PoW hash rate domination are all temporary and can be changed quickly, we have seen many times old hash rate king been knocked down by new mining pools/farms
Enjoy your new masters.
This is for PoS coin stake holders
Topic: Proof of stake mining of bicoin - page 17. (Read 25670 times)
Enjoy your new masters.
This is for PoS coin stake holders
People who prefer PoS can simply use the already existing PoS systems.
More and more Bitcoin owners are starting looking for alternatives to wasteful PoW, this is the point of this discussion.
It is not wasteful, it is a must. You can't create money out of thin air like fiat money, that kind of scam must stop, this is the point of bitcoin
The point of bitcoin was to liberate the monetary system from centralized powers (aka the central bankers). PoS and PoW currencies derive their value from their ability to allow people to escape from centralized monetary systems. Once a cryptocurrency fails to provide this decentralization and becomes prone to centralization like BTC, the cryptocurrency loses its original value proposition.
Right and PoS always goes up in price, right? Notice that the average yearly price goes up substantially every year.
Price in dollars is irrelevant. In PoS like Nxt you don't pay 10% tithing. This is why PoS is better than PoW from economical point of view (this is why this subdiscussion was started if you remember).
So you really think majority of hash power having full control of the protocol is better then stake holders leading the coin development? Are you serious?
To control the majority of hash power, you must put real resources and might still fail due to slow in movement, it is much more difficult than controlling a few stake holders. Imagine that once bitcoin is becoming POS, then top 10 stake holders will immediately enter the watch list of CIA
Right and PoS always goes up in price, right? Notice that the average yearly price goes up substantially every year.
Price in dollars is irrelevant. In PoS like Nxt you don't pay 10% tithing. This is why PoS is better than PoW from economical point of view (this is why this subdiscussion was started if you remember).
You are moving goalposts. Inflation is not problematic because it is mathematically fixed at a known predictable rate. Price is baked in.
Number of Bitcoins today = 13'646'425
Number of Bitcoin 365 days ago = 12'177'500
Inflation = (13'646'425 - 12'177'500) / 13'646'425 = 10.76%
Price of 1 BTC today = 324 USD
Price of 1 BTC 365 days ago = 734 USD
Aye, the price is indeed baked in.
It is not wasteful, it is a must. You can't create money out of thin air like fiat money, that kind of scam must stop, this is the point of bitcoin
Doesn't Bitcoin do the same - creates money out of thin air? Why the current reward is 25 BTC instead of 17.82 BTC?
However, PoW hash rate domination are all temporary and can be changed quickly, we have seen many times old hash rate king been knocked down by new mining pools/farms
Pools... farms... What should I do with my Intel Core i5?
PoW hash rate domination are all temporary and can be changed quickly, we have seen many times old hash rate king been knocked down by new mining pools/farms
Enjoy your new masters.
And of course he can write his own textbook on economics.
While you are here - I'm waiting for your reply on https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.9950164
POS=no production cost=no value
If I can produce a coin without any cost, why should I pay any thing valuable to exchange it??? I will just go ahead to mine it
Fiat money can do this because there is a law to force its circulation, and the cost to make that law can be a war, which costs millions of times more energy than POW mining
If I can produce a coin without any cost, why should I pay any thing valuable to exchange it??? I will just go ahead to mine it
Fiat money can do this because there is a law to force its circulation, and the cost to make that law can be a war, which costs millions of times more energy than POW mining
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/how-to-identify-a-bitcointard-848881
Point 7
So you really think majority of hash power having full control of the protocol is better then stake holders leading the coin development? Are you serious?
People who prefer PoS can simply use the already existing PoS systems.
More and more Bitcoin owners are starting looking for alternatives to wasteful PoW, this is the point of this discussion.
It is not wasteful, it is a must. You can't create money out of thin air like fiat money, that kind of scam must stop, this is the point of bitcoin
And POS coin is against the nature of decentralized system: It is fixed by a small group of stake holders while the others can never change the system even if the time comes. The POW coins instead will change when the majority of hash power decided that a change is necessary
Controlled hashpower ~ available money. This lead to the conclusion that there is no difference between PoW and PoS except the fact that PoW needs a lot of electricity.
PoS domination once established are unchangeable, this is clearly telling late comers: You are too late, don't join this game. However, PoW hash rate domination are all temporary and can be changed quickly, we have seen many times old hash rate king been knocked down by new mining pools/farms
Unfortunatly a lot of guys here are already involved in asic mining and they have own interests while argueing pointless contra POS:
So when having costs for producing "something", this "something" will automatically get a value?
We are not even talking about human ressource, it isonly a asic-miner standing in a datacenter and wasting energy.
In my opinion this is nonsense, you won´t find such behaviour anywhere in the economy.
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POS=no production cost=no value
If I can produce a coin without any cost, why should I pay any thing valuable to exchange it??? I will just go ahead to mine it
If I can produce a coin without any cost, why should I pay any thing valuable to exchange it??? I will just go ahead to mine it
So when having costs for producing "something", this "something" will automatically get a value?
We are not even talking about human ressource, it isonly a asic-miner standing in a datacenter and wasting energy.
In my opinion this is nonsense, you won´t find such behaviour anywhere in the economy.
Having a cost does not automatically give something value. However, when something is getting some demand, people will always seek the lowest possible cost to get it, either they mine or they buy. Mining cost is just a indicator of the real demand, if it is too low, capitals will flow into mining, and raise the difficulty to a point that buying cost is almost the same as mining cost
You can imagine, if someone created a very advanced mining machine (like quantum mining rig) thus there is almost no way for normal people to mine the coin without large investment in TIME and R&D, then they can only buy coins from the market. In that case, bitcoin mining can consume much less energy for this specific miner. But as soon as there are other similar companies start to deploy their quantum mining rigs into the field, the situation will change, exactly like what happened in the ASIC mining evolution
Right now we observe that there are some PoS systems that consume almost no electricity but have not been successfully attacked yet (and the reward is very appealing).
How wonderful! I suppose, in that case, we don't need to change Bitcoin after all. People who prefer PoS can simply use the already existing PoS systems. I guess you've put an end to this discussion once and for all. Bravo!
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Laws of Economics are not universal, they are environment dependent. Change environment (this is what cryptos do) and you will change the laws.
And of course he can write his own textbook on economics.
People who prefer PoS can simply use the already existing PoS systems.
More and more Bitcoin owners are starting looking for alternatives to wasteful PoW, this is the point of this discussion.
and start to dump the rest of my coins
Which will adjust the market cap to corresponding level. The coins on that site already passed this stage and established at some level.
And POS coin is against the nature of decentralized system: It is fixed by a small group of stake holders while the others can never change the system even if the time comes. The POW coins instead will change when the majority of hash power decided that a change is necessary
Controlled hashpower ~ available money. This lead to the conclusion that there is no difference between PoW and PoS except the fact that PoW needs a lot of electricity.
POS=no production cost=no value
If I can produce a coin without any cost, why should I pay any thing valuable to exchange it??? I will just go ahead to mine it
Fiat money can have value without production cost, because there is a law to force its circulation, and the cost to make that law can be a war, which costs millions of times more energy than POW mining
If I can produce a coin without any cost, why should I pay any thing valuable to exchange it??? I will just go ahead to mine it
Fiat money can have value without production cost, because there is a law to force its circulation, and the cost to make that law can be a war, which costs millions of times more energy than POW mining
Then http://coinmarketcap.com/ gives us incorrect information... or you are just wrong.
Yes, those information are meaningless
Imagine that I create a coin with 500 coins total supply, I hold 499.999 and sell the rest 0.001 to my another account at a market price of 1000 dollar, I will get a coin exchange rate of 1 million and a market capital of 500 million. With a small amount of capital and a good scheme I can pump the coin price by 10-100 fold and start to dump the rest of my coins
POS=no production cost=no value
If I can produce a coin without any cost, why should I pay any thing valuable to exchange it??? I will just go ahead to mine it
Fiat money can do this because there is a law to force its circulation, and the cost to make that law can be a war, which costs millions of times more energy than POW mining
If I can produce a coin without any cost, why should I pay any thing valuable to exchange it??? I will just go ahead to mine it
Fiat money can do this because there is a law to force its circulation, and the cost to make that law can be a war, which costs millions of times more energy than POW mining
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/how-to-identify-a-bitcointard-848881
Point 7
It is not labor theory of value, it is a simple fact that people will always select the lowest cost method to get a coin. POS miner can not get it since they think a POS coin could have same political position as fiat money, sadly no one listen to them because they don't have any army
And POS coin is against the nature of decentralized system: It is fixed by a small group of stake holders while the others can never change the system even if the time comes. The POW coins instead will change when the majority of hash power decided that a change is necessary
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