T20 and T20I cricket prediction and discussion - page 1315.

TheGreatPython

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Quote from: coinism on December 28, 2021, 06:49:40 AM

Quote from: pakhitheboss on December 27, 2021, 06:17:24 PM

What will the chaiman of ICC do here? ICC is being controlled by these big boards because of the enormous contribution that they get from them. BCCI cannot work outside the Indian government jurisdiction. The Indian government does not want to keep ties with Pakistan and the same has been followed by the BCCI.

Pakistan and India matches are always excited to see. There is more scope of India Pakistan series then Ashes. England and Australia are playing Ashes for decades regardless of what there government relationships were, why can't Pakistan and India keep playing with each other ? It will give huge financial benefits to both boards.

Here all statements are good about India and Pakistan relationship have no sympathy from anyone, and sadly we are not good enough to do things like UEFA which is the worst part of this area.

I agree that we have no change in next 5 to 10 years and this is not talk able because no party wants to have soft policy for other side, specially now as India is having more control in ICC. Finances are having very big impact in current covid-19 era and India will never allow giving any benefit to them and ICC can't do anything, it's just PCB who has to settle thing for there survive in cricket community.

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Quote from: pakhitheboss on December 27, 2021, 06:17:24 PM

What will the chaiman of ICC do here? ICC is being controlled by these big boards because of the enormous contribution that they get from them. BCCI cannot work outside the Indian government jurisdiction. The Indian government does not want to keep ties with Pakistan and the same has been followed by the BCCI.

Pakistan and India matches are always excited to see. There is more scope of India Pakistan series then Ashes. England and Australia are playing Ashes for decades regardless of what there government relationships were, why can't Pakistan and India keep playing with each other ? It will give huge financial benefits to both boards.

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Quote from: pakhitheboss on December 27, 2021, 06:17:24 PM

Quote from: jostorres on December 27, 2021, 04:15:31 PM

Quote from: og kush420 on December 26, 2021, 02:15:21 AM

It doesn't matter how BCCI has earned it, the discussion is now bcci is using it for its own political gains. They are doing what England and Australia do with small boards previously. As you said bcci and pcb both started moment together but bcci now has zero tolerance towards PCB because of political reasons.

Not sure of the political gains but I agree that the cricket board is being highly controlled and even manipulated by the bigger countries mainly India, earlier in the 1990s Australia and even England to some degree.

Anyone remembers there used to be a Champions League which was such a refreshing aspect but was cut down because certain countries were not making enough money from it and that shows the level of manipulation that exists in cricket and leagues. It also depends who is the chairman of the ICC because if more decisions are made with money in their mind, it will soon get rogue.

What will the chaiman of ICC do here? ICC is being controlled by these big boards because of the enormous contribution that they get from them. BCCI cannot work outside the Indian government jurisdiction. The Indian government does not want to keep ties with Pakistan and the same has been followed by the BCCI.

Yes exactly there is nothing that ICC can do about it. This is the internal matter of BCCI and Indian government and ICC cannot force BCCI about it. And I dont see this happening in next 5 years as well. Apart from ICC tournaments we will not see India vs Pakistan matches.

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Quote from: JSRAW on December 26, 2021, 05:51:32 AM

Let's say ICC gives nod to another structural reforms on revenue model and every one is entitled (Test playing nation) to receive equal amount of money. for example $120 Million each.

Ireland's population = 5 million Revenue contribution = 0.00001%
India's population = 1.35 Billion Revenue contribution = More than 70%

Does that look logical at all? I don't buy this argument of "Equal amount" anymore. BCCI contribute 70%-80% of revenue and after collapse of BIG-3 model they gets 20%-28% of amount back, if you reduce BCCI share now then it would turn into modern version of colonisation in cricket. Where everyone sucking out resources from only one cricketing nation. BTW BCCI is only reason ICC is able to subsidise every associate nation atm and you really want to kill the golden goose?

Whatever you have posted is factually correct and no one is going to argue against those points. All I am asking is that the ICC should follow the same approach being taken by the other sports federations such as FIH, FIFA and FIBA. None of the other federations distribute money as per the population of a particular country (even if that is the case, then China should be receiving more funds from the ICC, since they are also an associate member). Anyway, for me the best solution would be something that is mutually beneficial - the pig-3 agree for more ICC tournaments. If so, the ICC revenues would increase and they can continue with the higher share for BCCI.

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Quote from: jostorres on December 27, 2021, 04:15:31 PM

Quote from: og kush420 on December 26, 2021, 02:15:21 AM

It doesn't matter how BCCI has earned it, the discussion is now bcci is using it for its own political gains. They are doing what England and Australia do with small boards previously. As you said bcci and pcb both started moment together but bcci now has zero tolerance towards PCB because of political reasons.

Not sure of the political gains but I agree that the cricket board is being highly controlled and even manipulated by the bigger countries mainly India, earlier in the 1990s Australia and even England to some degree.

Anyone remembers there used to be a Champions League which was such a refreshing aspect but was cut down because certain countries were not making enough money from it and that shows the level of manipulation that exists in cricket and leagues. It also depends who is the chairman of the ICC because if more decisions are made with money in their mind, it will soon get rogue.

What will the chaiman of ICC do here? ICC is being controlled by these big boards because of the enormous contribution that they get from them. BCCI cannot work outside the Indian government jurisdiction. The Indian government does not want to keep ties with Pakistan and the same has been followed by the BCCI.

jostorres

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Quote from: og kush420 on December 26, 2021, 02:15:21 AM

It doesn't matter how BCCI has earned it, the discussion is now bcci is using it for its own political gains. They are doing what England and Australia do with small boards previously. As you said bcci and pcb both started moment together but bcci now has zero tolerance towards PCB because of political reasons.

Not sure of the political gains but I agree that the cricket board is being highly controlled and even manipulated by the bigger countries mainly India, earlier in the 1990s Australia and even England to some degree.

Anyone remembers there used to be a Champions League which was such a refreshing aspect but was cut down because certain countries were not making enough money from it and that shows the level of manipulation that exists in cricket and leagues. It also depends who is the chairman of the ICC because if more decisions are made with money in their mind, it will soon get rogue.

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Quote from: Theones on December 26, 2021, 06:21:01 AM

ICC knows exactly whats the financial worth of every board they talk with them accordingly. ICC and BCCI both goes hand in hand, since its ICC who stops cricket for two months for IPL. If India want more share from ICC then ICC need more cricket and new countries joining in. Its best in interest of Big 3 that new countries wont join the cricket eco system.

What you said isn't false but there is more to it.

First of all, yes during the IPL time the entire world is hardly playing competitive cricket but part of that is because TOP players from around the world come to India to play the IPL and their boards are paid hefty amounts to let the NOC for the player to pay in the league.

Secondly, ICC is not a rich board and depends on the earnings from individual boards so while the logic says they should support smaller regions, the reality is that ICC can't afford it.

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Quote from: mm2543363580 on December 27, 2021, 02:38:59 PM

Quote from: GbitG on December 27, 2021, 02:31:57 PM

ICC can't take these decisions without help from all boards, and it's not guaranteed because IPL is BCCI internal issue, and they will not take any dictation from ICC about their policies and internal issues. In near future we are going to have some better system in cricket like we have in UEFA and some boards will be able to have some good income from their leagues and these ICC events will be not popular as currently we have, so this could be good for many boards will be able to develop cricket and have better grassroots with this all its just matter of time which is coming in near future. Specially after success of 10 Leagues now, I am sure we will are going to have some good changes in this game.

How can a league be internal matter of a board? Its ICC who do not schedule any event during IPL duration and thats main reason why IPL is successful. We know ICC is not as strong as FIFA and FIBA, mostly its big 3 that controls the ICC. Small leagues get no attention, so they wont generate much revenue.

It's just because of money which is BCCI giving them, and it's not for cricket development it's all just for their deep pockets, so they are not scheduling any event during this time. Few years back Australia and England were completely holding all matters in ICC, and they never listen to any other boards now it's changed and India is controlling, and they are using all their power for having better benefits and financial advantage so just because of this all its BCCI internal issue ICC had no enough power to do any change in this. Small boards need to adjust with this all because they never compete with India right now, so just have their share of this game and enjoy.

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Quote from: GbitG on December 27, 2021, 02:31:57 PM

ICC can't take these decisions without help from all boards, and it's not guaranteed because IPL is BCCI internal issue, and they will not take any dictation from ICC about their policies and internal issues. In near future we are going to have some better system in cricket like we have in UEFA and some boards will be able to have some good income from their leagues and these ICC events will be not popular as currently we have, so this could be good for many boards will be able to develop cricket and have better grassroots with this all its just matter of time which is coming in near future. Specially after success of 10 Leagues now, I am sure we will are going to have some good changes in this game.

How can a league be internal matter of a board? Its ICC who do not schedule any event during IPL duration and thats main reason why IPL is successful. We know ICC is not as strong as FIFA and FIBA, mostly its big 3 that controls the ICC. Small leagues get no attention, so they wont generate much revenue.

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Quote from: mm2543363580 on December 27, 2021, 11:20:15 AM

Quote from: Sithara007 on December 25, 2021, 09:28:42 PM

What you have posted is definitely true, but I don't think that it will be very ethical from the part of the BCCI to do so. They are receiving billions of USD from the IPL, and there is no justification to ask for a larger share from the ICC funds as well. Those funds should be evenly distributed (i.e equal amounts for all the test nations and a significant portion should go to the associate nations). There will be damage for the ICC if India pulls out of the ICC tournaments. But financial loss will be there for the BCCI as well.

ICC must cut funding's of big boards that are getting too much money from IPL and spend that on under developed countries where there is great potential for cricket like Afghanistan and Nepal. Cricket is not involving more countries in its ecosystem, last time we have a new test nation was Bangladesh in 1999. Since then there is no country getting test status, this clearly tells what ICC is doing.

ICC can't take these decisions without help from all boards, and it's not guaranteed because IPL is BCCI internal issue, and they will not take any dictation from ICC about their policies and internal issues. In near future we are going to have some better system in cricket like we have in UEFA and some boards will be able to have some good income from their leagues and these ICC events will be not popular as currently we have, so this could be good for many boards will be able to develop cricket and have better grassroots with this all its just matter of time which is coming in near future. Specially after success of 10 Leagues now, I am sure we will are going to have some good changes in this game.

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Quote from: Sithara007 on December 25, 2021, 09:28:42 PM

What you have posted is definitely true, but I don't think that it will be very ethical from the part of the BCCI to do so. They are receiving billions of USD from the IPL, and there is no justification to ask for a larger share from the ICC funds as well. Those funds should be evenly distributed (i.e equal amounts for all the test nations and a significant portion should go to the associate nations). There will be damage for the ICC if India pulls out of the ICC tournaments. But financial loss will be there for the BCCI as well.

ICC must cut funding's of big boards that are getting too much money from IPL and spend that on under developed countries where there is great potential for cricket like Afghanistan and Nepal. Cricket is not involving more countries in its ecosystem, last time we have a new test nation was Bangladesh in 1999. Since then there is no country getting test status, this clearly tells what ICC is doing.

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Quote from: JSRAW on December 26, 2021, 05:51:32 AM

Quote from: Sithara007 on December 25, 2021, 09:28:42 PM

Quote from: JSRAW on December 25, 2021, 02:34:26 AM

ICC already slashed BCCI's share by 30-40% and I believe if by any chance ICC tries to dictate terms on IPL then its not going to sit well with the BCCI. What if BCCI feel threaten and decided to retaliate by ignoring ICC tournament. If it happens then all major brands also going to pull out, the best ICC could do is ban BCCI but we all know what would happen after that.

What you have posted is definitely true, but I don't think that it will be very ethical from the part of the BCCI to do so. They are receiving billions of USD from the IPL, and there is no justification to ask for a larger share from the ICC funds as well. Those funds should be evenly distributed (i.e equal amounts for all the test nations and a significant portion should go to the associate nations). There will be damage for the ICC if India pulls out of the ICC tournaments. But financial loss will be there for the BCCI as well.

Let's say ICC gives nod to another structural reforms on revenue model and every one is entitled (Test playing nation) to receive equal amount of money. for example $120 Million each.

Ireland's population = 5 million Revenue contribution = 0.00001%
India's population = 1.35 Billion Revenue contribution = More than 70%

Does that look logical at all? I don't buy this argument of "Equal amount" anymore. BCCI contribute 70%-80% of revenue and after collapse of BIG-3 model they gets 20%-28% of amount back, if you reduce BCCI share now then it would turn into modern version of colonisation in cricket. Where everyone sucking out resources from only one cricketing nation. BTW BCCI is only reason ICC is able to subsidise every associate nation atm and you really want to kill the golden goose?

Exactly the point! I have seen a lot of people criticizing how BCCI earns so much while other boards have to sustain with so little, the truth is BCCI helps ICC earns so much which is why it gets more, and if you compare the contribution it gives, it still isn't getting the equitable share.

Quote from: Theones on December 26, 2021, 06:21:01 AM

Quote from: Sithara007 on December 25, 2021, 09:28:42 PM

What you have posted is definitely true, but I don't think that it will be very ethical from the part of the BCCI to do so. They are receiving billions of USD from the IPL, and there is no justification to ask for a larger share from the ICC funds as well. Those funds should be evenly distributed (i.e equal amounts for all the test nations and a significant portion should go to the associate nations). There will be damage for the ICC if India pulls out of the ICC tournaments. But financial loss will be there for the BCCI as well.

ICC knows exactly whats the financial worth of every board they talk with them accordingly. ICC and BCCI both goes hand in hand, since its ICC who stops cricket for two months for IPL. If India want more share from ICC then ICC need more cricket and new countries joining in. Its best in interest of Big 3 that new countries wont join the cricket eco system.

The problem is adding any country to the cricketing ecosystem isn't an easy task, reasons are
1. Cricket is not an individual sport which means if a player in any country no matter how fond he is of cricket wants to play at the international level, he just can't without the help of his cricket board
2. Let's say he is from some American country and joins team America, he will never be able to play at that level of cricket where the legends play therefore won't be able to improve up to that level.
3. Let's say if ICC keeps matches of Associate nations with Cricketing giants, they are not going to get much revenue, so matches would be non-profitable in longer-term making the whole point of cricketing business useless.

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Quote from: Sithara007 on December 25, 2021, 09:28:42 PM

What you have posted is definitely true, but I don't think that it will be very ethical from the part of the BCCI to do so. They are receiving billions of USD from the IPL, and there is no justification to ask for a larger share from the ICC funds as well. Those funds should be evenly distributed (i.e equal amounts for all the test nations and a significant portion should go to the associate nations). There will be damage for the ICC if India pulls out of the ICC tournaments. But financial loss will be there for the BCCI as well.

ICC knows exactly whats the financial worth of every board they talk with them accordingly. ICC and BCCI both goes hand in hand, since its ICC who stops cricket for two months for IPL. If India want more share from ICC then ICC need more cricket and new countries joining in. Its best in interest of Big 3 that new countries wont join the cricket eco system.

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Quote from: Sithara007 on December 25, 2021, 09:28:42 PM

Quote from: JSRAW on December 25, 2021, 02:34:26 AM

ICC already slashed BCCI's share by 30-40% and I believe if by any chance ICC tries to dictate terms on IPL then its not going to sit well with the BCCI. What if BCCI feel threaten and decided to retaliate by ignoring ICC tournament. If it happens then all major brands also going to pull out, the best ICC could do is ban BCCI but we all know what would happen after that.

What you have posted is definitely true, but I don't think that it will be very ethical from the part of the BCCI to do so. They are receiving billions of USD from the IPL, and there is no justification to ask for a larger share from the ICC funds as well. Those funds should be evenly distributed (i.e equal amounts for all the test nations and a significant portion should go to the associate nations). There will be damage for the ICC if India pulls out of the ICC tournaments. But financial loss will be there for the BCCI as well.

Let's say ICC gives nod to another structural reforms on revenue model and every one is entitled (Test playing nation) to receive equal amount of money. for example $120 Million each.

Ireland's population = 5 million Revenue contribution = 0.00001%
India's population = 1.35 Billion Revenue contribution = More than 70%

Does that look logical at all? I don't buy this argument of "Equal amount" anymore. BCCI contribute 70%-80% of revenue and after collapse of BIG-3 model they gets 20%-28% of amount back, if you reduce BCCI share now then it would turn into modern version of colonisation in cricket. Where everyone sucking out resources from only one cricketing nation. BTW BCCI is only reason ICC is able to subsidise every associate nation atm and you really want to kill the golden goose?

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Quote from: eaLiTy on December 25, 2021, 05:26:26 PM

Since we are having discussions about how BCCI is controlling cricket, it was not given that power in a golden platter. It was earned strategically the moment BCCI was not able to secure two tickets to watch the 1983 World Cup finals and even though there were many empty seats reserved for elites.

England was having complete power over cricket and India along with Pakistan started the movement to bring the World Cup out of England and with no money to conduct the World Cup in 1987 they took the help of Ambani and that too with the help of political involvement who sponsored the entire event in return of advertisement rights and hence it is called the Reliance Cup in 1987 and other negotiations and that is how changes started to happen in Cricket.

I am seeing these discussions about how BCCI control Cricket for a long time and hence thought of letting everyone know how these changes happened and it was not bestowed upon one fine morning. It was a huge political struggle and canvasing and the politicians including Indira Gandhi who roped in Ambani to sponsor the tournament.

Cricket leagues will have their positions but International cricket will have its value.

It doesn't matter how BCCI has earned it, the discussion is now bcci is using it for its own political gains. They are doing what England and Australia do with small boards previously. As you said bcci and pcb both started moment together but bcci now has zero tolerance towards PCB because of political reasons.

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Quote from: JSRAW on December 25, 2021, 02:34:26 AM

ICC already slashed BCCI's share by 30-40% and I believe if by any chance ICC tries to dictate terms on IPL then its not going to sit well with the BCCI. What if BCCI feel threaten and decided to retaliate by ignoring ICC tournament. If it happens then all major brands also going to pull out, the best ICC could do is ban BCCI but we all know what would happen after that.

What you have posted is definitely true, but I don't think that it will be very ethical from the part of the BCCI to do so. They are receiving billions of USD from the IPL, and there is no justification to ask for a larger share from the ICC funds as well. Those funds should be evenly distributed (i.e equal amounts for all the test nations and a significant portion should go to the associate nations). There will be damage for the ICC if India pulls out of the ICC tournaments. But financial loss will be there for the BCCI as well.

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Quote from: Theones on December 25, 2021, 08:38:02 AM

~
Slowly but steadily cricket will move to leagues as well. I don't think there is future of bilateral series anymore as players and boards are more interested in money rich leagues. But in cricket leagues only IPL is big fish rest of leagues are not that big. So even if cricket moves to leagues we will still see supremacy of bcci.

Since we are having discussions about how BCCI is controlling cricket, it was not given that power in a golden platter. It was earned strategically the moment BCCI was not able to secure two tickets to watch the 1983 World Cup finals and even though there were many empty seats reserved for elites.

England was having complete power over cricket and India along with Pakistan started the movement to bring the World Cup out of England and with no money to conduct the World Cup in 1987 they took the help of Ambani and that too with the help of political involvement who sponsored the entire event in return of advertisement rights and hence it is called the Reliance Cup in 1987 and other negotiations and that is how changes started to happen in Cricket.

I am seeing these discussions about how BCCI control Cricket for a long time and hence thought of letting everyone know how these changes happened and it was not bestowed upon one fine morning. It was a huge political struggle and canvasing and the politicians including Indira Gandhi who roped in Ambani to sponsor the tournament.

Cricket leagues will have their positions but International cricket will have its value.

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Quote from: Theones on December 25, 2021, 08:38:02 AM

Quote from: teosanru on December 25, 2021, 07:05:05 AM

Football is regulated? Who said this? It's just that there is no single superpower in Football, the Barclays is equally popular as la liga and la liga is just about equally popular to copa America. This ensures that there is no power disputes among the countries, moreover football is much much more commercial than cricket, international tours are a rarity in football, it's all about the franchisee leagues and because all franchise leagues run at same time the scheduling thing rarely matters.

Slowly but steadily cricket will move to leagues as well. I don't think there is future of bilateral series anymore as players and boards are more interested in money rich leagues. But in cricket leagues only IPL is big fish rest of leagues are not that big. So even if cricket moves to leagues we will still see supremacy of bcci.

I agree with you on this, except for some major cricketing rivalries there is absolutely no comparison between the viewership that these leagues get and what these bilateral series get, even the bilateral T20 series don't get a lot of viewership if you do a direct comparison of it with any IPL match, same is the case with other countries and their leagues as well, so eventually this would happen for sure. International league tournaments like champions league might also become interesting if every country has good level teams.

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Quote from: teosanru on December 25, 2021, 07:05:05 AM

Football is regulated? Who said this? It's just that there is no single superpower in Football, the Barclays is equally popular as la liga and la liga is just about equally popular to copa America. This ensures that there is no power disputes among the countries, moreover football is much much more commercial than cricket, international tours are a rarity in football, it's all about the franchisee leagues and because all franchise leagues run at same time the scheduling thing rarely matters.

Slowly but steadily cricket will move to leagues as well. I don't think there is future of bilateral series anymore as players and boards are more interested in money rich leagues. But in cricket leagues only IPL is big fish rest of leagues are not that big. So even if cricket moves to leagues we will still see supremacy of bcci.

teosanru

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Quote from: galambo on December 24, 2021, 06:46:05 AM

Quote from: teosanru on December 24, 2021, 06:22:09 AM

Revenues around the world of cricket are split entirely based on the viewership and popularity, in this case, also it's basically the proportion of salaries of players that the boards are earning, as we all know it's primarily the Australian and English players who dominate IPL it's obvious that they are going to get a much larger chunk as compared to others, Nepal board is lucky that they are having that one player because of which they are getting even this much amount because there are many boards which aren't really getting anything. But this type of revenue sharing with boards would ensure one thing that the boards would avoid keeping any international fixtures at the time of IPL to ensure that their players play in IPL.

Sandeep Lamichhane of Nepal remain unsold in ipl 2021 and that makes no associate country in ipl for the first time in 5 years. Cricket is not regulated like other sports football, basketball. Its big 3 that decides most of cricketing matters. It's ICC that closes its calender for ipl, so he must check how it's governed.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/emergingcricket.com/news/lamichhane-and-others-go-unsold-in-ipl-auction/amp/

Football is regulated? Who said this? It's just that there is no single superpower in Football, the Barclays is equally popular as la liga and la liga is just about equally popular to copa America. This ensures that there is no power disputes among the countries, moreover football is much much more commercial than cricket, international tours are a rarity in football, it's all about the franchisee leagues and because all franchise leagues run at same time the scheduling thing rarely matters.

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