Butterfly Labs - Bitforce Single and Mini Rig Box - page 74.

Buckwheet

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Green Mining 85% Cheaper

Quote from: Inaba on March 06, 2012, 03:16:29 PM

Insurance.

Shipping a large flat rate box with online purchase of the insurance and the postage costs: $22.80.

If they used Regional Rate B boxes which are 12" x 10-1/4" x 5", which should fit the box according to their website specifications: $16.33.

Edit: The regional rate costs would change based upon where they are sending them. But they should almost always be cheaper than the flat rate, and if not then..go flat rate.

Inaba

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Insurance.

Buckwheet

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Green Mining 85% Cheaper

I want to know why their shipping is $34. They sent them out in USPS boxes(but didn't use USPS as the shipper), and based on the dimensions USPS flat rate large boxes could be used for a flat cost of $15.50. This does not include the online purchase price discount or if they actually implemented using the new USPS regional rate boxes which are just as large and can cost quite a bit less then the flat rates depending on where the end location is and how heavy the overall package is.

If they are willing to sudo abuse the postal service for free boxes, then they should purchase a used UPS zebra printer for $99 and then order the free thermal labels from UPS to print your USPS postage on. Not to mention, you can then use Paypal's shipping software to print in bulk to the thermal printer.

I just can't believe they would stuff $20 worth of shipping materials into the boxes.

RandyFolds

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Quote from: SgtSpike on March 06, 2012, 12:49:02 PM

Quote from: testerx on March 06, 2012, 12:42:57 PM

I noticed on Butterfly labs' website that they say that they're collecting sales tax for all US orders...how can that possibly be right? You'd have to have a business presence in all 50 states to be required to collect sales tax in all 50 states, and you'd have to remit sales taxes to 50 different states for which you'd need to have 50 sales tax certificates. Unless they're actually sending sales taxes to 50 different state tax boards plus calculating the tax rate for every county in all 50 states they're breaking the law. You can't just charge Missouri sales tax on an interstate transaction.

For people who ordered, what sales tax rate did they charge you?

Technically, they only need to collect sales tax for states in which they have retail presence, or in which they operate. I don't know why they are collecting sales tax for all 50 states. The government is trying to change the laws so that sales taxes would have to be collected for all states even for online sales, but last I checked, they had not come close to pushing that through.

But yes, if they are collecting sales taxes for all the states that charge a sales tax (even though they don't have to), they'd better be submitting those taxes to those states or they'll be heftily fined!

Are they even a registered entity? Last I heard, their wyoming registration had gone delinquent, and you can't collect sales tax without a resale permit.

Tamerz

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Quote from: testerx on March 06, 2012, 12:42:57 PM

I noticed on Butterfly labs' website that they say that they're collecting sales tax for all US orders...how can that possibly be right? You'd have to have a business presence in all 50 states to be required to collect sales tax in all 50 states, and you'd have to remit sales taxes to 50 different states for which you'd need to have 50 sales tax certificates. Unless they're actually sending sales taxes to 50 different state tax boards plus calculating the tax rate for every county in all 50 states they're breaking the law. You can't just charge Missouri sales tax on an interstate transaction.

For people who ordered, what sales tax rate did they charge you?

I asked them this same question and this was the response:

Code:

Just to Missouri.

Kind regards,
Sonny K
BF Labs Inc.

SgtSpike

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Quote from: testerx on March 06, 2012, 12:52:26 PM

It's especially weird since anybody who's mining as a business (i.e. reporting your mining income) would be deducting their mining hardware purchases but when reporting their state income taxes for their mining business you'd have to have paid *your* state's income taxes. Which would be handled by the filer. They really shouldn't be charging sales tax on anything except Missouri sales especially since they're a pretty small vendor.

Say what?

If you buy an asset and pay sales tax on it, that doesn't exempt you from paying income tax on the revenue it generates. Neither does generating revenue and paying income tax exempt you from paying sales tax on business expenditures.

I'll agree with you that they shouldn't be charging sales tax for anywhere but the state they reside in though.

testerx

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Quote from: stevegee58 on March 06, 2012, 12:47:18 PM

Quote from: testerx on March 06, 2012, 12:42:57 PM

I noticed on Butterfly labs' website that they say that they're collecting sales tax for all US orders...how can that possibly be right?

I find that hard to believe. The big guys don't do it so why would a little guy piss his customers off doing it?

That's why I'm asking if they're actually charging people sales tax like this. Their pre-order form claims that they do for all US orders:
http://www.butterflylabs.com/pre-order-form/ (at the very bottom)

It's especially weird since anybody who's mining as a business (i.e. reporting your mining income) would be deducting their mining hardware purchases but when reporting their state income taxes for their mining business you'd have to have paid *your* state's income taxes. Which would be handled by the filer. They really shouldn't be charging sales tax on anything except Missouri sales especially since they're a pretty small vendor.

DeathAndTaxes

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Gerald Davis

Quote from: testerx on March 06, 2012, 12:42:57 PM

I noticed on Butterfly labs' website that they say that they're collecting sales tax for all US orders...

They have to mean in the states they have a presence (likely put that language in there in case that changes in the future).

BTW. Not all states even have a sales tax so collecting in all 50 states is impossible even if you did have a Nexus in all 50.

SgtSpike

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Quote from: testerx on March 06, 2012, 12:42:57 PM

I noticed on Butterfly labs' website that they say that they're collecting sales tax for all US orders...how can that possibly be right? You'd have to have a business presence in all 50 states to be required to collect sales tax in all 50 states, and you'd have to remit sales taxes to 50 different states for which you'd need to have 50 sales tax certificates. Unless they're actually sending sales taxes to 50 different state tax boards plus calculating the tax rate for every county in all 50 states they're breaking the law. You can't just charge Missouri sales tax on an interstate transaction.

For people who ordered, what sales tax rate did they charge you?

Technically, they only need to collect sales tax for states in which they have retail presence, or in which they operate. I don't know why they are collecting sales tax for all 50 states. The government is trying to change the laws so that sales taxes would have to be collected for all states even for online sales, but last I checked, they had not come close to pushing that through.

But yes, if they are collecting sales taxes for all the states that charge a sales tax (even though they don't have to), they'd better be submitting those taxes to those states or they'll be heftily fined!

stevegee58

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Quote from: testerx on March 06, 2012, 12:42:57 PM

I noticed on Butterfly labs' website that they say that they're collecting sales tax for all US orders...how can that possibly be right?

I find that hard to believe. The big guys don't do it so why would a little guy piss his customers off doing it?

testerx

hero member

Activity: 608

Merit: 500

I noticed on Butterfly labs' website that they say that they're collecting sales tax for all US orders...how can that possibly be right? You'd have to have a business presence in all 50 states to be required to collect sales tax in all 50 states, and you'd have to remit sales taxes to 50 different states for which you'd need to have 50 sales tax certificates. Unless they're actually sending sales taxes to 50 different state tax boards plus calculating the tax rate for every county in all 50 states they're breaking the law. You can't just charge Missouri sales tax on an interstate transaction.

For people who ordered, what sales tax rate did they charge you?

Inspector 2211

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Quote from: BFL-Engineer on March 06, 2012, 10:28:31 AM

Quote from: Inspector 2211 on March 06, 2012, 09:57:21 AM

So, yesterday late at night I get the first email from Sonny that acknowledges my 2-23 order of four additional singles (I ordered
several singles prior to that) and he tells me to please pay up, so that they can process my order, WHEN IN FACT THIS ORDER WAS
IMMEDIATELY PAID VIA PAYPAL ON 2-23! Angry

This morning, I sent him an email with a screen shot of my Paypal account showing the $2420 payment on 2-23, and will let you all
know what he says.

I think they are so overwhelmed with orders that they start to lose track of who has paid and who hasn't - not a good sign. Sad

We've ran through all our logs and realized that neither the name or email of the paypal payment matched
the name or email of the purchase. It's still our fault, but that's where the confusion came from.

Sorry for the inconvinience, we'll fix it right away.

Regards,

OK, I just got an email acknowledging my payment.
It's a corporate Paypal account and it's possible that all they saw associated with the payment was the name of my business, not my first&last name.
Apology accepted and eagerly awaiting my first single, which I ordered exactly 2 months ago...

stevegee58

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Welcome to the world of Early Adopters guys!

BFL-Engineer

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Quote from: Inspector 2211 on March 06, 2012, 09:57:21 AM

So, yesterday late at night I get the first email from Sonny that acknowledges my 2-23 order of four additional singles (I ordered
several singles prior to that) and he tells me to please pay up, so that they can process my order, WHEN IN FACT THIS ORDER WAS
IMMEDIATELY PAID VIA PAYPAL ON 2-23! Angry

This morning, I sent him an email with a screen shot of my Paypal account showing the $2420 payment on 2-23, and will let you all
know what he says.

I think they are so overwhelmed with orders that they start to lose track of who has paid and who hasn't - not a good sign. Sad

We've ran through all our logs and realized that neither the name or email of the paypal payment matched
the name or email of the purchase. It's still our fault, but that's where the confusion came from.

Sorry for the inconvinience, we'll fix it right away.

Regards,

bombo999

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Has BFL released any rev 3 photos yet?

Inspector 2211

sr. member

Activity: 448

Merit: 250

So, yesterday late at night I get the first email from Sonny that acknowledges my 2-23 order of four additional singles (I ordered
several singles prior to that) and he tells me to please pay up, so that they can process my order, WHEN IN FACT THIS ORDER WAS
IMMEDIATELY PAID VIA PAYPAL ON 2-23! Angry

This morning, I sent him an email with a screen shot of my Paypal account showing the $2420 payment on 2-23, and will let you all
know what he says.

I think they are so overwhelmed with orders that they start to lose track of who has paid and who hasn't - not a good sign. Sad

DrG

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Quote from: jamesg on March 05, 2012, 06:31:18 PM

Quote from: SysRun on March 05, 2012, 05:23:05 PM

A single GPU unit doesn't make a lot of sense anymore.

Go big or go home....

Stop taunting me Cheesy

I keep picturing your setup and want to build it but the wife would kill me (since I would put it in her office for the free electricity. She even has 2 200AMP services. You know how many dreams I have of "well if I could just hide the wall of hair dryers from her patients...." lol