Topic: CoinBet Casino & Sportsbook - 125% Match Bonus plus March Madness Contest! - page 16. (Read 25128 times)

LOL, so sorry! I can't even read it all now myself! I've only ever read one other casino's T&C but it's good to know this verbiage is industry standard

I just suffered through the whole thing. Just kidding, it was a thoughtful post. The rules are fairly standard with books that work with cash. Going strictly by the rules it gives sportsbooks carte blanche. The only true recourse for players in a non-regulated environment is what we pass on as our experience.

OMG. That's long... I'll edit, try to condense as much as possible.

EDIT---

Maybe tomorrow. I don't even want to read all that shit.

As promised…

First my disclaimer: This is just my interpretation of coinbet.cc's Terms and Conditions. I don’t claim to know how to decipher, which is why I have questions. I’m also not picking sides here; I have given coinbet.cc and players the benefit of the doubt in their claims. Perhaps you can say I’ve even egged some of it on by asking for proof and such. Speaking of which… coinbet.cc, you’ve been asked to provide info to validate that email. To be fair, you posted the claim, please make an attempt to show us it's real. It would only help to verify your story if you do.  

If you all care to read (this is going to be a little lengthy), enjoy. If I misinterpret something or am getting too far into the details, please let me know, it’s possible that I’m over analyzing this thing. I’ve only read through the T&Cs and FAQs in totality once, skimmed this time around to find the sections I had immediate questions about.

Statements in italics are copied directly from the site. I don’t think I’ve omitted any info, definitely not in an attempt to make these words work for me. If I left anything out that aids interpretation, call me out. Questions in bold probably require most of you to put your thinking hats on before answering.  

I’m glad I was directed to read the T&Cs and FAQs. Even though It is recommended that a player reads all the necessary rules regulations and other information regarding their participation in the Casino, so as to avoid any possible misunderstanding or confusion as to the way the Casino operates, I actually find myself more confused now. Like most, I don’t go around reading T&Cs unless I have an issue (admit it, you don’t either), but since the invitation to read it was extended several times, I figured I’d give it a go. I’m glad I did because 1) I can tell most people haven’t read it all, and 2) it’s good to know terms and conditions may be changed or altered the player accepts this as part of the prerogative of the website to do so when and if necessary. Wouldn’t you hate to have the T&Cs change suddenly without any warning? Certainly, but we all have been warned this can happen; it’s normal business actually. I’m just glad that each change will be time and date-stamped so I only have to read it once! Just remember that it is the responsibility of the player to check the terms at the time of deposit.

There are several areas of concern I’ll make mention of, but let’s start with the first thing that every player should ask himself before partaking in coinbet.cc’s entertainment (or any casino): Am I ‘legally’ allowed to play here? coinbet.cc offers no representation of warranty, either implicit or explicit, regarding a Player's legal right to play in the Casino, so I assume if I deposit BTC (even it were illegal for me in the US) I shouldn’t have an issue and I won’t violate the rules and forfeit any winnings. According to the FAQs, since the ever popular cryptocurrency; bitcoin is not considered “legal tender” and isn’t recognized as a legitimate form of currency by the U.S. government, I’m good to go but I’m totally confused because In placing real bets, the Player acknowledges that they are legally permitted to do this within their jurisdiction territory or country. At first read, it seems clear-cut and it absolutely is. Problem is, technically if I’m not legally allowed to play, regardless if I deposit BTC or USD, the T&C can be used to refuse payouts. I can’t imagine this card wouldn’t be pulled with small wins, but can it be interpreted that way, sure.  But regardless, we are all warned several times in the T&C that Participation in the activities and games of the coinbet.cc is open only to residents of those jurisdictions where such participation is legal and not prohibited. Participation in the Game is void wherever prohibited by law. Doubt I’d win that argument.

But why argue? Everything I need to know is explained in the T&Cs and besides The Player shall hold the Casino, its employees, (pretty much everyone) risk free and shall fully underwrite the same from any and all costs, expenses, liabilities and damages whatsoever that could result because of: (i) the Player's entry, use, or reuse of the Web Site, (ii) the Player's use of any materials at the Web Site, (iii) the Player's entry, use, or reuse of the Casino's server, (iv) the Player's activity in the Casino and its games, or, (v) the Player's acceptance of any winnings or prizes, so getting a lawyer, if I feel I was wronged, even if I have proof… is pointless. Clearly I waive my right to ever sue coinbet.cc for any reason. Is this normal? In fact, At all times coinbet.cc has within its rights the ability to change or withdraw any of the games or activities within the Casino without recourse and without notice, so does this mean I’m shit out of luck if this happens and I’m expecting a big payout? Honestly, even if I had what I felt to be a ‘case’, I can’t say for certain that I’d even try. coinbet.cc will seek criminal and contractual sanctions against any customer involved in fraud, dishonesty or criminal acts. coinbet.cc will withhold payment to any customer where any of these are suspected. Albeit mostly unintentional, I wouldn’t doubt that I could randomly review an account and point out where the T&C was violated. On second thought, I better think twice before posting my two cents from now on. The customer shall indemnify and shall be liable to pay to coinbet.cc, on demand, all costs, charges or losses sustained or incurred by coinbet.cc (including any direct, indirect or consequential losses, loss of profit and loss of reputation) arising directly or indirectly from the customer's fraud, dishonesty or criminal act.

Moot point – moving along. We do not accept deposits or wagers from the USA, so legal or not I’d be fighting a losing battle because I’m from the USA. No point in even discussing it further.

I don’t read T&Cs often, but how is it that coinbet.cc will pursue the perpetrator using the full extent of law enforcement and its agencies in order to safeguard its reputation and will instigate any legal suits for damages against the said player and prosecute accordingly, but I’m shit out of luck even if I try to do the same? I’m concerned over this post now… I have no intention of trying to damage rep here. But can I be sued if this post isn’t favorable to coinbet.cc’s rep? Shit.

I understand that Should there be a discrepancy in the result displayed the result will stand only on the Casino server software... what piques my interest here isn’t the fact that Should a dispute arise, you and coinbet.cc agree that the transaction log database will be the ultimate authority in such matters, it’s the fact that coinbet.cc shall accept no liability for any damages or losses which are deemed or alleged to have arisen out of or in connection with coinbet.cc's website or its content; including without limitation, delays or interruptions in operation or transmission, loss or corruption of data, communication or lines failure, any person's misuse of the site or its content or any errors or omissions in content. Why? I won’t say it’s easy to have corrupt logs because really it doesn’t matter. Apparently even if the issue is with the site, we agreed we wouldn’t hold them responsible for ‘lost winnings.’ For those who have had technical issues and got credited, just know that coinbet.cc didn’t have to, so consider it a courtesy.

Okay… I haven’t been at this for an even an hour but I ready to get back to other stuff so I’ll hurry the rest along. I’ll be happy to explain my thought process further, just say so.

I don’t play in the sportsbook, so why must bet there to take advantage of the bonus?
Half of this wager amount must come from the sportsbook

And just like everyone else, I’m officially confused with the bonuses now:
You can withdraw your original deposit amount anytime, but may risk forfeiting the bonus if you have not met the requirements. but...
Anything you’ve earned over the bonus amount can be withdrawn as well as your original deposit anytime, however if you have not played the minimum amount of games you will forfeit the bonus.  

It sounds like I can withdraw winnings from bonus credits but If you opt in for the bonus, you can not withdraw any amount from your account until you have met the wagering requirements. What? Wait a second… to tired to process now, but I this leaves too much that can be interpreted.

Not sure if it matters anyway because The Player acknowledges that in order to be eligible for any promotion or bonus they must be playing with the primary currency used in the country where they have a registered address and are playing from. But I think I’m safe if I deposit BTC? I’m not entirely sure. I’m confused.
 
I’ll just be mindful that if I make a deposit, I have to bet it all otherwise I might not get my deposit!. If the value of a deposit is not played through in full before a withdrawal is requested, coinbet.cc reserves the right to reject the withdrawal. Or did I read this wrong?

I don’t know how to bet in the sportsbook but because Any bets placed containing selections at odds of less than 1/2 will not count towards any rollover requirement, I’m concerned because I don’t know if this can be applied to casino games too?

Understandably, coinbet.cc respectfully reserves the right to cancel any Player's account for any reason whatsoever, but what if I made a mistake (by not reading your T&C for example), and referred my college buddies or colleagues? Since Only one (1) Real Account per player, per household, address, e-mail address, credit card number, bank account, and environments where computers are shared (university, fraternity, school, public library, workplace, etc), this could be used against me until the end of time… technically, right? Seriously, does this mean that if one of my co-workers can’t play here if I do? The T&C doesn’t say sharing the same computer – it’s says environment.

But I’m not sure if I’d want to be an affiliate. Should I be concerned that coinbet.cc is the trade name of the Casino, and the Player has no rights to use or employ such a term, or any other terms, graphics, text, concepts or methodologies, by participating in the Web Site and the material contained therein. Maybe this is superseded with the T&Cs for referrals? IDK. But since Affiliates can earn up to 45% of the net losses of their member players, it’s something to think about.

Again, this is just my preliminary review of coinbet.cc's T&Cs.

BTW - Remind me never to do this again… it took more time applying formatting than writing it! Next time I’ll do this as I’m reading, it was hell trying to locate what I knew I read!

can you direct me to the police report? I can't find it. Thanks

The lawyer talk is also nonsensical since there isn't a governing body for most of the BTC books. I've seen a lot of lawsuits against books in Costa Rica and none have been successful. Default judgments aren't even being given and many tossed for lack of jurisdiction.

-computer- I guess I'm on the other side because of personal experience and I don't know 100% what's going on with others. You talk about illegal activity as if the cash books are all on the up and up. You seem like you've been around the block because you know the forums but then it seems as though you are new to gambling since you think that cash books and their reps are better. You ever deal with 5Dimes Tony or others?

I don't doubt that you'd have an issue refunding deposits if there's a problem. I also know I'd have better luck betting vs spinning the wheel. But what can I say.... I play slots sometimes for hours at a time, especially when I'm working; there's nothing like having to be occupied at all times. I'm not sitting at my desk only concentrating on slots, I'm also very productive at work too. I just can't do that with poker yet, but I might figure out how eventually.

Yes, there were issues with the vouchers, technical (them) and ethical (players). Informed people know what info they can take with a grain of salt... Which is why one should base their decision to play using as much info as they can. Very seldom do I make decisions using the experience of one somebody; scams go both ways. What I like to see are a shitload of reviews, both negative and positive. I realize that not all players post their experiences, and there's no way to account for that margin of error. Patterns help me make my decision, but I don't allow one or two posts to make he decision for me. Okay, time to get off this damn iPad. Takes forever to respond.

When we notice a problem with a particular game (slots are incredibly notorious, and not just for us), we report it to the developer and remove it if they can't fix it or provide an update. Game developers are responsible for their particular games, so we can't take credit, nor liability, for any particular game. We will, however, refund someone's money if we notice an obvious problem with one.

Not taking sides everyone! But in all fairness... Yes, coinbet.cc, I can say you have been flexible, at least for me. Due to errors with your slots, you gave me several vouchers, which I happily used. Unfortunately I think there's still an issue with the slots  but since you've admitted to having tech difficulties relating to the slots and he vouchers, I simply can't and won't hold that against you.

Of course I'm nobody but a potential customer looking for a slot casino to call home.

I'm just going by personal experience. I didn't take a voucher. I deposited by BTC and was paid with no problem when I asked for a withdraw. It does look there are some problems with the voucher people. It also looks like a lot of people are piling on with mob mentality. The death threat seems so far fetched that I still don't give much weight to coinboss' posts.

Again, not on anyone's side here. But I probably have 500 addresses, give or take. So I wouldn't call that a lie right off. And I can't speak about any other games except for the slots. I'm learning poker (getting good at bluffing ;P  and I don't know shit about sports. If I'm watching a game with my hubbie, I choose "my team" based on their colors.... Hey, knock it off, yes I'm a true girly girl.

But can you blame them for being on the defense? If we can flick them off and call them out, why can't they do the same? Let's not talk of professionalism when running a bitcoin related business. That's a whole other post that would include prolly the majority. We all have our guards up, that's only natural. But I do have a few questions about their T&Cs I'm about to post.

I don't think his response was eluding my question. I'm actually glad this information can be found, in writing, on their site. I just read the T&Cs and the FAQs.... actually.... I think I'll grab my laptop before I say anymore about that.

I'll be the first to admit we have had issues with regards to support reps being aware of terms, caught up on any changes quick enough, etc. but at the same time, we have been VERY flexible with regards to situations that were related to that (e.g. giving people the bonuses they expected, despite the terms, etc). We've even given bonuses to people who violated our terms without realizing it, paid out more than people won, and more! We bend over backwards trying to give people what they expect, until a situation arises where it becomes obvious someone is taking advantage of us and violating terms on purpose. That's where we draw the line, and that's where things become upsetting.

Listen coinbet you keep saying it's all the customers fault if they don't "play by the rules" but you guys are the ones who put out vague terms if service and vague voucher rules. I know earlier in this thread you even got caught in a mistake/lie about how many times you need to rollover the bonuses (3 times in FAQ and 10
Times in the terms). I mean, why haven't you fixed that yet in the terms in your site?  It could be like the other poster said, you will just have en excuse not to pay. And you had certain rules and then changed them on the vouchers - everyone who followed the whole fiasco knows that. So you guys need to work on clarity and consistency before blaming the players.

Look, if people can't play by the rules, then they will not get any winnings that result from failing to do so. It really is that simple. If someone fails to understand the rules, and wants their deposit back, that's no problem. We aren't here to steal anyone's money, but we also don't want to waste our time with people who fail to comprehend simple terms and conditions. I hate to put it in these terms, but if you don't like the rules, don't play on the site! I don't know how I can make it any simpler. Plenty of people like it just fine. If it's not for you, and you don't want to play, we won't be offended by your decision.

To me, that just sounds like some catch-all to find some way to avoid paying if people win.

and having 700 addresses is just a flat out lie.  i probably have more bitcoins than you do and i have roughly 10 addresses.  700 addresses, passwords, 2 factor authentication, varying bitcoin sites, would be almost IMPOSSIBLE to keep track of.

I'm sorry, but everything out of your mouth in this thread is either evasive, ignorant or just a lie.  

IF i'm wrong (and that IS possible) you've gone about marketing your site completely wrong.  You need to go back to the drawing board and start over.  slots that dont pay out, bitcoins that aren't used for gambling, poker that doesn't show up as a tab, saying you dont need to reg with personal info (when you actually did), bonuses that dont pay out, winnings that dont pay out.  

ITS ENOUGH ALREADY.  START SHOWING SOME LEGITIMACY BY DOING THINGS RIGHT.

I'm not the owners, but I can tell you we have about 700+ wallet addresses. Keeping all BTC in one wallet is just asking for trouble.

If you have any questions about coinbet, or want more information, you are - as always - free to email [email protected].

One thing I can tell you, while we definitely encourage people to try us out, and enjoy working with our legitimate players, we also encourage you to read our terms, try us out if you want, and ultimately do whats best for you. Confusion, people not understanding our terms and conditions, and people misunderstanding our bonuses or special offers doesn't do any good for anyone. Definitely not for you, and definitely not for us.

Damn Damn Damn.  My intention (although i had some issues early with this site and their bitcoin/cash conversion), was always to deposit $5,000 in bitcoins and get a $10,000 bonus.  There is just so much negative stuff about this site and barely anything positive.  

in addition I've found some other negative press on a site called "bitcoinscammers." I would assume that its from some of the posters from here, but who knows.  Probably just not worth the risk...

At this point I just dont think this site is worth it.  There's too much sketchiness surrounding this place.

At a minimum I would like for the owners to post their wallet address so we know they actually have the money they claim to have.