Motosport General discussion tread --- Formula1, MotoGP, WTCC, ETCC, DTM..... - page 140.

Koal-84

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Quote from: coinlocket$ on June 17, 2023, 12:10:37 PM

Bagnaia will probably champion this year too

If he hadn't crashed so often, the world championship would already be boring.

To the race today:

Perfect race for Ducati, I didn't think that Bagnaia would fight for the victory and rather prefer the safe points for the world championship, it was closer than expected.

It was a pity that Binder dropped out, it was a demonstration of power for Ducati, where the Sachsenring is actually more a Yamaha and Marquez track.

Davian144

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Marc Marquez again suffered a small injury to his left finger after falling during today's WUP session although he was still declared fit to take part in the race. And after the crash I saw that Marc Marquez was very frustrated with his condition in the current race because this could have arisen through his bike which has not been very competitive this season. so Marc Marquez looks very tired even though racing at a circuit that usually makes a good record for him, and today's race probably won't go well for Marc Marquez either.

I just read that there is another update regarding Marc Marquez who has decided to withdraw from the German Grandprix today and maybe this is a better thing for Marc Marquez. Hopefully we can be back racing again next week in Assen Netherlands. Source: motogp

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Quote from: Velvet78 on June 17, 2023, 05:54:54 PM

The qualifying session was under serious level of rain and this even caused Q3 to end earlier. Verstappen still managed to take pole position easily by a quite big time gap with the others. Hulkenberg was the most surprising name of this session because he is going to start the race from the second position. He had a really nice lap time and the heavy rain in the last minutes helped him secure this position as well.

This session was just a nightmare for Perez on the other hand. Because he couldn't even make it to Q3. He was struggling too much in Q2 and he couldn't use his last chance for a better lap well either. I hoped to see him capturing a good position to start honestly. The curse on him still continues as he had a really horrible weekend in the previous race in Canada.

Hulkenberg sounds like Alonso of last year when he started second with a car similar to Hulkenberg in terms of performance last year in Canada.The race though was not that wet last year and the predictions for the race now are also not that wet,I hope that we have rain,massive rain just enough like the one in Q3 yesterday and we are going to see a super beautiful race with a lot of unpredictable things happening.

Perez made a mistake in the Q2 as he tried with the intermediate tires when he still had a chance to do a lap with the softs before but he did not bother and now will start 12th place.Ferrari also screwed up again their strategy with Leclerc,so the starting grid is very interesting for the race of tonight (it is in night time European time).

Velvet78

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The qualifying session was under serious level of rain and this even caused Q3 to end earlier. Verstappen still managed to take pole position easily by a quite big time gap with the others. Hulkenberg was the most surprising name of this session because he is going to start the race from the second position. He had a really nice lap time and the heavy rain in the last minutes helped him secure this position as well.

This session was just a nightmare for Perez on the other hand. Because he couldn't even make it to Q3. He was struggling too much in Q2 and he couldn't use his last chance for a better lap well either. I hoped to see him capturing a good position to start honestly. The curse on him still continues as he had a really horrible weekend in the previous race in Canada.

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Havey rain in the free Practice 3, with good times for MAx and Ferraris.

Sainz also crashed his car, but they should be able to fix it for the qualifying hour.

They are expecting light rain.

dezoel

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Mercedes definitely been on the up, they have made some great upgrades, if they keep this up then they are going to be the second team this season behind Red Bull, however Aston Martin said they brought an upgrade this week as well, we haven't seen anything on practice that was exceptional but if that is how practice is usually, let's see if they will do better today, if they do get third place with Alonso then Mercedes is not there yet.

The only thing Mercedes benefiting from Aston Martin is that Stroll sucks, we are not going to see him lose his spot neither, the father Stroll bankrolls this whole team literally for his son to drive, so they will lose a lot of points because of that. In the end 1 Red Bull, 2- Mercedes, 3-Aston Martin (no thanks to Stroll) and 4- Ferrari seems to be the story of the season thus far, and seems like might be for the reason of the season.

ILuckyGuyI

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Quote from: tokeweed on June 17, 2023, 07:32:34 AM

~snip~

Anyway, what do you guys think of Hamilton to finish on the podium at 2.10? Mercedes might have made a breakthrough in car development.

Now I see this odd as 3.00 and he is sharing the same odd with Leclerc to go for podium. Honestly it would be worth giving a shot. In FP2, Mercedes drivers seemed really fast and took the first and second places. FP3 was way different though but the track condition wasn't the same. On a wet track Mercedes drivers couldn't be effective enough.

Maybe this is a sign that Mercedes drivers may not be able to have a good placement in the race if we have a wet track during most part of the race. But of course it is still an FP session so it is better not to be very confident about such thing. If it rains during the race this track can be much more challenging for the drivers. I think we can see many DNFs.

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Results of the sprint race.

2023 German MotoGP, Sachsenring - Sprint Race Results
Pos   Rider   Nat   Team   Time/Diff
1   Jorge Martin   SPA   Pramac Ducati (GP23)   20m 21.871s
2   Francesco Bagnaia   ITA   Ducati Lenovo (GP23)   +2.468s
3   Jack Miller   AUS   Red Bull KTM (RC16)   +3.287s
4   Luca Marini   ITA   Mooney VR46 Ducati (GP22)   +5.487s
5   Johann Zarco   FRA   Pramac Ducati (GP23)   +5.538s
6   Brad Binder   RSA   Red Bull KTM (RC16)   +6.289s
7   Marco Bezzecchi   ITA   Mooney VR46 Ducati (GP22)   +6.956s
8   Alex Marquez   SPA   Gresini Ducati (GP22)   +9.261s
9   Aleix Espargaro   SPA   Aprilia Racing (RS-GP23)   +9.691s
10   Enea Bastianini   ITA   Ducati Lenovo (GP23)   +9.715s
11   Marc Marquez   SPA   Repsol Honda (RC213V)   +10.828s

Source: https://www.crash.net/motogp/results/1029110/1/german-motogp-sachsenring-sprint-race-results

Bagnaia will probably champion this year too

MinMan

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Quote from: swogerino on June 16, 2023, 04:05:22 AM

Both Leclerc and Russell are good choices for Redbull and seeing the situation it would be stupid of them not to replace Perez if he does not pick up his pace and wins at least a couple more races for the season,he surely has the better car of the grid and for Verstappen it won't always go his way,he will have problems or failures some time and when that does,Perez still does not win then he will be removed and not contracted again.

Daniel I think has lost his motivation now as old in age who just loves to drive a F1 car but not that he will be of any threat to Verstappen at all while Russell and Leclerc may want to win themselves and that would be a scenario I would love to see materializing.

I am not sure if Russel would be willing to drive as second driver at Red Bull, it just doesn't make sense when he is the future of Mercedes, a top three team. I think he will stay at Mercedes and not going to switch teams this early on his career, it could be a risky move.

Charles on the other hand is a different situation, he is at Ferrari and everyone dreams of driving a Ferrari without a doubt, he is their first driver as well so he is in a dream situation right now, it should be all that anyone ever wants and he is doing so well in life. But one thing is for sure, the team sucks, the whole staff sucks, from engineers to pit crew, everyone there sucks. Which means that it is not going to be that easy to stay, if Red Bull convinces Charles, being competent at work would be the main key.

Davian144

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Quote from: Koal-84 on June 17, 2023, 08:02:32 AM

Perfect qualifying from Bagnaia, Mar Marquez crashed a total of three times in qualifying, that's almost a record 🤣.Even though it's the Sachsenring, he won't have a chance tomorrow.

He (Marquez) did crash three times in two qualifying sessions because he struggled from Q1 to Q2. And it was also very clear in the Sprint Race that just finished that Marquez had to really struggle with controlling the bike because Honda manufacturers and also other Asian manufacturers are not in good condition this season. How could it not be, on a circuit where Honda can usually easily win through Marquez today, you have to see the harsh reality where Marquez is outside the top ten.

Quote

For Ducati it looks very good again tomorrow, if it's not a flag to flag race. Maybe Miller on the KTM can surprise tomorrow, will be a nice motorsport day with MotoGP and Formel1.

I see that KTM is also getting better with their two drivers this season so that Jack Miller and Brad Binder also often make surprises in every race that has passed, including in today's Sprint Race. Tomorrow's race will probably be even more tense than today if the weather is clear and Jorge Martin also needs to watch out for Pecco Bagnaia because today Jorge Martin was able to win the Sprint Race.

Koal-84

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Quote from: Davian144 on June 17, 2023, 07:50:25 AM

I will not bet on Marc Marquez to race this time at the Sachsenring even though Marc Marquez is very famous at the Sachsenring by winning eleven races there, because in today's qualifying Marc Marquez still crashes in Q1 and also in Q2. So I decided not to bet on him, especially in the Sprint Race which is about to start which of course will be quite interesting to watch because the weather is starting to clear up. Wink

Perfect qualifying from Bagnaia, Mar Marquez crashed a total of three times in qualifying, that's almost a record 🤣.Even though it's the Sachsenring, he won't have a chance tomorrow.

For Ducati it looks very good again tomorrow, if it's not a flag to flag race. Maybe Miller on the KTM can surprise tomorrow, will be a nice motorsport day with MotoGP and Formel1.

Davian144

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Quote from: swogerino on June 16, 2023, 07:52:19 AM

Finally a track where rider skill is somewhat above bike in the MotoGP and Sachsenring circuit is well known at least several years ago when I used to watch closely every race in the era of Rossi,Biaggi and Lorenzo sure I have seen great races in this track.Since Marc Marquez is the favorite here I think we would be all doing a nice try if we bet on him to win the race,the last two races I have bet on him the odd were 9 to be the winner and over 2 in top 3 but he always crashed in those races.If the odd is good here and hopefully he does not crash,we are all going to make some additional good amount of money from this bet,only bet when you can afford to lose though and don't take this as an advice Grin

.

I will not bet on Marc Marquez to race this time at the Sachsenring even though Marc Marquez is very famous at the Sachsenring by winning eleven races there, because in today's qualifying Marc Marquez still crashes in Q1 and also in Q2. So I decided not to bet on him, especially in the Sprint Race which is about to start which of course will be quite interesting to watch because the weather is starting to clear up. Wink

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Quote from: jakdanyel on June 16, 2023, 04:24:12 AM

I wonder if we can see Verstappen in a Ferrari car in the future. There must be 4 or 5 years on his new contract now and I don't expect him to decide to leave Red Bull in this time period. Something big should just happen like Red Bull's dropping down from the title race for Verstappen to think of his future earlier. But I don't think such thing will happen that easy.

I think Verstappen stays as long as Horner stays with Red Bull. Maybe if Horner goes to Ferrari and becomes their team principal, Verstappen couod follow. Wink

The other influencial guy in Red Bull is their CTO Adrian Newey. The guy is a genius designer and engineer. Any team willbe lucky to have him... But I think he's gonna retire in a couple of years or so. There was a time when he demoted himself to a pure car designer role, giving signs of retirement and have less responsibilities with the team. But later went back and had a more active role again.

Don't think Red Bull would be where they are today without Newey... And Horner for that matter. :/

Anyway, what do you guys think of Hamilton to finish on the podium at 2.10? Mercedes might have made a breakthrough in car development.

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Quote from: coinlocket$ on June 16, 2023, 02:06:58 PM

1st hour of practice was complete with only 20ish minutes raced.

They got a problem with the cameras and they canceled the session.

To compensate the second hour of practice will be 90 minutes.

I think that always the practice does not show the true power of the cars,we have seen last races that Verstappen to end 5th or 6th in free practices and then skyrocketing to the pole on official qualifying.Nevertheless they give us a good overview about other teams who try their best in the practice sessions to do the more laps they can and to collect as much data as they can in order to help them improve when they prepare for the qualifying or the race itself.

I only hope rain is present here otherwise it will be a super boring race this one with Redbull dominating every single inch of this track from the beginning to the end of the race,the rain if there will make sure to stop Redbull supremacy as in rain we see more driver skills than car supremacy.

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Quote from: coinlocket$ on June 15, 2023, 04:52:47 PM

Quote from: Pulsar77 on June 14, 2023, 05:04:32 PM

McLaren to go for pole? I don't know.

It can be a high risk, high reward bet.

Mclaren is actually overheating the tires so when it rains and it is cold, so when it rains but only at some condition they have an incredible grip and they fly on the track.

After a few laps, they destroy the tires but this is another story. Grin

Of course it would be a really big profit you would have @41.00 odd for Norris to take pole position. Especially if we see a situation like the track conditions change continually during the qualifying session then this could make things really interesting. The probability of seeing surprise positionings and even a surprise pole would be higher than normal. I see that Verstappen's odd is 1.70 now and I don't think it is worth betting on. Because it is quite risky while the weather conditions don't seem good at all.

I would rather bet on another driver to try my luck with a small amount. Even Perez's odd is 10.00 now. Grin

karabiber

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Quote from: swogerino on June 16, 2023, 01:33:11 AM

Quote from: retreat on June 16, 2023, 01:13:31 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6g7A0qpB4g

We are back at the Canadian GP, an interesting circuit with slightly the same characteristics as Monaco and has a straight track and sharp turns which are quite tricky and a track that is a bit dusty which will be a challenge for the drivers. What's interesting about the interview above is when Leclerc made a statement that Aston Martin would be quite profitable with the circuit layout and RBR which would always be at the forefront. I laugh quite a bit when Leclerc makes statements like this and doesn't give a bit of credit to his team and car. Well, from this we can see that Leclerc is quite disappointed with the team and the car he drives and that's quite understandable.

I think this track has absolutely nothing to do with Monaco except those low speed corners which in here are a few and most of this circuit is run full power so hopefully we are going to see a better race than in Monaco here,the DRS would be making a difference here,a big one much different than in Monaco.Since there is rain in the forecast during all the weekend we can even expect a better race as long as we will be racing in wet conditions,those conditions put in the forefront the drivers skill more than the power of the car so who knows who wins this race in these conditions.

We will definitely see a better race in Montreal than in Monaco. It is said that there will be precipitation throughout the race and here the tires will come to the fore. All teams except Ferrari updated ahead of Montreal. Most of the updates are related to changes related to the downforce pack. Actually it can be said that the updates and parts made according to the track. The Red Bull has a new front wing, the Mercedes has a sidepod intake, while the Aston Martin has a new engine cover, cooling system and floor body. Williams brought a comprehensive update to Alex Albon's car making it the team that brought the biggest update package of the weekend. It must be something Ferrari relies on so it doesn't update. I guess they haven't figured out the problem Leclerc is having with his car yet and they don't have time to update it. lol. I thought Mclaren came with the new color package but this time they really understood that the update is different from painting the car. A race where updates are felt is waiting for us. Montreal could be a big lesson for Ferrari.

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1st hour of practice was complete with only 20ish minutes raced.

They got a problem with the cameras and they canceled the session.

To compensate the second hour of practice will be 90 minutes.

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Quote from: Davian144 on June 16, 2023, 07:47:42 AM

FP1 for the German MotoGP has been completed and will soon be followed by FP2 at the Sachsenring circuit, which incidentally Marc Marquez has won eleven races there so he is still very wary of the other riders here at the Sachsenring. Apart from that, it will be quite interesting to see who will qualify for Q2 today even though the weather is not so bright and in FP1 earlier it was Johan Zarco who took first place, followed by Marc Marquez in second and Aleix Espargaro in third.

Finally a track where rider skill is somewhat above bike in the MotoGP and Sachsenring circuit is well known at least several years ago when I used to watch closely every race in the era of Rossi,Biaggi and Lorenzo sure I have seen great races in this track.Since Marc Marquez is the favorite here I think we would be all doing a nice try if we bet on him to win the race,the last two races I have bet on him the odd were 9 to be the winner and over 2 in top 3 but he always crashed in those races.If the odd is good here and hopefully he does not crash,we are all going to make some additional good amount of money from this bet,only bet when you can afford to lose though and don't take this as an advice Grin

.

Davian144

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FP1 for the German MotoGP has been completed and will soon be followed by FP2 at the Sachsenring circuit, which incidentally Marc Marquez has won eleven races there so he is still very wary of the other riders here at the Sachsenring. Apart from that, it will be quite interesting to see who will qualify for Q2 today even though the weather is not so bright and in FP1 earlier it was Johan Zarco who took first place, followed by Marc Marquez in second and Aleix Espargaro in third.

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I wonder if we can see Verstappen in a Ferrari car in the future. There must be 4 or 5 years on his new contract now and I don't expect him to decide to leave Red Bull in this time period. Something big should just happen like Red Bull's dropping down from the title race for Verstappen to think of his future earlier. But I don't think such thing will happen that easy.

Because we have just entered this new era in Formula 1 and I don't think there would be a path-breaking change in the sport for so many years. Red Bull should be able to keep being strong as long as they develop the car regularly. However after Verstappen's contract starts to close in on ending then maybe he might decide to look for a new adventure and who knows maybe the rumours about Ferrari would come true.

Verstappen already says that he doesn't have any target like breaking the championship record. So he might not mind a change then even if Red Bull still continue to be the number one team then.

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