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Topic: [Proposal] Mining Co-Op - page 8. (Read 11341 times)

hero member
Activity: 562
Merit: 506
We're going to need a bigger heatsink.
September 26, 2015, 04:57:02 PM
#47
I read this as ...we are gonna fill out our data hall first...then we MAY get to you on some units IF you buy a shitload of them to make it worth our while...assuming we have any left Smiley

(hey I'm just cynical since home mining btc is over for me at 13.5c kwh and 100 amp panel ...I feel soooooo small) Smiley

Me too.
However, it also seems like they will end up selling to the general public in a few months--and from there we can negotiate a bulk buy. Luckily, there's no pressure to start collecting funds now, so we can afford to wait until the moment is right.
member
Activity: 105
Merit: 250
September 26, 2015, 02:25:19 PM
#46
Well, that's quite the stretch goal!

61 SP50s (6.7PH/1MW) calls for quite a bit of cash. Some napkin math and price guesses probably puts the total upfront payment over 2M USD. I don't think our pockets go that deep, but who knows.

Regardless, the more you show up with the cheaper hosting will be.
copper member
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1465
Clueless!
September 26, 2015, 12:43:00 AM
#45
I just got a very personal (definitely not a form letter) response from Spondoolies.  Roll Eyes

Quote
Thank you for your email and your interest in the SP50. We are excited and proud to unveil our next generation machine as a breakthrough product for industrial mining.

With its extremely low power consumption and modular design the SP50 has been specifically designed for maximum power efficiency and ease of management.

Initially the SP50 will be offered in limited quantities only to a select group of customers. Due to the limited anticipated supply and overwhelming interest we initially intend to discuss purchases of the SP50 with certain significant shareholders, although this is not a requirement for purchase. If you have funding and are interested in a bulk purchase please reply to this email and let us know. If you are a BTCS shareholder please let us know that as well. Preference will be given to existing bulk customers and well-funded projects.

As we scale up production we hope to offer the SP50 to a wider market. At that time we will publish pricing and shipping terms as well as warranty information.

We thank you for your interest in the SP50 and look forward to working with you.

Since we aren't funded yet and ready to pull the trigger, it looks like we'll have to wait for wider availability. This might be a good thing, buying a little later would allow us to see whether or not the SP50 is a steaming turd (No offense Spondoolies, but you never know!)

Also:
I did some reading on stackoverflow on how to actually use multisig, it's a little nitty gritty (done on the command line) but well within my capabilities. I also may end up using armory as I've heard there is a good multisig implementation there. Of course, we'll do some test transactions before we start piling money into the address! The best part is that you can generate multisig addresses without needing to trust the person doing the generation--that means I can set it up without actually having full control over it! I think a 4/6 setup would work best, it minimizes risk of keys being lost (and freezing funds forever!) while also being fairly secure from members conspiring to run with the funds.

Phillip would be a great candidate to hold one of those keys. Personally, I think valkir would be good too. Maybe even me as well.  Wink


I read this as ...we are gonna fill out our data hall first...then we MAY get to you on some units IF you buy a shitload of them to make it worth our while...assuming we have any left Smiley

(hey I'm just cynical since home mining btc is over for me at 13.5c kwh and 100 amp panel ...I feel soooooo small) Smiley
hero member
Activity: 562
Merit: 506
We're going to need a bigger heatsink.
September 25, 2015, 04:44:15 PM
#44
What I mean with 0.14$ is that the stock is 0.14$. We could bough way more than 1.  Tongue

Personally I find it a bit risky to invest a large sum of cash in a company for the sole purpose of trying to jump ahead in line. I'm not sure how successful it would be either. If you think it's a good buy though, by all means go ahead.

Well I would be happy to help if it gets to that point. Got a business degree and experience in multi-branch operations management. Smiley

It would be great to have that expertise on board, thanks! I will be contacting you if/when this gets bigger.
legendary
Activity: 1708
Merit: 1080
September 25, 2015, 03:48:08 PM
#43
With an investment that, large 10+ Sp50's, I think it would be worth while to form an LLC or S-corp... for protections on both ends before and after the purchase but thats just my 2 cents Smiley
Yes, I agree there should be a legal framework at that point. I know only the basics about that stuff, I'll have to do some research if it gets to that.

Well I would be happy to help if it gets to that point. Got a business degree and experience in multi-branch operations management. Smiley
legendary
Activity: 1484
Merit: 1004
September 25, 2015, 03:20:47 PM
#42
What I mean with 0.14$ is that the stock is 0.14$. We could bough way more than 1.  Tongue
hero member
Activity: 562
Merit: 506
We're going to need a bigger heatsink.
September 25, 2015, 03:05:50 PM
#41
I'll be legitimately surprised if the SP50 comes in under $50K each. Buying 22x S7 to get the same hashrate would cost you over $40K, plus PSUs, plus the premium of having about 40% lower power consumption and, if it's like everything else SP has ever released, undervoltability (but this is very questionable given the released specs). $50-60k seems about right, which puts the 1MW cost around $3M.

Maybe, but from my chat with SP it looks like we'll only be buying them in a couple of months, there's no way we're a high priority customer. The difficulty will be higher, Avalon's new miners might be popping up, and bitmain will probably have lowered their prices by then, so the SP50 price could come down significantly.

I had a similar email from spondoolies. So Im looking to buy some BTCS stocks  Grin

Only 0,14$ We could than write to them that we are shareholder.

From the email I got:
With an investment that, large 10+ Sp50's, I think it would be worth while to form an LLC or S-corp... for protections on both ends before and after the purchase but thats just my 2 cents Smiley
Yes, I agree there should be a legal framework at that point. I know only the basics about that stuff, I'll have to do some research if it gets to that.
legendary
Activity: 1708
Merit: 1080
September 25, 2015, 02:57:04 PM
#40
With an investment that, large 10+ Sp50's, I think it would be worth while to form an LLC or S-corp... for protections on both ends before and after the purchase but thats just my 2 cents Smiley

And personally, I wouldnt touch the BTCS stock, at least not yet. BTCS has been operating at a loss since day one. Although, year over year they have managed to diminish the total deficit/year operating loss... it is still far from a profitable holding.
legendary
Activity: 1484
Merit: 1004
September 25, 2015, 02:42:54 PM
#39
I had a similar email from spondoolies. So Im looking to buy some BTCS stocks  Grin

Only 0,14$ We could than write to them that we are shareholder.

We could also buy some share together.

Let me know what you think about that.
legendary
Activity: 3416
Merit: 1865
Curmudgeonly hardware guy
September 25, 2015, 02:40:15 PM
#38
I'll be legitimately surprised if the SP50 comes in under $50K each. Buying 22x S7 to get the same hashrate would cost you over $40K, plus PSUs, plus the premium of having about 40% lower power consumption and, if it's like everything else SP has ever released, undervoltability (but this is very questionable given the released specs). $50-60k seems about right, which puts the 1MW cost around $3M.
legendary
Activity: 1456
Merit: 1000
September 25, 2015, 02:04:23 PM
#37
If there is a miner Co-OP just throwing this in there I am interested.   I would need to know specifics.

But I would love even if we set up a Co-Op where we could bring gear to a very low cost electricity area.   And split the cost's to make it affordable to do.  I will keep a closer eye on this thread.  I would like it to be in US if at all possible as I would probley want to visit it and drive my gear there.

Also I do not have any problem with philipma1957 being key holder.   He has my trust.
hero member
Activity: 562
Merit: 506
We're going to need a bigger heatsink.
September 25, 2015, 01:55:40 PM
#36
Well, that's quite the stretch goal!

61 SP50s (6.7PH/1MW) calls for quite a bit of cash. Some napkin math and price guesses probably puts the total upfront payment over 2M USD. I don't think our pockets go that deep, but who knows.
member
Activity: 105
Merit: 250
September 25, 2015, 01:19:51 PM
#35
Just throwing it out there, size is efficiency, so if a collective run by Armedmilitia approached us with 1MW, and at least four months notice, we could get something online for $45/kW with taxes included.
legendary
Activity: 4326
Merit: 8950
'The right to privacy matters'
September 25, 2015, 08:53:55 AM
#34
I would be willing to hold a key.

If we get 3 to 6 of these.

It could be interesting.
hero member
Activity: 562
Merit: 506
We're going to need a bigger heatsink.
September 25, 2015, 08:09:19 AM
#33
I just got a very personal (definitely not a form letter) response from Spondoolies.  Roll Eyes

Quote
Thank you for your email and your interest in the SP50. We are excited and proud to unveil our next generation machine as a breakthrough product for industrial mining.

With its extremely low power consumption and modular design the SP50 has been specifically designed for maximum power efficiency and ease of management.

Initially the SP50 will be offered in limited quantities only to a select group of customers. Due to the limited anticipated supply and overwhelming interest we initially intend to discuss purchases of the SP50 with certain significant shareholders, although this is not a requirement for purchase. If you have funding and are interested in a bulk purchase please reply to this email and let us know. If you are a BTCS shareholder please let us know that as well. Preference will be given to existing bulk customers and well-funded projects.

As we scale up production we hope to offer the SP50 to a wider market. At that time we will publish pricing and shipping terms as well as warranty information.

We thank you for your interest in the SP50 and look forward to working with you.

Since we aren't funded yet and ready to pull the trigger, it looks like we'll have to wait for wider availability. This might be a good thing, buying a little later would allow us to see whether or not the SP50 is a steaming turd (No offense Spondoolies, but you never know!)

Also:
I did some reading on stackoverflow on how to actually use multisig, it's a little nitty gritty (done on the command line) but well within my capabilities. I also may end up using armory as I've heard there is a good multisig implementation there. Of course, we'll do some test transactions before we start piling money into the address! The best part is that you can generate multisig addresses without needing to trust the person doing the generation--that means I can set it up without actually having full control over it! I think a 4/6 setup would work best, it minimizes risk of keys being lost (and freezing funds forever!) while also being fairly secure from members conspiring to run with the funds.

Phillip would be a great candidate to hold one of those keys. Personally, I think valkir would be good too. Maybe even me as well.  Wink
full member
Activity: 140
Merit: 100
September 24, 2015, 07:49:24 PM
#32
Ill be following this thread. Would definitely be considering partaking in this ventue if we can get our hands on some SP50's

Me too

Same!
legendary
Activity: 1484
Merit: 1004
September 24, 2015, 03:29:48 PM
#31
I would for sure trust philipma with no problem. Depend of if he want to manage this.  Grin
hero member
Activity: 562
Merit: 506
We're going to need a bigger heatsink.
September 24, 2015, 08:45:02 AM
#30

That's great! Ckpool sounds like a great idea to distribute payouts, they allow % distributions to multiple addresses for big miners. Bam! There goes our distribution problems.

Another option is an escrow...

Yes, the subject of my above post is about using multisig/regular escrow (to handle initial fund collection) and finding the right person/people to do it. We can't just trust some random escrow provider!
hero member
Activity: 572
Merit: 506
September 24, 2015, 08:39:48 AM
#29
I have a question for those who are interested, and it's probably the most important one!

Who should be responsible for holding funds and distributing payouts?

I'm a little paranoid. I certainly wouldn't trust myself with this much cash if I were you, and I don't think my security practices are good enough to be confident in storing that many coins. I use cold storage, but I would be very nervous as a single point of failure. No way can I cover it out of pocket if it gets hacked, and then you and me and a few dozen other people are royally screwed. Plus, I'll get doxxed by some (rightfully) pissed off people!

We need someone who:
  • Has experience storing large amounts of BTC, preferably someone who has run GBs/escrow services in the past.
  • Has a huge amount of rep--and I mean a lot, and an established presence.
  • We know the identity of (so we can have some form of recourse if shit hits the fan)

If you have any other requirements for this person, feel free to suggest them below!

We can do this in an even cooler way, too. We can create a multisig wallet under the control of multiple trusted members, deposit funds to that, and then do a big multisig transaction to the hoster & manufacturer (I can cc you guys in all my email communication). We should be able to get our hoster & manufacturer to sign their messages with PGP so you guys can verify I'm not talking to a sockpuppet!

Then we mine to a single address controlled by a trusted member. That way, there is only time a single person can run with the funds, and they can only take the current balance. We can have a failsafe to switch the mining payout address (set up beforehand) if this ends up happening. To those who have experience using multisig, do you think this plan makes sense?

Look at this  Wink

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.12509531

Another option is an escrow...
hero member
Activity: 562
Merit: 506
We're going to need a bigger heatsink.
September 24, 2015, 08:38:55 AM
#28
I think a multi-sig wallet makes absolute sense but still finding people to trust with a presumably $50-$100k or more, lump sum of coins/cash will be difficult given the history of this industry.

I agree with that completely.
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