Chess online? | Bitcointalksearch.org

qwertyup23

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Quote from: yayayo on March 30, 2022, 05:22:46 AM

Quote from: dunfida on March 29, 2022, 05:00:06 PM

As long there would be no involvement of cheats then it would really be giving out that confidence on having a fair game but we know that cheating does exist on this sport through online which it do really makes hard

As long as there is money involved I don't think cheating will be out of the option since some people will do everything even cheating just to have the wagered money or the pot money. The OP was looking at some gambling site for a p2p chess online which I don't think exist yet.

ya.ya.yo!

Based purely on my personal experience watching online tournaments live, cheating is almost non-existence if the players that consist of such are within the top 20 of the rankings. If those GMs that are within the top 20 participates in a tournament, you can almost guarantee that they will not be using any chess engine during the whole match due to the effects of it on their careers.

I would somehow understand if the players involve are within the range of 1700-2500 but when a tournament consists of players within the top 20, then I guess it is safe to bet on those games. I just hope that there will be websites that will consider chess gambling as it is really an underrated game to be betted on.

Distinctin

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Quote from: yayayo on March 30, 2022, 05:22:46 AM

Quote from: dunfida on March 29, 2022, 05:00:06 PM

As long there would be no involvement of cheats then it would really be giving out that confidence on having a fair game but we know that cheating does exist on this sport through online which it do really makes hard

As long as there is money involved I don't think cheating will be out of the option since some people will do everything even cheating just to have the wagered money or the pot money. The OP was looking at some gambling site for a p2p chess online which I don't think exist yet.

ya.ya.yo!

Chances of people/players to cheat gets higher when there's a huge money at stake as it could give difference in their life even for a short time and that is where greediness kick that's why people tend to cheat just to secure that the money will likely be in their possession at the end of the day or tournament.

For now, there's no gambling sites about the chess yet but maybe soon there will be some.

Gozie51

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Quote from: madnessteat on March 30, 2022, 06:44:17 AM

In my opinion, if we play online chess, it is necessary that we can view the opponent's screen and be able to watch him in real time. Only this can guarantee fair play without the use of artificial intelligence or bots. In general, play chess with friends if you like this game, because it's not so expensive to buy chess and defeating a friend is still a pleasure.

Buying chess board isn't really an issue but to see a partner to play with for fun is not always easy. Many gamblers don't like to play games just for the fun of it except you involve money on it then you can get them attracted and for a learner to start playing with money means you are going to lose alot of money. You need to learn a game first before making bet on it. Many chess players don't do it for just the fun, they always make bet on it.

Lucasgabd

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Quote from: dunfida on March 29, 2022, 05:00:06 PM

Quote from: Lucasgabd on March 29, 2022, 04:05:47 PM

Quote from: Viscore on March 27, 2022, 04:56:46 AM

Quote from: Zackgeno96 on March 22, 2022, 08:21:05 AM

<...>

This is why there are less platforms about playing chess online as it can be mostly manipulated and controlled by any cheater who wants to take advantage of the bet. Good thing if you only play with your friends online as your money will be safe but if you happen to play with strangers, most likely cheating will be present. IMHO, i always prefer to play chess over the board than to play it online due to some risks.

playing in person is much more cool, definitely
but for me the big advantage of playing online is being able to face players with similar ratings and have good competition
at least here in my life is a bit hard to meet friends that are on the same level as me and really enjoy playing chess

As long there would be no involvement of cheats then it would really be giving out that confidence on having a fair game but we know that cheating does exist on this sport through online which it do really makes hard

for us to trust on dealing or making out some competitions against other people and its not surprising that gambling sites doesnt offer this one yet it wont be something profitable for them
or doesnt really have much demand if you do ask me.

yes, that's why ethics and fair play is really important,

regarding websites not offering chess
maybe because they think there's not a lot of demand?
personally as much as I love chess I wouldn't be so interested on playing online for money, maybe in real life for fun but not online where my win rate is close to 50/50...

madnessteat

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In my opinion, if we play online chess, it is necessary that we can view the opponent's screen and be able to watch him in real time. Only this can guarantee fair play without the use of artificial intelligence or bots. In general, play chess with friends if you like this game, because it's not so expensive to buy chess and defeating a friend is still a pleasure.

yayayo

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Quote from: dunfida on March 29, 2022, 05:00:06 PM

As long there would be no involvement of cheats then it would really be giving out that confidence on having a fair game but we know that cheating does exist on this sport through online which it do really makes hard

As long as there is money involved I don't think cheating will be out of the option since some people will do everything even cheating just to have the wagered money or the pot money. The OP was looking at some gambling site for a p2p chess online which I don't think exist yet.

ya.ya.yo!

LUCKMCFLY

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Quote from: Mahanton on March 25, 2022, 04:41:22 PM

Quote from: LUCKMCFLY on March 25, 2022, 12:44:50 AM

Quote from: tabas on March 20, 2022, 05:04:25 PM

Quote from: coolcoinz on March 20, 2022, 04:44:55 PM

That's basically why I quit online gaming. There's rarely any online game where you fight other players that will not make you nervous. Even games where you play with others against an AI can be frustrating.

I can feel you when I've read what you've said. It's true that even we're just playing against AI makes me frustrated because the higher it gets. The intelligence and strategy of these AI are becoming better and I admit that I can't defeat the higher levels it's funny to think that these are no real people but programmed in a better way to play for the better chess players. But if someone really wants to get a focus on this one, he can be one of the best and it's a good training ground that we have nothing lose.

Well this has always been one thing that limits us as human beings not being able to beat an artificial intelligence, however when we play online unless it is in a tournament it is something that can frustrate, however there are some pages like the ones I used to play chess21 before, which are very good, they even have a chat where you can interact with your opponent, and since there are several categories in chess, you can play by time, be it 3 minutes, 5 minutes, among others, that is something that each player can define.

Human beings did create AI but we know that there are things which cant be beaten up by human brain which it could really be superior on which people do really able to have a hard time on handling it out.
It do really keeps better and better as years passing by and continue to develop(well its a broad topic in regarding with AI).
As for Chess online then there are sites but hindrance on minding about whose your opponent would be always there whether its a bot or an actual person.
So far we arent seeing any platforms do adopts this one.

In our local Spanish section a distinguished member had a site under which he had programmed it so that any player would have interaction playing chess, and whoever won would have some satoshis there as a prize. But apparently an AI entered and made all the satoshis available for the site and he determined that it was an AI, so it is currently difficult to put sites for entertainment and reward people's effort, obviously this is seen as cheating, because an AI AI is at another level, however the human being can beat it on several occasions, but it is still a difficult challenge to perform or at least realize that at the moment of playing it is an AI.

dunfida

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Quote from: Lucasgabd on March 29, 2022, 04:05:47 PM

Quote from: Viscore on March 27, 2022, 04:56:46 AM

Quote from: Zackgeno96 on March 22, 2022, 08:21:05 AM

I am not sure if adding a reward or betting that is inclined with financial figures could be a good thing when it comes to chess. As stated by the others, if it is a game set in the computer, then cheating is most likely to happen. And I think that real chess players and chess enthusiasts would be dismay if matches would end up being rigged due to aggressive desire to win the monetary reward.

This is why there are less platforms about playing chess online as it can be mostly manipulated and controlled by any cheater who wants to take advantage of the bet. Good thing if you only play with your friends online as your money will be safe but if you happen to play with strangers, most likely cheating will be present. IMHO, i always prefer to play chess over the board than to play it online due to some risks.

playing in person is much more cool, definitely
but for me the big advantage of playing online is being able to face players with similar ratings and have good competition
at least here in my life is a bit hard to meet friends that are on the same level as me and really enjoy playing chess

As long there would be no involvement of cheats then it would really be giving out that confidence on having a fair game but we know that cheating does exist on this sport through online which it do really makes hard

for us to trust on dealing or making out some competitions against other people and its not surprising that gambling sites doesnt offer this one yet it wont be something profitable for them
or doesnt really have much demand if you do ask me.

Lucasgabd

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There's no need to be upset

Quote from: Viscore on March 27, 2022, 04:56:46 AM

Quote from: Zackgeno96 on March 22, 2022, 08:21:05 AM

I am not sure if adding a reward or betting that is inclined with financial figures could be a good thing when it comes to chess. As stated by the others, if it is a game set in the computer, then cheating is most likely to happen. And I think that real chess players and chess enthusiasts would be dismay if matches would end up being rigged due to aggressive desire to win the monetary reward.

This is why there are less platforms about playing chess online as it can be mostly manipulated and controlled by any cheater who wants to take advantage of the bet. Good thing if you only play with your friends online as your money will be safe but if you happen to play with strangers, most likely cheating will be present. IMHO, i always prefer to play chess over the board than to play it online due to some risks.

playing in person is much more cool, definitely
but for me the big advantage of playing online is being able to face players with similar ratings and have good competition
at least here in my life is a bit hard to meet friends that are on the same level as me and really enjoy playing chess

Mauser

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Quote from: South Park on March 28, 2022, 05:12:21 PM

Cheating by using a computer to play chess for you is something that happens mostly on the middle levels of chess tournaments, and the reason for this is simple, a computer does not play like a human, one way in which online cheaters are caught is that their play is compared to the different chess engines and if their play matches one of those engines then we can know they are cheating, so at the highest level of play a GM will immediately recognize that his opponent is using a computer to play on his place, so such cheating is not something that can be sustained for the long term.

I have no idea how big cheating is on the chess world, but I would expect it to be very small in the higher levels. Once you reach IM or GM rank everybody knows each other. The people have been playing chess since their teens and played against each other in many tournaments. It's not like one guy just using cheat software for 2 weeks and becoming a new chess professional. That's why the ELO system is so important. I think that online only players with a long track record can play each other. The potential backlash from cheating, like ruining your career, being banned for life from chess tournaments and paying a big fine should prevent anyone professional to do such a think. For small online chess tournaments with no professionals I think that betting on it is no real option because of the cheating risk.

Fatunad

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Quote from: livingfree on March 28, 2022, 07:33:43 PM

Quote from: South Park on March 28, 2022, 05:12:21 PM

Cheating by using a computer to play chess for you is something that happens mostly on the middle levels of chess tournaments, and the reason for this is simple, a computer does not play like a human, one way in which online cheaters are caught is that their play is compared to the different chess engines and if their play matches one of those engines then we can know they are cheating, so at the highest level of play a GM will immediately recognize that his opponent is using a computer to play on his place, so such cheating is not something that can be sustained for the long term.

In the long term, it's not really going to be sustained because the cheater can be caught by an instance no matter how good he is in hiding.

The time will come that he'll uncover the cheat that he's been doing and all the tricks despite measures being made by the organizers if it's an online tournament.

But with the loosening of restrictions worldwide, if there will be casinos that are going to put this into their book. They'll probably only going to take those matches that are live and F2F tournaments.

Live or F2F tournament would be much more the case on this manner since its been proved out that there are indeed instances or situations which a player do able to execute some cheat on an online tournament.
There might be some solutions to avoid possible situations to happen but it would be still putting some doubt.
No doubt that we arent seeing lines being offered on most bookies because of these possible problems but pretty much sure it would really be talking about the less demand in regarding this manner.

livingfree

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Quote from: South Park on March 28, 2022, 05:12:21 PM

Cheating by using a computer to play chess for you is something that happens mostly on the middle levels of chess tournaments, and the reason for this is simple, a computer does not play like a human, one way in which online cheaters are caught is that their play is compared to the different chess engines and if their play matches one of those engines then we can know they are cheating, so at the highest level of play a GM will immediately recognize that his opponent is using a computer to play on his place, so such cheating is not something that can be sustained for the long term.

In the long term, it's not really going to be sustained because the cheater can be caught by an instance no matter how good he is in hiding.

The time will come that he'll uncover the cheat that he's been doing and all the tricks despite measures being made by the organizers if it's an online tournament.

But with the loosening of restrictions worldwide, if there will be casinos that are going to put this into their book. They'll probably only going to take those matches that are live and F2F tournaments.

South Park

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Quote from: qwertyup23 on March 21, 2022, 03:46:38 PM

Quote from: joeperry on March 21, 2022, 03:44:09 AM

I would agree with @Wildan a player can use other computer to cheat so it doesn't make sense on having a bet on a Chess game but that would be great if anyone can stop people from cheating (Which is not) for me adding a bet on Chess game could spice up or make the game more intense.

It is possible to have a this kind of game if the player could have a live webcam to them (to see if they are using other computer) and a screen share of their computer just like what they are doing in online chess tournament but that was too much right? Setting up cameras and sharing your screen to others.

I severely disagree with your first statement.

First, high-level tournaments contain super GMs who does not use any engines at all. While we may argue that they may have the possibility of using so, they are strictly monitored with their respective PCs in order to avoid such cheating. In addition, these super GMs would not want to use any engine as they are the engines themselves. In the event that they actually use one, then they would just put their whole career into jeopardy and waste all of their efforts building their ratings on the ladder.

Again, betting in chess is just as fun as betting into other sports. I just hope that people would see the potential of this sport exploding in the near future.

Cheating by using a computer to play chess for you is something that happens mostly on the middle levels of chess tournaments, and the reason for this is simple, a computer does not play like a human, one way in which online cheaters are caught is that their play is compared to the different chess engines and if their play matches one of those engines then we can know they are cheating, so at the highest level of play a GM will immediately recognize that his opponent is using a computer to play on his place, so such cheating is not something that can be sustained for the long term.

jostorres

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Quote from: og kush420 on March 27, 2022, 10:41:22 AM

Chess is an amazing game - I really admire and like all those who have interest in chess and those who wins the game. Much appreciated!

Yeah you said it right. It is really an amazing game because not only it is enjoyable to play but it also has a benefit to sharpen our brains. You can click the link that he posted to see how the game went thru and you can also click on the subscribe button as it is the account of one of the player names Magnus Carlsen. You can check his other videos to learn more of him and see his past games.

I was looking at the other player named Jan Duda on youtube but I can't seem to find his official account. I think the guy didn't set up a youtube account yet. You can try searching them on google and see if you can find other information in regards to them.

og kush420

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Quote from: qwertyup23 on March 27, 2022, 06:41:51 AM

Since there is no separate board for any chess related discussion on tournaments, I would start from here.

Congratulations for Magnus in winning the 2022 Charity Cup Meltwater Champions Chess Tour defeating Duda after two (2) days of playing. Duda was able to retaliate and snatch two wins which forced a tiebreaks but Magnus won the blitz. Props to Duda for defeating the current world champion in 26 moves but Magnus showed on why he is indeed the Chess Magician!

¹photo taken from https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bR64wh9V3MI

Thank you for sharing the photos. I am going to search these two.
Chess is an amazing game - I really admire and like all those who have interest in chess and those who wins the game. Much appreciated!

KTChampions

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Quote from: CDC AP on March 27, 2022, 06:14:26 AM

I used to play email chess a long time ago, in fact someone on this forum also I met there before I picked up on bitcoin. It is fun, but you always knew when you were playing against someone using computer software, which is impossible to detect just have a lot of suspicion when you try ask them why they make the move and they cannot explain.

This is rather strange since the computer analysis shows the main line after the proposed move and all the ideas are obvious. If a player cannot describe it in words, then he either does not use computer analysis or plays so badly that he does not even understand the meaning of the moves.

qwertyup23

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Since there is no separate board for any chess related discussion on tournaments, I would start from here.

Congratulations for Magnus in winning the 2022 Charity Cup Meltwater Champions Chess Tour defeating Duda after two (2) days of playing. Duda was able to retaliate and snatch two wins which forced a tiebreaks but Magnus won the blitz. Props to Duda for defeating the current world champion in 26 moves but Magnus showed on why he is indeed the Chess Magician!

¹photo taken from https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bR64wh9V3MI

CDC AP

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I used to play email chess a long time ago, in fact someone on this forum also I met there before I picked up on bitcoin. It is fun, but you always knew when you were playing against someone using computer software, which is impossible to detect just have a lot of suspicion when you try ask them why they make the move and they cannot explain.

Theones

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Quote from: uneng on March 26, 2022, 03:24:38 PM

There is no problem in using or programming bots for hobby, testing and learning purposes, but it can't be done in competitive matches that will count for increasing players' classification in a global ranking, or to earn money against others during tournaments.

I don't know how often this kind of thing happens, but from humans, of course you can expect cheating anytime and anywhere. Sometimes it's not even for the money, but for the status, glory and fame.

Bots are easy way out. Many people are smart to know who uses bots and who has got the followers through organic reach. So its better to get some followers organic way because if your account get popular in coming days. It would be recognized easily if you have used some bots earlier. I think the sites does not support that bot population too.

Viscore

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Quote from: Zackgeno96 on March 22, 2022, 08:21:05 AM

I am not sure if adding a reward or betting that is inclined with financial figures could be a good thing when it comes to chess. As stated by the others, if it is a game set in the computer, then cheating is most likely to happen. And I think that real chess players and chess enthusiasts would be dismay if matches would end up being rigged due to aggressive desire to win the monetary reward.

This is why there are less platforms about playing chess online as it can be mostly manipulated and controlled by any cheater who wants to take advantage of the bet. Good thing if you only play with your friends online as your money will be safe but if you happen to play with strangers, most likely cheating will be present. IMHO, i always prefer to play chess over the board than to play it online due to some risks.

Topic: Chess online? (Read 1285 times)