ODI cricket and general cricketing discussion [self - mod] - page 336.

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Quote from: Shishir99 on November 23, 2023, 05:50:34 AM

The pitch was the same. But the condition of the pitch changes due to the dew at night. This happened because BCCI had to organize the Day/Night match due to their broadcaster's request for more TRP.

Yeah. These greedy boards and broadcasters are usually the reason why the pitch conditions change drastically for two teams in the same match making it completely unfair for both of them.

You won't find such an issue in sports like Basketball, Baseball etc in comparison.

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Quote from: 3kpk3 on November 22, 2023, 09:09:59 AM

The pitch did play a big role in Australia's win for sure, but these are all just excuses at the end of the day. Fact is that Australia was the better team in the final plain and simple while India choked once again.

True. As a home side, India has a chance to choose the pitch according to them and I believe they did it too. The fact is, India had to win the toss. Did you notice that the Aussies were struggling after losing the first three wickets? But the dew changed many things here. But agree, all these facts are just excuses at this moment.

Quote from: 3kpk3 on November 22, 2023, 09:09:59 AM

Also, I truly detest the fact that pitch conditions are different for both teams in the same match which is an unfair aspect of cricket.

The pitch was the same. But the condition of the pitch changes due to the dew at night. This happened because BCCI had to organize the Day/Night match due to their broadcaster's request for more TRP.

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Quote from: Cheema02 on November 22, 2023, 09:59:09 PM

Quote from: Sithara007 on November 22, 2023, 09:44:19 PM

Quote from: HelliumZ on November 22, 2023, 06:43:13 PM

Mohammed Shami has taken almost five wickets in every match he has played. One got a wicket in the final match so can blame the bowlers in the final match. In this case I will admit that India is unlucky because India lost their luck that day. If India had won the toss and decided to field on that day, India could have become the champion of this World Cup. However, if the luck is bad, one has to fall into a bad situation from any side.

Mohammed Shami found himself left out of the playing XI a few times recently, but in the end he managed to storm in to the squad. In the first few matches of the world cup, India decided to go with the combination of Mohammed Siraj and Jasprit Bumrah, and there was no room to include Shami. But despite all that, he finished the tournament as the top wicket taker. I was actually disappointed with the performance from both Siraj and Bumrah. They took wickets against weak opponents, but crumbled while bowling under pressure situations.

Muhammad Shami top wickets tacker bowler of the world cup they picked 24 wickets in just 9 matches of world cup and second Adam Zampa for picking 23 wickets in 11 matches and Virat kholi is top scorer of tournament but India lose the final match one soded that a quite disappointing for india. I think this lose not that Indian Bowler's didn't perform well but due to batting performance of team india is responsible beacuse if they are add 40 to 50 more runs in the total then it will be challenging for Australia to chase down. India didn't get advantage of home ground they losse match after Australia winning the toss in start of match.

Mohammad Shami bowled very well in all the matches of ICC World Cup 2023 and took 24 wickets in all the matches.The Australian team played the final match very well and everyone will be surprised to see this match that Australia won the match. Yes that's true indian batsman could not good performance. If the Indian batsmen tried something, they were going to be a tough target. Australia took a very good decision after winning the toss.

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Quote from: Jateng on November 23, 2023, 04:37:08 AM

Australia never lost any knockout match except some one because they dont take preesure in knock out matches on other hand India lost knockout matches since 2014
India lost t20 world cup final against sri lanka and also lost semi-final against Australia in 2015 also lost t20 world cup semi final against West indies in 2016 on their home and lost icc champion trophy final against pakistan in 2017 fruther they lost ODI world cup semi final against New Zealand in 2019 and lost test championship final against new Zealand in 2021 they lost t20 world cup semi final against england in 2022 and they lost icc test championship final against Australia in 2023 and recently they lost Icc world cup final agianst Australia on their home in october 2023. India record in knockout matches are not good in last 10 years

I had posted about this even before the start of the world cup. Australia always get to beast mode, during the knockout phase of major tournaments. Other teams lose their focus and energy as a result of wear and tear as the tournament progresses, but in case of Australia it is the opposite. Also, one thing that I noticed about Australia is that they do proper rotation of their players. They provide adequate rest for their main players and this help them to stay away from injuries and burnouts. Other teams such as India never implement such measures.

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Quote from: Jateng on November 23, 2023, 04:37:08 AM

Quote from: fuguebtc on November 23, 2023, 03:33:24 AM

Quote from: 7788bitcoin on November 22, 2023, 05:19:32 PM

When Australia lost the first two matches of the world cup, everyone of criticizing Pat Cummins for the failure because he was not aggressive as a captain and to win the rest of the match and then to have a great game plan to counter India in the final was marvelous. Credit should be given to the coaching staff and the captain for leading from the front through the tournament with the bat even though he did not play any fancy innings but was helping the team during crucial situations and with the ball and then executing them in the field was perfect.

Let's be honest, Pat Cummins was actually scared. And that was the best thing that happened to him. Australia was being criticized a lot and a lot of people also said that Australia was not going to make it to the semifinals. Even I was thinking the same thing when Australia was in really bad situation against Afghanistan. I thought India was going to take the trophy without any big trouble. But Australia turned things around. Australia where scared and that is exactly what enabled them to perform better and make themselves. Push harder for better performance.

Australia never lost any knockout match except some one because they dont take preesure in knock out matches on other hand India lost knockout matches since 2014
India lost t20 world cup final against sri lanka and also lost semi-final against Australia in 2015 also lost t20 world cup semi final against West indies in 2016 on their home and lost icc champion trophy final against pakistan in 2017 fruther they lost ODI world cup semi final against New Zealand in 2019 and lost test championship final against new Zealand in 2021 they lost t20 world cup semi final against england in 2022 and they lost icc test championship final against Australia in 2023 and recently they lost Icc world cup final agianst Australia on their home in october 2023. India record in knockout matches are not good in last 10 years

The way India has performed since the start of the 2023 World Cup has been truly remarkable, including Virat Kohli and Rohit Sharma, every Indian batsman has batted brilliantly. I would say that India's luck may not have been on India's side in the final. Otherwise, such good batsmen could not score very well. It is really painful. They should forget the pain of not winning the 2023 World Cup and focus on the upcoming championship and T20 World Cup. As they have tasted defeat more than once in the final game and in the semi-final too the Indian team has lost several times. So India team should play both the batting and bowling very responsibly when they play semi-final or final then maybe they can taste the champions.

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Quote from: fuguebtc on November 23, 2023, 03:33:24 AM

Let's be honest, Pat Cummins was actually scared. And that was the best thing that happened to him. Australia was being criticized a lot and a lot of people also said that Australia was not going to make it to the semifinals. Even I was thinking the same thing when Australia was in really bad situation against Afghanistan. I thought India was going to take the trophy without any big trouble. But Australia turned things around. Australia where scared and that is exactly what enabled them to perform better and make themselves. Push harder for better performance.

And let's be honest India didn't have any true competition throughout the whole tournament. So I actually think probably India took things a little easy.

I agree with your opinion about the Australian, but you are missing few things they are the best learners and having best cricketing minds as well which give them edge in cricket and just because of this currently they are ruling the cricketing world without spending huge funds like India.

After first two matches I was also not sure about their chances but as they fight back and done things in next 9 games it's surely giving all how they can change the tables with their own match against Afghanistan and then having semifinal against South Africa were the best of them before this big show against India in final where nearly 90% Indians were sure for the win and many ads and other social media related material was also ready but suddenly Aussies done magic and bring them down.

Ricky Ponting give them good tips which works, and they were able to bring down one of the best Indian side in ODI history with bang and won this world cup in front of 100K fans at Narendra Modi Stadium, Ahmedabad.

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Quote from: fuguebtc on November 23, 2023, 03:33:24 AM

Quote from: 7788bitcoin on November 22, 2023, 05:19:32 PM

When Australia lost the first two matches of the world cup, everyone of criticizing Pat Cummins for the failure because he was not aggressive as a captain and to win the rest of the match and then to have a great game plan to counter India in the final was marvelous. Credit should be given to the coaching staff and the captain for leading from the front through the tournament with the bat even though he did not play any fancy innings but was helping the team during crucial situations and with the ball and then executing them in the field was perfect.

Let's be honest, Pat Cummins was actually scared. And that was the best thing that happened to him. Australia was being criticized a lot and a lot of people also said that Australia was not going to make it to the semifinals. Even I was thinking the same thing when Australia was in really bad situation against Afghanistan. I thought India was going to take the trophy without any big trouble. But Australia turned things around. Australia where scared and that is exactly what enabled them to perform better and make themselves. Push harder for better performance.

Australia never lost any knockout match except some one because they dont take preesure in knock out matches on other hand India lost knockout matches since 2014
India lost t20 world cup final against sri lanka and also lost semi-final against Australia in 2015 also lost t20 world cup semi final against West indies in 2016 on their home and lost icc champion trophy final against pakistan in 2017 fruther they lost ODI world cup semi final against New Zealand in 2019 and lost test championship final against new Zealand in 2021 they lost t20 world cup semi final against england in 2022 and they lost icc test championship final against Australia in 2023 and recently they lost Icc world cup final agianst Australia on their home in october 2023. India record in knockout matches are not good in last 10 years

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Quote from: LDL on November 23, 2023, 03:06:34 AM

We cannot put the entire blame on the team selection as India's performance in the first 10 matches was outstanding. Everyone started to think that India might win the 2023 World Cup but their reverse in the finals is really unacceptable. Moreover, if India won the toss in the final, the picture of the final might have changed. Rohit Sharma's performance in this World Cup was amazing, Virat Kohli performed amazingly and became the highest run scorer. However, despite India's all-round performance, such a defeat cannot be accepted at the end.

Previous meeting, India won by 142 runs
But final meeting, Australia won by 6 wickets
Both matches consists of Same team.
How can you explain this results??

You want explanation? LOL.. the explanation is that India got overconfident and failed to adjust to the conditions. On both occasions, it was Australia who won the toss. But in the first match, Australia chose to bat first. They got bowled out for just 199 runs, and India chased down the target with 6 wickets to spare. In the second match, Australia sent India to bat first after winning the toss. The outcome was similar. Chasing team won the match with 6 wickets to spare. In the first match, it was Ravindra Jadeja and Kuldeep Yadav who did the maximum damage, with Ravichandran Ashwin taking the wicket of Cameron Green. In the second match, the Australians were quite prepared, and they handled the spinners quite well.

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Quote from: LDL on November 23, 2023, 02:24:22 AM

Your idea is 100% true and everyone will agree with your idea. If the Indian team management had given importance to the team selection and chosen to bowl on the Ahmedabad pitch, they might not have performed so badly that day. Rahul Dravid's team selection was not wrong, but they should have considered the spin on the pitch that day. Only Virat Kohli, Rohit Sharma, and KL Rahul's contribution was noticeable that day but others contribution fully zero.

OP, I appreciate you 100%, but the Indian team management hadn't given importance to the pitch. If they had given their look on the pitch, they would have done anything before. Here we can't find that. They felt proud of the previous matches. They thought that the Indian team would be the winner that day naturally but unfortunately, they were defeated. They forget that it's a game of Cricket here that has occurred anything at any time.

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Quote from: 7788bitcoin on November 22, 2023, 05:19:32 PM

Quote from: fuguebtc on November 22, 2023, 10:22:41 AM

~
Indian team was just outplayed. There is no excuse. The captaincy of Australian team was absolutely on the point. They set up the field really well. It was a pretty unusual field setting in the middle of from Australia. They forced Virat Kohli to take a single through the third man region. And eventually, Virat Kohli got out trying to do that. And Australia had a really good plan which they executed perfectly. And honestly, it did not matter how well India was going to bowl Australia had the capability of chasing the target. we have seen Australia winning impossible matches in this tournament. Especially against Afghanistan. And I think India was used to playing in fast pitches throughout the whole tournament, so when they eventually had to play in a slow pitch, they didn't do well.

When Australia lost the first two matches of the world cup, everyone of criticizing Pat Cummins for the failure because he was not aggressive as a captain and to win the rest of the match and then to have a great game plan to counter India in the final was marvelous. Credit should be given to the coaching staff and the captain for leading from the front through the tournament with the bat even though he did not play any fancy innings but was helping the team during crucial situations and with the ball and then executing them in the field was perfect.

Let's be honest, Pat Cummins was actually scared. And that was the best thing that happened to him. Australia was being criticized a lot and a lot of people also said that Australia was not going to make it to the semifinals. Even I was thinking the same thing when Australia was in really bad situation against Afghanistan. I thought India was going to take the trophy without any big trouble. But Australia turned things around. Australia where scared and that is exactly what enabled them to perform better and make themselves. Push harder for better performance.

And let's be honest India didn't have any true competition throughout the whole tournament. So I actually think probably India took things a little easy.

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Quote from: Sithara007 on November 23, 2023, 02:49:39 AM

Quote from: LDL on November 23, 2023, 02:24:22 AM

Your idea is 100% true and everyone will agree with your idea. If the Indian team management had given importance to the team selection and chosen to bowl on the Ahmedabad pitch, they might not have performed so badly that day. Rahul Dravid's team selection was not wrong, but they should have considered the spin on the pitch that day. Only Virat Kohli, Rohit Sharma, and KL Rahul's contribution was noticeable that day but others contribution fully zero.

I am not sure whether Rahul Dravid was given 100% freedom in team selection. I was not very happy with the way Mohammed Shami was left out of the first couple of matches, and also the way they treated Ravichandran Ashwin. The current selection criteria hasn't worked well, as we have seen from the failure of the Indian team during world cup finals. I would suggest providing complete freedom to Dravid, at least for the next 12 months, and also some of the senior players (especially guys such as KL Rahul) needs to be rested and replaced with younger players.

We cannot put the entire blame on the team selection as India's performance in the first 10 matches was outstanding. Everyone started to think that India might win the 2023 World Cup but their reverse in the finals is really unacceptable. Moreover, if India won the toss in the final, the picture of the final might have changed. Rohit Sharma's performance in this World Cup was amazing, Virat Kohli performed amazingly and became the highest run scorer. However, despite India's all-round performance, such a defeat cannot be accepted at the end.

Previous meeting, India won by 142 runs
But final meeting, Australia won by 6 wickets
Both matches consists of Same team.
How can you explain this results??

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Quote from: Sithara007 on November 23, 2023, 02:49:39 AM

Quote from: LDL on November 23, 2023, 02:24:22 AM

Your idea is 100% true and everyone will agree with your idea. If the Indian team management had given importance to the team selection and chosen to bowl on the Ahmedabad pitch, they might not have performed so badly that day. Rahul Dravid's team selection was not wrong, but they should have considered the spin on the pitch that day. Only Virat Kohli, Rohit Sharma, and KL Rahul's contribution was noticeable that day but others contribution fully zero.

I am not sure whether Rahul Dravid was given 100% freedom in team selection. I was not very happy with the way Mohammed Shami was left out of the first couple of matches, and also the way they treated Ravichandran Ashwin. The current selection criteria hasn't worked well, as we have seen from the failure of the Indian team during world cup finals. I would suggest providing complete freedom to Dravid, at least for the next 12 months, and also some of the senior players (especially guys such as KL Rahul) needs to be rested and replaced with younger players.

I personally think Rahul Dravid may not be given full freedom. India did not get the expected performance from Suryakumar. Even then he was given a chance. I thought the Indian management would give Ashwin a chance in the last match. Because the pitch was spin bowling friendly. An extra spinner would have been more helpful for India. At the same time, Ashwin bats quite well. But when I didn't see Ashwin in the final square, I was disappointed. Suryakumar Yadav's batting was also not as good as expected. Yadav has been included in the squad for batting well at crucial moments for the team. But he failed completely.

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Quote from: LDL on November 23, 2023, 02:24:22 AM

Your idea is 100% true and everyone will agree with your idea. If the Indian team management had given importance to the team selection and chosen to bowl on the Ahmedabad pitch, they might not have performed so badly that day. Rahul Dravid's team selection was not wrong, but they should have considered the spin on the pitch that day. Only Virat Kohli, Rohit Sharma, and KL Rahul's contribution was noticeable that day but others contribution fully zero.

I am not sure whether Rahul Dravid was given 100% freedom in team selection. I was not very happy with the way Mohammed Shami was left out of the first couple of matches, and also the way they treated Ravichandran Ashwin. The current selection criteria hasn't worked well, as we have seen from the failure of the Indian team during world cup finals. I would suggest providing complete freedom to Dravid, at least for the next 12 months, and also some of the senior players (especially guys such as KL Rahul) needs to be rested and replaced with younger players.

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Quote from: LDL on November 23, 2023, 02:24:22 AM

.
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Your idea is 100% true and everyone will agree with your idea. If the Indian team management had given importance to the team selection and chosen to bowl on the Ahmedabad pitch, they might not have performed so badly that day. Rahul Dravid's team selection was not wrong, but they should have considered the spin on the pitch that day. Only Virat Kohli, Rohit Sharma, and KL Rahul's contribution was noticeable that day but others contribution fully zero.

We can say if's and but's after the result but what team India did was right and they got bad day and unfortunately it happened on final. The same XI did terrific for the past 10 games so how can you guys justify that with one bad day and the pitch was supposed to assit spin but it didn't due to the dew factor so even if India played Ashwin it won't made any actual difference. Still India is the better team but Australia won the trophy and they managed by doing extra preparations and tactics to outperform the excellent Indian team where Indian team lacked but apart from that no one can be blamed, if one should be blamed then I would say the pitch curator for giving a dad pitch on the final day.

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Quote from: Sithara007 on November 23, 2023, 02:10:50 AM

Quote from: LDL on November 23, 2023, 12:28:26 AM

Virat kholi most runs collector In the world cup history as well as all Indian.
Shami 24 wickets another world class the highest record in the CWC.
Jadeja the best all-rounder and sometimes he greatly backed up batting at number 6/7.
SKY batting well at number 7/8.

In fact, you can tell whether a player should be blamed or not. Since the entire Indian team did not play well on the day of the final, it should be blamed on the entire Indian team, in this case, blaming only two or four players would certainly look spectacular.

The blame should fall on the team, as well as the management. The pitch at Ahmedabad was supportive of spin bowling and still Indian selectors refused to include Ravichandran Ashwin in the playing XI. Ashwin's inclusion would have strengthened their bowling as well as strengthened the lower order batting. For the final match, Kuldeep was the only full-time spinner and that was more like a big handicap for India. Jadeja was supposed to back him up, but he failed in doing that. Also, Indian lower order failed to make any significant contribution with the bat.

Your idea is 100% true and everyone will agree with your idea. If the Indian team management had given importance to the team selection and chosen to bowl on the Ahmedabad pitch, they might not have performed so badly that day. Rahul Dravid's team selection was not wrong, but they should have considered the spin on the pitch that day. Only Virat Kohli, Rohit Sharma, and KL Rahul's contribution was noticeable that day but others contribution fully zero.

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Quote from: wiss19 on November 23, 2023, 12:18:03 AM

Quote from: Fuso.hp on November 22, 2023, 03:23:24 PM

Although 120,000 supporters were in favor of India, it seems that the crowd's voice worked against India. When such a large number of people chanted India India together, it made a mark in the minds of the Indian cricketers that they must win this final. Indian cricketers were afraid that if they lost the final for any reason, they would be under a lot of pressure. The extra push to win the match pushed them away from this match. India has a T20 series ahead of them against Australia, against whom India has performed poorly. Team India will perform well in the upcoming T20 series against Australia as Team India will play a lot of pressure free in the upcoming match.

Foremost there were only 93000 supporters not 120000 with Indian were overconfident after winning ten matches, and they were taking Australians lightly where was their mistake, and they pay for this as well in first 10 overs things were in well control but sadly wicket of the Rohit Sharma bring them down and after this no one do aggressively which helps Australia for win in this final game.

Now it's all ended with sad lost because I watch many things on social media they were 100% sure about win many ads and other things were ready for the win but at the end we have big disappointment which needs time to bring back fans at their level and hopefully things will be much better and under control in next few months with now we are heading for the T20i World Cup which is going to play in the USA/West Indies.

The World Cup final left the Indian 1 lac plus fans in shock, considering the promising start and the high expectations after remain unbeaten in 10 matches. I think Rohit Sharma aggressive innings and Virat Kohli's fifty were not enough to overcome Australia clinical display of batting and bowling. The closing moments of the match were marked by a stunned silence among the 92,450 plus strong crowd in the Narendra Modi Stadium, highlighting the unexpected turn of events and Australia's well-deserved triumph in this world cup 2023.

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Quote from: LDL on November 23, 2023, 12:28:26 AM

Virat kholi most runs collector In the world cup history as well as all Indian.
Shami 24 wickets another world class the highest record in the CWC.
Jadeja the best all-rounder and sometimes he greatly backed up batting at number 6/7.
SKY batting well at number 7/8.

In fact, you can tell whether a player should be blamed or not. Since the entire Indian team did not play well on the day of the final, it should be blamed on the entire Indian team, in this case, blaming only two or four players would certainly look spectacular.

The blame should fall on the team, as well as the management. The pitch at Ahmedabad was supportive of spin bowling and still Indian selectors refused to include Ravichandran Ashwin in the playing XI. Ashwin's inclusion would have strengthened their bowling as well as strengthened the lower order batting. For the final match, Kuldeep was the only full-time spinner and that was more like a big handicap for India. Jadeja was supposed to back him up, but he failed in doing that. Also, Indian lower order failed to make any significant contribution with the bat.

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Quote from: 3kpk3 on November 22, 2023, 11:41:05 PM

Quote from: JSRAW on November 22, 2023, 03:36:17 PM

Every Indian cricket fan was expecting India to lift the trophy because that was the expectation after 10 straight wins but in finals, players just didn't turn up with their performances.

I can understand why some fans are doubting players but IMO it's temporary because of loss. The sooner they move on, the better and they just have to accept that the team lost the finals despite being in red hot form. It hurts but it happens, that's how the game of cricket or sports goes.

I can understand the frustration of fans in this regard, but blaming players like Kohli who contributed so much through a crazy amount of dedication and hard work is just stupidity at its finest.

Blaming players like Sky, Siraj(Unexpectedly) etc makes sense since they were pretty underwhelming in this tournament.

Virat kholi most runs collector In the world cup history as well as all Indian.
Shami 24 wickets another world class the highest record in the CWC.
Jadeja the best all-rounder and sometimes he greatly backed up batting at number 6/7.
SKY batting well at number 7/8.

In fact, you can tell whether a player should be blamed or not. Since the entire Indian team did not play well on the day of the final, it should be blamed on the entire Indian team, in this case, blaming only two or four players would certainly look spectacular.

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Quote from: Fuso.hp on November 22, 2023, 03:23:24 PM

Although 120,000 supporters were in favor of India, it seems that the crowd's voice worked against India. When such a large number of people chanted India India together, it made a mark in the minds of the Indian cricketers that they must win this final. Indian cricketers were afraid that if they lost the final for any reason, they would be under a lot of pressure. The extra push to win the match pushed them away from this match. India has a T20 series ahead of them against Australia, against whom India has performed poorly. Team India will perform well in the upcoming T20 series against Australia as Team India will play a lot of pressure free in the upcoming match.

Foremost there were only 93000 supporters not 120000 with Indian were overconfident after winning ten matches, and they were taking Australians lightly where was their mistake, and they pay for this as well in first 10 overs things were in well control but sadly wicket of the Rohit Sharma bring them down and after this no one do aggressively which helps Australia for win in this final game.

Now it's all ended with sad lost because I watch many things on social media they were 100% sure about win many ads and other things were ready for the win but at the end we have big disappointment which needs time to bring back fans at their level and hopefully things will be much better and under control in next few months with now we are heading for the T20i World Cup which is going to play in the USA/West Indies.

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Quote from: JSRAW on November 22, 2023, 03:36:17 PM

Every Indian cricket fan was expecting India to lift the trophy because that was the expectation after 10 straight wins but in finals, players just didn't turn up with their performances.

I can understand why some fans are doubting players but IMO it's temporary because of loss. The sooner they move on, the better and they just have to accept that the team lost the finals despite being in red hot form. It hurts but it happens, that's how the game of cricket or sports goes.

I can understand the frustration of fans in this regard, but blaming players like Kohli who contributed so much through a crazy amount of dedication and hard work is just stupidity at its finest.

Blaming players like Sky, Siraj(Unexpectedly) etc makes sense since they were pretty underwhelming in this tournament.

Topic: ODI cricket and general cricketing discussion [self - mod] - page 336. (Read 170558 times)