Have the Flight Data Recorder been recovered yet. Last I read, only its empty shell was found with no content.
Also, not all seems to be as streamlined with the suicide theory as it first seems:
Hacked: Did You Really Think Cockpit Door Was Locked?
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2015/03/27/350535/
and
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2015/03/27/neo-trailing-isis-to-tel-aviv/
Topic: France plane crash: No survivors expected [Condolences to the families] - page 3. (Read 7989 times)
March 29, 2015, 04:30:56 PM
March 29, 2015, 09:43:00 AM
Could it be possible that the co-pilot suffered a stroke or brain aneurysm which left him in a delusional state as he tried to land the plane? If so, then perhaps he mistook the captain for an intruder. Or perhaps he fell unconscious at the controls? Perhaps there was some sort of breach in the cockpit's windshield (e.g. a leak which would not have been detectable by the voice recorder) which caused a decompression incident in the cockpit which caused loss of consciousness and shut the cockpit door firmly closed?
The cockpit voice recorder heard the faint breathing of the co-pilot as the plane descended. It would of certainly heard a broken window.
Edit: Disturbingly the co-pilot's breathing was completely calm and relaxed!
March 29, 2015, 09:41:03 AM
So what are the odds of this not being a murder-suicide now? While the evidence gathered so far certainly points towards the co-pilot being the one at fault, could there be any other reasons that might explain why he was unresponsive and why he flew his plane into the ground?
Could it be possible that the co-pilot suffered a stroke or brain aneurysm which left him in a delusional state as he tried to land the plane? If so, then perhaps he mistook the captain for an intruder. Or perhaps he fell unconscious at the controls? Perhaps there was some sort of breach in the cockpit's windshield (e.g. a leak which would not have been detectable by the voice recorder) which caused a decompression incident in the cockpit which caused loss of consciousness and shut the cockpit door firmly closed?
A decompression in the cockpit would have blown the door open, not closed it more firmly. Pilots usually have oxygen masks that auto inflate above 25,000 feet, since there is no time at those altitudes to grab a mask and put it on, should decompression occur.Could it be possible that the co-pilot suffered a stroke or brain aneurysm which left him in a delusional state as he tried to land the plane? If so, then perhaps he mistook the captain for an intruder. Or perhaps he fell unconscious at the controls? Perhaps there was some sort of breach in the cockpit's windshield (e.g. a leak which would not have been detectable by the voice recorder) which caused a decompression incident in the cockpit which caused loss of consciousness and shut the cockpit door firmly closed?
"as he tried to land..."
There was no attempt to land this plane, it was deliberately crashed from 38,000 feet.
March 29, 2015, 09:23:49 AM
So what are the odds of this not being a murder-suicide now? While the evidence gathered so far certainly points towards the co-pilot being the one at fault, could there be any other reasons that might explain why he was unresponsive and why he flew his plane into the ground?
Could it be possible that the co-pilot suffered a stroke or brain aneurysm which left him in a delusional state as he tried to land the plane? If so, then perhaps he mistook the captain for an intruder. Or perhaps he fell unconscious at the controls? Perhaps there was some sort of breach in the cockpit's windshield (e.g. a leak which would not have been detectable by the voice recorder) which caused a decompression incident in the cockpit which caused loss of consciousness and shut the cockpit door firmly closed?
Could it be possible that the co-pilot suffered a stroke or brain aneurysm which left him in a delusional state as he tried to land the plane? If so, then perhaps he mistook the captain for an intruder. Or perhaps he fell unconscious at the controls? Perhaps there was some sort of breach in the cockpit's windshield (e.g. a leak which would not have been detectable by the voice recorder) which caused a decompression incident in the cockpit which caused loss of consciousness and shut the cockpit door firmly closed?
March 29, 2015, 07:05:07 AM
is it the plane crash because the pilot suicide ?
bcos in my country that news said the pilot suicide and something.
Yes, they just published the tapes from the cockpit. The captain went to the bathroom and the co-pilot closed the door and started to descend. The captain couldn't get in and started to hit the door and shout from the outside, but the other guy never answered. Apparently he had problems with his eyes and could lose the licence, so it seems the whole thing was planned. bcos in my country that news said the pilot suicide and something.
I can understand he wanted to die, but why not rent a plane and crash it yourself? Why would you kill so many innocent people? Such people should be brought back to life and then slowly killed again.
March 29, 2015, 01:13:42 AM
is it the plane crash because the pilot suicide ?
bcos in my country that news said the pilot suicide and something.
bcos in my country that news said the pilot suicide and something.
March 28, 2015, 09:29:09 PM
Guess they'll have to start doing better background checks on Pilots, as well as mental health checks, etc. Scary. Poor people on board must have known as the other Pilot was banging on the cockpit door.
March 28, 2015, 03:03:15 PM
It's happened before see SilkAir 185 and Pacific 773
March 28, 2015, 01:52:18 PM
Always fun to listen to these guys,,, always good analysis of major events.
https://www.noagendaplayer.com/listen/707/12-58
On the Germanwing Crash
https://www.noagendaplayer.com/listen/707/12-58
On the Germanwing Crash
March 28, 2015, 01:45:29 PM
http://www.planecrashinfo.com/cause.htm
This site is full of air accident stats. Number of accidents and fatalities have both been trending down, even though the number of flights increases year over year. 2014 was an outlier year in terms of number of fatalities.
This site is full of air accident stats. Number of accidents and fatalities have both been trending down, even though the number of flights increases year over year. 2014 was an outlier year in terms of number of fatalities.
March 28, 2015, 01:31:46 PM
Damn, it seems like there's been a lot or air disasters recently. Has there been any comment on the cause of it?
There was only 1 other plane crash this year, which still makes planes very safe and reliable. Just think about it, most airports in the world have over 10 takeoffs every hour and out of these thousands of planes in air every day we have maybe one crash every 2 months. I read a lot about plane crashes and most are due to human error.
Just like cars, plane travel will become a lot safer when humans are taken out of the equation and only used for emergencies (mechanical problems).
Exactly, human error is the cause for most of the accidents found in automobiles and aircrafts.
March 28, 2015, 12:55:14 PM
....
Might work, but you'll still need someone to operate the system. Who would that be? The pilot? The flight attendants?
Where would the button be? If we put it outside the cockpit a rogue passenger could eject everyone. If inside, it would make it easier for the pilot to kill everyone without crashing the plane. He'd just have to push it somewhere over the Arctic Ocean and they'd be all dead of hypothermia within an hour.
The solution to this new wave of maniacal use of the heavy locked door to the cockpit is to simply mandate that it be unlocked.Might work, but you'll still need someone to operate the system. Who would that be? The pilot? The flight attendants?
Where would the button be? If we put it outside the cockpit a rogue passenger could eject everyone. If inside, it would make it easier for the pilot to kill everyone without crashing the plane. He'd just have to push it somewhere over the Arctic Ocean and they'd be all dead of hypothermia within an hour.
Then any crazy or religious-crazy pilot or copilot would have to deal with the passengers not being inclined to participate with the crazy.
Crazy passengers would have to deal with the other passengers.
Majority would rule.
March 28, 2015, 09:21:43 AM
Responding to the developments, Mr Driessens said: ‘Looking back, I slowly start to be angry. I don’t understand how a serious company can let a depressed man pilot a plane.
How was the airline to know the pilot was depressed?
There is no central database to store that information. Even if it was required to disclose the info to the current employer, a person could just switch jobs and be anonymous again.
Should we set up a registry? How would that clash with privacy rights? Depression is a pretty private issue.
I've been depressed in my life. I would be horrified if an entire forum found out about that, so I keep it a secret.
I don't think you'd need to go that far; I imagine some form of regular psychological assessment of the flight crew, mandated by the company, would go a long way in helping to determine if they were fit to fly. Now, this wouldn't work in every scenario, of course, as there is a limit to what those tests can do; but it might be better than just expecting them to self-report, which often doesn't seem to happen, perhaps out of fear of losing the job, financial problems, and so on.
Pilots have to undergo regular (annual) medical testing, but these are just physical examinations and do not include a psychological assessments.
I feel that you are not really depressed but if you do. Why would you go as far as avoiding talking about it and keeping it secret? Closing in with your depression is nothing good, you should be seeking help and not running away from solution. I would rather know if someone I know or have contact with is under effect of depression...
The possibility of losing your job (and just the stigma) is a real deterrent.
March 28, 2015, 09:14:22 AM
Responding to the developments, Mr Driessens said: ‘Looking back, I slowly start to be angry. I don’t understand how a serious company can let a depressed man pilot a plane.
How was the airline to know the pilot was depressed?
There is no central database to store that information. Even if it was required to disclose the info to the current employer, a person could just switch jobs and be anonymous again.
Should we set up a registry? How would that clash with privacy rights? Depression is a pretty private issue.
I've been depressed in my life. I would be horrified if an entire forum found out about that, so I keep it a secret.
March 28, 2015, 08:58:05 AM
Responding to the developments, Mr Driessens said: ‘Looking back, I slowly start to be angry. I don’t understand how a serious company can let a depressed man pilot a plane.
How was the airline to know the pilot was depressed?
There is no central database to store that information. Even if it was required to disclose the info to the current employer, a person could just switch jobs and be anonymous again.
Should we set up a registry? How would that clash with privacy rights? Depression is a pretty private issue.
I've been depressed in my life. I would be horrified if an entire forum found out about that, so I keep it a secret.
I don't think you'd need to go that far; I imagine some form of regular psychological assessment of the flight crew, mandated by the company, would go a long way in helping to determine if they were fit to fly. Now, this wouldn't work in every scenario, of course, as there is a limit to what those tests can do; but it might be better than just expecting them to self-report, which often doesn't seem to happen, perhaps out of fear of losing the job, financial problems, and so on.
March 27, 2015, 10:57:00 PM
Absolutely heartbreaking to hear, it all seems so senseless. Can't imagine what it must have been like during those 8 minutes in descent.
March 27, 2015, 09:57:19 PM
Responding to the developments, Mr Driessens said: ‘Looking back, I slowly start to be angry. I don’t understand how a serious company can let a depressed man pilot a plane.
How was the airline to know the pilot was depressed?
There is no central database to store that information. Even if it was required to disclose the info to the current employer, a person could just switch jobs and be anonymous again.
Should we set up a registry? How would that clash with privacy rights? Depression is a pretty private issue.
I've been depressed in my life. I would be horrified if an entire forum found out about that, so I keep it a secret.
March 27, 2015, 09:51:59 PM
How Germanwings Co-Pilot Hid Secret Mental Illness
Families' fury at airline as police find pile of torn-up sick notes in home of killer nicknamed 'Tomato Andy' - including one for day he crashed jet
The co-pilot who crashed his plane into a mountain killing himself and 149 people hid a secret illness from his employers, German prosecutors have revealed.
‘Obsessive’ Andreas Lubitz locked the captain out of the Airbus A320’s cockpit before setting the plane’s controls to descend into a rocky valley, it emerged yesterday.
Following a search of Lubitz’s Dusseldorf apartment, investigators today revealed they had found old torn-up sick leave notes, current ones and one issued for the day of the disaster.
Prosecutors said the finds indicate 28-year-old Lubitz may have had a medical condition which he kept secret from his employers, budget airline Germanwings. They have found no suicide note or claim of responsibility and no evidence of a political or religious motivation for his actions.
As the revelations emerged, families of those killed in the disaster expressed fury that Germanwings allowed Lubitz to fly a plane. Claude Driessens, whose 59-year-old brother died on the Airbus A320, said the co-pilot should not have been anywhere near the cockpit.
Responding to the developments, Mr Driessens said: ‘Looking back, I slowly start to be angry. I don’t understand how a serious company can let a depressed man pilot a plane.
‘Because the boy was depressed, it was necessary to say he was. It’s not normal to leave somebody by himself in charge, and who shuts the doors, I’m very angry.’
More...https://www.lewrockwell.com/2015/03/no_author/killer-pilot-was-under-psychiatric-care/
Families' fury at airline as police find pile of torn-up sick notes in home of killer nicknamed 'Tomato Andy' - including one for day he crashed jet
The co-pilot who crashed his plane into a mountain killing himself and 149 people hid a secret illness from his employers, German prosecutors have revealed.
‘Obsessive’ Andreas Lubitz locked the captain out of the Airbus A320’s cockpit before setting the plane’s controls to descend into a rocky valley, it emerged yesterday.
Following a search of Lubitz’s Dusseldorf apartment, investigators today revealed they had found old torn-up sick leave notes, current ones and one issued for the day of the disaster.
Prosecutors said the finds indicate 28-year-old Lubitz may have had a medical condition which he kept secret from his employers, budget airline Germanwings. They have found no suicide note or claim of responsibility and no evidence of a political or religious motivation for his actions.
As the revelations emerged, families of those killed in the disaster expressed fury that Germanwings allowed Lubitz to fly a plane. Claude Driessens, whose 59-year-old brother died on the Airbus A320, said the co-pilot should not have been anywhere near the cockpit.
Responding to the developments, Mr Driessens said: ‘Looking back, I slowly start to be angry. I don’t understand how a serious company can let a depressed man pilot a plane.
‘Because the boy was depressed, it was necessary to say he was. It’s not normal to leave somebody by himself in charge, and who shuts the doors, I’m very angry.’
More...https://www.lewrockwell.com/2015/03/no_author/killer-pilot-was-under-psychiatric-care/
March 27, 2015, 09:13:01 PM
Own jetpack won't work at extreme height, too cold and no oxigen, but the whole plane might be possible to first eject slowdown parachute at tail then lots of parachute/airbag around the body, thus ATC can override with an emergency brake and shutdown the engine
I think you're underestimating how much parachute you'd need to slow down a jetliner traveling at 600 mph. And a parachute to slow down an entire plane, assuming this was physically and mechanically feasible, would ostensibly be deployed from the cockpit, which makes this a solution that wouldn't have worked in this case, since the co-pilot locked out everyone who didn't want to crash the plane.
When you are taking a car driving course, your instructor can always step on break and stop the car. Air Traffic Control can not do this to an airplane because of safety concern, but if the plane can be safely parachuted, the control of plane can be overridden by ATC, the pilots will have no control over the plane when ATC take over
In fact if ATC can override, parachute is not needed, it can just autopilot the airplane to land on any nearby airport. You only need to code a specific emergency landing sequence in the airplane computer and trigger that sequence when something is wrong. But parachuting is easier than autopilot since it could also solve other problems like computer/engine/gear failure etc...
The amount of engineering this would require relative to its utility keeps this from being a worthwhile endeavor. (In my opinion.)
Maybe not, since the increased safety in air plane will draw more customers. A big obstacle for many people to take airplane is this psychological barrier that there is no parachute on commercial airliners, once you entered the cabin, you can only pray to god, quite scaring. High speed train will gain more support if airline's safety is not improving
March 27, 2015, 09:09:35 PM
Own jetpack won't work at extreme height, too cold and no oxigen, but the whole plane might be possible to first eject slowdown parachute at tail then lots of parachute/airbag around the body, thus ATC can override with an emergency brake and shutdown the engine
I think you're underestimating how much parachute you'd need to slow down a jetliner traveling at 600 mph. And a parachute to slow down an entire plane, assuming this was physically and mechanically feasible, would ostensibly be deployed from the cockpit, which makes this a solution that wouldn't have worked in this case, since the co-pilot locked out everyone who didn't want to crash the plane.
When you are taking a car driving course, your instructor can always step on break and stop the car. Air Traffic Control can not do this to an airplane because of safety concern, but if the plane can be safely parachuted, the control of plane can be overridden by ATC, the pilots will have no control over the plane when ATC take over
In fact if ATC can override, parachute is not needed, it can just autopilot the airplane to land on any nearby airport. You only need to code a specific emergency landing sequence in the airplane computer and trigger that sequence when something is wrong. But parachuting is easier than autopilot since it could also solve other problems like computer/engine/gear failure etc...
Would the autopilot be able to land everywhere? Someone said above that it worked on large airports but airports can be different and with different sizes, etc. And maybe it could cause problems for the airport if they weren't ready.
And if you can send information to the plane to do that, or to say it can't land there, can't there be the risk of it being used to hijack the plane? : /
That's why parachuting is a better practice, hijack the plane just make it parachuted (Those pilots will be crazy after being parachuted forcefully
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