Topic: rpietila Wall Observer - the Quality TA Thread ;) - page 271. (Read 907212 times)

No.  Look it up.  They didn't collect state sales tax for years.  For example they started collecting CA state sales tax in 2012.

Exactly.  Tiny gains that nobody will bother to report accurately, and nobody will bother to enforce.

Software is not even relevant here, but I'm a software guy.

BS. That was sales tax and Amazon collected it directly on checkout. It was no hassle at all.

Read my prior post, I said it is not so much about getting burned rather about it not being worth the hassle.

I have friends who work in call centers. Do you realize how many Americans can't figure out how to turn on their cell phone?

Even my mother who is intelligent would never use Bitcoin if it means another form for her to add to her IRS filing. I asked her.


They collect the most refunds.


The rich people are not the target market for a currency. If we are talking about the fundamental adoption among white males, I already agreed this hasn't been affected.


Lots of tiny gains for every day transactions. No you won't. Even I won't. Hassle. Major hassle.

And don't tell me about software. I have a word for you n00bs:

interoperability

I am software guy. You are not.

I'm sorry but this is nonsense.  For years people were required to declare and pay state sales tax on everything they bought from Amazon.com.   Guess how many people stayed away from Amazon because of this?  None.  Either they did the accounting work or they just fucking ignored the IRS [Edit: state department of revenue].  Eventually Amazon was pressured into collecting the tax because the state governments had no way to enforce it.

I suspect Americans will do exactly the same with bitcoin CG that they did with Amazon state sales tax.  It will be an inconsequential amount for 95% of users, they will ignore it and the IRS will do jack squat about it.  It will cost more to audit than the revenue it will bring in.

I still want to know who AnonyMint is referring to that is going to get burned by the IRS policy on bitcoin.

It's not poor people, they owe no tax at all.

It's not rich people, they are already accustomed to handling CG with their other investments, and their use of bitcoin as a currency will incur negligible CG tax compared to their investment activity.

It's not middle class people like me - given a choice between taxes on gains and no gains at all, I choose gains.

So you are a momentum trader. How has that worked out for you with bitcoin?

The other near-term implication of the tax ruling is the margin call on miners who have to get cash before April 15.

Ditto in China apparently with April 15 deadline to sell and get out before exchanges close.

So we have perhaps persistent selling for next 2 weeks.

About the tax planning+timing issue. You just don't get it. Normal people already have no incentive to use Bitcoin and now they will really stay away from it. Why fuck with the hassle? Most people don't even know what a Schedule D is.

New software? Have you tried using H&R Block? I do every year, and they are the experts on simplification. My ex can't figure it out. I have to do her taxes this week.

Do you realize how stupid Americans are? They voted for Obama.  

None of that affects the fundamental adoption by fanatical white males, but it is enough to bust the bubble run we've had and cause capitulation among all the weak hands.

And I think there are a lot of newbies that bought at $600 - $1000 who are sweating it right now.

Then there are those who are sure it can't go lower than $400. Some of them might capitulate as it breaks down from there.

We don't have the system of Sweden. IN the USA, everyone is afraid of the IRS. Or at least they don't want to add hassle with IRS just to use some stupid technobabble money that they don't need any way.

It would be a very uncommon man who managed the complexity of the tax code at that level of detail.  I think the overwhelming majority either outsource tax concerns and take general advice from experts, or simply don't plan at all.  Definitely a software development opportunity in any case.

Its just an excuse to talk about the castle, dont be alarmed

Who needs sleep when they mistake a joke for a serious statement?

Can't you tell that I see you are emotionally flustered and I am poking you. Now you played your pride card.

Risto you will talk all strong then if it goes lower you will say you only put 60% odds on it bottoming. You try to play both sides and always be seen as correct.

Now I see that you need sleep. I have as many bitcoins now as I had a year ago, but bought a castle and have sizable fiat reserves with the profits. "buying too high" can only attributed to my name if the speaker does not see the picture  

Allow me to an express a view on the factual points you raised, creekbore:


All press is good press.  Just wait until the next wave of pedophiles and terrorists.


Always true of the vanguard.  It means there's a lot of upside.


Good news.  Institutional money would not touch it until there was tax clarity.


Admittedly painful, but to be expected, and not in any way fatal.


That's over.


NeoBee is rather minor.  Cyprus?  Noise.


Bids 50% out from the book can't be taken seriously.


You are mistaken regarding which number I deem significant.  New addresses is not significant.  The number of active addresses during a rolling window is the best representation available for the size of the commerce network.  The only other number which reflects this vigor is the value transferred, again, during a rolling window.


It is what it is.  Whether it is OK or not is very subjective.  You might enjoy a benzodiazepine.  Not too much now.  It will make you feel things are a bit more OK.

Price can do many things, but it can't deviate from fundamental value for too long, or there is arbitrage.

Go to your browser settings and erase all cookies related to blockchain.info

Fair enough. About the tax situation at least in Sweden I know the Swedish IRS won't be going after bitcoin purchases. Bitcoin exchange transfers however will be a different ball game but that's not strange. I personally think you are too fearing of taxes and the government agencies collecting them. Even with an economic collapse a la Armstrong (which I'm counting on as well) there will not be a crusade to tax bitcoin purchases on orderly purchases, imo.

yea and it will be the volume too that will squeeze the last bulls out on panic selling when we go for another dip

It will be the volume, not the price that will push the bears into panic buy

Let's just compare the same person spending dollars vs spending bitcoin.  Their tax situation is exactly the same except for a small amount of CG on the bitcoin they spent.  How is paying CG worse than having no gain at all?

If you expect the CG to be significant, that means they must have held bitcoin as savings or investment, and not spent it before their next paycheck arrived.

Edit:
Now that I see your other post - I'm not a tax expert, but I have yet to see one tax credit that is all or nothing based on some income threshold.  Obviously that creates perverse incentives to avoid going over the threshold.  However, in the US at least, none of them work like that, or if any do, they're so uncommon as to be irrelevant to bitcoin adoption.

I don't see enough capitulation yet. Risto needs to buy too high first.  

I am not certain. I just don't see any reason the bottom should be here. Why? What happened to make it a bottom?

Recent sentiment isn't exhausted yet. It is just getting started. Most don't even understand the tax implication issue yet.

I find it comical that the opinions here seem so certain and grounded. For a change, I think we can up I also think we can go down.