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Topic: rpietila Altcoin Observer - page 31. (Read 387542 times)

legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
September 13, 2014, 11:24:32 PM
Nice omissions smooth.  If you have to remove context to make your point, it's a clue that your point is not very strong.

The presale was done in an entirely honorable and optimal manner.  It provided funds to hire Brynn San and Peter Todd, etc.

There was no omission. I was making a specific point, without comment on your opinion whether the presale was handled well or not

Fact: 1/9 (correction noted and see below) of the eventual total coin supply (presumably a much higher portion of the current supply, but I haven't figured this out) was sold to a group of relative insiders (i.e. people who even knew the coin existed) within a relatively short period of time.

What the was used for and whether it was conducted well doesn't change that point at all. As I said, if you think presales are a good idea, you will likely favor this, particularly if it was handled well (which according to you it was).

I leave it up to individuals who care to decide whether that makes or a desirable outcome or not.

Quote
It prevented insta/ninja/nerd mining.

This is nonsense. There are plenty of ways of preventing instaming, etc. that have nothing to do with a presale, and if anything the extra coins rewarded in the first week encourage instamining-type behavior (people who are able to deploy a lot of the right kind of hardware quickly and get everything in place right away get a disproportionate advantage).

I believe coins should do the exact opposite: a slow-start method (first suggested to me by gmaxwell) where the earlier blocks have lower rewards. That provides a good opportunity to address any startup issues (download problems, build problems, etc.) and avoids giving any particular advantage to people who are good with getting stuff up and running quickly (note, this last group happens to include me, and I've made a fair amount mining new coin launches, so I'm arguing against my own interest here). I'll note in fairness that Monero didn't do this, though also fair to note that the current team was not at all involved with the actual launch.

If by "nerd" mining you mean dga-type stuff, it is true they use the relatively mature Scrypt algorithm, and that is what prevents dga-style "nerd" mining, not the presale. It also likely gives a major advantage to people with the best Scrypt ASICs, which if history is any indication (and I believe it is) will usually be people with close relationships to the developers of those ASICs or the developers themselves.

Whether or not anyone cares about that I leave up to them (obviously opinions about ASIC-mining vs. non-ASIC-mining differ widely). It certainly doesn't count as a strike against VIA compared to other Scrypt coins, I'll say that.

Quote
PS You also got the total coins wrong, it's 92 million not "30."   Wink

Important correction! I misread the block reward schedule. I will edit above to avoid misleading anyone.

EDIT: In further correction on VIA. They did have a slow-start period of 10K blocks (about 4 days) with no mining reward. I applaud that, though I probably would just include some tiny reward as opposed to zero (small difference).

But overall the reward for the first 40K (not including the first 10K) blocks was about 100K coins in excess of the normal reward. I still find that bizarre and close to being an instamine over the first week. I see no valid purpose for it other than giving insiders a chance to rent rigs and mine out some extra coins quickly when few people even knew the coin existed.


legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1072
Crypto is the separation of Power and State.
September 13, 2014, 11:09:36 PM
presale

10 million coin presale out of the entire 30 million total.

If you think presales are cool, you probably like this. If you don't, you don't.

The accelerated block rewards the first week were rather bizarre and probably the opposite of how it should be done, but that's a relatively minor 100K coins or so.

Nice omissions smooth.  If you have to remove context to make your point, it's a clue that your point is not very strong.

The presale was done in an entirely honorable and optimal manner.  It provided funds to hire Brynn San and Peter Todd, etc.  It prevented insta/ninja/nerd mining.

I don't think all "presales are cool" and you have no evidence I approve of any presale besides VIA's, much less presales in general. 

Instead of being lazy, putting words in my mouth, and alluding to the general case against presales, why not tell us specifically you have against VIA's plan?

http://blog.viacoin.org/2014/07/08/viacoin-presale-launch.html

If you bother to read, you'll find the VIA presale was conducted in an exemplary, fair, and transparent manner.

PS You also got the total coins wrong, it's 92 million not "30."   Wink
legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
September 13, 2014, 10:49:59 PM
presale

10 million coin presale out of the entire 30 million total. Correction noted: 92 million.

If you think presales are cool, you probably like this. If you don't, you don't.

The accelerated block rewards the first week were rather bizarre and probably the opposite of how it should be done, but that's a relatively minor 100K coins or so.

legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1072
Crypto is the separation of Power and State.
September 13, 2014, 10:22:23 PM
XPOST from failed reboot thread:
Viacoin.  This is the only alt besides monero that I'm currently watching and take seriously.  Another smart coin developed by btcdrak in the same vein as counterparty but without all the btc drama that comes with it.  Peter Todd was hired to help with the design and is going to be implementing tree chains into the Viacoin network which he believes will solve the 51% attack problem.

You can find the relevant info here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/ann-via-viacoin-the-future-of-digital-currency-699278

The developers bring the same level of quality and commitment that the monero developers have brought to XMR imo.

Here is the live stream recorded of Peter Todd, BTCdrak, and many others discussion VIAcoin and Treechains...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8hTbfKAhfE

Also looks like Peter Todd is implementing "frozen coin" to VIA and BTC!  hugeee

https://twitter.com/petertoddbtc/status/510360423770898432

Let's add up VIA's score:

1. Is the coin delivering a relevant technological breakthrough as the first legitimate instance of the code?
++yes - 2 points (clearinghouse and treechains)

2. Does the coin have a developer team of several people, with at least 2 public people?
++Yes - 2 points (Peter Todd, Grynn San, and drak are well known)

3. Is the software open source?
++Yes - 2 points (https://github.com/viacoin/viacoin)

4. Involvement of Bitcoin whales/legendaries/hero members?
++Yes, so much that it inspires both awe and hate - 2 points (Otoh, Peter Todd, and myself)

5. What % of the eventual market cap is held by the 3 largest staked devs?
++<3% - 2 points (http://www.richlist.eu/viacoin)

6. Was there a premine/instamine/ninjamine/..?
++0-1% - 2 points (presale of Block One was exemplary and successfully prevented insta/ninja/nerd mines)

7. What % of coins are mined in the first year?
++<20% - 2 points (http://blog.viacoin.org/2014/07/07/viacoin-distribution-model.html)

8. Was there lying/deception at any point in the launch, eg. concerning pre(etc.)mine?
++no - 2 points (http://blog.viacoin.org/2014/07/08/viacoin-presale-launch.html)

9. What's the marketcap?(* free float only)
+TOP-20 marketcap - 1 point (#14 at http://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/views/filter-non-mineable-and-premined/)

10. What's the trading volume?
-less - 0 points

11. What's the emission (daily inflation measured by mktvalue)?
-less - 0 points

VIA tally = 17 Pietila Points

Monero tally = 18   Cool

VIA loses points for being small, but a tiny cap doubles more easily...
newbie
Activity: 39
Merit: 0
September 13, 2014, 05:49:34 AM
Here's a look at the SuperNEt ICO:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/read-before-investing-in-supernet-ico-780481

And further explanations:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.8800002

I wish anyone investing in it, best of luck.
donator
Activity: 1722
Merit: 1036
September 13, 2014, 03:46:07 AM
PRIMECOIN (XPM) is breaking upwards with high volume on btc-e  Shocked  Cool



I almost got a shock thinking that was XMR chart early in the morning...
legendary
Activity: 1554
Merit: 1000
September 13, 2014, 02:22:08 AM
A previously published example (my largest XMR purchase to date):  I purchased a large-format oil painting in XMR; the artist subsequently paid rent in XMR.
Did the artist pay the rent to someone else than you? It makes all the difference.
Plus: did he have a regular contract, and got a invoice?

She.  No.

Was she attractive?

Is this important?

Nice to see that more deals are done with XMR.
hero member
Activity: 518
Merit: 502
September 13, 2014, 01:48:40 AM
PRIMECOIN (XPM) is breaking upwards with high volume on btc-e  Shocked  Cool

Primecoin still exists? I remember this being all the rage about a year ago, articles everywhere etc.
In retrospective, that algorithm seems like one of the best "gpu-resistant" POWs out there.
(where gpu-resistant does NOT that there are no gpu miners, but it does mean that gpu miners
have only a low advantage over cpu miners)

A pity that the emission rule makes this coin to unprofitable to all miners.
legendary
Activity: 2660
Merit: 2868
Shitcoin Minimalist
September 13, 2014, 01:23:09 AM
A previously published example (my largest XMR purchase to date):  I purchased a large-format oil painting in XMR; the artist subsequently paid rent in XMR.
Did the artist pay the rent to someone else than you? It makes all the difference.
Plus: did he have a regular contract, and got a invoice?

She.  No.


Was she attractive?
legendary
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1000
September 12, 2014, 11:31:58 PM
PRIMECOIN (XPM) is breaking upwards with high volume on btc-e  Shocked  Cool

legendary
Activity: 1596
Merit: 1030
Sine secretum non libertas
September 12, 2014, 11:21:13 AM
A previously published example (my largest XMR purchase to date):  I purchased a large-format oil painting in XMR; the artist subsequently paid rent in XMR.
Did the artist pay the rent to someone else than you? It makes all the difference.
Plus: did he have a regular contract, and got a invoice?

She.  No.
legendary
Activity: 1596
Merit: 1030
Sine secretum non libertas
September 12, 2014, 11:20:55 AM
Did the artist pay the rent to someone else than you? It makes all the difference.

Yes.
hero member
Activity: 630
Merit: 500
Bitgoblin
September 12, 2014, 09:09:14 AM
A previously published example (my largest XMR purchase to date):  I purchased a large-format oil painting in XMR; the artist subsequently paid rent in XMR.
Did the artist pay the rent to someone else than you? It makes all the difference.
Plus: did he have a regular contract, and got a invoice?
hero member
Activity: 649
Merit: 500
September 12, 2014, 05:14:45 AM
Right now.  I have paid for goods and services in XMR myself.  It's not hard to do, really.  You just find a motivated seller and offer a fair deal.


Good to hear that. Can you say more about that?

A previously published example (my largest XMR purchase to date):  I purchased a large-format oil painting in XMR; the artist subsequently paid rent in XMR.


Did the artist pay the rent to someone else than you? It makes all the difference.
legendary
Activity: 1834
Merit: 1019
September 12, 2014, 02:09:47 AM
Right now.  I have paid for goods and services in XMR myself.  It's not hard to do, really.  You just find a motivated seller and offer a fair deal.


Good to hear that. Can you say more about that?

A previously published example (my largest XMR purchase to date):  I purchased a large-format oil painting in XMR; the artist subsequently paid rent in XMR.


they must have a pretty cool landlord to accept XMR.

My landlord should accept XMR but payment is conducted through a management company and not on an individual basis Sad
maybe I should talk to the owners and undercut my management company soon...
legendary
Activity: 1610
Merit: 1004
September 12, 2014, 12:10:01 AM
Right now.  I have paid for goods and services in XMR myself.  It's not hard to do, really.  You just find a motivated seller and offer a fair deal.


Good to hear that. Can you say more about that?

A previously published example (my largest XMR purchase to date):  I purchased a large-format oil painting in XMR; the artist subsequently paid rent in XMR.


they must have a pretty cool landlord to accept XMR.
hero member
Activity: 508
Merit: 500
Jahaha
September 11, 2014, 04:55:01 PM
StealthCoin is a new cryptocurrency that is changing CryptoNote's ring signature scheme. It is coming up with a blockchain that needs smaller space. You can read the latest whitepaper released.
legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
September 11, 2014, 03:33:19 PM
The main point of my post is still valid. In its current state, XMR requires a lot of resources. If you "extrapolate the blockchain size vs time and figure out when the daemon will not load on a plain vanilla Win build with 8GB 4GB. Unless the database is complete at that time, new users will be unable to try out XMR and those already using XMR will lose functionality."

I agree. The current blockchain memory usage is about 2.5 GB (the actual blockchain is about 1 GB but it seems to bloat up by about 2.5x when loaded into memory, the reasons for which were explained by crypto_zoidberg on the BBR thread, since BBR is about the same as XMR in this respect). The natural growth rate seems to be something less than 10 MB per day. At that rate we have at least 160 days until blockchain size increase by 1.6 GB and therefore memory usage increases by about 4 GB (putting an 8 GB system in the same spot as 4 GB system today).

A tighter deadline is a memory increase by 1.5 GB which which will likely make things uncomfortable (but possibly still usable) on 4 GB systems even with virtual memory. That corresponds to a blockchain size increase of 400 MB, which is something more than 40 days (since the 10 GB estimate above was conservative).

Hopefully we will have a database functional by then.

Quote
Bitcoin and all altcoins except XMR run on her emachine.

I thought all users were welcome, not just uber geeks.

True, it wasn't our bad idea to load everything into RAM. We are fixing it though.


I'm starting to wonder why the people/person who originally released monero with the intention of loading everything in RAM. Geez. lol

Probably because it was easier and they were in a hurry to release something with a huge hidden premine and take advantage of willingness of investors during the altcoin bubble to not pay much attention to such things and buy almost any piece of shit. They were a bit late though.

legendary
Activity: 2492
Merit: 1491
LEALANA Bitcoin Grim Reaper
September 11, 2014, 02:25:26 PM
The main point of my post is still valid. In its current state, XMR requires a lot of resources. If you "extrapolate the blockchain size vs time and figure out when the daemon will not load on a plain vanilla Win build with 8GB 4GB. Unless the database is complete at that time, new users will be unable to try out XMR and those already using XMR will lose functionality."

I agree. The current blockchain memory usage is about 2.5 GB (the actual blockchain is about 1 GB but it seems to bloat up by about 2.5x when loaded into memory, the reasons for which were explained by crypto_zoidberg on the BBR thread, since BBR is about the same as XMR in this respect). The natural growth rate seems to be something less than 10 MB per day. At that rate we have at least 160 days until blockchain size increase by 1.6 GB and therefore memory usage increases by about 4 GB (putting an 8 GB system in the same spot as 4 GB system today).

A tighter deadline is a memory increase by 1.5 GB which which will likely make things uncomfortable (but possibly still usable) on 4 GB systems even with virtual memory. That corresponds to a blockchain size increase of 400 MB, which is something more than 40 days (since the 10 GB estimate above was conservative).

Hopefully we will have a database functional by then.

Quote
Bitcoin and all altcoins except XMR run on her emachine.

I thought all users were welcome, not just uber geeks.

True, it wasn't our bad idea to load everything into RAM. We are fixing it though.


I'm starting to wonder why the people/person who originally released monero with the intention of loading everything in RAM. Geez. lol
legendary
Activity: 1596
Merit: 1030
Sine secretum non libertas
September 11, 2014, 12:10:17 PM
Right now.  I have paid for goods and services in XMR myself.  It's not hard to do, really.  You just find a motivated seller and offer a fair deal.


Good to hear that. Can you say more about that?

A previously published example (my largest XMR purchase to date):  I purchased a large-format oil painting in XMR; the artist subsequently paid rent in XMR.
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