Topic: ⚖️ Crypto Gambling Foundation ⚖️ - Fair Gambling For All - page 10. (Read 25272 times)

If you say justice in gambling there may be because gambling covers many aspects such as casinos, bets, games and gamblers here what kind of justice do you want to ask.
From all that, only a casino or a place for someone to play or bet can provide justice to every gambler who becomes their customer.
If what you want to know and demand justice for every game in the casino, because you have lost several times, you will never get it.
Casinos can be fair on all games but fair in the sense of giving RTP or Rakeback to gamblers who bet in a game so that gamblers get at least a fraction of the amount of money wagered.

maybe @BlackyJacky is a guy who needs to take a break from the world of gambling, he is quite emotional in gambling because in some ANN some casinos always see him.

yes, @BlackyJacky loses several arguments with @TwitchySeal. and he gets even angrier every time he loses talking to @TwitchySeal.

even though TwitchySeal has explained all the details about how House Edge works but BlackyJacky disagrees and always ignores the fact.

If that is the case, this whole situation is rather weird and bizarre.
In the board alone there must be hundreds of people who have lost money to a casino (some of them even open threads and openly admit it in order to vent their emotions) and this is the first time I have seen someone consistently trying to damage the reputation of a casino.

As far as I get it, the problem here is that he is trying to calculate the house edge, disregarding the skill/decision making that comes with blackjack, isn't it?

Your stats show the total number of games you idiot.  This has already been explained to you and if you actually don't believe it all you have to do is go look in your bet archive.  One bet id = 1 hand.  They could call the stat "bets". "games", "rounds", it doesn't matter.  It's obvious to any normal person with a few brain cells and if it weren't obvious all you have to do is check and see for yourself.

To determine your ROI (which you use the idiotic term "experienced house edge" for) you need to calculate

 You can not make this calculation using only the stats Stake gives you under "statistics" since it doesn't include either of these numbers.

    -  I just saw skill-based slots, in fairness it's quite attractive when you go there in person because you seem to appreciate playing and touching it more because it's beautiful and makes me say the word WOW!

All I know is that the slot is the one I played here in crypto gambling, not what it looks like, what's in the picture you gave, is that an article?...

Michael Shackleford published the "Summarized Net Win of games in BlackJack" and not the summarized net win of bets.

In a game where you can place only one bet per game and where you can lose or win only one bet per game, the statistic of how many games you won and lost is exactly your experienced house edge.

However, and as I explained to you earlier, in a game where you can place multiple bets within one game (double, split) and with a 1,5 payout in case of a won Black Jack, your experienced house edge is determined by how many bets you lost per 100 bets.

If you lost 0,5 bets per 100 bets, which is the case when you won 49,75% and lost 50,25% of your bets, then your experienced house edge is 0,5%.

If the advertised house edge is 0,5%, like in the case of the Stake in-house Black Jack, then long term you will lose 0,5% of the bets placed.

If the house edge is 0%, then you will win 50% of the bets placed and will lose 50% of the bets placed long term.

Your experienced edge is always determined by the number of bets won and number of bets lost.

If the Statistics states that you lost 4,6% of the bets placed long term while the advertised house edge is 0,5%, then either the game is rigged or the statistic is rigged or both!

In either case, Stake is at fault here and has to settle the issue, instead they ignore!

Does the Stake owner solely found it? I am not sure. Since OP is Stunna, I thought he created this ANN on their behalf of them. If the initiatives come from Stake, That's a good idea from them. When you create a platform and your concern and Priority change over the years because you are already the king, it's not good.

I believe you got my point. It will look like Stake created this platform to make sure other platforms use provably fair technology so they cannot take advantage. Now Stake becomes a whale in the casino Industry. But, if this is the main reason of abandoning the Crypto Gambling Foundation. That's selfish.

I have played some roullete and slots this week and I lost all the gamble, I use what I could afford but that's not even why I make this comment.

Is there anything in the gambling space called fair? I don't believe that fair gambling exists, because I've tried some gambling this week and I just keep losing, I got some free rolls too and I keep losing, I seem that gambling slots are wired in such a way that gamblers will lose more than the owners if this is right why are some gamblers saying the word Fair in gambling, I believe such don't exists and I don't want to believe that I am the worse gambler.

Yes that's just not the calculation for black jack.  Here's the calculation for blackjack with very similar rules as stake, and an even lower house edge (.28%)


https://wizardofodds.com/ask-the-wizard/blackjack/probability/

These numbers are from Michael Shackleford

Who's that?

Glad you asked.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Shackleford



It must not feel good to realize how wrong you've been this whole time while lacking the character to admit you were wrong.

My calculation is 100% correct:

0,5% house edge means that I win 49.75% of all bets placed and lose 50.25% of all bets placed.

181,000 bets x 49.75% = 90,048 wins

181,000 bets x 50.25% = 90,953 losses

The difference between wins and losses is 905 bets, means after 181,000 bets I will statistically lose 905 bets.

But my Stake statistics states that I lost 8,327 bets!!!

Bets: 180,904 | Wins: 78,285 | Losses: 86,612 = 8,327 more losses

Proof: https://ibb.co/Hxf8NpR


TwitchySeal is too stupid to diversify between games played and bets made!

However, the 8048/JAZ license Stake claims to operate under clearly diversifies between games played and bets made.

He just lost a bunch of money and then got banned for doing something shady.  He's just trying to get back at Stake, and just keeps making a fool of himself, which makes him more angry...it's a vicious circle. 

I mean, I know that some businesses of all kind can opt to sow FUD onto the community against competitors, but I personally doubt this person actually owns a casino or has a high position in one.

It would be more likely if he just managed to get some information in PDF about the license and feels he owns privileged information.
There is also a chance this is a FUD campaign targeted against specific casinos, but it is not as likely as the former explanation.

there have been people trying to explain to him several times how his calculations seem to be wrong and yet does not offer further mathematical counter-points...   

Well this is awkward, did BlackyJacky just by bragging accidentally admit a motive behind all this fud?

Running your own casino would be quite obvious one but i didn't think any other casino fudding competition could be this transparent. Focusing on baseless fud must be working on some level, otherwise they wouldn't be using their time by fudding other casinos in here.

But as we see they are struggling. Or maaybe they just don't have enough customers to keep them busy and got ton of free time. Who knows.

It's obvious BlackyJacky is out of point with the main debate on ground. Perhaps he's oblivion of the discussion on ground. Haven said that, i think Crypto Gambling Foundation needs to do more in their bid to sanitize the gambling casinos  off unfair games practices. Today we have more and more new casino's flocking in with the expression of probable fair games which we the gamblers can't easily establish such to be true and that's why CGF needs to expand their invitation to these new casinos for them to be verified of the fairness of some of their games as claimed.  Maybe those casinos that refuse the invitation can be listed through a thread y CGF or under this very post to keep interested gamblers abreast with those gambling websites that are suspected with unfair games.

I have a very bad speculative guess. And that's that they were very principled in the beginning. As most crypto people were. Libertarian, free market, open/transparent, provably fair, etc. And then a new barrage of casinos were coming online that were only using pre-made third party closed source non-provably fair games. And they were concerned about their market share getting eaten up. So they created the foundation as a way to inform the public and not get over run by bad actors.

But then time passed, concerns changed, overall care was diluted and the project was largely forgotten.

Stake makes so much money right now I doubt this foundation means much of anything to them now vs 2017. Priorities changed.

It would be cool if a new one opened up by people that actually cared to run it that had some previous reputation in being able to run such a thing. Perhaps that foundation could charge a small annual fee to be part of it. And then that foundation would maintain a website, maintain their active roster, and promote their casino list on BitcoinTalk and other places.

That's precisely what I was talking about. Back then, there were fewer casino platforms.
But the situation now is not like before. We see new casinos pop up every few days, and they claim their platform using provably fair technology. Either they don't know about the Crypto gambling Foundation, Or they choose not to verify their games.

I am wondering, Does the Crypto gambling Foundation Invite other casinos to verify their games? They have to spread their existence among the casino industries. If Casino companies don't know that there are such platform where they can verify their games, I won't blame casinos for not knowing the existence of the Crypto gambling Foundation.

 BlackyJacky thinks he plays optimal black jack and should be winning 49.75% of the hands he plays.

Let's see what that would look like.

In black jack, you are paid even money (1 -1) for winning a hand, except when you're first two cards equal 21, then you're paid 1.5-1, (also known as 3-2).  So we need to figure out how often each of the two possible payouts happens in order to determine the rtp.

21 is either an Ace and a Ten card, or a Ten card and an Ace.

With an infinite deck, odds of an Ace are 4/52, any Ten card is 16/52

Chances of Ten card first, then an Ace:  16/52 * 4/52 = 0.0236
And then the other way around, Ace first: 4/52 * 16/52 = 0.0236

Combined that gives us a 4.7%  chance of being dealt a black jack and profiting 1.5x our bet.

So, of the 49.75% of hands blackyjacky thinks he should be winning, he should expect to be paid even money on 45.02% of them, and 1.5x on 4.73% of them.

Lets say 100,000:
That would be 4,730 black jacks, 45,020 even money wins, and 50,250 losses.

He will be paid $2.50 on each black jack and $2 on the other wins.

4,730 * $2.50 = $11,825
45,020 * $2 = $90,040
Total = $101,865
Result  = +$1,865 (1.8% ROI)
(note: I'm not calculating for when the dealer is also dealt black jack and the bet is pushed, which happens 0.22% of the time. so the profit is a couple hundred bucks too high in my calculation)

Conclusion: Blackyjacky is pulling numbers out of his ass.  

Stake in-house Black Jack is rigged, [email protected] ignores!

Yeah.. kind of felt that way. I really don't want to speak out of turn since I might be wrong, it was so long ago, but I think I tried to get MintDice on there, a provably fair casino which fit the requirements. I think I was ignored (though I could be wrong).

In general, I think the idea of this foundation is a very good one. Inform people of the importance of provably fair options and to keep things open and transparent whenever possible. Which the vast majority of casinos don't abide by.

But if there's no real process to get in... it's kind of worthless.

I take it you've realized now that your math was wrong but have too much of an ego to admit it so you will just pretend it's right.