Topic: I am about to do something massivley stupid - page 8. (Read 24167 times)

Then why are you doing it?  Look, I can't see into the future, it's possible that this could be the smartest thing you ever did.  But on the other hand, isn't the fact that you want to do this now, even when you say "I know it is stupid, but I want to do it anyway" evidence for the fact that you are letting your emotions make this decision for you?  I mean, I know there are arguments pro and contra, but what is actually making the decision for you?  Is it a greed-joy-induced high, or are you feeling sober? From my short personal experience in silver, I have learned that crazy gains can stop the bloodflow to your brains and end badly (I overleveraged too much thinking I could be out before the bubblepop, losing all my previous gains and then some).

My 2 cents, I am bullish on BTC, this could make you rich, but be honest to yourself about the true motivators and try to really think through (feel it) what speculative failure would do to your life.  Then decide if you think it is worth the risk.

In all seriousness, have you thought about other alternatives?  Do you have family who would be willing to loan you money?  You should explore other options before you take this route.  Not only that, but you have probably already put yourself at risk by posting about these intentions, for the reasons DeathAndTaxes mentioned on the first page.

Thanks proudhon. I was wondering what you were going to say. And yes, that is how I feel. Please be merciful because I know that this is a bad idea.

I think this will come in handy here.

Holy fuck, did Atlas and Dank combine and mutate into a Super-moron?  This is seriously the dumbest fucking thing I have seen here in a while. 

Thank you for your thoughtful reply. This is the kind of negative post I am happy to receive.

Do you think that it is wiser to use a credit card for this kind of purchase despite the large fees involved? Like I said before I am not into running afoul of the law. I don't think that using a student loan in this manner is fraudulent, but I am not going forward unless I am sure.


This is actually my biggest concern and the only reason why I would change my bullish stance. But this is my biggest concern even WITHOUT taking out a loan though...

I have a tent...

But really, unless my parents lose their home (entirely possible) I will have a place to live. If they don't have their home I think I will have bigger problems than all of this, including the student loan. A refugee camp wouldn't sound outlandish at that point...


This is my problem like I said before. I get that there are risks involved and I have been thinking about this since before the uptick. I had been holding for 4-5 months at that point and then I thought the price hike was a bubble. So I waited... for 2 months. You all know what happened.

And it's not like I can convince you, but I am the kind of person who decides something and sticks with it like a mule. This has gotten me in trouble quite a few times...

I am actually counting on the adoption to stagnate, I don't believe that this rally can continue but I am also afraid that it will. This is what is driving me towards the loan. I would actually feel relief if it fell back to $15-$10 after I bought, below that not so much. My stop loss would hit me at $5 where I would crawl away with ~$2k left and I would be ~$10k in debt assuming this all happens tomorrow. If it did in a year or two I would just break even.

The truth is that none of us knows what will happen. This is life.

Edit: However, if the market crashed in a year or two when I have everything paid off, I probably wouldn’t pull a stop loss because I wouldn't stand to make anything off of it. The money would be gone either way, why the hell would I care? You can't have less than 0.

15k is not so much and guess what, if you don't gamble you ll never win.
Even at 36$, if you think spending your time and money in creating a business is less risky then i bet you never did.
but there is still a shit loads of people doing it, so why not a loan for bitcoin?
Be aware of the risk, you might loose it all, act accordingly.
Be prepared to live with your parents for a bit more and good luck with that!


And also the more bitcoin goes up the more those loan folks will appear it is not a sign of future colapse it is due to the fact that btc price is rising. But i agree the proportion of thoose against the proportion of regular hoarder or btc spender will have a direct impact on the eventual bubble pop.
Now i have no idea of this proportion...

Yeah, I'm pretty much a permabull here, and that was my first thought when reading this post...


Regardless, to the OP:

Read DeathAndTaxes' post a few times. I have no issue with people taking risks that they fully understand, but this is just fraudulent and stupid. As D&T points out, student loan debt never goes away. Pretty much all other types do. Credit card debt pretty readily (and that doesn't (directly) screw me, the taxpayer, when you default).

I know you're not planning on defaulting, but your financial position suggests a volatile situation where even *you* may not be aware of how you'll react to various developments. I question your resolve to hold for "at least 5-10 years" if, say, this current wave of adoption stagnates, maybe there's a high-profile hack or two, maybe Chuck Schumer gets some ugly bill to pass banning bitcoin and law-abiding merchants jump ship... Price slowly drops towards single digits, hashrate falls, no new positive news stories about bitcoin every week...

I would (and did in 2011) continue to accumulate in such a scenario, since none of the above indicates a long-term fundamentals change.....that's the luxury of not being leveraged. You, on the other hand, with no ability to even pay rent, would face, shall we say, a different set of incentives and considerations.

You know what? Ignore what I said...you should totally get that loan.

But, instead of putting it all into bitcoin, you should take some of it (like at least 30%-40%) and blow it on a shitload of hookers and coke. Then, in a drug-and-herpes fueled rampage, you should try and rob the liquor store across town (because, hey, you gotta come down, right?).  After shooting the cashier and ditching the police in a high-speed chase, you can torch the car and hitchhike back to mommy and daddy's house with a bag full of money and a six pack of PBR.

Problem solved.

I only want to sell $15k worth, the rest I keep. I plan on buying everything I can in btc. And like I said, if I make it I want to keep it. The tax man didn't take on this risk, why should he get a slice? If I had a million I wouldn’t care and I would be happy to pay my taxes like a good 1%er.

Dear God please don't let prodhon show up...

the capital gains are added to whatever other income you had. So to avoid taxes you would just not sell more than 30k worth in a year...

This is true, but I think of it as if I am one of the people who bought in at the previous all time high. If I hold long enough I just might make it to the next one.

Or I could just have to pay a shit ton of money

Seriously, can I quote you on that!? Lol!

That is fantastic if it is true. Now my next question would be: If I make more than $36k, in bitcoin value, does that mean I am still considered 'low income'?

Lessons learned about financial markets can be hard. It doesn't seam like you learned such lessons already - buying in when the price is peaking on an all-time high is hardly clever.
However I am holding which is also kind of "buying"...

Actually if you are in a low income tax bracket (something like below 32k in the US.. or maybe it's 36k.. somewhere in there) you don't pay taxes on capital gains. And bitcoin appreciation would be a capital gain I am pretty sure.

Now this is why I posted my question. Thank you for your advice, I knew I was going to get the haters but I was willing to fight through it to see what the thoughtful people had to say.


I was doing this until I realized that I didn't have the cashflow I desired. The people around me are all willing to loan me the money, but I don't want them to take on the risk. If I make a mistake, it is my mistake and no one but me will pay for it.

I am expanding my income, I am even selling all of my stuff. I didn't need it anyway, I just read books, listen to music, program, work, and go to school. I can reasonably forsee myself making enough money to pay off this loan very soon. I just don't want to wait another year or two and have my purchasing power diminished.

I thought about buying some rigs, but it seems like I would be taking on even more risk. BFL hasn't even delivered and the difficulty is variable. I would rather have the coins then be hoping to have the coins and being nervous that the difficulty rises to 300X it's current value.

May miracles never cease...I agree with ~notig on something!

learn from the mistakes from others !
I thought of doing that when bitcoins were at 1$ and sometimes regretted and that was with a job and decent income.
No matter the rise in price, you can still manage to fuck it up big time. There are other factors in play and your emotions are going to mess around and screw you.
Have a plan for all scenarios and stick to the plan before the fan takes the hit. What are you going to do if bitcoins go back to 10$ losing 3/4 of your investment? Bitcoins will hit 100 and you will think how grandiose things are, then they will drop to 20-30 for a whole 18 months and you will have pressure from outside to sell those useless coins and that will frustrate you because you know it is a good investment, it is just you got the timing all wrong.
The price will drop at some point, albeit temporarily, prepare accordingly.

Avoid debt, be smart. Invest a little bit every month from your current income, at least 10% and you will sleep much better at night.
Seek to expand your income and increase your monthly purchase.