Premier League Prediction Thread 2021/2022 - page 4590.

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Quote from: rendravolt on December 16, 2022, 08:56:00 PM

It seems that Liverpool are really in good form, last night they just had a friendly match against AC milan and Liverpool managed to win with a score of 4-1. Good work for Darwin Nunez who this time managed to score 2 goals against AC Milan. It seems that after returning from Qatar the Liverpool players have found their best game and I hope that they will also prove their appearance when the English Premier League starts again. Even though this was only a friendly match against AC Milan it should be quite difficult for them and Liverpool managed to meet the goal requirement.

This result indeed cannot be used as the reference for Liverpool performance for upcoming matches because according to starting lineup AC Milan was playing used their reserved players but at least this result showed the current squad for Liverpool was ready to competition again and talking about Nunez premier league almost reach to half season but Nunez seems still struggling to adapt with Liverpool and on pre season tour too he has scoring goals several times but at the competitions seems he was unable to performing well so i am not very excited although in this match he can scoring two goals

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Quote from: asriloni on December 17, 2022, 07:24:40 AM

Quote from: rendravolt on December 16, 2022, 08:56:00 PM

It seems that Liverpool are really in good form, last night they just had a friendly match against AC milan and Liverpool managed to win with a score of 4-1. Good work for Darwin Nunez who this time managed to score 2 goals against AC Milan. It seems that after returning from Qatar the Liverpool players have found their best game and I hope that they will also prove their appearance when the English Premier League starts again. Even though this was only a friendly match against AC Milan it should be quite difficult for them and Liverpool managed to meet the goal requirement.

Ac milan seems an easy opponent to the liverpool and the level between liverpool compared with ac milan was too far. The italian league was so far compared with EPL. The competition is also different while EPL is very competitive at this moment.
It seems like that liverpool has been coming back again to the right track but ac milan can't be used as a parameter to make sure liverpool already got its best performance again. There must be an important parameter just like a few matches in EPL.
This will be far reliable caused by we do know that ac milan was also losing against chelsea in UCL

But Ac milan is in 2nd place in the serie A standings, isn't that a pretty tough opponent even though it's only a friendly match? Even so the competition for the Scudetto definitely belongs to Napoli because the difference with AC Milan is quite far. Back to the EPL, Liverpool still need a win in the competition, it's impossible for them to finish below the top 4. Therefore they are concocting a good strategy to move up to a better position.

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Quote from: martyns on December 17, 2022, 06:14:59 AM

It seems Jorghen Klopp's period of reign and dominance on the English premier league table is beginning to come to an end as the different clubs in England seems to be now understanding their method of play,and now knowing how to tackle and defend them.The other thing that really made the team loose balance is the sale of Mane to Bayern Munich.Mohamed Salah and Nunez could not do the work that Mane was doing,attacking their opponent with aggression and also coming back to defend as well.The guy was in deed every thing to Liverpool,but they didn't know untill they lose him,Salah himself didn't even know that his scoring form was as a result of Mane's effort.
We will wait to see where they will end up on the table.

Yes, that's right, since Sadio Mane was sold, Liverpool has had difficulties at the start of the season, because Mane is a player who is always guarded by the opposing team, versatile and good at finding space and creating opportunities, hopefully LIVERPOOL will quickly rise from adversity.
however I still believe, last season MU also slumped at the start of the season, but still managed to rank 7th. Liverpool still have a chance to finish at least in 4th position. Arsenal almost succeeded in finishing 4th place with a much worse squad than Liverpool last season.

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Quote from: Pokapoka124 on December 17, 2022, 05:21:32 AM

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Liverpool are no less than 15 points behind league leaders Arsenal. That says a lot about the current form of Liverpool and the last few months. Perhaps things went wrong at the start of the season, even after the big defeat against Napoli in Italy. the teams from place 3 are all quite close to each other in the ranking. Liverpool should be able to finish at least 3rd with this selection. How to estimate Newcastle is difficult. It is a bit like the Leicester team that became champions a few years ago in terms of strength.

I still can't forget about the legendary season Manchester City had in the Premier League. They were in a similar condition to Liverpool's current one but they climbed the positions one by one and even got a comfortable championship by opening a quite big gap with their closest rival.

Maybe it is too much to ask from Liverpool to do a similar thing in this season. Because it is a really low chance and we don't see this kind of stories come true very often. Apart from that, Liverpool's situation is even more difficult. Because Arsenal and Manchester City have been doing an amazing work until this point. It means that there isn't only one serious title contender at the moment. It is very difficult for Liverpool to get past both of these beasts. But even if they finish in top 3 despite this bad start, it'd still be a nice work.

This will be a difficult task for Liverpool to try and turn the season around and be title contenders, I'm not saying it is impossible but it wouldn't be an easy task for the team. There is a low possibility of making it happen especially with the level of form Arsenal and Manchester city are on this season. It gives a major doubt that they will be able to make it happen. The only possibility I see is making the top four at the end of the season.

Liverpool were a very strong team. However, since Sadio Mane joined another team from Liverpool, the performance of the Liverpool team has been noticed. But the type of players they have in the team are all of a very high quality, hopefully after the World Cup Liverpool will return to their usual form and good things will go on.

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Quote from: el kaka22 on December 17, 2022, 06:42:41 AM

It is not "impossible" for Liverpool to win the title, there is a 15 point difference and it's not something that can't be covered but lets be honest and just realize that it won't happen. We have seen Liverpool trail City with just 1-2 points and still lose because City refused to lose points, hence they kept winning and Liverpool ended up with points that would have been champions in most years, became second in those years because of Cities record breaking point championships.

All in all I think City will get it again, even though Arsenal is at the top, I still would bet on City to get it because they are a much more consistent team when it comes to winning games in premier league.

Liverpool winning the Premier League can only be possible if they have a rapid turn around with how they play from defense to attack.
Thry have to do more than Arsenal and Manchester City together, if they can achieve that then they can find way or themselves into the top four slots. As it stands, both Manchester City and Arsenal are the biggest challenge they'll face they may likely not end up with the three points.

I feel like it's time for Arsenal to get the premier league, they may lack depth and no much quality players to fight, but more consistency than they did during the first half round will make sense.

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Quote from: BitcoinHunt3r on December 16, 2022, 04:46:04 PM

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Quote from: keyscore44 on December 16, 2022, 09:43:33 AM

I think Arsenal will be able to beat West Ham. Because Arsenal have enough great players who are performing better than West Ham. However, there is nothing to underestimate West Ham, they will also try hard to secure victory. But I see Arsenal winning this match.

In terms of this chance it can still be but of course this is still not certain.
Currently, the stinky players have gathered again after about a month when they returned to their respective countries to undergo a break and the world cup competition (which follows) and now they have to be demanded again to concentrate on the EPL with no less hot tension.
I think there will be a few things that are difficult especially from the fatigue factor, hopefully this isn't too disturbing.

Most of the players in the Premier League do not participate in the World Cup or have come out so more precisely they returned from holidays Cheesy

The coaches in the Premier League are busy paying attention to players in the World Cup to be included in the target list in the upcoming transfer market

Only Alvarez from the EPL who has shone enough in the Qatar world cup has scored 4 goals so far. maybe some of those who competed in the Qatar world cup have returned home from the start because their team failed to penetrate the next round, it can be said that they are more appropriate to look for a vacation before the game starts again. now several clubs are having friendly sessions against other teams from different leagues. there is indeed quite a lot of speculation that has arisen in the winter transfer window, especially teams that are experiencing big problems with player injuries and they have to look for other players in the January transfer window. Arsenal will continue to monitor several names of players who are already on their radar to strengthen their flanks and front line before the game starts again.

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Quote from: Doell on December 17, 2022, 07:23:31 AM

Quote from: el kaka22 on December 17, 2022, 06:42:41 AM

It is not "impossible" for Liverpool to win the title, there is a 15 point difference and it's not something that can't be covered but lets be honest and just realize that it won't happen. We have seen Liverpool trail City with just 1-2 points and still lose because City refused to lose points, hence they kept winning and Liverpool ended up with points that would have been champions in most years, became second in those years because of Cities record breaking point championships.

All in all I think City will get it again, even though Arsenal is at the top, I still would bet on City to get it because they are a much more consistent team when it comes to winning games in premier league.

Overall City can get the tittle again I agree with you. City still be EPL title favourites, the previous season City could win the title with a good record one point from Liverpool, the slight difference is like dejavu 2018-2019 in 2021-2022 we can see the same club sitting in the same position from top six to top one. I don't doubt City in the Premier League, they are still the biggest threat to a club in the top four.

Any top-five team can win the English Premier League title but it all depends on their performance. Currently, Arsenal has been outstanding, winning some important games and the team has shown much quality and character. But we must not also forget that Arsenal sometimes acts inconsistently. It is not strange to see the team start losing points drastically, but we expect that they would keep staying on top till the end of the season. City and Liverpool are teams that have always portrayed a never-give-up spirit. They have the character of coming from behind and fighting to clinch the title. Nobody ever imagined that Liverpool would be a title contender last season after their poor run at the beginning of the season. We shouldn't also forget Newcastle United because this team has the right players, coach, and money-spending owners.

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Quote from: rendravolt on December 16, 2022, 08:56:00 PM

It seems that Liverpool are really in good form, last night they just had a friendly match against AC milan and Liverpool managed to win with a score of 4-1. Good work for Darwin Nunez who this time managed to score 2 goals against AC Milan. It seems that after returning from Qatar the Liverpool players have found their best game and I hope that they will also prove their appearance when the English Premier League starts again. Even though this was only a friendly match against AC Milan it should be quite difficult for them and Liverpool managed to meet the goal requirement.

Ac milan seems an easy opponent to the liverpool and the level between liverpool compared with ac milan was too far. The italian league was so far compared with EPL. The competition is also different while EPL is very competitive at this moment.
It seems like that liverpool has been coming back again to the right track but ac milan can't be used as a parameter to make sure liverpool already got its best performance again. There must be an important parameter just like a few matches in EPL.
This will be far reliable caused by we do know that ac milan was also losing against chelsea in UCL

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Quote from: el kaka22 on December 17, 2022, 06:42:41 AM

It is not "impossible" for Liverpool to win the title, there is a 15 point difference and it's not something that can't be covered but lets be honest and just realize that it won't happen. We have seen Liverpool trail City with just 1-2 points and still lose because City refused to lose points, hence they kept winning and Liverpool ended up with points that would have been champions in most years, became second in those years because of Cities record breaking point championships.

All in all I think City will get it again, even though Arsenal is at the top, I still would bet on City to get it because they are a much more consistent team when it comes to winning games in premier league.

Overall City can get the tittle again I agree with you. City still be EPL title favourites, the previous season City could win the title with a good record one point from Liverpool, the slight difference is like dejavu 2018-2019 in 2021-2022 we can see the same club sitting in the same position from top six to top one. I don't doubt City in the Premier League, they are still the biggest threat to a club in the top four.

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Quote from: Bobrox on December 16, 2022, 08:16:33 PM

Quote from: nurilham on December 16, 2022, 06:53:40 PM

Agree. Liverpool seems hard to compete for the title with the current points. It is too far from Arsenal in the first place. Liverpool also still can't play consistently and win 3 points in every match. There is a significant change in Liverpool performance this season. So, we cannot expect Liverpool to play as well as the last season. I also think that UCL zone is the most possible goal for Liverpool. But it won't be easy too since they must compete with Tottenham and Man United.
You are right that only Arsenal and Man City compete for the title this season. Although Arsenal is leading with 5 points, Man City isn't a typical club that is easy to stop struggling. They must try all out to overtake Arsenal, Arsenal isn't safe yet.

Started with poor performance in this season, Liverpool chance with Primer League tittle seems hard after remaining 15 points left from Arsenal leaded standing position awhile. No doubt with Primer League left many matches but Liverpool performance still inconsistency and I don't sure can exist and compete in Primer League tittle race with Arsenal and Manchester City.

Reaching to UEFA Champion League Zone standing seems possible for Liverpool because left 5 points from Tottenham Hotspur at 4th placed right now, but Liverpool still have one match left than Spur have played 15 matches. Arsenal and Manchester City are strong candidate team with Primer League tittle until matchday 15, if have consistency performance I believe with Arsenal opportunity can exist in the top standing position.

The Liverpool team is currently placed sixth in the English Premier League with 22 points, and they are 15 points behind the league leader Arsenal after 15 matches.

By my estimation, this is quite a big difference after 15 matches in the English Premier League. As a Liverpool fan, I must admit that I did not expect Liverpool to be playing this poorly.

However, I think the departure of Sadio Mané has hit them really hard. In my opinion, their biggest problem is the lack of depth with in the squad. In the meantime, I think we will have a really fierce race between Arsenal and Manchester City to secure the league title. This is because there are only five points separating these two teams at the top.

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Quote from: bitzizzix on December 16, 2022, 11:10:57 PM

Quote from: rendravolt on December 16, 2022, 08:56:00 PM

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Quote from: Joca97 on December 16, 2022, 05:39:20 PM

Liverpool is out of the title race,the bad start to the season costed them badly and now they can only hope that they reach the champions league group faze amd that is really intense. Arsenal and City will be battling the entire season for the title and only them

Liverpool are still in the top five and in my opinion there is still hope for them to return to the top position, even though it is hard to do at least Liverpool must try their best to restore their achievements and provide fresh air for the fans who provide full support for them.

It seems that Liverpool are really in good form, last night they just had a friendly match against AC milan and Liverpool managed to win with a score of 4-1. Good work for Darwin Nunez who this time managed to score 2 goals against AC Milan. It seems that after returning from Qatar the Liverpool players have found their best game and I hope that they will also prove their appearance when the English Premier League starts again. Even though this was only a friendly match against AC Milan it should be quite difficult for them and Liverpool managed to meet the goal requirement.

Unfortunately, the 2022 Dubai Super Cup title already belongs to Arsenal.
Yes Liverpool played very well against AC Milan and also dominated the game until the end of the match, and hopefully keep it consistent for Loverpool when it comes back to EPL and UCL too.
and the competition in the EPL is very fierce, even though Liverpool's best game has returned but it still makes it difficult for Liverpool to lead the standings, maybe the ultimate goal in the EPL is to be in the top four.

Indeed, logically, even though you cannot compete for the EPL championship, it is enough to get into the top four so that in the following season you can enter the champions league qualification. Considering that the point distance from the top of the Arsenal standings is 15 points, it is quite difficult to catch up and what can compete with Arsenal is Manchester City. The most important thing now for Liverpool is to make a consistent record in every game, if they can maintain it then they will return to their usual good game.

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It is not "impossible" for Liverpool to win the title, there is a 15 point difference and it's not something that can't be covered but lets be honest and just realize that it won't happen. We have seen Liverpool trail City with just 1-2 points and still lose because City refused to lose points, hence they kept winning and Liverpool ended up with points that would have been champions in most years, became second in those years because of Cities record breaking point championships.

All in all I think City will get it again, even though Arsenal is at the top, I still would bet on City to get it because they are a much more consistent team when it comes to winning games in premier league.

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Quote from: naira on December 17, 2022, 05:39:51 AM

Quote from: Pokapoka124 on December 17, 2022, 05:21:32 AM

This will be a difficult task for Liverpool to try and turn the season around and be title contenders, I'm not saying it is impossible but it wouldn't be an easy task for the team. There is a low possibility of making it happen especially with the level of form Arsenal and Manchester city are on this season. It gives a major doubt that they will be able to make it happen. The only possibility I see is making the top four at the end of the season.

After all, only 4 seats can qualify for the Champions League next season. When Liverpool lose their chance, it's a shame that a club that already has a big name has to give in to a team that is now moving faster. Liverpool's initial steps were less fortunate after signing Nunez, and their progress has been slow. It is true that there is little possibility for Liverpool, who are now outperforming teams such as Arsenal and Manchester City. Plus, if Liverpool don't have additional player options next season, it will make it even more difficult to be at the top of the standings.

It seems Jorghen Klopp's period of reign and dominance on the English premier league table is beginning to come to an end as the different clubs in England seems to be now understanding their method of play,and now knowing how to tackle and defend them.The other thing that really made the team loose balance is the sale of Mane to Bayern Munich.Mohamed Salah and Nunez could not do the work that Mane was doing,attacking their opponent with aggression and also coming back to defend as well.The guy was in deed every thing to Liverpool,but they didn't know untill they lose him,Salah himself didn't even know that his scoring form was as a result of Mane's effort.
We will wait to see where they will end up on the table.

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Quote from: Pokapoka124 on December 17, 2022, 05:21:32 AM

This will be a difficult task for Liverpool to try and turn the season around and be title contenders, I'm not saying it is impossible but it wouldn't be an easy task for the team. There is a low possibility of making it happen especially with the level of form Arsenal and Manchester city are on this season. It gives a major doubt that they will be able to make it happen. The only possibility I see is making the top four at the end of the season.

It's mostly impossible for The Kop to win Premier League 2022 - 2023 but it is very possible for them to end it within top four. The title competition if no big changes, will only be between Arsenal and Manchester City.

Quote from: naira on December 17, 2022, 05:39:51 AM

After all, only 4 seats can qualify for the Champions League next season. When Liverpool lose their chance, it's a shame that a club that already has a big name has to give in to a team that is now moving faster. Liverpool's initial steps were less fortunate after signing Nunez, and their progress has been slow. It is true that there is little possibility for Liverpool, who are now outperforming teams such as Arsenal and Manchester City. Plus, if Liverpool don't have additional player options next season, it will make it even more difficult to be at the top of the standings.

Liverpool still have good chance to take a position in top four of Premier League. They had problems with medical care for their players which caused too many injuries in the past two seasons especially in early of this season. They had problems with Nunez adaptation to Liverpool formation and Premier League. That caused problems for them in need of a good replacement for Sadio Mane who moved to Bayern Munich.

After all, their injured players are gradually recovered and returning to their training and are ready for matches. Nunez in latest matches before World Cup 2022 shown that he was playing better for Liverpool. All these are good supports for Liverpool performance after World Cup 2022 and it can help them to fight for top four position.

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Quote from: naira on December 17, 2022, 05:39:51 AM

Quote from: Pokapoka124 on December 17, 2022, 05:21:32 AM

This will be a difficult task for Liverpool to try and turn the season around and be title contenders, I'm not saying it is impossible but it wouldn't be an easy task for the team. There is a low possibility of making it happen especially with the level of form Arsenal and Manchester city are on this season. It gives a major doubt that they will be able to make it happen. The only possibility I see is making the top four at the end of the season.

After all, only 4 seats can qualify for the Champions League next season. When Liverpool lose their chance, it's a shame that a club that already has a big name has to give in to a team that is now moving faster. Liverpool's initial steps were less fortunate after signing Nunez, and their progress has been slow. It is true that there is little possibility for Liverpool, who are now outperforming teams such as Arsenal and Manchester City. Plus, if Liverpool don't have additional player options next season, it will make it even more difficult to be at the top of the standings.

Basically, the performance of Arsenal and Manchester City is also not as perfect as imagined, they are not easy to keep winning. It's just that, when the performance of Arsenal and Manchester City was not good, other competing teams also experienced very severe performance declines such as Liverpool and Chelsea.
But yes, we don't know what will happen next, but if I consider situations like this, then I think Liverpool still have a chance to finish in the top four.

Besides that, when I consider Arsenal and Manchester City's performance is not so perfect, then I doubt them to be able to win the title this season.
Even though so far Arsenal and Manchester City are still in first and second place in the Premiere League standings, it looks like their position will be taken over by a team that has just become the richest team and is experiencing a very rapid increase in performance.

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Quote from: Pokapoka124 on December 17, 2022, 05:21:32 AM

This will be a difficult task for Liverpool to try and turn the season around and be title contenders, I'm not saying it is impossible but it wouldn't be an easy task for the team. There is a low possibility of making it happen especially with the level of form Arsenal and Manchester city are on this season. It gives a major doubt that they will be able to make it happen. The only possibility I see is making the top four at the end of the season.

After all, only 4 seats can qualify for the Champions League next season. When Liverpool lose their chance, it's a shame that a club that already has a big name has to give in to a team that is now moving faster. Liverpool's initial steps were less fortunate after signing Nunez, and their progress has been slow. It is true that there is little possibility for Liverpool, who are now outperforming teams such as Arsenal and Manchester City. Plus, if Liverpool don't have additional player options next season, it will make it even more difficult to be at the top of the standings.

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Quote from: ILuckyGuyI on December 16, 2022, 03:11:35 PM

Quote from: pungopete468 on December 16, 2022, 03:03:58 PM

Liverpool are no less than 15 points behind league leaders Arsenal. That says a lot about the current form of Liverpool and the last few months. Perhaps things went wrong at the start of the season, even after the big defeat against Napoli in Italy. the teams from place 3 are all quite close to each other in the ranking. Liverpool should be able to finish at least 3rd with this selection. How to estimate Newcastle is difficult. It is a bit like the Leicester team that became champions a few years ago in terms of strength.

I still can't forget about the legendary season Manchester City had in the Premier League. They were in a similar condition to Liverpool's current one but they climbed the positions one by one and even got a comfortable championship by opening a quite big gap with their closest rival.

Maybe it is too much to ask from Liverpool to do a similar thing in this season. Because it is a really low chance and we don't see this kind of stories come true very often. Apart from that, Liverpool's situation is even more difficult. Because Arsenal and Manchester City have been doing an amazing work until this point. It means that there isn't only one serious title contender at the moment. It is very difficult for Liverpool to get past both of these beasts. But even if they finish in top 3 despite this bad start, it'd still be a nice work.

This will be a difficult task for Liverpool to try and turn the season around and be title contenders, I'm not saying it is impossible but it wouldn't be an easy task for the team. There is a low possibility of making it happen especially with the level of form Arsenal and Manchester city are on this season. It gives a major doubt that they will be able to make it happen. The only possibility I see is making the top four at the end of the season.

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Quote from: Avirunes on December 16, 2022, 03:01:30 PM

Quote from: Jody.Drummer on December 16, 2022, 02:33:41 PM

I think fatigue is normal but with the holiday conditions now after the world cup titles are over for some players because there are only 4 clubs who will be playing I don't think this will be a bit serious because they must know that they often live in this condition too.
Even though it was a bit forced with the world cup which was actually different compared to the previous several titles, this is not an excuse for professional players and I think they will understand that.

Well not an excuse but manager often tries to rest players who he doesn't think can give their 100%. Maybe they can be switched on but by playing them they know their risk and they might lose a player for an entire season if injury is a bad one.

Quote from: Jody.Drummer on December 16, 2022, 02:33:41 PM

On Arsenal I think they have to fight before the start of the transfer and I'm pretty sure about their form if you look at it from before they had their holidays.

Yeah I am confident about their form. One thing that I like the most is the chemistry that Arteta is building inside the squad. Its not only the regular squad or senior players, but young players are getting involved too. I like the way this is headed. No wonder Ronaldo praised Arteta and rooted Arsenal for this season in Piers Morgan interview.

At the moment only Wiliam Lilina still has to compete in the world cup and I think for the players there is no problem because everyone has lost and is no longer in the world cup this time and that is enough for them to rest. Fatigue is not included for conditions where they have rested for 2 weeks or even more.

As for the chemistry, at the moment it is going well, apart from that the young players also complement each other. who would have thought that Odegaard's leadership would be very good until now because I personally did not expect it but their young players have proven their capacity until now.

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Liverpool is out of the title race,the bad start to the season costed them badly and now they can only hope that they reach the champions league group faze amd that is really intense. Arsenal and City will be battling the entire season for the title and only them

Liverpool are still in the top five and in my opinion there is still hope for them to return to the top position, even though it is hard to do at least Liverpool must try their best to restore their achievements and provide fresh air for the fans who provide full support for them.

It will be difficult for Liverpool to return back to top position,because we have seen their displayed in some past games for the results they got that made many people to believed that it will be difficult for such miracle to happen in this season. They can struggle for 3rd position or second position in this premier league, but Manchester city will never allow them to take the top position from them because they are coming with another new tactics that will make them difficult for any team to beat.

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Quote from: X-ray on December 16, 2022, 08:41:38 AM

Quote from: Sirait on December 16, 2022, 05:25:35 AM

Quote from: borovichok on December 15, 2022, 03:54:13 PM

cut

Arsenal didn't contribute a lot to the world cup but remember that if its key players like gabriel jesus was getting injured. That means if arsenal may face the same situation like city. City and arsenal have disadvantage and advantages. The only problem is when people didn't know what's gonna be the result for the rest of english premier league. I think that the players who played in the world cup have enough time to recover after the world cup already ended. The players have almost a week to recover from their tired.
That's enough time for players to get back their strength again.

1 week time to rest? I think you're right, that's enough time for the tired players in the world cup to rest. but for the injured players, it looks like they need more time, that's why I say that arsenal is stumbling in the middle of this season because their mainstay player (who has helped Arsenal go so far) is seriously injured. on December 2, Arsenal will be scheduled to face West Ham, what strategy will Arteta use!

Topic: Premier League Prediction Thread 2021/2022 - page 4590. (Read 784226 times)