Author

Topic: Scientific proof that God exists? - page 329. (Read 845573 times)

legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
March 11, 2015, 02:56:25 PM
And how does that explain why we are getting punished for the mistakes of others? And if adam and eve made a mistake isnt it God fault for not making them good enough?

The corruption is in the genetics. We are in a lineage that includes their corrupted genetics.

God told them that they could eat the fruit of all the trees in the Garden except one. He did this to give them the free choice to do right rather than wrong, to glorify God for His greatness of creating them. The choice they were supposed to make was to NOT eat of that one tree. It was easy... they had all the rest of the trees to eat from.

It would have been to the benefit of Adam and Eve and us all if they had glorified God by obeying Him. He glorifies us, at times, through praise when we do good things. Just think how great His praise would have been of us if we had abstained from eating the fruit through all these thousands of years.

It was our choice, just like abstaining from sex until we are married is our best option today.

Smiley

Pretty cool story, any proofs besides the bible?

No proofs to be applied to this thread. Now that we have accepted the existence of God, we really need to start other threads to expand on Who He is, and why, etc.

Smiley
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
March 11, 2015, 02:54:01 PM
If God exists then he is a BAD God a malevolent God, why would he decieve us like this? Why wouldnt he just show us that he exists plain and simple. Why would he let accidents happen or a baby dying when that baby hasnt done anything wrong? If heaven exists why doesnt he take us there already instead of making us suffer?

Maybe he created us (souls) and gave us free will to experience his ability to create by creating our own experiences. Some souls maybe decided to take part in his experiment some didn't. I believe that everyone at least think sometimes about him (some do much much more - creating religions, forcing their believes to others etc.) because deep inside we just know him.

Maybe we just forgot everything as soon we were born to our bodies. Maybe some souls are born to "wrong" parents who shouldn't have kids. Maybe some souls suffer simply because of other soul's actions. God has nothing to do with it. He can't break free will of anyone because his experiment would fail - ended prematurely. Maybe he want us to remember and find out how great his experiment (The universe) is "from the inside" without him exposing whole truth.

My last crazy guess: Maybe he didn't create the Universe, maybe he became one and we are "him". Maybe he just want to find out who/what he is by us and our bodies (eyes,ears..) Maybe that's why we have consciousness. Sorry for my bad english, I'm just trying to think outside of the box, that's all.

I enjoy your free thinking. Your best line is "... because deep inside we just know him."

Smiley
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
March 11, 2015, 02:51:25 PM
And how does that explain why we are getting punished for the mistakes of others? And if adam and eve made a mistake isnt it God fault for not making them good enough?

The corruption is in the genetics. We are in a lineage that includes their corrupted genetics.

God told them that they could eat the fruit of all the trees in the Garden except one. He did this to give them the free choice to do right rather than wrong, to glorify God for His greatness of creating them. The choice they were supposed to make was to NOT eat of that one tree. It was easy... they had all the rest of the trees to eat from.

It would have been to the benefit of Adam and Eve and us all if they had glorified God by obeying Him. He glorifies us, at times, through praise when we do good things. Just think how great His praise would have been of us if we had abstained from eating the fruit through all these thousands of years.

It was our choice, just like abstaining from sex until we are married is our best option today.

Smiley

Pretty cool story, any proofs besides the bible?
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
March 11, 2015, 02:49:58 PM
And how does that explain why we are getting punished for the mistakes of others? And if adam and eve made a mistake isnt it God fault for not making them good enough?

The corruption is in the genetics. We are in a lineage that includes their corrupted genetics.

God told them that they could eat the fruit of all the trees in the Garden except one. He did this to give them the free choice to do right rather than wrong, to glorify God for His greatness of creating them. The choice they were supposed to make was to NOT eat of that one tree. It was easy... they had all the rest of the trees to eat from.

It would have been to the benefit of Adam and Eve and us all if they had glorified God by obeying Him. He glorifies us, at times, through praise when we do good things. Just think how great His praise would have been of us if we had abstained from eating the fruit through all these thousands of years.

It was our choice, just like abstaining from sex until we are married is our best option today.

Smiley
newbie
Activity: 6
Merit: 0
March 11, 2015, 02:47:01 PM
If God exists then he is a BAD God a malevolent God, why would he decieve us like this? Why wouldnt he just show us that he exists plain and simple. Why would he let accidents happen or a baby dying when that baby hasnt done anything wrong? If heaven exists why doesnt he take us there already instead of making us suffer?

Maybe he created us (souls) and gave us free will to experience his ability to create by creating our own experiences. Some souls maybe decided to take part in his experiment some didn't. I believe that everyone at least think sometimes about him (some do much much more - creating religions, forcing their believes to others etc.) because deep inside we just know him.

Maybe we just forgot everything as soon we were born to our bodies. Maybe some souls are born to "wrong" parents who shouldn't have kids. Maybe some souls suffer simply because of other soul's actions. God has nothing to do with it. He can't break free will of anyone because his experiment would fail - ended prematurely. Maybe he want us to remember and find out how great his experiment (The universe) is "from the inside" without him exposing whole truth.

My last crazy guess: Maybe he didn't create the Universe, maybe he became one and we are "him". Maybe he just want to find out who/what he is by us and our bodies (eyes,ears..) Maybe that's why we have consciousness. Sorry for my bad english, I'm just trying to think outside of the box, that's all.
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
March 11, 2015, 02:39:00 PM
And how does that explain why we are getting punished for the mistakes of others? And if adam and eve made a mistake isnt it God fault for not making them good enough?
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
March 11, 2015, 02:38:26 PM
If God exists then he is a BAD God a malevolent God, why would he decieve us like this? Why wouldnt he just show us that he exists plain and simple. Why would he let accidents happen or a baby dying when that baby hasnt done anything wrong? If heaven exists why doesnt he take us there already instead of making us suffer?

Your wasting your time with these questions. Religious folk have an arsenal of rehearsed answers to these. You need to ask stuff they are unprepared for.

Just wanted to let you know that the way you are using the word "Your," above, isn't correct. You should be using the contraction "You're," contracted from the word combo "You are."

Smiley

Oh. Is this relevant or are trying to score cheap points because your getting shot down in flames today? Cheesy

Hey! You were the one complaining about redefining words. I was simply trying to show you one of the ways that you continually try to redefine the word "your." I had thought that you wanted more correctness in things. I was simply throwing in my two cents worth. Take another bite of that cookie or cake or whatever it is.

Smiley

EDIT: Besides, I'm not getting shot down. Most of the rest of you are simply losing the gravity of the situation. You are floating up into the emptiness of space where you belong with all your empty talk.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
March 11, 2015, 02:35:03 PM
If God exists then he is a BAD God a malevolent God, why would he decieve us like this? Why wouldnt he just show us that he exists plain and simple. Why would he let accidents happen or a baby dying when that baby hasnt done anything wrong? If heaven exists why doesnt he take us there already instead of making us suffer?

You certainly are welcome to your opinion about the goodness or badness of God, or how you think He is deceitful.

Adam and Eve walked with God. Why don't we? Those of us who are not against Him walk with Him in spirit.

There is corruption in everything, even when someone hasn't personally done anything wrong. Adam and Eve brought the corruption on us all when they ate the fruit. If we were in their shoes, would we have done much better than they?

God is giving us time here to build our own glory somewhat, by bringing others to faith in Him. Those who make it to Heaven will wish that their time were longer here so that they could build their glory even more. Those who go to Hell will wish their time had been shorter here, so that they wouldn't have as many sins to pay for in HellFire.

Smiley

And why exactly should we suffer because adam and eve fucked up? Thats totally not logical

Just because you don't remember voluntarily accepting their lineage at the time you were conceived...

Smiley


I have no idea what you mean with that

The souls of people are prepared by God, beforehand... and held by Him. When there is an opening down here - a new child being conceived - the souls that God holds are given the opportunity to take the particular body that is being conceived. They have a choice. The first one that jumps gets it. Some may never take a body. What God will do with them in the hereafter is unknown.

Smiley
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1016
March 11, 2015, 02:32:26 PM
If God exists then he is a BAD God a malevolent God, why would he decieve us like this? Why wouldnt he just show us that he exists plain and simple. Why would he let accidents happen or a baby dying when that baby hasnt done anything wrong? If heaven exists why doesnt he take us there already instead of making us suffer?

Your wasting your time with these questions. Religious folk have an arsenal of rehearsed answers to these. You need to ask stuff they are unprepared for.

Just wanted to let you know that the way you are using the word "Your," above, isn't correct. You should be using the contraction "You're," contracted from the word combo "You are."

Smiley

Oh. Is this relevant or are trying to score cheap points because your getting shot down in flames today? Cheesy
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
March 11, 2015, 02:30:13 PM
If God exists then he is a BAD God a malevolent God, why would he decieve us like this? Why wouldnt he just show us that he exists plain and simple. Why would he let accidents happen or a baby dying when that baby hasnt done anything wrong? If heaven exists why doesnt he take us there already instead of making us suffer?

You certainly are welcome to your opinion about the goodness or badness of God, or how you think He is deceitful.

Adam and Eve walked with God. Why don't we? Those of us who are not against Him walk with Him in spirit.

There is corruption in everything, even when someone hasn't personally done anything wrong. Adam and Eve brought the corruption on us all when they ate the fruit. If we were in their shoes, would we have done much better than they?

God is giving us time here to build our own glory somewhat, by bringing others to faith in Him. Those who make it to Heaven will wish that their time were longer here so that they could build their glory even more. Those who go to Hell will wish their time had been shorter here, so that they wouldn't have as many sins to pay for in HellFire.

Smiley

And why exactly should we suffer because adam and eve fucked up? Thats totally not logical

Just because you don't remember voluntarily accepting their lineage at the time you were conceived...

Smiley


I have no idea what you mean with that
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
March 11, 2015, 02:28:31 PM
If God exists then he is a BAD God a malevolent God, why would he decieve us like this? Why wouldnt he just show us that he exists plain and simple. Why would he let accidents happen or a baby dying when that baby hasnt done anything wrong? If heaven exists why doesnt he take us there already instead of making us suffer?

You certainly are welcome to your opinion about the goodness or badness of God, or how you think He is deceitful.

Adam and Eve walked with God. Why don't we? Those of us who are not against Him walk with Him in spirit.

There is corruption in everything, even when someone hasn't personally done anything wrong. Adam and Eve brought the corruption on us all when they ate the fruit. If we were in their shoes, would we have done much better than they?

God is giving us time here to build our own glory somewhat, by bringing others to faith in Him. Those who make it to Heaven will wish that their time were longer here so that they could build their glory even more. Those who go to Hell will wish their time had been shorter here, so that they wouldn't have as many sins to pay for in HellFire.

Smiley

And why exactly should we suffer because adam and eve fucked up? Thats totally not logical

Just because you don't remember voluntarily accepting their lineage at the time you were conceived...

Smiley
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
March 11, 2015, 02:25:10 PM
If God exists then he is a BAD God a malevolent God, why would he decieve us like this? Why wouldnt he just show us that he exists plain and simple. Why would he let accidents happen or a baby dying when that baby hasnt done anything wrong? If heaven exists why doesnt he take us there already instead of making us suffer?

You certainly are welcome to your opinion about the goodness or badness of God, or how you think He is deceitful.

Adam and Eve walked with God. Why don't we? Those of us who are not against Him walk with Him in spirit.

There is corruption in everything, even when someone hasn't personally done anything wrong. Adam and Eve brought the corruption on us all when they ate the fruit. If we were in their shoes, would we have done much better than they?

God is giving us time here to build our own glory somewhat, by bringing others to faith in Him. Those who make it to Heaven will wish that their time were longer here so that they could build their glory even more. Those who go to Hell will wish their time had been shorter here, so that they wouldn't have as many sins to pay for in HellFire.

Smiley

And why exactly should we suffer because adam and eve fucked up? Thats totally not logical
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
March 11, 2015, 02:21:26 PM
If God exists then he is a BAD God a malevolent God, why would he decieve us like this? Why wouldnt he just show us that he exists plain and simple. Why would he let accidents happen or a baby dying when that baby hasnt done anything wrong? If heaven exists why doesnt he take us there already instead of making us suffer?

Your wasting your time with these questions. Religious folk have an arsenal of rehearsed answers to these. You need to ask stuff they are unprepared for.

Just wanted to let you know that the way you are using the word "Your," above, isn't correct. You should be using the contraction "You're," contracted from the word combo "You are."

Smiley
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
March 11, 2015, 02:18:55 PM
If God exists then he is a BAD God a malevolent God, why would he decieve us like this? Why wouldnt he just show us that he exists plain and simple. Why would he let accidents happen or a baby dying when that baby hasnt done anything wrong? If heaven exists why doesnt he take us there already instead of making us suffer?

You certainly are welcome to your opinion about the goodness or badness of God, or how you think He is deceitful.

Adam and Eve walked with God. Why don't we? Those of us who are not against Him walk with Him in spirit.

There is corruption in everything, even when someone hasn't personally done anything wrong. Adam and Eve brought the corruption on us all when they ate the fruit. If we were in their shoes, would we have done much better than they?

God is giving us time here to build our own glory somewhat, by bringing others to faith in Him. Those who make it to Heaven will wish that their time were longer here so that they could build their glory even more. Those who go to Hell will wish their time had been shorter here, so that they wouldn't have as many sins to pay for in HellFire.

Smiley
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1016
March 11, 2015, 02:16:02 PM
If God exists then he is a BAD God a malevolent God, why would he decieve us like this? Why wouldnt he just show us that he exists plain and simple. Why would he let accidents happen or a baby dying when that baby hasnt done anything wrong? If heaven exists why doesnt he take us there already instead of making us suffer?

Your wasting your time with these questions. Religious folk have an arsenal of rehearsed answers to these. You need to ask stuff they are unprepared for.
hero member
Activity: 1064
Merit: 505
March 11, 2015, 02:08:38 PM
If God exists then he is a BAD God a malevolent God, why would he decieve us like this? Why wouldnt he just show us that he exists plain and simple. Why would he let accidents happen or a baby dying when that baby hasnt done anything wrong? If heaven exists why doesnt he take us there already instead of making us suffer?
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
March 11, 2015, 02:02:24 PM

Hold on. You've give us the green light to manipulate the definition of words! You can't have your cake and eat it BADecker.
Either:
A) We all stick to the standard definition of words.
B) We are all allowed to change the definition of words

We can't have one rule for some and other rules for others.
So what's it going to be? A or B?


Wow! You make reasonable sense here. And you are asking me to be your leader by making this choice for all of you?

 Cheesy

No. What I'm saying is if you choose to manipulate the definition of words such as 'scientists' and 'atheists' which you have endlessly here on the forum, you cannot protest when others do the same.

Not meaning to change the definitions of words. Simply explaining some details about the people who claim that they are what those words express.

Smiley

EDIT: However, if it takes a redefining of the words to do it, why not? I mean, it's about time that people stop hiding behind a bunch of deceitfulness.

Changing words about for your own gain is in itself deceitful.

Wrong. Sometimes it is beneficial, to help people understand what they are saying about themselves, even if it is gainful to the one who is doing it.

Smiley
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1016
March 11, 2015, 01:54:03 PM
BADecker: Is the only proof the people need that bible is shit. Just read BADeckers posts.. no truth, no evidence, no proof, just shite spoutin from the most un-educated bible basher in history. Someone needs to tell him we're only entertaining him to see what more shite he'll spout about his jewish diety.. imagine.. a christian jew.. wow.. he's prob got a cross with a photo of himself stuck to jesus's face just to remind himself of his one fatal flaw.. he's a fuckin idiot, As his 'evidence' proves. Yeah BADecker, we know you are.. now hurry up and crucify yourself, saves us doing it for ya..

I know, I know. Now that we have figured out that God most certainly exists, you simply want to argue some about His attributes.

Smiley

The only thing we've figured out today is that you've secretly been an atheist all along. Cheesy

Nobody has complete faith in the existence of God. And one must have some faith just to live. The question is, do I have enough faith that God can use it to save me? I hope and trust that He will hold my faith strong enough that I will be saved. Why? Certainly I don't want the pain of damnation. But more importantly, I don't want to miss out on living in the New Heavens and the New Earth, with God, forever beholding the Greatness and Wonderfullness that He is.

Smiley

What's this got to do with my last statement? Your rambling.

Do I have to literally spell it out for you?

Atheism suggests there is no God. Nobody living has complete faith in the existence of God. Therefore everybody lives with at least a touch of atheism in him/her. Because of this, since I am living, there is a part of me that holds to atheism just like there is a part of you that holds to God. Secrecy has nothing to do with it... except that, though you seem to write the language very well, you don't seem to be able to understand much of what anyone says.

Nothing wrong with that. Your field of expertise simply lies elsewhere.

Smiley

Hold on. You've give us the green light to manipulate the definition of words! You can't have your cake and eat it BADecker.
Either:
A) We all stick to the standard definition of words.
B) We are all allowed to change the definition of words

We can't have one rule for some and other rules for others.
So what's it going to be? A or B?


Wow! You make reasonable sense here. And you are asking me to be your leader by making this choice for all of you?

 Cheesy

No. What I'm saying is if you choose to manipulate the definition of words such as 'scientists' and 'atheists' which you have endlessly here on the forum, you cannot protest when others do the same.

Not meaning to change the definitions of words. Simply explaining some details about the people who claim that they are what those words express.

Smiley

EDIT: However, if it takes a redefining of the words to do it, why not? I mean, it's about time that people stop hiding behind a bunch of deceitfulness.

Changing words about for your own gain is in itself deceitful.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
March 11, 2015, 01:45:29 PM
BADecker: Is the only proof the people need that bible is shit. Just read BADeckers posts.. no truth, no evidence, no proof, just shite spoutin from the most un-educated bible basher in history. Someone needs to tell him we're only entertaining him to see what more shite he'll spout about his jewish diety.. imagine.. a christian jew.. wow.. he's prob got a cross with a photo of himself stuck to jesus's face just to remind himself of his one fatal flaw.. he's a fuckin idiot, As his 'evidence' proves. Yeah BADecker, we know you are.. now hurry up and crucify yourself, saves us doing it for ya..

I know, I know. Now that we have figured out that God most certainly exists, you simply want to argue some about His attributes.

Smiley

The only thing we've figured out today is that you've secretly been an atheist all along. Cheesy

Nobody has complete faith in the existence of God. And one must have some faith just to live. The question is, do I have enough faith that God can use it to save me? I hope and trust that He will hold my faith strong enough that I will be saved. Why? Certainly I don't want the pain of damnation. But more importantly, I don't want to miss out on living in the New Heavens and the New Earth, with God, forever beholding the Greatness and Wonderfullness that He is.

Smiley

What's this got to do with my last statement? Your rambling.

Do I have to literally spell it out for you?

Atheism suggests there is no God. Nobody living has complete faith in the existence of God. Therefore everybody lives with at least a touch of atheism in him/her. Because of this, since I am living, there is a part of me that holds to atheism just like there is a part of you that holds to God. Secrecy has nothing to do with it... except that, though you seem to write the language very well, you don't seem to be able to understand much of what anyone says.

Nothing wrong with that. Your field of expertise simply lies elsewhere.

Smiley

Hold on. You've give us the green light to manipulate the definition of words! You can't have your cake and eat it BADecker.
Either:
A) We all stick to the standard definition of words.
B) We are all allowed to change the definition of words

We can't have one rule for some and other rules for others.
So what's it going to be? A or B?


Wow! You make reasonable sense here. And you are asking me to be your leader by making this choice for all of you?

 Cheesy

No. What I'm saying is if you choose to manipulate the definition of words such as 'scientists' and 'atheists' which you have endlessly here on the forum, you cannot protest when others do the same.

Not meaning to change the definitions of words. Simply explaining some details about the people who claim that they are what those words express.

Smiley

EDIT: However, if it takes a redefining of the words to do it, why not? I mean, it's about time that people stop hiding behind a bunch of deceitfulness.
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1016
March 11, 2015, 01:34:19 PM
BADecker: Is the only proof the people need that bible is shit. Just read BADeckers posts.. no truth, no evidence, no proof, just shite spoutin from the most un-educated bible basher in history. Someone needs to tell him we're only entertaining him to see what more shite he'll spout about his jewish diety.. imagine.. a christian jew.. wow.. he's prob got a cross with a photo of himself stuck to jesus's face just to remind himself of his one fatal flaw.. he's a fuckin idiot, As his 'evidence' proves. Yeah BADecker, we know you are.. now hurry up and crucify yourself, saves us doing it for ya..

I know, I know. Now that we have figured out that God most certainly exists, you simply want to argue some about His attributes.

Smiley

The only thing we've figured out today is that you've secretly been an atheist all along. Cheesy

Nobody has complete faith in the existence of God. And one must have some faith just to live. The question is, do I have enough faith that God can use it to save me? I hope and trust that He will hold my faith strong enough that I will be saved. Why? Certainly I don't want the pain of damnation. But more importantly, I don't want to miss out on living in the New Heavens and the New Earth, with God, forever beholding the Greatness and Wonderfullness that He is.

Smiley

What's this got to do with my last statement? Your rambling.

Do I have to literally spell it out for you?

Atheism suggests there is no God. Nobody living has complete faith in the existence of God. Therefore everybody lives with at least a touch of atheism in him/her. Because of this, since I am living, there is a part of me that holds to atheism just like there is a part of you that holds to God. Secrecy has nothing to do with it... except that, though you seem to write the language very well, you don't seem to be able to understand much of what anyone says.

Nothing wrong with that. Your field of expertise simply lies elsewhere.

Smiley

Hold on. You've give us the green light to manipulate the definition of words! You can't have your cake and eat it BADecker.
Either:
A) We all stick to the standard definition of words.
B) We are all allowed to change the definition of words

We can't have one rule for some and other rules for others.
So what's it going to be? A or B?


Wow! You make reasonable sense here. And you are asking me to be your leader by making this choice for all of you?

 Cheesy

No. What I'm saying is if you choose to manipulate the definition of words such as 'scientists' and 'atheists' which you have endlessly here on the forum, you cannot protest when others do the same.
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