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Topic: Israel: Operation Protective Edge (Read 14700 times)

sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 250
September 09, 2014, 06:12:15 AM
so, is this real or fan-fiction?
http://uprootedpalestinians.blogspot.co.il/2014/09/abbas-to-tamim-mishaal-lies.html

Quote
Abbas to Qatari Emir Tamim: Meshaal is lying
During the war and destruction in Gaza, Mahmoud Abbas (Abu Mazen) arrived on August 21 in Doha, to complain to the Qatari emir about “(Khaled) Meshaal the liar,” whose group he accused of trying to stage a coup in the West Bank. Mahmoud Abbas seemed tense. He brought to Emir Tamim bin Hamad “two issues that we cannot resolve”: The failed negotiations with Israel and the relationship with Hamas. “Hamas wants to drive me mad,” Abbas said. He relayed to the emir what the Israelis had told him, that “[They] have arrested 93 members of Hamas who were preparing to stage a coup in the West Bank, with help from Saleh al-Aruri from Turkey, while the liaison person between them in Amman was a man called Jawad.”
This strikes me as reasonable in the context. It makes me think a bit more highly of Abbas. I have very little respect for Hamas leadership, so that remains unchanged.
sr. member
Activity: 378
Merit: 250
September 09, 2014, 05:54:35 AM
so, is this real or fan-fiction?
http://uprootedpalestinians.blogspot.co.il/2014/09/abbas-to-tamim-mishaal-lies.html

Quote
Abbas to Qatari Emir Tamim: Meshaal is lying
During the war and destruction in Gaza, Mahmoud Abbas (Abu Mazen) arrived on August 21 in Doha, to complain to the Qatari emir about “(Khaled) Meshaal the liar,” whose group he accused of trying to stage a coup in the West Bank. Mahmoud Abbas seemed tense. He brought to Emir Tamim bin Hamad “two issues that we cannot resolve”: The failed negotiations with Israel and the relationship with Hamas. “Hamas wants to drive me mad,” Abbas said. He relayed to the emir what the Israelis had told him, that “[They] have arrested 93 members of Hamas who were preparing to stage a coup in the West Bank, with help from Saleh al-Aruri from Turkey, while the liaison person between them in Amman was a man called Jawad.”
sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 250
September 04, 2014, 12:35:16 PM
The most recent from the Combating Terrorism Center, it has an article on ISIS's military / political power in Iraq, and another on foreign fighters in Syria.
https://www.ctc.usma.edu/v2/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/CTCSentinel-Vol7Iss8.pdf
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
September 03, 2014, 09:52:49 AM
As for McGavin's links, I'm not a big fan of the Small Wars Journal, but Jihadica and Foreign Policy are pretty good sources.

For the most part, ISIS funds itself internally. Primary means of money are: smuggling, extortion / "taxation", kidnapping, the sale of oil both to Assad and to other parties through Iran, and the capture of monetary reserves in Mosul.

Other smaller sources include private funding (mostly from persons in Gulf States).
Thanks for the links, both of you.

I was wondering what you meant by sale of oil through Iran? I have a hard time seeing IS and Iran working together on anything, really.
Iran is just a smuggling route, like the Kurdish regions are. The Assad government is directly involved in buying oil straight from the ISIS, while Iran and Kurdish regions are mostly smuggling routes for black market transactions. There are already supply lines established up north through Kurdish black market deals as well that the ISIS can tap into.

ISIS now also has access to significant grain resources that it can sell internally in Iraq for money.
sr. member
Activity: 994
Merit: 441
September 03, 2014, 09:46:42 AM
As for McGavin's links, I'm not a big fan of the Small Wars Journal, but Jihadica and Foreign Policy are pretty good sources.

For the most part, ISIS funds itself internally. Primary means of money are: smuggling, extortion / "taxation", kidnapping, the sale of oil both to Assad and to other parties through Iran, and the capture of monetary reserves in Mosul.

Other smaller sources include private funding (mostly from persons in Gulf States).
Thanks for the links, both of you.

I was wondering what you meant by sale of oil through Iran? I have a hard time seeing IS and Iran working together on anything, really.
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
September 03, 2014, 09:39:24 AM
As for McGavin's links, I'm not a big fan of the Small Wars Journal, but Jihadica and Foreign Policy are pretty good sources.

For the most part, ISIS funds itself internally. Primary means of money are: smuggling, extortion / "taxation", kidnapping, the sale of oil both to Assad and to other parties through Iran, and the capture of monetary reserves in Mosul.

Other smaller sources include private funding (mostly from persons in Gulf States).
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
September 03, 2014, 09:21:52 AM
A general reading list that I have enjoyed as I learn about the ISIS. While I found these pieces informative, I must state that Iraq and Syria aren't large focuses of mine, so apologies in advance for an incomplete list.

Background: Divisions within Al Qaeda and the formation of the Islamic State of Iraq

Splits within Al Qaeda and Al Qaeda in Iraq's divide with al Qaeda Central:

Source 1: https://www.ctc.usma.edu/posts/lette...adin-sidelined

Source 2: https://www.ctc.usma.edu/posts/bewar...tial-secretary

Source 3: https://www.ctc.usma.edu/posts/self-inflicted-wounds

Background: The conflict in Syria (early years)

Source 1: http://www.understandingwar.org/report/jihad-syria

Background: The Awakening and AQI's defeat in Iraq

Source 1: http://www.hqmc.marines.mil/Portals/...lII%5B1%5D.pdf

Source 2: https://www.understandingwar.org/sit...g%20Forces.pdf

Source 3: https://www.understandingwar.org/rep...d-western-iraq

Background: Rising Sectarianism and the Islamic State of Iraq's resurgence

Source 1: http://www.understandingwar.org/back...and-remobilize

Source 2: http://www.understandingwar.org/repo...-sunnis-crisis

Source 3: http://www.understandingwar.org/repo...iraq-resurgent

Source 4: http://www.understandingwar.org/repo...urgent-part-ii

ISIS growth in Iraq and Syria:

Source 1: http://www.understandingwar.org/repo...returns-diyala

Source 2: http://www.understandingwar.org/repo...vernance-syria

Other players in Iraq:

Source 1: http://www.jamestown.org/uploads/med...Issue15_02.pdf

Source 2: http://www.understandingwar.org/back...isis-offensive

Source 3: http://www.longwarjournal.org/archiv...kes_in_ame.php

Jihadi discourse and financing:

Source 1: https://www.ctc.usma.edu/posts/jihad...he-arab-spring

Source 2: https://www.ctc.usma.edu/posts/risky...-of-contraband

Source 3: http://www.understandingwar.org/back...-islamic-state

For Leb, Hezbollah in Syria:

Source 1: http://www.understandingwar.org/report/hezbollah-syria
sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 250
September 03, 2014, 09:16:21 AM
2. http://www.smallarmssurvey.org/fileadmin/docs/R-SANA/SANA-Dispatch4-Syrian-Jihadism.pdf
Quote
ISIS’s advantages: funding
ISIS’s recruitment efforts have continued to increase its numbers of foreign fighters. Its solid funding—based in part on its own activities, primarily refining oil drilled in Syria’s ‘liberated’ areas (Hubbard, Krauss, and Schmitt, 4 SANA Dispatches · April 2014 Foreign Jihadism in Syria: The Islamic State of Iraq and al-Sham Small-calibre Ammunition in Libya: An Update ng 2014), and in part on sums that volunteers bring with them (often derived from the Muslim custom of zakat)—is rumoured to allow it to pay its fighters a salary.18 In a sense, ISIS’s increasing visibility and wealth have become self-sustaining: the more foreign fighters it has in its ranks, the more newly arrived foreign fighters seek to join, preferring to fight for a well-funded and consequently well-armed organization. As the ranks swell, the more educated and wealthy foreigners also gravitate to ISIS, taking up leadership positions in the field and bringing yet more money and networks of contacts to the group [...]

Box 1 Anatomy of recruitment
In practice, much of the recruitment is tied to local mosques, although not necessarily organized by mosque authorities. A given mosque may prove fertile ground for both recruitment and fundraising. The latter may be formally encouraged: in popular mosques in Fatih (the historic conservative quarter of Istanbul), for example, believers are regularly and strongly reminded of the third pillar of Islam: zakat or compulsory charity. The groups receiving donations may not necessarily be formally connected to the mosque and their charitable purpose may not be clear, e.g. donations taken to ‘ease the suffering’ of fellow Muslims in Syria may be used for travel expenses for volunteer fighters and even the purchase of weapons. The same ‘charity’ organizers (or people affiliated with them) may also provide volunteers with contacts in Syria and even ‘recruit’ interested young men to go and fight. Nevertheless, the presence of fundraising organizations–even informal recruitment by people associated with these organizations– should not be understood to equate with the existence of a formal recruiting network.


3. http://www.foi.se/Global/V%C3%A5r%20kunskap/S%C3%A4kerhetspolitiska%20studier/Asien/Rapporter_och_memon/FOI%20Memo%204947.pdf
Quote
Whilst little suggests that wages are used to recruit combatants, relying on well-established
and well-funded networks in part inherited from Al Qaeda in Iraq (AQI), allows JN and ISIS
to procure access to effective weaponry, offer humanitarian support to civilians and provide
fighters with training and logistical support. ISIS benefits from pre-existing funding sources
inside Iraq (including extortion in Mosul), whilst JN seems to receive support from donors in
the Gulf countries, and both organizations derive revenues from controlling oil wells in Syria,
a method previously developed in Iraq. Based on what is known about AQI, the financial
support structure is hierarchical, bureaucratic, exerts close monitoring of incomes and is able
to collect money in stable areas and channel them to militarily contested regions.
sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 250
September 03, 2014, 09:11:26 AM
Outside of that, most of what I have read recently has been reports released by various agencies and NGO's (Would be happy to share if you have a specific subject you wanted to read on, most are related to conflict, terrorism, economic development, or women's rights). I could also recommend fiction books like classic Sci Fi or fantasy which I also read a lot of depending on what you are interested in.
Have you read any reports on IS/ISIS that you'd recommend? I pretty much just read up on middle-east history whenever I get the chance.
There are a number absolutely. I mostly get by ISIS news from the Institute for the Study of War which has published several in depth papers on the organization in both Iraq and Syria, the Combating Terrorism Center, and the Jamestown Foundation. Also for some decent (though more conservative) reading, there is the Long War Journal.

Depending on how far back you'd like to go I'd be happy to suggest some specific papers that I found useful.
hmm, I'm not sure. Do you have anything that focuses on their funding/recruitment? Otherwise, if you've read any reports pertaining to their attacks on lebanese soil I'd be interested in that as well.
These three dispatches provide a nice overall summary for their general funding and recruitment. Obviously, like other violent terror organizations, additional funding derives from small-scale operations like kidnapping and ransom and extortion. I would definitely recommend reading articles from The Small Wars Journal, ForeignPolicy, and Jihadica for some great, great reading. The RAND Corporation also puts out some very dense articles about the group, which are free to download or view online.
1. http://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/view/saudi-funding-of-isis
Quote
PRIVATE DONATIONS
There is a misconception that the kingdom does not get in the way of private Saudi financing of terrorist groups operating in Syria, including ISIS. Yet one of Riyadh's most observable counter-terrorism financing activities is its monitoring of the country's formal financial sector in order to block suspect donations. Indeed, social media fundraising campaigns highlight the challenges of sending such funds from Saudi Arabia to Syria. To ensure that their contributions actually reach Syria, Saudi donors are encouraged to send their money to Kuwait, long considered one of the most permissive terrorism financing environments in the Persian Gulf.
sr. member
Activity: 994
Merit: 441
September 03, 2014, 09:05:06 AM
Outside of that, most of what I have read recently has been reports released by various agencies and NGO's (Would be happy to share if you have a specific subject you wanted to read on, most are related to conflict, terrorism, economic development, or women's rights). I could also recommend fiction books like classic Sci Fi or fantasy which I also read a lot of depending on what you are interested in.
Have you read any reports on IS/ISIS that you'd recommend? I pretty much just read up on middle-east history whenever I get the chance.
There are a number absolutely. I mostly get by ISIS news from the Institute for the Study of War which has published several in depth papers on the organization in both Iraq and Syria, the Combating Terrorism Center, and the Jamestown Foundation. Also for some decent (though more conservative) reading, there is the Long War Journal.

Depending on how far back you'd like to go I'd be happy to suggest some specific papers that I found useful.
hmm, I'm not sure. Do you have anything that focuses on their funding/recruitment? Otherwise, if you've read any reports pertaining to their attacks on lebanese soil I'd be interested in that as well.
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
September 03, 2014, 08:55:58 AM
Outside of that, most of what I have read recently has been reports released by various agencies and NGO's (Would be happy to share if you have a specific subject you wanted to read on, most are related to conflict, terrorism, economic development, or women's rights). I could also recommend fiction books like classic Sci Fi or fantasy which I also read a lot of depending on what you are interested in.
Have you read any reports on IS/ISIS that you'd recommend? I pretty much just read up on middle-east history whenever I get the chance.
There are a number absolutely. I mostly get by ISIS news from the Institute for the Study of War which has published several in depth papers on the organization in both Iraq and Syria, the Combating Terrorism Center, and the Jamestown Foundation. Also for some decent (though more conservative) reading, there is the Long War Journal.

Depending on how far back you'd like to go I'd be happy to suggest some specific papers that I found useful.
I'm getting more interested in this. If you wouldn't mind sharing, I would like to read up.

One of the reasons is I was just told something I wasn't aware of, and it conflicts with what is commonly assumed. This al Baghdadi guy...someone just suggested to me that he was formerly with Saddam, and was trained by US forces in Jordan around 2006. Now it's possible I misunderstood who was being referred to, but it certainly was someone high up in ISIS. Does that make any sense to you?
I'll post some when I get home. To answer your question though: yes and no. The person talking to you got the wrong Baghdadi (if they were referring to the current caliph). They are thinking of Abu Bakr Baghdadi's predecessor: Abu Omar Baghdadi. A quazi fictional character played by an actor who was loosely associated with (operationally speaking, not in terms of acting) a man named Hamed Dawood Mohammed Khalil al Zaw. It was this guy who used to work for the Iraqi security forces. Then again they may have been thinking of someone else. Al Zaw "headed" AQI prior to Baghdadi though and seems a likely candidate given the information you presented.
sr. member
Activity: 378
Merit: 250
September 03, 2014, 08:43:19 AM
Outside of that, most of what I have read recently has been reports released by various agencies and NGO's (Would be happy to share if you have a specific subject you wanted to read on, most are related to conflict, terrorism, economic development, or women's rights). I could also recommend fiction books like classic Sci Fi or fantasy which I also read a lot of depending on what you are interested in.
Have you read any reports on IS/ISIS that you'd recommend? I pretty much just read up on middle-east history whenever I get the chance.
There are a number absolutely. I mostly get by ISIS news from the Institute for the Study of War which has published several in depth papers on the organization in both Iraq and Syria, the Combating Terrorism Center, and the Jamestown Foundation. Also for some decent (though more conservative) reading, there is the Long War Journal.

Depending on how far back you'd like to go I'd be happy to suggest some specific papers that I found useful.
I'm getting more interested in this. If you wouldn't mind sharing, I would like to read up.

One of the reasons is I was just told something I wasn't aware of, and it conflicts with what is commonly assumed. This al Baghdadi guy...someone just suggested to me that he was formerly with Saddam, and was trained by US forces in Jordan around 2006. Now it's possible I misunderstood who was being referred to, but it certainly was someone high up in ISIS. Does that make any sense to you?
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
September 03, 2014, 08:29:10 AM
As it relates to the thread subject, the ceasefire is already being violated daily as Egypt and Israel have yet to ease blockade restrictions as agreed to in the ceasefire:

http://www.irinnews.org/report/10056...s-of-loosening
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
September 03, 2014, 08:23:22 AM
Outside of that, most of what I have read recently has been reports released by various agencies and NGO's (Would be happy to share if you have a specific subject you wanted to read on, most are related to conflict, terrorism, economic development, or women's rights). I could also recommend fiction books like classic Sci Fi or fantasy which I also read a lot of depending on what you are interested in.
Have you read any reports on IS/ISIS that you'd recommend? I pretty much just read up on middle-east history whenever I get the chance.
There are a number absolutely. I mostly get by ISIS news from the Institute for the Study of War which has published several in depth papers on the organization in both Iraq and Syria, the Combating Terrorism Center, and the Jamestown Foundation. Also for some decent (though more conservative) reading, there is the Long War Journal.

Depending on how far back you'd like to go I'd be happy to suggest some specific papers that I found useful.
sr. member
Activity: 350
Merit: 250
September 02, 2014, 10:16:31 AM
Now of course that doesn't mean that Israel did what we were pressuring them to do (engage in a peace process), instead they unilaterally pulled out of Gaza in order to end peace talks with Abbas.

Dov Weisglass (the aid) went on to explain:

"The significance of the disengagement plan is the freezing of the peace process, and when you freeze that process, you prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state, and you prevent a discussion on the refugees, the borders and Jerusalem. Effectively, this whole package called the Palestinian state, with all that it entails, has been removed indefinitely from our agenda. And all this with authority and permission. All with a presidential blessing and the ratification of both houses of Congress."

If there was any ambiguity in that he also stated:

"The disengagement is actually formaldehyde. It supplies the amount of formaldehyde that is necessary so there will not be a political process with the Palestinians."

That's fairly cut and dry, so no i'm not just proverbially speaking talking out of my ass, rather I say those things because I have paid attention to internal Israeli political dialogue. I make those claims specifically because I have direct supporting evidence for them.
This actually isn't true either, we see pressures occur all of the time in the absence of security council agreement.
No you sit on the oil bases and as long as that is given you dont give a damn when people kill themselves there. These sunnits try to fool people. The truth is they hate, shia, kurds or turkmen more than the jews. Thats why they dont move a finger while the heads roll. Free men gather in the region to bring an end to these barbarians. What will be supported next to destabilize the region?
sr. member
Activity: 994
Merit: 441
September 02, 2014, 09:45:02 AM
Outside of that, most of what I have read recently has been reports released by various agencies and NGO's (Would be happy to share if you have a specific subject you wanted to read on, most are related to conflict, terrorism, economic development, or women's rights). I could also recommend fiction books like classic Sci Fi or fantasy which I also read a lot of depending on what you are interested in.
Have you read any reports on IS/ISIS that you'd recommend? I pretty much just read up on middle-east history whenever I get the chance.
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
September 02, 2014, 07:55:14 AM
Outside of that, most of what I have read recently has been reports released by various agencies and NGO's (Would be happy to share if you have a specific subject you wanted to read on, most are related to conflict, terrorism, economic development, or women's rights). I could also recommend fiction books like classic Sci Fi or fantasy which I also read a lot of depending on what you are interested in.
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
September 02, 2014, 07:52:01 AM
Now of course that doesn't mean that Israel did what we were pressuring them to do (engage in a peace process), instead they unilaterally pulled out of Gaza in order to end peace talks with Abbas.

Dov Weisglass (the aid) went on to explain:

"The significance of the disengagement plan is the freezing of the peace process, and when you freeze that process, you prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state, and you prevent a discussion on the refugees, the borders and Jerusalem. Effectively, this whole package called the Palestinian state, with all that it entails, has been removed indefinitely from our agenda. And all this with authority and permission. All with a presidential blessing and the ratification of both houses of Congress."

If there was any ambiguity in that he also stated:

"The disengagement is actually formaldehyde. It supplies the amount of formaldehyde that is necessary so there will not be a political process with the Palestinians."

That's fairly cut and dry, so no i'm not just proverbially speaking talking out of my ass, rather I say those things because I have paid attention to internal Israeli political dialogue. I make those claims specifically because I have direct supporting evidence for them.
This actually isn't true either, we see pressures occur all of the time in the absence of security council agreement.
sana8410, have you read any interesting books lately? i'm in the mood to read something not work related for once .
Depends on what you do for work and what genres you like to read. I tend to like history books or classic sci fi and fantasy when I want something lighter.

The last couple of history books that I have read over the summer have been:

Darfur: The Long Road to Disaster by Robert O. Collins and Millard Burr, which is primarily a book about Chad, and the conflict dynamics that have existed between Chad, Sudan, Libya and Egypt since independence. It's only really in the last chapter or two that he really gets into Darfur.

Dancing in the Glory of Monsters: The collapse of the Congo and the Great War of Africa by Jason Stearns, a book about the conflict in the DR Congo since the early 90s. It looks at both Congolese wars and the stage setting for the Mai Mai militias and jungle rebel groups that still exist today. This book isn't as dry of reading as the Darfur one, it has good facts, but also a lot of interviews and human testimonies. So he won't just name a massacre give some numbers and a date and move on (Like the French political Scientist Gerard Prunier does in his telling of the conflict in Africa's World War) but he'll do that and then couple it with a personal account from someone he interviewed.

On Saudi Arabia:Its People, Past, Religion, Fault Lines, and Future by Karen Elliott House, title is pretty self descriptive. It lacks the research levels and details that I tend to like in books and is mostly an account of her personal experiences and fieldwork in Saudi Arabia and observations of Saudi culture. It isn't too long though.

Radical Religious and Violent by Eli Berman, written by an economist it is an examination of the behavior of religious radical groups (both violent and non-violent) and how they operate, and why they are so much better at terrorism when they do turn violent relative to non-religious radicals. He mostly examines the Taliban, Hamas, and ultra Orthodox Jewish communities. Though other groups make appearances as well and he even examines (briefly) the growth of Christian radical movements in historical Europe.

Boko Haram: Islamism, Politics, Security and the State in Nigeria, It is a collection of academic works and analyses on different aspects of Boko Haram in northern Nigeria. I read this one in PDF form and it can be found for free online. Some essays are better written and more interesting than others, but all in all it has good content. If you read this one I'd suggest probably reading Curbing Violence in Nigeria (II): The Boko Haram Insurgency published by the International Crisis Group first. it gives a more generalized historical overview of the movement which would be helpful to have before tackling the more specific looks at the insurgency that the above listed paper does. The Crisis Group's Boko Haram report can also be found online for free in PDF form.

A Savage War of Peace: Algeria 1954 - 1962 by Alistair Horne, About the Algerian struggle for independence from France. Probably the best written book on this list. Easy to read with good selections of quotes like Stearns work on the Congo (so it isn't too dry), but very well researched and detailed in its facts (like Collin's work on Chad). It covers pre-war, different ethnic, cultural, and political factions, the entire conflict, and sets the stage for understanding the subsequent civil war and the formation of the GSPC (which would eventually become Al Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb).

Next on the list is: A History of Modern Sudan by Robert O. Collins, Collins is a well respected expert on Sudanese history, since the first book of his that I read on Darfur ended up being more about Chad, I looked up his other works and picked this one up on Sudan. It is shorter than his more regional work (listed above) and I expect it to be somewhat dry reading like his other book, but also very well researched.
sr. member
Activity: 994
Merit: 441
September 02, 2014, 06:51:44 AM
Now of course that doesn't mean that Israel did what we were pressuring them to do (engage in a peace process), instead they unilaterally pulled out of Gaza in order to end peace talks with Abbas.

Dov Weisglass (the aid) went on to explain:

"The significance of the disengagement plan is the freezing of the peace process, and when you freeze that process, you prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state, and you prevent a discussion on the refugees, the borders and Jerusalem. Effectively, this whole package called the Palestinian state, with all that it entails, has been removed indefinitely from our agenda. And all this with authority and permission. All with a presidential blessing and the ratification of both houses of Congress."

If there was any ambiguity in that he also stated:

"The disengagement is actually formaldehyde. It supplies the amount of formaldehyde that is necessary so there will not be a political process with the Palestinians."

That's fairly cut and dry, so no i'm not just proverbially speaking talking out of my ass, rather I say those things because I have paid attention to internal Israeli political dialogue. I make those claims specifically because I have direct supporting evidence for them.
This actually isn't true either, we see pressures occur all of the time in the absence of security council agreement.
Please point out the pressure put on any security council member that was solely done by the UN. Because I would say that the UN made some noise, and the US, China, or Russia did what they chose despite the UN comments. In fact, I would say that the UN only puts out what at least one of those countries wants put out.
relevant:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1iCcltrV3Jk
Probably not. I mean, Abbas saying whatever he was saying, which I can't translate, and someone writing a description in Hebrew about that...no context...probably is suspect. I certainly wouldn't draw any conclusion from it.
He's basically saying he spoke to the leaders of hamas and they denied being behind the kidnapping. when he questioned the people claiming responsibility (he names saleh al-arouri) they told him they did it without approval from higher up. he then says something along the lines of "an operation like this and you don't get approval from leadership?".

it cuts off after that so what he meant by that last sentence is up for debate.
sr. member
Activity: 378
Merit: 250
September 02, 2014, 06:40:06 AM
Now of course that doesn't mean that Israel did what we were pressuring them to do (engage in a peace process), instead they unilaterally pulled out of Gaza in order to end peace talks with Abbas.

Dov Weisglass (the aid) went on to explain:

"The significance of the disengagement plan is the freezing of the peace process, and when you freeze that process, you prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state, and you prevent a discussion on the refugees, the borders and Jerusalem. Effectively, this whole package called the Palestinian state, with all that it entails, has been removed indefinitely from our agenda. And all this with authority and permission. All with a presidential blessing and the ratification of both houses of Congress."

If there was any ambiguity in that he also stated:

"The disengagement is actually formaldehyde. It supplies the amount of formaldehyde that is necessary so there will not be a political process with the Palestinians."

That's fairly cut and dry, so no i'm not just proverbially speaking talking out of my ass, rather I say those things because I have paid attention to internal Israeli political dialogue. I make those claims specifically because I have direct supporting evidence for them.
This actually isn't true either, we see pressures occur all of the time in the absence of security council agreement.
Please point out the pressure put on any security council member that was solely done by the UN. Because I would say that the UN made some noise, and the US, China, or Russia did what they chose despite the UN comments. In fact, I would say that the UN only puts out what at least one of those countries wants put out.
relevant:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1iCcltrV3Jk
Probably not. I mean, Abbas saying whatever he was saying, which I can't translate, and someone writing a description in Hebrew about that...no context...probably is suspect. I certainly wouldn't draw any conclusion from it.
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