Topic: Cops immediately shot a 12 year old holding a toy gun without warning. - page 5. (Read 6159 times)

Did you bother to even read any of the articles about this? Did you not see the picture of the gun? There was no way anyone would have been able to tell at first glance that it was only a BB gun (IT WASN'T A TOY!!)

well cops are idiots

cant belive they shot a 12 year old kid who had a toy gun

they are pretty stupid...those people should go to jail!!!

Remember, when they call a grand jury to determine if the cops should go to trial, it isn't a lawful grand jury. It may be a legal grand jury, but it isn't lawful. Grand juries are composed of less than 25 people. Original law requires 25.

Did Li'l Zé from "City of God" teach anyone anything? 

An LEO's job is to protect the public, not avenge them.  Brandishing a weapon is close enough to actual shooting to justify a kinetic response.

"Innocent" vs "guilty" has nothing to do with this.  A cop responding to a call about an armed and dangerous individual is not a court of law. 

If you don't understand the diff between a trial and a police response to an emergency, you need to learn to keep your mouth shut until you get a few dozen more clues.

Of course you assume the cop is guilty until proven innocent, because you are a hypocrite.

How stupid and completely unfit for survival must one be to not understand that [point gun at cop] = [Bam headshot]?

It's the parents' fault their kid got a Darwin Award, not the poor cop who has to live with his actions (however justifiable they were). 

Where were the parents when this child learned to act like a thug/bully and modified a BB gun to look real, then used it to terrorize other people?

This is a very sad story, i don't like to comment on things that i dont do a bit of research on first but everything i have heard so far sounds like murder or at least manslauter in this case.
A 12 year old boy with a gun, real or not cops should know how to deal with that situation without shooting first.
Cops have a very hard job to do but this paticular cop should lose his job and face charges.
If a cop kicks in your door at 3am with masks and guns shouting and then you shoot one dead you would probably be on death row no questions asked.

Assuming this is not premeditated murder, there is no justification whatsoever for outrage/anger here as it is neither the kid's nor the officers' fault. It's simple natural death that outwardly appear unfair. Given all the variables at play, it is inevitable that mishaps like this will happen from time to time without being backed by hate, rage or any other emotions. Looking for a solution to this 'problem' at a superficial level will always fail but then the actual root of the 'problem' lies at a depth that neither the victim's family/enforcer nor the 'powers that be' are willing to explore.

That literally summarized what happened
Just drove the car right up to him Bam Headshot ....  
I'm more concerned that they didn't bother to assess the situation and just recklessly went in like that I wonder if they even read the police manual on how to avoid getting hit by a potential person with a weapon.

Innocent until proven guilty, right? Cops need to learn to keep their guns in their holsters until they see the kid shoot somebody.

Please tell me this isn't going to devolve into an argument about whether the gun was white or black.

 What's wrong about the cop's behavior as shown by the video is this.

Police are told about a possibly armed guy, one police car drives right up the the suspect and the cop gets out.  The suspect waves what might be a gun around a bit, then the cop shoots him.

Huh?  The car drives right up to the guy and the cop gets out?

No precautions?  No concealment or cover?  Just drive right up to him?

If this had been a real encounter with a bad guy, I rather doubt the cop would have gotten out with his life.  So what the video shows is poor judgement, poor judgement, and then panic when he decided - wrongly - his life was in danger.

What this in turn shows is flaws in the training of police.  Yes, they are trained to shoot if there is something that looks like a gun barrel pointed in their direction.  This does not adequately handle the problem of kids with toys and/or mentally deficient adults with toys.  There are large numbers of examples of the end effects of these policies.

By the way, there's absolutely no logical reason to translate talk like mine into "anti-police" or "Anti-LEO".  Police who act more like "assault officers" than "peace officers" need to be reprimanded, retrained or retired.  The reason is that they are our employees, we don't need "assault officers".

The left wing part of the media has a history of spinning stories and evidence to support their left wing agenda (NBC for example edited the 911 call of the guy who killed Trevon Martin).
I don't think this would have made a difference. Even if the officers were told the gun might be fake, they would not have assumed that it was fake from the start, they would only act as if the gun was fake once they can tell for sure that it was in fact fake.
The kid was only escalating the situation by doing this. I would like to know who taught him to act like that.
agreed

Hey, calm down.  I'm just saying that in the survelliance video, the gun looks WHITE.  From that I conclude that it was some color other than gray or black.

This is pretty much irrefutable, right?  How do you explain it.

Added. 

Looking at the video again,  I guess what I'm seeing as a horizontal section of white, likely the slide and barrel, might possibly be a light color shirt sleeve or something. 

But the cop's actions are a bit puzzling.  He moves back away from the car out into the open, where he is most vulnerable.   Then he moves forward and fires.

When threatened he should have moved to cover and concealment first, then assess the situation.   But the kid's actions could certainly be construed as threatening.  In cop think that's seeing a barrel pointed your direction....

Yet another case where the general public reacts based on passion rather than fact. And of course, the mainstream media, as usual, is doing its best to cover up as many facts as possible in an effort to spin it in the way they want it to be spun.

There are several facts that were released right after the incident that are conveniently being left out now that it has gathered more attention. The first is that the 911 caller stated that someone who appeared to be in his 20s was holding a gun and pointing it at people and basically scaring the shit out of everyone. Now, he did say to the 911 operator that he thought the gun MIGHT be fake, but he wasn't sure. The 911 operator did not relay this information to the responding officers.

Looking at the video I can see two things that would definitely put me on edge if I were a cop. One, the kid definitely did NOT look 12. Second, as the cop car is pulling up, the kid starts walking toward the car and lifts up the front of his shirt to show/grab the gun. Now, I am no police officer, but I have had tactical training in the military. It is a fact that in situations like this, cops/military have to make split second decisions based on what limited facts they may have and from an immediate survey of the scene/situation. And having someone walking toward the car like that will always be treated as a threatening gesture.

People are saying the cop was too hasty in his shooting of the "suspect", but I am sure in his mind he was only thinking of protecting himself and his partner from what at the time seemed like a life-threatening situation. Cops are shot and killed by armed suspects all of the time. It's funny how there's never a public outcry when that happens. Newsflash! Not all cops are hate-filled bigots whose only purpose in life is to kill as many innocent people as they can.

We can deduce some things, but yeah the quality is shit.  Police in USA shock ROW most i think thats where the absolutes come from.

It is my understanding that the pink/red cap on guns were suppose to show that a toy gun is in fact a toy. The very reason these caps were placed on toy guns (and BB  guns) by the manufacturers is to tell the police not to shoot when they are pointed at them because they know they cannot do any real damage/harm. If the gun was modified to not have this red cap then the police officer should assume that it was a real gun

In a "required-to-open-carry" State, things would be different.

It might be disastrous for a State to implement Open-Carry-Required on the spot, without any movement to get the people used to the idea, and that isn't the way it should be done. Neither is it the way that I am talking about.

Open carry in the past was a bit of a hassle. Even though it would be easier now, with all the modifications to holsters and such, who wants to open carry all the time in public. Nobody. It is a nuisance to have that thing hanging there. We have enough trouble carrying groceries to the car.

If the people of a State were used to the idea, training would be in place about how and when to use guns. We wouldn't need cops. There wouldn't be as many school shootings, because anyone using a gun in an armed school would be dead before he knew it. Everyone would know how to handle kids with toy guns; there might be toy gun areas. A real shooter in a toy gun area would be dead because folks would know how to handle such situations.

Once the bad guys are dead, only friendly, respectful people are left.

Implement this in your State, and you won't need a National Guard or police.



EDIT: Cops are simply trained and armed people. Train and arm everybody, and you won't need cops.

Using this tragedy to score cheap anti-police and/or anti-RKBA debate points is asinine.

If you could get your facts right, that would be great.

The toy gun was modified to make it look real:



Who was in charge of this child while he was modifying the gun's appearance and using it to scare people?

If he was massacring people with a real gun, the public would be all "ZOMG WHERE WERE THE POLICE WHY DIDN'T THEY ACT SOONER?"

No, I'd have to disagree in part.  The toy gun was white in the b&w video, therefore it was some color that comes up as white.  Could have been green, white, red....

Any cop that interprets a green bb gun as a threat needs some serious psychiatric help.

Look, I'm experienced with handguns and I know there are a few made and sold which are real guns, and which are pink.  But that's very very few.

Toy guns are legally required to have an appearance which is different from real ones - color, or an orange tip on the barrel.  This "signals visually" that it's a toy.

That video is shit quality, so how the fuck is anyone making absolute statements about it?