Liberated: LoyceV's Legendary Little Lightning Loans - page 9.

Timelord2067

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Quote from: LoyceV on June 30, 2019, 03:24:10 AM

It was night here, so your request expired (that's a serious shortcoming of using 6 hour expiration times on a global payment system!). But there's another problem: since last night, Eclair Wallet tells me there's a temporary node problem so I can't send anything. I'll wait if this gets resolved or I may need to force close the channel.

Update: I can send up to 4 satoshi, anything larger gives an error. I'm not sure why.

I've funded BlueWallet, it's now waiting for confirmation. It has an annoying bug on Android: when entering the BTC amount, the keyboard doesn't show a decimal dot. I had to copy/paste the amount to be able to send less than 1 Bitcoin.

Damm it! You were online a moment ago!

Code:

lnbc1pw339a4pp5k29mr7j4rqm8x3hk3xfzu2t9jxzvy9aldtskcxv65crfg5ja29sqdqqxqr4rqrzjqwryaup9lh50kkranzgcdnn2fgvx390wgj5jd07rwr3vxeje0glc7z89q5qqssqqqqqqqqlgqqqqqeqqjq5kp53erns9t04y2mewfgk8nyafknv06a0jeefv95ptyylj8eku3hzcddmzeyppgl4lrr2acz2euqs7g67c0nagxq4qalamgzt5h7hksqh43msl

My channel (Node) seems OK, I think I have worked out that funds get shuffled about when a node is created sometimes the other end gains funds but the actual balance is showing in your wallet (when in fact it's not).

I guess it's in anticipation of the funds going out that they are "parked" elsewhere.

I'd say the funds don't go to miners, but to the "nodes" carrying the signal. I might investigate seeing if I can keep a couple of connections open. With more channels open, I'd say more funds are parked elsewhere. Strange setup. Plus there doesn't seem to be any actual way to send my funds out, I have to wait for a funds request to come in.

Code:

Re: Legendary LoyceV's Luscious, Loopy and Lip-smacking "Little Lightning Loans"

LoyceV

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Activity: 3290

Merit: 16489

Thick-Skinned Gang Leader and Golden Feather 2021

Quote from: Timelord2067 on June 29, 2019, 07:48:22 PM

Am trying it again: (main-net)

Code:

lnbc1pw3spvspp5zhcz69a3jhq3emxphnvrtfnmytffvgm7w2mraqcxesr0n29v9lgsdq5235k6etvdaexgv3sxcmsxqr4rqrzjqwryaup9lh50kkranzgcdnn2fgvx390wgj5jd07rwr3vxeje0glc7z89pqqq96gqqqqqqqlgqqqqqeqqjqrmksz4xx46f4paayk4ym0fn09t3vzdwqs8v2wm4q0puf54ej07dp5m0lyy4ps76z2z3rukgxyceuah8kc936q45tva9ze0ul4xp44mcpy5dq0v

It was night here, so your request expired (that's a serious shortcoming of using 6 hour expiration times on a global payment system!). But there's another problem: since last night, Eclair Wallet tells me there's a temporary node problem so I can't send anything. I'll wait if this gets resolved or I may need to force close the channel.

Update: I can send up to 4 satoshi, anything larger gives an error. I'm not sure why.

I've funded BlueWallet, it's now waiting for confirmation. It has an annoying bug on Android: when entering the BTC amount, the keyboard doesn't show a decimal dot. I had to copy/paste the amount to be able to send less than 1 Bitcoin.

WhyFhy

hero member

Activity: 1443

Merit: 513

I stumbled upon this by accident, (I havn't been on Lending in ages)
LLLLL is almost a Tounge Twister! I'm really happy to see this service BTW! #StackingSats
I'm also stoked to see this many users playing with LN now!

Timelord2067

legendary

Activity: 3696

Merit: 2219

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Quote from: Rath_ on June 29, 2019, 12:24:39 PM

Quote from: Timelord2067 on June 29, 2019, 07:55:05 AM

No. No. No. Thank you for the suggestion, but no. I thought we were just testing out the lightning network.

If you want to test it out without touching your mainnet coins then install Eclair Mobile Testnet, grab some free testnet coins and buy yourself a coffee via the Lightning Network.

Thanks for the faucet link - I'd lost it quite a long time ago (it was empty at the time)

Am trying it again: (main-net)

Code:

lnbc1pw3spvspp5zhcz69a3jhq3emxphnvrtfnmytffvgm7w2mraqcxesr0n29v9lgsdq5235k6etvdaexgv3sxcmsxqr4rqrzjqwryaup9lh50kkranzgcdnn2fgvx390wgj5jd07rwr3vxeje0glc7z89pqqq96gqqqqqqqlgqqqqqeqqjqrmksz4xx46f4paayk4ym0fn09t3vzdwqs8v2wm4q0puf54ej07dp5m0lyy4ps76z2z3rukgxyceuah8kc936q45tva9ze0ul4xp44mcpy5dq0v

Rath_

legendary

Activity: 1876

Merit: 3139

Quote from: Timelord2067 on June 29, 2019, 07:55:05 AM

No. No. No. Thank you for the suggestion, but no. I thought we were just testing out the lightning network.

If you want to test it out without touching your mainnet coins then install Eclair Mobile Testnet, grab some free testnet coins and buy yourself a coffee via the Lightning Network.

Timelord2067

legendary

Activity: 3696

Merit: 2219

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Quote from: LoyceV on June 29, 2019, 07:51:46 AM

Quote from: Timelord2067 on June 29, 2019, 07:47:35 AM

If there's a TESTNET version of eclair https://github.com/ACINQ/eclair-mobile/releases why aren't we using testnet bitcoins?

It's more fun to play with the real stuff

Quote

Can a new thread for TESTNET Bitcoin lightning be started to run in parallel to this thread?

I'm not doing it (and I'm not sure if it would be allowed on the Lending board), but feel free to create one.

No. No. No. Thank you for the suggestion, but no. I thought we were just testing out the lightning network.

LoyceV

legendary

Activity: 3290

Merit: 16489

Thick-Skinned Gang Leader and Golden Feather 2021

Quote from: Timelord2067 on June 29, 2019, 07:47:35 AM

If there's a TESTNET version of eclair https://github.com/ACINQ/eclair-mobile/releases why aren't we using testnet bitcoins?

It's more fun to play with the real stuff

Quote

Can a new thread for TESTNET Bitcoin lightning be started to run in parallel to this thread?

I'm not doing it (and I'm not sure if it would be allowed on the Lending board), but feel free to create one.
Timelord2067's Trusted Testnet Thunder Timepayments?

Timelord2067

legendary

Activity: 3696

Merit: 2219

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I'm going to ask a mindnumbingly obvious question here.

If there's a TESTNET version of eclair https://github.com/ACINQ/eclair-mobile/releases why aren't we using testnet bitcoins?

Can a new thread for TESTNET Bitcoin lightning be started to run in parallel to this thread?

LoyceV

legendary

Activity: 3290

Merit: 16489

Thick-Skinned Gang Leader and Golden Feather 2021

Quote from: bitmover on June 28, 2019, 06:17:47 PM

I send 0.0011 BTC to eclair, and my final balance now is 0.000652
Open and closing channels are transactions... I sent to eclair with 3 sat/byte and create a channel with 13 sat/byte. Even with those relatively low w fees , this was quite expensive.

What was the fee for closing the channel? I assume that's the one that took a much larger share than when you opened it.

Quote from: Timelord2067 on June 28, 2019, 07:22:53 PM

I've already lost 66¢ by opening a channel (where my funds went I have no idea)

Miners?

Quote

Code:

lnbc1pw3d2a3pp525tlssfzmtsaqqg26mampzz5k99snkkml8tjmqr5w268tu7vpnrsdq5235k6etvdaexgv3sxcmsxqr4rqtqadr90fkwu8wt7lfjw3yy68mufqyzkr4zs5sce8kdnscd78vd05auh7wvmre7nzuf723es0xfscxzqe77jjkz840k5h7lkwwddychqp5rt0uw

I get "PAYMENT FAILED!" in Eclair: Route not found. Type: Local.

Quote

Opening a channel cost me 534 sats according to the TX or 5,340 sats on the eclair program, of which 0.00004060 BTC went to bc1qu6y02ypekdze9wrjhyma9eqkufnznzeu2x8et62umqe345uc06mqj3n3a4

The fee was 5340 sat (Blockchain.com doesn't show the 8th digit for some reason). The remaining 4060 sat is change. That happened to me too when I opened the channel: despite trying to send the maximum amount, it created a change. I think this was because I adjusted the fee.
It would have been much better if Eclair would open a slightly bigger channel and have no change (which is almost dust).

Timelord2067

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Activity: 3696

Merit: 2219

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Don't get me wrong, I don't mind testing this out for you...

Quote from: Timelord2067 on June 28, 2019, 10:37:06 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Bump! 10,000,000 milli-satoshis are waiting for a 7 day loan Cheesy

I'm just transferring some funds over - hopefully they won't take too long to arrive Roll Eyes

I've already lost 66¢ by opening a channel (where my funds went I have no idea), so this is indeed a steep learning curve.

Code:

lnbc1pw3d2a3pp525tlssfzmtsaqqg26mampzz5k99snkkml8tjmqr5w268tu7vpnrsdq5235k6etvdaexgv3sxcmsxqr4rqtqadr90fkwu8wt7lfjw3yy68mufqyzkr4zs5sce8kdnscd78vd05auh7wvmre7nzuf723es0xfscxzqe77jjkz840k5h7lkwwddychqp5rt0uw

Quote from: bitmover on June 28, 2019, 06:17:47 PM

Open and closing channels are transactions... I sent to eclair with 3 sat/byte and create a channel with 13 sat/byte. Even with those relatively low w fees , this was quite expensive.

Opening a channel cost me 534 sats according to the TX or 5,340 sats on the eclair program, of which 0.00004060 BTC went to bc1qu6y02ypekdze9wrjhyma9eqkufnznzeu2x8et62umqe345uc06mqj3n3a4

bitmover

legendary

Activity: 2352

Merit: 6089

bitcoindata.science

Just a small update.

I have closed all channels (2, one created by and the other probably created by loycev). I received a few Satoshis from those channels, but in the end this test was expensive. I don't know exactly why because the fees aren't very transparent.

I send 0.0011 BTC to eclair, and my final balance now is 0.000652
Open and closing channels are transactions... I sent to eclair with 3 sat/byte and create a channel with 13 sat/byte. Even with those relatively low w fees , this was quite expensive.

Timelord2067

legendary

Activity: 3696

Merit: 2219

💲🏎️💨🚓

Quote from: ?? on ??

Bump! 10,000,000 milli-satoshis are waiting for a 7 day loan Cheesy

I'm just transferring some funds over - hopefully they won't take too long to arrive Roll Eyes

bitmover

legendary

Activity: 2352

Merit: 6089

bitcoindata.science

Quote from: Rath_ on June 22, 2019, 12:55:53 PM

Quote from: LoyceV on June 22, 2019, 06:52:05 AM

I'm still not entirely sure how payments are registered and how you can prove a request was paid.

Payment hash proves that transaction has been paid. You can see it in Eclair Mobile in transaction details.

I saw that too. But I couldn't find anywhere to paste it so I could verify (see fees, receipt or whatever).

Quote from: LoyceV on June 22, 2019, 06:52:05 AM

Quote

When the channel is closed I will know my final balance and how much that test cost in fees.

I'm curious to see that too, and I really dislike that I can't set a custom fee.

I tried to close the channel prematurely (now) and I was warned that I would pay higher fees.
I believe that in the way lightning channels are designed channels should only be closed prematurely if there is a reason or a misunderstanding between the parts. I read something like this in mastering bitcoin but I am lazy now to check it

Rath_

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Activity: 1876

Merit: 3139

Quote from: LoyceV on June 22, 2019, 06:52:05 AM

I'm still not entirely sure how payments are registered and how you can prove a request was paid.

Payment hash proves that transaction has been paid. You can see it in Eclair Mobile in transaction details.

Quote from: LoyceV on June 22, 2019, 06:52:05 AM

There are explorers like 1ML - Lightning Network Search and Analysis Engine, but I'm haven't searched for transactions yet. I kinda expect it only shows nodes.

One of the benefits of using the Lightning Network is that no one can see your transactions. Nodes which route payments don't know which node initialized the payment and if the next node is the final one. Also, such explorers don't show private channels (those are incapable of routing payments, for example, mobile wallets use them).

Quote from: LoyceV on June 22, 2019, 06:52:05 AM

I'm curious to see that too, and I really dislike that I can't set a custom fee.

That's a software limitation. Other wallets allow setting custom fee.

LoyceV

legendary

Activity: 3290

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Thick-Skinned Gang Leader and Golden Feather 2021

Quote from: bitmover on June 22, 2019, 06:45:33 AM

Paid. There is no payment receipt or whatsoever.

Received

I'm still not entirely sure how payments are registered and how you can prove a request was paid. There are explorers like 1ML - Lightning Network Search and Analysis Engine, but I'm haven't searched for transactions yet. I kinda expect it only shows nodes.

Quote

When the channel is closed I will know my final balance and how much that test cost in fees.

I'm curious to see that too, and I really dislike that I can't set a custom fee.

bitmover

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Activity: 2352

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bitcoindata.science

Quote from: LoyceV on June 22, 2019, 06:18:53 AM

Here it is:

Code:

lnbc101u1pwsuz6fpp5um0962czsdaygfspmevz3ca3qkf6fn2q0xssdyz70wayg40a89pqdqdwpshjgrzv93kkxqr4rqrzjqwryaup9lh50kkranzgcdnn2fgvx390wgj5jd07rwr3vxeje0glc7zxwl5qq04qqqqqqqqlgqqqqqeqqjqq2dcr4xw62cvlucqzxmhe3v7anhe23fz0p2gl5zdavfr6wpprzzxct53dmnu4vcfzfy047kkfw32mpl399tw28xqfv4um069zk6awxgpgkl8qc

Paid. There is no payment receipt or whatsoever.

Same 2 sat fee.

No doubt it is good for Mass adoption. Nobody knows where he money comes from or where it goes.
I will close the channel in a few hours, in case someone else wants to use it just post here something...

When the channel is closed I will know my final balance and how much that test cost in fees.

Thanks LoyceV, and congrats on your initiative.

LoyceV

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Thick-Skinned Gang Leader and Golden Feather 2021

Quote from: bitmover on June 22, 2019, 04:06:35 AM

I will pay your back as soon as you post your request

Here it is:

Code:

lnbc101u1pwsuz6fpp5um0962czsdaygfspmevz3ca3qkf6fn2q0xssdyz70wayg40a89pqdqdwpshjgrzv93kkxqr4rqrzjqwryaup9lh50kkranzgcdnn2fgvx390wgj5jd07rwr3vxeje0glc7zxwl5qq04qqqqqqqqlgqqqqqeqqjqq2dcr4xw62cvlucqzxmhe3v7anhe23fz0p2gl5zdavfr6wpprzzxct53dmnu4vcfzfy047kkfw32mpl399tw28xqfv4um069zk6awxgpgkl8qc

Quote

I could not find anything related to your payment, such as fees or from which address you paid. This is interesting for privacy, as companies cannot track customers even if they are using the same address in multiple lightning payments. I cannot even pay you back because I don't see where it came from

I don't think there is such a thing as "using the same address twice", if you try to pay the same request again, it says it's already paid.
I'm not sure how much nodes can see from transactions that they don't process. I can imagine this is very good for mass adoption: no node will have to handle millions of transactions, all nodes will only handle the transactions that pass through that node.

Quote

Sadly I cannot see the fees...

2 sat

Quote

For me, so far I paid 0.4mbtc in fees for opening the channel and sending out the funds to eclair,, even using very low fees.

How do you get to that amount? Is that the amount "reserved" in the channel that you can't send? I've noticed the amount I can send sometimes goes up and down a bit.

bitmover

legendary

Activity: 2352

Merit: 6089

bitcoindata.science

You're fast! I made a new request and you just paid before I could paste the lightning request here. How? Lol

I will pay your back as soon as you post your request

Edit:
I could not find anything related to your payment, such as fees or from which address you paid. This is interesting for privacy, as companies cannot track customers even if they are using the same address in multiple lightning payments. I cannot even pay you back because I don't see where it came from

I cannot track you in this offchain database. Interesting. Sadly I cannot see the fees...

Waiting for your request LoyceV.

For me, so far I paid 0.4mbtc in fees for opening the channel and sending out the funds to eclair,, even using very low fees.

LoyceV

legendary

Activity: 3290

Merit: 16489

Thick-Skinned Gang Leader and Golden Feather 2021

Quote from: bitmover on June 22, 2019, 03:27:00 AM

lightning:lnbc100u1pwsmedmpp5syshv54ve523dncw498058hwjcul5vf37dcjvcqe0anw560504lsdq0dpjhj grvdaukxegxqr4rqrzjqwryaup9lh50kkranzgcdnn2fgvx390wgj5jd07rwr3vxeje0glc7z8qcuqq vjgqqqqqqqlgqqqqqeqqjqju8560ztv9lwdndckytvjvnkvjadyzh72y975m8etjhr0gy8cgw4nded6 zvht8syv5355vpga4zw7hdx32c082x2mcenhzqcrlvna5cqj4qt0e

Payment failed! "channel is currently disabled", RemoteFailure.
Does that mean your wallet is offline?
It worked 5 minutes later. Loan funded Cheesy

Fee paid: 2 satoshi.

Quote

I will try to pay back in the same channel.

I'm not sure if you can choose the channel by yourself, but you'll need a payment request from me before you can pay (they're working on an update that allows payments without sending a request first).

bitmover

legendary

Activity: 2352

Merit: 6089

bitcoindata.science

Got confirmed @LoyceV. 3 sat/byte got confirmed in about 17hours lol

I made the payment request of 0.1 mbtc
Let's hurry we have few hours left

lightning:lnbc100u1pwsmedmpp5syshv54ve523dncw498058hwjcul5vf37dcjvcqe0anw560504lsdq0dpjhj grvdaukxegxqr4rqrzjqwryaup9lh50kkranzgcdnn2fgvx390wgj5jd07rwr3vxeje0glc7z8qcuqq vjgqqqqqqqlgqqqqqeqqjqju8560ztv9lwdndckytvjvnkvjadyzh72y975m8etjhr0gy8cgw4nded6 zvht8syv5355vpga4zw7hdx32c082x2mcenhzqcrlvna5cqj4qt0e

I will try to pay back in the same channel.

Topic: Liberated: LoyceV's Legendary Little Lightning Loans - page 9. (Read 4905 times)