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Topic: Motosport General discussion tread --- Formula1, MotoGP, WTCC, ETCC, DTM..... - page 500. (Read 144020 times)

legendary
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@Cnut37 I too was under the impression that it was Bottas fault, but after reading the article that you have shared here now I too feel that it wasn’t Bottas fault. Also I feel that F1 authorities need to step out of their comfort zone and address these issues, because as Hamilton righty said that the lives of the driver’s are at a risk, and hence I’m hoping that they’ll soon sort this issue out so incidents like these don’t happen again.

Glad the article was useful Smiley

Their aim with this safety car change is to increase excitement in the races. The current rules and tyres were supposed to allow easier overtaking, but it didn't work out like that. 2022 is a reset, and the changes coming then should lead to a more level field, more overtaking and more exciting racing - I have faith that Ross Brawn knows what he's doing, given his hugely impressive record.

But for this season and next, due to the limitations on development due to the pandemic, we are stuck with the current cars... and unfortunately a Mercedes that is vastly better than the other cars. Even Hamilton has said that if were a fan rather than a driver, he'd probably only watch the highlights rather than full races. So the result is that the FIA are trying everything they can to increase the excitement. They are considering reverse-grids as an option (although Mercedes for obvious reasons are strongly against this). And the thing with the safety car in the last race is more of the same... it shows how desperate they are to keep the races interesting and ad an element of uncertainty. It's a difficult position.
hero member
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It was a great race yesterday.It would have been even greater if Bottas would not have slowed down that much in the first safety car restart of the race which brought a big crash
What Bottas did at the restart was way to dangerous for the back of the field.
I don't think Bottas did something wrong, he didn't break any rules. He started so slow in order not to give Hamilton slipstream

It did initially look like it was Bottas' fault - even if it was within the rules and perfectly acceptable strategy... however, after the race both Hamilton and Albon (as well as Bottas) said the fault lay with the safety car not letting the drivers start racing until the very last minute. Apparently this has been a trend recently, although I was not aware of it until I read the article:

Quote
Hamilton said the way governing body the FIA handled a safety car restart, which led to a multi-car pile-up that took four cars out of the race, "put people at risk so maybe they need to rethink that".
The top three drivers all expressed the same opinion about the FIA's decision to delay the point at which the safety-car lights are extinguished, which defines the moment from which the leader can control the pace.
Hamilton, team-mate Valtteri Bottas and Red Bull's Alexander Albon all said the decision to do so at the last corner left the leader with no option but to back up the field until he reached the start-finish line, where racing can start, to reduce the risk of being passed.
At Mugello, this led to confusion among the drivers behind.
Haas driver Kevin Magnussen slowed down as he approached the line, reacting to cars in front. Williams' Nicholas Latifi took avoiding action and, unsighted until the last second, Alfa Romeo's Antonio Giovinazzi rammed into the back of Magnussen's car. McLaren's Carlos Sainz then hit both Latifi and Giovinazzi, who came close to rolling, before his car settled back on to the track.
Hamilton said: "It's absolutely not Valtteri's fault at all. It's the decision makers. I don't know who.
"They have been been moving the switching off the safety car lights later and later. We are out there fighting for position. Especially when you earn a position like Valtteri earned the position of being in the lead.
"Obviously they are trying to make it more exciting - but today was a little bit over the limit perhaps. But he [Bottas] did exactly what anyone would do."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/54141953

@Cnut37 I too was under the impression that it was Bottas fault, but after reading the article that you have shared here now I too feel that it wasn’t Bottas fault. Also I feel that F1 authorities need to step out of their comfort zone and address these issues, because as Hamilton righty said that the lives of the driver’s are at a risk, and hence I’m hoping that they’ll soon sort this issue out so incidents like these don’t happen again.
legendary
Activity: 1904
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It was a great race yesterday.It would have been even greater if Bottas would not have slowed down that much in the first safety car restart of the race which brought a big crash
What Bottas did at the restart was way to dangerous for the back of the field.
I don't think Bottas did something wrong, he didn't break any rules. He started so slow in order not to give Hamilton slipstream

It did initially look like it was Bottas' fault - even if it was within the rules and perfectly acceptable strategy... however, after the race both Hamilton and Albon (as well as Bottas) said the fault lay with the safety car not letting the drivers start racing until the very last minute. Apparently this has been a trend recently, although I was not aware of it until I read the article:

Quote
Hamilton said the way governing body the FIA handled a safety car restart, which led to a multi-car pile-up that took four cars out of the race, "put people at risk so maybe they need to rethink that".
The top three drivers all expressed the same opinion about the FIA's decision to delay the point at which the safety-car lights are extinguished, which defines the moment from which the leader can control the pace.
Hamilton, team-mate Valtteri Bottas and Red Bull's Alexander Albon all said the decision to do so at the last corner left the leader with no option but to back up the field until he reached the start-finish line, where racing can start, to reduce the risk of being passed.
At Mugello, this led to confusion among the drivers behind.
Haas driver Kevin Magnussen slowed down as he approached the line, reacting to cars in front. Williams' Nicholas Latifi took avoiding action and, unsighted until the last second, Alfa Romeo's Antonio Giovinazzi rammed into the back of Magnussen's car. McLaren's Carlos Sainz then hit both Latifi and Giovinazzi, who came close to rolling, before his car settled back on to the track.
Hamilton said: "It's absolutely not Valtteri's fault at all. It's the decision makers. I don't know who.
"They have been been moving the switching off the safety car lights later and later. We are out there fighting for position. Especially when you earn a position like Valtteri earned the position of being in the lead.
"Obviously they are trying to make it more exciting - but today was a little bit over the limit perhaps. But he [Bottas] did exactly what anyone would do."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/54141953
legendary
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According to Binotto Ferrari will probably skip even the next year for upgrading the car.
They will probably come with a new car but they will not invest so much waiting for the revolution in 2022.


About Bottas, he did nothing wrong the mistake was from Latifi who accelerated to early, around 1.1-1.3 seconds before Bottas.

Binotto is the false man for Ferrari, but Ferrari have not really options for next year!? Next year the development is as good as frozen (i mean only 2 major things) and the biggest problem is the engine from Ferrari. At time Alfa Rome is ahead with Ferrari so also at the aerodynamic makes Ferrari wrong thinks!

Mercedes sleeps not and make also development and bring new parts.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/mercedes-design-upgrades-mugello-win/
legendary
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According to Binotto Ferrari will probably skip even the next year for upgrading the car.
They will probably come with a new car but they will not invest so much waiting for the revolution in 2022.


About Bottas, he did nothing wrong the mistake was from Latifi who accelerated to early, around 1.1-1.3 seconds before Bottas.
legendary
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It was interesting to see race in not typical modern F1 track. Here every mistake costs a lot, because there is no safety zones, like where Max basically stuck in gravel after accident. Overtaking was possible only in one place - DRS zone and first coner. But beforer ace I expected that there will be even less overtakes.

True but I don't think was a big problem in the end.
Often in other tracks where you can pass only at one point in the rest of the track, you lose a lot of time because the air is dirty and you can't stay near your opponent.

Here even if was possible to overtake only in one point to me wasn't a real problem since in the rest of the track they were close to the opponent and they could overtake him the next lap on the same point.

This year is just an exception and you see classic racetracks, unfortunately, the classic racetracks don't have that much money that you can see them every year. Hamilton have more luck than Bottas but I'm happy for Kimi his first points and that ahead of Ferrari.
legendary
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Slava Ukraini!
It was a great race yesterday.It would have been even greater if Bottas would not have slowed down that much in the first safety car restart of the race which brought a big crash making even more drivers go out of the race after Verstappen and Gasly were out in the second turn of the first lap.
I don't think Bottas did something wrong, he didn't break any rules. He started so slow in order not to give Hamilton slipstream and not lose position before the first corner. I think it's fault of other drivers who started to early and didn't noticed what's going on in front.
sr. member
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It was a great race yesterday.It would have been even greater if Bottas would not have slowed down that much in the first safety car restart of the race which brought a big crash making even more drivers go out of the race after Verstappen and Gasly were out in the second turn of the first lap.

What Bottas did at the restart was way to dangerous for the back of the field.

The race was very entertaining. I didn't expect that much overtakes as there were.
legendary
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Congratulations F. Morbidelli winning the Misano Marco Simoncelli World Circuit, Morbidelli made a pretty GAP in Lap eighteenth, with secondly he is completely comfortable in first place after that. Unfortunately Valentino Rossi had to settle for finishing fourth after being overtaken by Joan Mir on the last lap. But in my opinion, these results are good enough for Valentino Rossi. I was surprised today, two Suzuki riders really showed good performance in the MotoGP San Marino, they looked better than usual.

Yes congratulation to Morbidelli and Bagnaia, at a past race the two have no luck with his engine but perfect run for the two. Sorry for Rossi but the will make his #200 Podium place next week but definitely this year.

My suspicion that the Yamaha and Suzuki work well in Misano has been proven.

 
legendary
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It was a great race yesterday.It would have been even greater if Bottas would not have slowed down that much in the first safety car restart of the race which brought a big crash making even more drivers go out of the race after Verstappen and Gasly were out in the second turn of the first lap.
sr. member
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True but I don't think was a big problem in the end.
Often in other tracks where you can pass only at one point in the rest of the track, you lose a lot of time because the air is dirty and you can't stay near your opponent.

Here even if was possible to overtake only in one point to me wasn't a real problem since in the rest of the track they were close to the opponent and they could overtake him the next lap on the same point.


It is a good track, fast and tight. I don't care that much about the amount of overtaking rather the tightness of the pack and the drama it brings.It was a fun race to watch and this shows that there are a lot of tracks that can produce much more interesting racing then most of those artificial Tilkedromes Cheesy
legendary
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It was interesting to see race in not typical modern F1 track. Here every mistake costs a lot, because there is no safety zones, like where Max basically stuck in gravel after accident. Overtaking was possible only in one place - DRS zone and first coner. But beforer ace I expected that there will be even less overtakes.

True but I don't think was a big problem in the end.
Often in other tracks where you can pass only at one point in the rest of the track, you lose a lot of time because the air is dirty and you can't stay near your opponent.

Here even if was possible to overtake only in one point to me wasn't a real problem since in the rest of the track they were close to the opponent and they could overtake him the next lap on the same point.
legendary
Activity: 1904
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It was interesting to see race in not typical modern F1 track. Here every mistake costs a lot, because there is no safety zones, like where Max basically stuck in gravel after accident. Overtaking was possible only in one place - DRS zone and first coner. But beforer ace I expected that there will be even less overtakes.

The last two races have been interesting, but both times it was because of incidents beyond the drivers' control. We need races that are interesting not because of safety cars or botched pit stops, but because we have evenly matched drivers in evenly matched vehicles... but it doesn't like that will be the case until 2022.

Verstappen is the closest to Hamilton in talent, but he is still young and still makes mistakes. The Hamilton of the last couple of seasons has just been relentless in his consistency, an improvement to the already formidable driver we saw in the Rosberg years. No-one can challenge Hamilton until the car reset in 2022. Verstappen has talent but not the car, Bottas has the car but although he's a good driver he's just not in Hamilton's class.

I should add that Hamilton's position on the BLM issue has been impressive, too. He really has used his power in the sport as a force for good.
legendary
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Slava Ukraini!
So, after all these safety cars, red flags and restarts, Mercedes still won comfortable without any doubts. Last red flag helped them a lot because they had problems with tyres, especially Bottas and then they got chance to change tyres without making pit stop.
Albon finally achieved podium. It's important thing for him in order to keep his seat in Red Bull. It's pity for Ricciardo, he had great race and was close to podium, but 4th place is also good after all. And finally Kimi got his first points today, despite 5 second penalty.

Do you like the old school tracks?
It was interesting to see race in not typical modern F1 track. Here every mistake costs a lot, because there is no safety zones, like where Max basically stuck in gravel after accident. Overtaking was possible only in one place - DRS zone and first coner. But beforer ace I expected that there will be even less overtakes.
sr. member
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Honestly I believe we are watching something that is there for us to just be a loyal customer and nothing more, it is getting boring after a while. I know that there are shocking results here and there, one day Hamilton gets a punishment, one day something else happens, but at the end of the day, we all know the champion will be Hamilton, I know this is basically car companies showing off and everyone acting like it is just a big sponsorship type of situation for these mega companies, but I am not even kidding I want them all to be on the same car.

In basketball you do not give a bigger hoop to better team, in football you do not give losing team a wider post, in golf the best do not get a huge hole, at this point f1 is so predictable because Mercedes basically has 10x better car, give every racer the same exact car and watch the fun, that would be 100000x more fun than this.
legendary
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Another red flag, wth is happening  Grin.
Do you like the old school tracks?

The second third (lol) start will probably behind the safety car because we have only 12 cars left  Grin
hero member
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It is official now and that is Vettel to Racing Point as this is indicated in the official instagram of Racing Point.We all would have preferred Checco and Vettel but when daddy is the owner of the F1 team things behave differently.

I'm not a fan of Perez, as in I have no special affinity with him, however that move doesn't make sense for Racing Point/Aston Martin if they want to win GPs and championships. Unless they're able to make a very fast car, but since their current car is only fast because it's a copy of the Mercedes, meaning they don't actually know how to make a fast car by themselves.

I think Vettel deserves a chance to bounce back, but Perez was a much safer bet, especially if they want to keep Lance Stroll who is too young yet (or not good enough). I guess Vettel brings sponsors, that's the only explanation.
legendary
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Congratulations F. Morbidelli winning the Misano Marco Simoncelli World Circuit, Morbidelli made a pretty GAP in Lap eighteenth, with secondly he is completely comfortable in first place after that. Unfortunately Valentino Rossi had to settle for finishing fourth after being overtaken by Joan Mir on the last lap. But in my opinion, these results are good enough for Valentino Rossi. I was surprised today, two Suzuki riders really showed good performance in the MotoGP San Marino, they looked better than usual.
legendary
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Is this an F1 race or a demolition derby entrainment?  Grin

What a race 10laps, 9 behind the safety car, RED FLAG and 2 safity cars  Huh

sr. member
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The track is impressive for driving in to, many turns at 270 kph this is impressive but it will probably boring for overtakes.

The nice point it will red flags and yellow flags, you you miss a turn here at thise speed the safity car will come.

I thinkg this is a record.

5.6G



Source: https://twitter.com/MercedesAMGF1/status/1304399684946071553

They almost need to be Jet Drivers to race here  Cheesy

The last turn is pure ecstasy and joy to watch from on board. The way it flows and drags the car outside is awesome, you can feel the power as it is accelerating and the G force involved. The fact that they almost go out of the track limits just enhances that impression.

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