Incoming Avalon News 8/9/2013 - page 20.

bigbeninlondon

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Quote from: pajak666 on August 30, 2013, 04:46:06 PM

you can buy overpriced chips "in stock" at chinese market, chips pre-funded by bitcointalk community.
we have no chips, meanwhile chinese resellers have chips in stock with production date corelating with our orders.
troll harder

Yea, because it's impossible that those chips were ordered by a Chinese reseller whose interested in bitcoin and got there before the group buys did. Right? There's no way that could possibly happen, right?

bigbeninlondon

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Quote from: ecliptic on August 30, 2013, 04:42:56 PM

They ordered the chips with your money, SOMEONE acquired them, used and still is using them for mining, and then they had to order another run of chips from TSMC after this happened. That's why the chips are so late.

Who acquired them? When? How do you know these chips are the same as the chips we ordered? This is exactly what I am talking about. You have no information to back any of these accusations up except "I saw a picture!!!".

Dunkelheit667

legendary

Activity: 1045

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no degradation

Quote from: Dunkelheit667 on August 29, 2013, 11:40:46 AM

Yifu, to exercise professionalism fill out this form:

I will deliver all April chip orders until...
I will deliver all May chip orders until...
I will deliver all June chip orders until...
I will deliver all July chip orders until...

Ytterbium

full member

Activity: 238

Merit: 100

Quote from: dnaleor on August 29, 2013, 10:04:35 AM

Quote from: jspielberg on August 29, 2013, 09:40:02 AM

Looks like yifu is pushing for full refunds for chip orders:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.3035535

Group buys should be okay, but someone is going to need to eat the cost of the PCB's and components.

I want my chips... Not a refund...
I hope it's still possible to receive chips and yofu will NOT refund just all orders...

Take your refund money and order a KnC or something. Or bitfury.

pajak666

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Looking for advertising deal

you can buy overpriced chips "in stock" at chinese market, chips pre-funded by bitcointalk community.
we have no chips, meanwhile chinese resellers have chips in stock with production date corelating with our orders.
troll harder

dmcdad

sr. member

Activity: 302

Merit: 250

Quote from: bigbeninlondon on August 30, 2013, 04:40:48 PM

But can we stop assuming these baseless accusations of shady backroom dealings and mining with chips (that would have to be mounted to boards before mining, which would be easy to see on the chips themselves) and all of this baseless nonsense?

Again, it isn't baseless. We don't have all the information but there are lots of facts you apparently refuse to acknowledge. Until Yifu provides more information, or sets things right (refund, etc.), the accusations will continue.

ecliptic

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Activity: 322

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Quote from: bigbeninlondon on August 30, 2013, 04:40:48 PM

Quote from: ecliptic on August 30, 2013, 04:37:44 PM

Quote from: bigbeninlondon on August 30, 2013, 04:28:20 PM

Quote from: SebastianJu on August 30, 2013, 04:14:35 PM

Man, im tired to defend myself to people that doesnt even bother if their claims are true.

I wonder if this is exactly how Bitsyncom feels. Don't mean to kick the hornet's nest, but there's a lot of speculation and accusation going on in this thread and others that is generally baseless as hell. The only two gripes we REALLY have are that the chips weren't delivered on time and Yifu has been very begrudging with information on his side. All this talk about reselling chips and making insane profits and mining with CHIPS that have to be SODERED ONTO A BOARD before they work is just that; talk. Can we please maintain a level head in all of this? Yifu has already stated he's looking into refunds. That's an acknowledgement that shit went wrong and an attempt to rectify the situation. Can all the crazy people take a break for a little while so the grownups can sort shit out please?

Nobody gives a shit about "acknowledging" solmething went wrong. That's self-evident, even a child can see that

What is desired, and what is purposely being withheld, covered up, and obfusciated is WHAT went wrong.

Ordering chips by a 10k reel from a fab and shipping them is orders of magnitude easier than selling their Batches #1 to #3

There is good evidence that a great deal of these chips EXISTED and WERE SHIPPED TOGETHER back in June to China.

Lots of talk on Chinese forums about backroom deals

Part of Avalon broke off at this time as well. Did they take all the chips? Why so secretive?

Are these new batches just the "OH FUCK" second order they had to make?

He said himself "NO BS" terms. Bullshit happened, and it wasn't explained.

Don't even start with "conspiracy" talk either. These are plain facts, most of these yifu / avalon / etc admitted themselves.

Until we get some real answers, nobody is going to trust Avalon. I'm not sure why they're even bothering with a 2nd gen while they leave these unanswered.

The 'answers' we have gotten about customs simply do not line up with the facts, and don't account for what we have seen.

Sure, don't trust them. Sure, don't bother with 2nd gen. But can we stop assuming these baseless accusations of shady backroom dealings and mining with chips (that would have to be mounted to boards before mining, which would be easy to see on the chips themselves) and all of this baseless nonsense? There are real issues here that I'm not discounting. I just hate all the extra bullshit that slips in and then is repeated over and over until everyone assumes it's the truth. The truth is: A) Chips are late as fuck B) Yifu is very withholding of crucial information and C) He's offering refunds. Everything else is speculation and should be treated as such.

Yes, How fucking crazy to think that a possible 10 - 50,000,000$ profit in the hands of a dozen people or less classifies as a "conspiracy".

They're not mining with your chips and shipping them to you

They took your chips and ordered "your" chips 10+ weeks LATER, AGAIN, after SOMEONE took the first batch.

1. You order chips from TSMC
2. TSMC ships them 8-10 weeks later
3. You ship them to the customer

So what the fuck went wrong?

And stop with this fucking stupid ass strawman of "they took the chips, mounted them, then UNMOUNTED them and shipped them!"

No you asshole

They ordered the chips with your money, SOMEONE acquired them, used and still is using them for mining, and then they had to order another run of chips from TSMC after this happened. That's why the chips are so late.

bigbeninlondon

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Activity: 742

Merit: 500

Quote from: ecliptic on August 30, 2013, 04:37:44 PM

Quote from: bigbeninlondon on August 30, 2013, 04:28:20 PM

Quote from: SebastianJu on August 30, 2013, 04:14:35 PM

Man, im tired to defend myself to people that doesnt even bother if their claims are true.

I wonder if this is exactly how Bitsyncom feels. Don't mean to kick the hornet's nest, but there's a lot of speculation and accusation going on in this thread and others that is generally baseless as hell. The only two gripes we REALLY have are that the chips weren't delivered on time and Yifu has been very begrudging with information on his side. All this talk about reselling chips and making insane profits and mining with CHIPS that have to be SODERED ONTO A BOARD before they work is just that; talk. Can we please maintain a level head in all of this? Yifu has already stated he's looking into refunds. That's an acknowledgement that shit went wrong and an attempt to rectify the situation. Can all the crazy people take a break for a little while so the grownups can sort shit out please?

Nobody gives a shit about "acknowledging" solmething went wrong. That's self-evident, even a child can see that

What is desired, and what is purposely being withheld, covered up, and obfusciated is WHAT went wrong.

Ordering chips by a 10k reel from a fab and shipping them is orders of magnitude easier than selling their Batches #1 to #3

There is good evidence that a great deal of these chips EXISTED and WERE SHIPPED TOGETHER back in June to China.

Lots of talk on Chinese forums about backroom deals

Part of Avalon broke off at this time as well. Did they take all the chips? Why so secretive?

Are these new batches just the "OH FUCK" second order they had to make?

He said himself "NO BS" terms. Bullshit happened, and it wasn't explained.

Don't even start with "conspiracy" talk either. These are plain facts, most of these yifu / avalon / etc admitted themselves.

Until we get some real answers, nobody is going to trust Avalon. I'm not sure why they're even bothering with a 2nd gen while they leave these unanswered.

The 'answers' we have gotten about customs simply do not line up with the facts, and don't account for what we have seen.

Sure, don't trust them. Sure, don't bother with 2nd gen. But can we stop assuming these baseless accusations of shady backroom dealings and mining with chips (that would have to be mounted to boards before mining, which would be easy to see on the chips themselves) and all of this baseless nonsense? There are real issues here that I'm not discounting. I just hate all the extra bullshit that slips in and then is repeated over and over until everyone assumes it's the truth. The truth is: A) Chips are late as fuck B) Yifu is very withholding of crucial information and C) He's offering refunds. Everything else is speculation and should be treated as such.

ecliptic

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Activity: 322

Merit: 250

Quote from: bigbeninlondon on August 30, 2013, 04:38:06 PM

Quote from: pajak666 on August 30, 2013, 04:36:13 PM

Quote from: bigbeninlondon on August 30, 2013, 04:28:20 PM

Quote from: SebastianJu on August 30, 2013, 04:14:35 PM

Man, im tired to defend myself to people that doesnt even bother if their claims are true.

I wonder if this is exactly how Bitsyncom feels. Don't mean to kick the hornet's nest, but there's a lot of speculation and accusation going on in this thread and others that is generally baseless as hell. The only two gripes we REALLY have are that the chips weren't delivered on time and Yifu has been very begrudging with information on his side. All this talk about reselling chips and making insane profits and mining with CHIPS that have to be SODERED ONTO A BOARD before they work is just that; talk. Can we please maintain a level head in all of this? Yifu has already stated he's looking into refunds. That's an acknowledgement that shit went wrong and an attempt to rectify the situation. Can all the crazy people take a break for a little while so the grownups can sort shit out please?

read thread carefully, search for tracking numbers, and then skip to page 80 to see chips from china.

Those chips on page 80 prove nothing. Those chips were bought by a reseller for a client that never showed up. How does that prove anything at all? Everything on this thread is pure speculation.

Why the fuck are chips ordered in april, with an 8-10 week leadtime coming down with 2-3x that leadtime?

All the evidence points to the fact that the first batch was indeed ordered, but never showed up. These very few chips that have begun to ship? They were ordered from the fab 8-10 weeks ago from today.

They are fucking chips from TSMC. They've already been made, the masks are good, it's simply a process of ordering more. It's the simplest fucking thing in the world, there is no long and complicated supply chain for a PCB assembly. There is the manufacturer of the chips, and the group buy / private party buying them.

bigbeninlondon

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Activity: 742

Merit: 500

Quote from: pajak666 on August 30, 2013, 04:36:13 PM

Quote from: bigbeninlondon on August 30, 2013, 04:28:20 PM

Quote from: SebastianJu on August 30, 2013, 04:14:35 PM

Man, im tired to defend myself to people that doesnt even bother if their claims are true.

I wonder if this is exactly how Bitsyncom feels. Don't mean to kick the hornet's nest, but there's a lot of speculation and accusation going on in this thread and others that is generally baseless as hell. The only two gripes we REALLY have are that the chips weren't delivered on time and Yifu has been very begrudging with information on his side. All this talk about reselling chips and making insane profits and mining with CHIPS that have to be SODERED ONTO A BOARD before they work is just that; talk. Can we please maintain a level head in all of this? Yifu has already stated he's looking into refunds. That's an acknowledgement that shit went wrong and an attempt to rectify the situation. Can all the crazy people take a break for a little while so the grownups can sort shit out please?

read thread carefully, search for tracking numbers, and then skip to page 80 to see chips from china.

Those chips on page 80 prove nothing. Those chips were bought by a reseller for a client that never showed up. How does that prove anything at all? Everything on this thread is pure speculation.

ecliptic

sr. member

Activity: 322

Merit: 250

Quote from: bigbeninlondon on August 30, 2013, 04:28:20 PM

Quote from: SebastianJu on August 30, 2013, 04:14:35 PM

Man, im tired to defend myself to people that doesnt even bother if their claims are true.

I wonder if this is exactly how Bitsyncom feels. Don't mean to kick the hornet's nest, but there's a lot of speculation and accusation going on in this thread and others that is generally baseless as hell. The only two gripes we REALLY have are that the chips weren't delivered on time and Yifu has been very begrudging with information on his side. All this talk about reselling chips and making insane profits and mining with CHIPS that have to be SODERED ONTO A BOARD before they work is just that; talk. Can we please maintain a level head in all of this? Yifu has already stated he's looking into refunds. That's an acknowledgement that shit went wrong and an attempt to rectify the situation. Can all the crazy people take a break for a little while so the grownups can sort shit out please?

Nobody gives a shit about "acknowledging" solmething went wrong. That's self-evident, even a child can see that

What is desired, and what is purposely being withheld, covered up, and obfusciated is WHAT went wrong.

Ordering chips by a 10k reel from a fab and shipping them is orders of magnitude easier than selling their Batches #1 to #3

There is good evidence that a great deal of these chips EXISTED and WERE SHIPPED TOGETHER back in June to China.

Lots of talk on Chinese forums about backroom deals

Part of Avalon broke off at this time as well. Did they take all the chips? Why so secretive?

Are these new batches just the "OH FUCK" second order they had to make?

He said himself "NO BS" terms. Bullshit happened, and it wasn't explained.

Don't even start with "conspiracy" talk either. These are plain facts, most of these yifu / avalon / etc admitted themselves.

Until we get some real answers, nobody is going to trust Avalon. I'm not sure why they're even bothering with a 2nd gen while they leave these unanswered.

The 'answers' we have gotten about customs simply do not line up with the facts, and don't account for what we have seen.

Ytterbium

full member

Activity: 238

Merit: 100

Quote from: VinceSamios on August 29, 2013, 01:38:12 AM

Quote from: BitSyncom on August 28, 2013, 05:15:05 PM

I am tired of this toxic community malformed by greed.

Dude has a point...

Should have thought about it before COLLECTING MILLIONS OF DOLLARS from people on this board.

bigbeninlondon

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Quote from: dmcdad on August 30, 2013, 04:33:34 PM

Quote from: bigbeninlondon on August 30, 2013, 04:28:20 PM

but there's a lot of speculation and accusation going on in this thread and others that is generally baseless as hell.

I don't consider the photos of millions of chips from months ago baseless. I mean if that accusation (that Yufo sold the chips to a higher bidder and now is having problems getting our chips produced), then he is more than welcome to set the record straight. But if it walks like a duck, and it quacks like a duck...

You got photos of a bunch of chips. Those could have been private orders not related to the group buys. Yifu himself said most of the orders originated in China. If you don't know where those chips went, or where they are now, how can you say that any accusation isn't baseless? You have no evidence of anything except pictures of chips that didn't have a name on them and no indication of who they belonged to that never showed up on radar. That's pretty baseless in my book.

pajak666

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Looking for advertising deal

Quote from: bigbeninlondon on August 30, 2013, 04:28:20 PM

Quote from: SebastianJu on August 30, 2013, 04:14:35 PM

Man, im tired to defend myself to people that doesnt even bother if their claims are true.

I wonder if this is exactly how Bitsyncom feels. Don't mean to kick the hornet's nest, but there's a lot of speculation and accusation going on in this thread and others that is generally baseless as hell. The only two gripes we REALLY have are that the chips weren't delivered on time and Yifu has been very begrudging with information on his side. All this talk about reselling chips and making insane profits and mining with CHIPS that have to be SODERED ONTO A BOARD before they work is just that; talk. Can we please maintain a level head in all of this? Yifu has already stated he's looking into refunds. That's an acknowledgement that shit went wrong and an attempt to rectify the situation. Can all the crazy people take a break for a little while so the grownups can sort shit out please?

read thread carefully, search for tracking numbers, and then skip to page 80 to see chips from china.

knightlife999

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Whale Watchers and Pinnacle Brilliance founder

Quote from: bigbeninlondon on August 30, 2013, 04:28:20 PM

Quote from: SebastianJu on August 30, 2013, 04:14:35 PM

Man, im tired to defend myself to people that doesnt even bother if their claims are true.

I wonder if this is exactly how Bitsyncom feels. Don't mean to kick the hornet's nest, but there's a lot of speculation and accusation going on in this thread and others that is generally baseless as hell. The only two gripes we REALLY have are that the chips weren't delivered on time and Yifu has been very begrudging with information on his side. All this talk about reselling chips and making insane profits and mining with CHIPS that have to be SODERED ONTO A BOARD before they work is just that; talk. Can we please maintain a level head in all of this? Yifu has already stated he's looking into refunds. That's an acknowledgement that shit went wrong and an attempt to rectify the situation. Can all the crazy people take a break for a little while so the grownups can sort shit out please?

There is one thing we know for certain. The present chip batches arriving to people who ordered in mid April are stamped with dates that show they were made the first week of August. That has heavy implications. Either the chip batches were only ordered just recently, or the original batches were sold/used for something else.

dmcdad

sr. member

Activity: 302

Merit: 250

Quote from: bigbeninlondon on August 30, 2013, 04:28:20 PM

but there's a lot of speculation and accusation going on in this thread and others that is generally baseless as hell.

I don't consider the photos of millions of chips from months ago baseless. I mean if that accusation (that Yifu sold the chips to a higher bidder and now is having problems getting our chips produced), then he is more than welcome to set the record straight. But if it walks like a duck, and it quacks like a duck...

And I don't see how he is "tired" of defending himself. He hasn't defended himself. He's mentioned something about a gangster shake down a few chips being held up for a couple of weeks in customs. But he hasn't defended any of the accusations or explained where the hell the chips are.

bigbeninlondon

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Activity: 742

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Quote from: SebastianJu on August 30, 2013, 04:14:35 PM

Man, im tired to defend myself to people that doesnt even bother if their claims are true.

I wonder if this is exactly how Bitsyncom feels. Don't mean to kick the hornet's nest, but there's a lot of speculation and accusation going on in this thread and others that is generally baseless as hell. The only two gripes we REALLY have are that the chips weren't delivered on time and Yifu has been very begrudging with information on his side. All this talk about reselling chips and making insane profits and mining with CHIPS that have to be SODERED ONTO A BOARD before they work is just that; talk. Can we please maintain a level head in all of this? Yifu has already stated he's looking into refunds. That's an acknowledgement that shit went wrong and an attempt to rectify the situation. Can all the crazy people take a break for a little while so the grownups can sort shit out please?

SebastianJu

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Quote from: tinoki on August 29, 2013, 07:26:58 PM

Given that most us will never buy the Avalon Chips if there were no group buy, the moderators must keep their side of the bargain and refund in full amount to those who join their group buy. The only 1 so far who is ethical and will honour the refund is Zefir, he wrote to Yifu and got a reply. Sebastian and Steamboat has already make good profit's from their numerous group buys would you all please be considerate and be a great gentleman and refund back their money.

What the... do you actually inform yourself before you accuse other people? I was behind this all the time beneath the work with the groupbuy and it was really stress to run after Yifu. I sent him many tickets and pm's, i called him for days every hour 2-4 times. After some time i realized he wont answer me anymore. I cant understand this behaviour.

Regarding your claim the groupbuy organizers draw you into their groupbuy... What are you saying? I clearly stated everybody has to make his calculations on its own. And now you act like a child who was tricked into taking part in something? Please grow up.

And of course i try to get a refund. Now, after hours of reading through the wishes of the members of my groupbuy i find the time to read this thread and i see accusations that im too silent in this thread? Man, im tired to defend myself to people that doesnt even bother if their claims are true.

HorseRider

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Quote from: Xialla on August 30, 2013, 06:08:09 AM

Quote from: BitSyncom on August 28, 2013, 05:15:05 PM

I am tired of this toxic community malformed by greed.

.)) you kidding me chinese kid, right? maybe you are just stupid or completely lost your mind, bud please let me remind you your funny page:

Code:

The no bullshit, no fine print terms of sale:

5. the lead time on the chips is 9 to 10 weeks

source: http://store.avalon-asics.com/?page_id=9605

so, as you can see, there was a deal and you simply breach one of points defined by you..and now, after couple of weeks of delay, you have a courage to post something about greed? omfg, refund everybody and go away..

Avlaon team, including the Yifu Guo and ngzhang(张楠庚, aka 南瓜）, is a kind of low life, who breaks their own promise as often as they fucking their own ass.

MinermanNC

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Quote from: Bicknellski on August 30, 2013, 02:56:10 AM

Quote from: MinermanNC on August 29, 2013, 08:15:57 PM

Quote from: bystander on August 29, 2013, 07:53:51 PM

Quote from: tinoki on August 29, 2013, 07:26:58 PM

Given that most us will never buy the Avalon Chips if there were no group buy, the moderators must keep their side of the bargain and refund in full amount to those who join their group buy. The only 1 so far who is ethical and will honour the refund is Zefir, he wrote to Yifu and got a reply. Sebastian and Steamboat has already make good profit's from their numerous group buys would you all please be considerate and be a great gentleman and refund back their money.

Bicknellski refunded everyone in his group:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/refund-processing-completed-k1-nanos-big-picture-mining-cooperative-251831

I'm not part of his group, but have crossed a few paths with him thoughout this chip ordeal, but ya got to hand it to the guy, Bicknellski is so professional and genuine. We need more like him in this community, as he certainly raises the bar for the rest of us. Wink

You know what I think MOST of us posting are trying to do the right thing and that to me is professional and genuine... gullible is also another adjective for us as well unfortunately we believed and really should have listened to the Batch 1 to 3 people and their issues rather than simply assuming those damn chips being delivered would be a cakewalk.

Hind sight is always 20/20

Yet life is always a little bit of chance and risk I guess, especially when there is no clear way forward, no road map to follow as in the world of Bitcoin

Topic: Incoming Avalon News 8/9/2013 - page 20. (Read 186720 times)