Italian League Prediction Thread (Serie A) - page 365.

BitcoinHunt3r

legendary

Activity: 2954

Merit: 1155

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

Quote from: imamusma on September 28, 2024, 01:10:07 PM

If Torino manages to beat Lazio, then they will take over the top of the standings again. For me, it looks a little unique, because they managed to collect more points than Juventus, AC Milan, Inter Milan and Napoli who we consider as the Scudetto challengers this season. Although I still see Torino as a temporary nuisance, but they might be the team that can create many surprises this season. Torino will act as the host, they will certainly get full support from their own fans, Lazio clearly have to work hard to be able to bring home 3 points. On paper Lazio is more favored, but Torino ambition to create a sensation at the top of the standings cannot be underestimated.

That's right, Torino are in the spotlight because they were at the top of the standings yesterday and today Juventus took over, as you said Torino could be back at the top of the table if they beat Lazio tomorrow so the question is, can Torino beat Lazio? honestly i'm not really sure even though Lazio's game is inconsistent, they cannot be underestimated. I think both teams will play a draw and Torino are still in second place, due to goal difference unless Torino can win by 7 goals then they are ahead.

On the other hand, Inter Milan's performance is a little questionable, why are they in 4th place and concede more often? there are changes in the defense line which looks weaker than last season. Of course that could hinder them in their title race especially now the competition there is more competitive, their mainstay player Martinez also slightly declined in performance.

ginsan

hero member

Activity: 1358

Merit: 627

Quote from: Swordsoffreedom on September 28, 2024, 03:47:58 PM

In the pre season matches we got to see excellent performances from AC Milan players. We felt that this group was very strong. And I thought AC Milan would fight for the Serie A title this season. And they have the ability to dominate Serie A. But since the beginning of the season we have seen very poor performances from Milan players.

Milan share the points with Torino and Lazio. And against a team as small as Parma, Milan were defeated. Milan's performance in the opening three games of the season was very poor. This is why they lost points. However, Milan has been able to gradually fix their weaknesses. And this team is in very good shape right now. Milan is performing well in every match. And Milan are now third in the table after winning three matches in a row.

Milan's squad is strong. And they have the potential to top the table. However, Milan's match strategy is still not predictable. However, if Milan can continue with such performance, AC Milan will fight for the Serie A title this season.

Actually the bad start was about the approach of their new coach's strategy which was not yet well understood by the players, but slowly but surely AC Milan has been able to show a good trend in Serie A because they were able to beat Inter Milan and also Lecce. The victory that AC Milan got when facing Inter Milan was a good start for them to improve their playing style and the match against Lecce where AC Milan was able to continue their winning trend.

AC Milan is now only 1 point behind Juventus who leads the standings so there is a big chance in the next few matches to lead the standings if they are able to maintain their winning trend. Inter Milan has also risen they want to take over the leader of the standings again. Well at the same time Juventus must be ready to perform better if not the two Milan will remove them at the top of the standings.

coinlocket$

legendary

Activity: 2632

Merit: 1518

#1 VIP Crypto Casino

Anoter horrible result for Atalanta.
The good thing is that they avoided losing the game versus Bologna.

The bad part is that they were playing 11 vs 10 for half the game and they barely tied the game.
What's happened to them?

7 points in 6 games is a relegation median points.

Raflesia

hero member

Activity: 2282

Merit: 560

_""""Duelbits""""_

Quote from: Jatiluhung on September 27, 2024, 11:14:43 PM

Quote from: Raflesia on September 27, 2024, 03:59:27 PM

Btw in another match today Milan won again with a fairly landslide score, after the victory in the Milan derby last week it looks like Milan are starting to get good confidence and can maximize the momentum they have.

My worries about AC Milan are now starting to lessen with the positive results they have continued to get in the last few weeks. So far in Serie A AC Milan has managed to win 3 matches in a row and I think this is all thanks to Fonseca who seems to be starting to find a suitable strategy for his team. I am happy that AC Milan was patient with Fonseca and did not make a hasty decision like the AS Roma club. And now the results are starting to show. But the next match AC Milan will compete again in the Champions League. And I hope they can get full points in this match. Because in the previous match AC Milan suffered a crushing defeat by Liverpool.

Looking in terms of the attacking scheme carried out in the game from the beginning of the season, there is actually no doubt for them, it's just that in this case before Fonseca could not balance between the attacking line and the defense line so that when the attacking line was good but the defense line seemed careless because there were several reasons such as being too busy in attacking and forgetting the defense area that was not well guarded when anticipating the counterattack.

But after several experiments Fonseca seems to have prepared more for this and it is evident in the last few matches that they always look strong and can even win with a fairly landslide score, especially for the first meeting in the Milan derby ended well so this could be a good momentum if Fonseca is maintained.

indah rezqi

hero member

Activity: 1512

Merit: 874

Quote from: Swordsoffreedom on September 28, 2024, 03:47:58 PM

Quote from: hahay on September 28, 2024, 03:29:16 PM

~~ Snip ~~

In the pre season matches we got to see excellent performances from AC Milan players. We felt that this group was very strong. And I thought AC Milan would fight for the Serie A title this season. And they have the ability to dominate Serie A. But since the beginning of the season we have seen very poor performances from Milan players.

Milan share the points with Torino and Lazio. And against a team as small as Parma, Milan were defeated. Milan's performance in the opening three games of the season was very poor. This is why they lost points. However, Milan has been able to gradually fix their weaknesses. And this team is in very good shape right now. Milan is performing well in every match. And Milan are now third in the table after winning three matches in a row.

Milan's squad is strong. And they have the potential to top the table. However, Milan's match strategy is still not predictable. However, if Milan can continue with such performance, AC Milan will fight for the Serie A title this season.

Overall, I agree with the picture you conveyed regarding the current condition of AC Milan. The manager transition and a little squad overhaul made AC Milan journey a little hampered, their adaptation process did not go as it should in the first few matches. Thanks to three consecutive wins, Paulo Fonseca can now be a little calmer, because the pressure on him has started to ease. However, they must maintain that performance to face Leverkusen in the Champions League, previously AC Milan could not do much at the San Siro when they were defeated by Liverpool.

The competition for the Scudetto this season is fiercer than last season, and I see Napoli benefiting from not appearing in any European competition. AC Milan must work harder to be able to win the Scudetto this season, we know they now have quite good squad depth. We'll see how far AC Milan can maintain their positive trend, what is clear is that the challenges ahead will be increasingly difficult and require a lot of luck.

Swordsoffreedom

legendary

Activity: 2996

Merit: 1136

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

Quote from: hahay on September 28, 2024, 03:29:16 PM

Previously Milan were said to have started the season badly but anyway, the fact is that Milan are currently in third place and only one point different from Juventus who are at the top of the table. Thus, Milan is not really bad as previously assumed by predictors out there, because in fact Milan still has a chance to be able to compete for the Scudetto this season.

In the pre season matches we got to see excellent performances from AC Milan players. We felt that this group was very strong. And I thought AC Milan would fight for the Serie A title this season. And they have the ability to dominate Serie A. But since the beginning of the season we have seen very poor performances from Milan players.

Milan share the points with Torino and Lazio. And against a team as small as Parma, Milan were defeated. Milan's performance in the opening three games of the season was very poor. This is why they lost points. However, Milan has been able to gradually fix their weaknesses. And this team is in very good shape right now. Milan is performing well in every match. And Milan are now third in the table after winning three matches in a row.

Milan's squad is strong. And they have the potential to top the table. However, Milan's match strategy is still not predictable. However, if Milan can continue with such performance, AC Milan will fight for the Serie A title this season.

hahay

legendary

Activity: 3486

Merit: 1055

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

Quote from: MAAManda on September 28, 2024, 11:22:16 AM

Quote from: skarais on September 27, 2024, 11:08:14 AM

Regarding this match, Milan is the favorite to secure 3 points. They seem very confident of continuing their winning streak in Serie A, but regardless, there are still risks to consider so there is no guarantee of easy money for each game. Gamble responsibly because you can still lose at 1.01 odds in a match, there is no telling when you will have that bad day.

The match is over and AC Milan proved that they deserved the 3 points, AC Milan managed to get it with a good score too (3 goals), the goals were scored by Alvaro Morata, Theo Hernandez and Christian Pulisic. What was unique about the match was that all of AC Milan's goals were scored in the first half, after that there were no more goals coming which then made me wonder, why were they able to score 3 goals in the first half and not even 1 in the second half?

Obviously, playing against Lecce will still provide a great chance for Milan to win, but winning with a score of 3-0 is a good result for Milan. Although in the second half Milan can be said to reduce the intensity of the attack, but it is also not bad if the final result Milan still gets clean sheets in this home match. Because after all, although Lecce is a team that is in the lower zone, but Lecce also still plays with high aggressiveness in this match but unfortunately, Lecce is still weak and or unlucky to take advantage of opportunities to become goals.

Previously Milan were said to have started the season badly but anyway, the fact is that Milan are currently in third place and only one point different from Juventus who are at the top of the table. Thus, Milan is not really bad as previously assumed by predictors out there, because in fact Milan still has a chance to be able to compete for the Scudetto this season.

Lida93

hero member

Activity: 980

Merit: 621

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

Quote from: Ondekinecakabilirim on September 28, 2024, 05:34:26 AM

Yes. I agree with you. Inter started this season with a disappointing start. Last season they were clear champions. But they didn't start this season well. The previous season Napoli were clear champions. They were disappointing last season. I don't think Inter will go through the same thing. But I expected a better of them. Today they will be away to Udinese. Udinese have had good results at home this season. They have played two league and two cup games at home. And they won them all. I think Inter will return to last season's performance. But Udinese away will not be an easy match for them. I'm not going to bet on this match. I see Inter as a favorite. But I don't want to bet on this match.

Inter is quite different from Napoli in terms of class, prestige and popularity and at such there shouldn't be any bases for comparisons, during inter era of domination in the serie A they won it back to back but when Napoli won the Scudetto they couldn't defend it, but with Inter the case is different and am sure they are going to get back to winning ways and until they get back to the top of the table and probably end up retaining their title once again.

Juse14

sr. member

Activity: 1190

Merit: 417

Duelbits

Quote from: coinlocket$ on September 28, 2024, 02:39:17 PM

Strong performace from Juventus in the result.
The game is not still perfect, a lot of mistakes and they still don't get exactly what the coach wants.

Dusan is back in action, scoring 2 goal and missing 1.
1st goal in Italy for conceicao Junion.

Its fun to seen him during interviews he looks like a kid in comparison to his teammates.

Juventus did indeed perform quite well and slickly in the match,, so this win was more than deserved for them. Not everything is perfect, but their game is already crystallizing, which, for example, two goals scored by Dusan Vlahovic against them prove once again. And the goal scored by Junior Messias for his debut in Italian football colors this moment in the game.

In the next match in Serie A they will face Cagliari and it seems they will win this match. I am really looking forward to the performance of both players, and maybe in that match they will score more goals, more than their match against Genoa.

At this time Juventus only have a one point advantage as the team at the top of the standings. Juventus must continue to perform consistently to be able to add winning points and stay at the top of the standings.

coinlocket$

legendary

Activity: 2632

Merit: 1518

#1 VIP Crypto Casino

Strong performace from Juventus in the result.
The game is not still perfect, a lot of mistakes and they still don't get exactly what the coach wants.

Dusan is back in action, scoring 2 goal and missing 1.
1st goal in Italy for conceicao Junion.

Its fun to seen him during interviews he looks like a kid in comparison to his teammates.

Pandu Geddon

hero member

Activity: 826

Merit: 583

Quote from: imamusma on September 28, 2024, 01:10:07 PM

If Torino manages to beat Lazio, then they will take over the top of the standings again. For me, it looks a little unique, because they managed to collect more points than Juventus, AC Milan, Inter Milan and Napoli who we consider as the Scudetto challengers this season. Although I still see Torino as a temporary nuisance, but they might be the team that can create many surprises this season. Torino will act as the host, they will certainly get full support from their own fans, Lazio clearly have to work hard to be able to bring home 3 points. On paper Lazio is more favored, but Torino ambition to create a sensation at the top of the standings cannot be underestimated.

Torino got off to a pretty good start. holding Milan to a draw and winning against Atalanta. They performed well at the start of the season.
while we see the favored teams actually experiencing inconsistent performances. maybe Juventus who are unbeaten in 6 matches this season and have not even conceded a goal.

Torino will be playing at home and they have never lost at home this season. Their bad result at home might be playing 0-0 against Leece. now facing Lazio, they are not a weak team. Lazio also held Milan to a 2-2 draw. even in the Europa League match they managed to win 0-3 against Dynamo Kyiv. a match that is quite difficult to predict.

Palakka

legendary

Activity: 1568

Merit: 1000

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

Quote from: fadhilz123 on September 28, 2024, 11:50:43 AM

Quote from: junder on September 28, 2024, 09:40:28 AM

Lautaro scored his second goal for Inter Milan, he has performed well in the match so far, the temporary score is 3-1 for Inter's advantage. Statistics in the second half that is currently underway, Inzaghi's troops dominate their opponents 63% Inter and Udinese 37%.
Inzaghi's squad has been confirmed to win and has shifted Torino at the top of the standings, Udinese's chances are small to equalize
The match has been going on for 70 minutes, leaving plenty of time for Inter to add to their goals, and I think they can do that considering Inter's overall dominant team play, I will wait for the next goal.

The home team was only able to score two goals in the match so that Inter Milan became the team that won the match with a better level of ball possession. But for the first place in the Serie A standings is still occupied by Torino even though Inter Milan's number of points is the same as Torino and also with AC Milan who today were also able to win over Lecce. I think this season looks tighter and also fiercer in terms of competing for points in the standings because the six teams at the top have the same number of points and the distance is also quite close.

Intermilan took revenge in the match after their failure to win the derby, appearing with high enthusiasm to win that the match, they didn't have to wait long to score in first haltf, the match was indeed dominated by Intermilan but we can see how Udinese who have a very high fighting spirit was also able to trouble Intermilan defense in the match, Playing at home made Udinese try to pressure Intermilan even though in fact they continue to be faced with dangerous attacks from Intermilan, if you look at the toughness shown by Udinese in the match, actually very lucky for Intermilan to be able to maintain their advantage until the match is over, because if you look at the attack that Udinese continues to build in the match it is not impossible if there is still a little time left then Udinese will be able to equalize the score.
The achievement of 3 points makes Intermilan currently in the top 4 but their current position is still not safe because Napoli and Empoli have not played their week 6 match.

imamusma

hero member

Activity: 1386

Merit: 731

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

If Torino manages to beat Lazio, then they will take over the top of the standings again. For me, it looks a little unique, because they managed to collect more points than Juventus, AC Milan, Inter Milan and Napoli who we consider as the Scudetto challengers this season. Although I still see Torino as a temporary nuisance, but they might be the team that can create many surprises this season. Torino will act as the host, they will certainly get full support from their own fans, Lazio clearly have to work hard to be able to bring home 3 points. On paper Lazio is more favored, but Torino ambition to create a sensation at the top of the standings cannot be underestimated.

fullhdpixel

hero member

Activity: 2828

Merit: 611

Quote from: wmaurik on September 28, 2024, 09:10:43 AM

A home win with a score of three goals over Lecce is quite normal for AC Milan because it is indeed something that should have happened for AC Milan. Likewise, the red card received by Davide Bartesaghi in the 80th minute is very normal, moreover it also did not make AC Milan concede a goal and still won by a landslide without any reply from the Lecce team. And the match for AC Milan in the next match is to be a guest at Fiorentina's headquarters and Milan must be able to win again in order to improve their position before it is too late.

While it is "normal" in the sense that Milan was the better team so them winning isn't really that shocking to anyone and it's normal, then you are right about that. But also, people had fear because Milan all season had some great games and bad games too so people worried if they would have some shocking result but thankfully that didn't happen that much.

The tough part in Serie A for big clubs is that you can attack all game long but the fouls are harder to call, so there is a harder defense with tougher opponents, which means that scoring is harder and that is why there are even more injuries as well.

So if Lecce got lucky, like just defended crazy and they attacked on counter attacks and found a goal early on, the whole game could have been totally different and we would not be seeing this. But because Milan got lucky and found the first goal, Lecce had to attack and that meant even worse defense and that's how Milan managed to get the win easily.

There wasn't any bad results all around the world this week, most of the games happened like it should, was a good day to bet and had some good profitable results, at the very least todays games were free to bet thanks to Friday games.

SOKO-DEKE

hero member

Activity: 924

Merit: 595

Quote from: fadhilz123 on September 28, 2024, 11:50:43 AM

Quote from: junder on September 28, 2024, 09:40:28 AM

Lautaro scored his second goal for Inter Milan, he has performed well in the match so far, the temporary score is 3-1 for Inter's advantage. Statistics in the second half that is currently underway, Inzaghi's troops dominate their opponents 63% Inter and Udinese 37%.
Inzaghi's squad has been confirmed to win and has shifted Torino at the top of the standings, Udinese's chances are small to equalize
The match has been going on for 70 minutes, leaving plenty of time for Inter to add to their goals, and I think they can do that considering Inter's overall dominant team play, I will wait for the next goal.

The home team was only able to score two goals in the match so that Inter Milan became the team that won the match with a better level of ball possession. But for the first place in the Serie A standings is still occupied by Torino even though Inter Milan's number of points is the same as Torino and also with AC Milan who today were also able to win over Lecce. I think this season looks tighter and also fiercer in terms of competing for points in the standings because the six teams at the top have the same number of points and the distance is also quite close.

Udinese's performances have really improved, and I was not surprised that they were able to score two goals against Inter Milan. But honestly, despite knowing Udinese was in good form, I had some confidence that Inter Milan would be able to secure the victory. And truly, they played well, and in the end, they were able to win the match. The way the Serie A competition is looking right now, it will be difficult to predict which team will make it to the top four. Almost all the big teams in Serie A are not consistent this season.They have to rely on great form. Just imagine that all the big teams have only managed to win three matches out of six played. It's not looking good for them. It's just the beginning of the season, and the competition is already getting tough. I'm curious to see how their performances will look toward the middle of the competition and especially toward the end of the season when everything gets even tougher.

fadhilz123

sr. member

Activity: 1288

Merit: 253

casinosblockchain.io

Quote from: junder on September 28, 2024, 09:40:28 AM

Lautaro scored his second goal for Inter Milan, he has performed well in the match so far, the temporary score is 3-1 for Inter's advantage. Statistics in the second half that is currently underway, Inzaghi's troops dominate their opponents 63% Inter and Udinese 37%.
Inzaghi's squad has been confirmed to win and has shifted Torino at the top of the standings, Udinese's chances are small to equalize
The match has been going on for 70 minutes, leaving plenty of time for Inter to add to their goals, and I think they can do that considering Inter's overall dominant team play, I will wait for the next goal.

The home team was only able to score two goals in the match so that Inter Milan became the team that won the match with a better level of ball possession. But for the first place in the Serie A standings is still occupied by Torino even though Inter Milan's number of points is the same as Torino and also with AC Milan who today were also able to win over Lecce. I think this season looks tighter and also fiercer in terms of competing for points in the standings because the six teams at the top have the same number of points and the distance is also quite close.

armanda90

hero member

Activity: 1246

Merit: 612

SSF Games - Redefining Blockchain Gaming

Quote from: Ondekinecakabilirim on September 28, 2024, 05:34:26 AM

Yes. I agree with you. Inter started this season with a disappointing start. Last season they were clear champions. But they didn't start this season well. The previous season Napoli were clear champions. They were disappointing last season. I don't think Inter will go through the same thing. But I expected a better of them. Today they will be away to Udinese. Udinese have had good results at home this season. They have played two league and two cup games at home. And they won them all. I think Inter will return to last season's performance. But Udinese away will not be an easy match for them. I'm not going to bet on this match. I see Inter as a favorite. But I don't want to bet on this match.

Inter Milan got back their victory over Udinese after defeating by Milan on last match, in this season Inter performance not really consistent and difficult keep defend the winning result for every week match.
Until game week 6, Inter Milan have loss many points after 2 matches being draw and got one match defeated by Milan until make Inter position dropped to 3rd standings awhile although have the same points with the 1st and 2nd standings team.

The Scudetto race season 2024/25 on the early match begin seems very interested, have several top standings team awhile have close points each other and I think the winning Serie A this season very competitive than last season how easily Inter Milan dominance first position with many points remaining from second standings place team.

khiholangkang

hero member

Activity: 2226

Merit: 610

Quote from: wmaurik on September 28, 2024, 09:10:43 AM

Quote from: koang on September 28, 2024, 08:45:09 AM

I appreciate the conservation of AC Milan, my weekend is full of smiles

The Rossoneri were very dominant in this match but the red card for Davide Bartesaghi bothered me a little, sending Bartesaghi off with a straight red card was excessive in my opinion, a yellow card would have been enough.
But Theo Hernandez is shining bright for Milan, His talent is undeniable. Keep up the fantastic work, Theo...
Job done. On to the next. Let’s keep the momentum.

A home win with a score of three goals over Lecce is quite normal for AC Milan because it is indeed something that should have happened for AC Milan. Likewise, the red card received by Davide Bartesaghi in the 80th minute is very normal, moreover it also did not make AC Milan concede a goal and still won by a landslide without any reply from the Lecce team. And the match for AC Milan in the next match is to be a guest at Fiorentina's headquarters and Milan must be able to win again in order to improve their position before it is too late.

AC Milan must always get a victory to save his name in Serie A, the rumors are too bad because it has experienced a very significant decline in the start of the season, victory against Lecce should be a motivation for AC Milan to face Bayer Leverkusen in the Champions League.

Fiorentina is quite unique and they are quite strong enough, it's just that they also started this season not so well in Serie A, the 3 -series match one lost one and one win, this was not a good start for them, but if they played on The cage is currently able to fix it, AC Milan must be careful in facing Fiorentina because with its new situation it will still be vulnerable.

MAAManda

hero member

Activity: 1736

Merit: 798

Quote from: skarais on September 27, 2024, 11:08:14 AM

Regarding this match, Milan is the favorite to secure 3 points. They seem very confident of continuing their winning streak in Serie A, but regardless, there are still risks to consider so there is no guarantee of easy money for each game. Gamble responsibly because you can still lose at 1.01 odds in a match, there is no telling when you will have that bad day.

The match is over and AC Milan proved that they deserved the 3 points, AC Milan managed to get it with a good score too (3 goals), the goals were scored by Alvaro Morata, Theo Hernandez and Christian Pulisic. What was unique about the match was that all of AC Milan's goals were scored in the first half, after that there were no more goals coming which then made me wonder, why were they able to score 3 goals in the first half and not even 1 in the second half?

Frankolala

hero member

Activity: 952

Merit: 617

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

Quote from: tygeade on September 28, 2024, 10:44:35 AM

Quote from: Frankolala on September 27, 2024, 11:23:03 AM

You cannot compare Mourinho with De Rossi a baby coach. Mourinho won Europa title when he was in Roma and also improved the club's performance to the extent that Roma was a threat to their opponent. Roma failed to give Mourinho his demand for new players, but he was turned down and that was when Roma brough De Rossi to come and coach the club thinking he will be able to do better that Mourinho an experience coach who have won several title with big clubs.

When De Rossi came, he was given a condition that if he didn't improve the team's performance as expected, he would be sacked and that was why he got sacked after he failed to win any of his matches this season. The mistake that Roma did was to fire Mourinho and felt De Rossi will be able to do better than him without solving the problem on ground. Let Roma management fix the problem they caused themselves.

Mourinho of course is a better manager, and he had a great history, but the Mourinho we know is not the Mourinho today, and he is feeling like he is spiralling out of control as well. He is now in Turkish league, and not even at the champions, the team he manages couldn't win a title for 10-11 years, so they brought him in, and so far it doesn't look like he will get it neither.

So the Mourinho you think, the porto one, the inter one, the Real Madrid one, this isn't the same person. Sure he won conference league, which is great, and also went to finals, which is great, and he deserved to win that one too, but look at the league for both of those years, dude sucked at the league and won a few games at cups and claimed he was great.

I agree with you that Mourinho of those days is no longer what he is currently but if you look at Mourinho, he is a coach that cannot do without quality players and if he does not have thoss players, he cannot bring out the best in him. Thia is the only challenge I think he is having to become victorious like he used to be in the past.

He is in Turkish league, the clubs in this league are not strong enough to dominate European competition and for that reaaon, I am not expecting any magic from Mourinho but I think if he gets the players that he request for, he might help them win the league. However, there are some clubs that he coached but got sacked due to not meeting up with their expectations from him.

Topic: Italian League Prediction Thread (Serie A) - page 365. (Read 868720 times)