some movement on the ML odds if i'm not wrong as last week it was Donaire ML @1.37 but not it goes high @1.53, more money poured on to Santiago i guess.

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