Tennis League All Thread - page 270.

Rabi3

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Quote from: examplens on May 21, 2022, 10:30:19 AM

Quote from: Daniel91 on May 21, 2022, 10:15:38 AM

I believe that it is much more important for Djokovic to win Roland Garros and Wimbledon at this moment and thus surpass Nadal in the race for GOAT in tennis.
Unlike Australia, where Djokovic couldn't compete for well-known reasons, and his main rival Nadal used it well to win a record of 21 GS, this decision could now help Djokovic because one of his main Wimbledon rivals, Medvedev, will not be able to compete, and Nadal is also questionable due to the injury.
It is known that Djokovic loves records and wants everyone to agree that he is the best and that is why he wants to win as many GS as possible.

In the end, politics and sport should never get mixed up together.

that's exactly what I was going to say, and as far as I remember everyone I always heard them say that we should keep politics out of sports, but here we are banning individual tennis players because of their nationality, I am totally against the war but I'd love to see Medvedev and other players playing high level tennis, Rublev even wrote in a camera after he won a match "no war please" which shows that he's against it, but everything runs by their rules and we just have to obey them.

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Quote from: Trofo on May 20, 2022, 04:19:14 PM

Quote from: Joca97 on May 20, 2022, 03:41:28 PM

Quote from: Cnut237 on May 20, 2022, 01:35:51 PM

Breaking news!!!

Wimbledon: ATP Tour strips ranking points from Grand Slam over ban for Russians and Belarusians

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/61401519

This is a huge surprise, I thought the ATP would cave in and award full points, but it appears not. Of course this means amongst other things that Djokovic loses his 2,000 points from last year, without being able to defend them, and so is very likely to lose his number one ranking.

It remains to be seen what will happen on the women's side, but I'd imagine the WTA would follow suit. It would be very strange if the women got points and the men didn't.

For betting purposes it's probably irrelevant, all players will still want to win Wimbledon just as much, even with no points to play for.

I think it's a good decision. It would really skew the rankings if say Djokovic could score up to 2,000 points whilst his nearest challenger Medvedev was guaranteed 0 points just because of where he was born.

I honestly dont blame ATP for doing this,i blame wimbledon for going with the ban and this totally unfair from them. What if it was the otherway around it would never happen. Only sad thing if this is true is that Djokovic losses those 2000 points that will lose him the first place

I am actually glad this happened. Wimbledon always gave itself leave to do whatever they please. For instance that stupid rule that you have to play dressed in all white, including sneakers and soles of sneakers. I would love if couple of major players decided to skip it now that it does not bring points. That would give them something to think about in future.

I agree with this one, at least the the tennis association has enough of Wimbledon because it's obvious that the ban of Wimbledon has nothing to do with the sports, it's simply geo-politics and the players are a unfair victim.

As for the games, it was still Casper Ruud in the Geneva Open.

Winning in 3 sets against Sousa, 6-7 , 6-4 , 6-7 and retains his Geneva Open title, while C. Norrie wins in Lyon vs Molcan.

examplens

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Quote from: Daniel91 on May 21, 2022, 10:15:38 AM

I believe that it is much more important for Djokovic to win Roland Garros and Wimbledon at this moment and thus surpass Nadal in the race for GOAT in tennis.
Unlike Australia, where Djokovic couldn't compete for well-known reasons, and his main rival Nadal used it well to win a record of 21 GS, this decision could now help Djokovic because one of his main Wimbledon rivals, Medvedev, will not be able to compete, and Nadal is also questionable due to the injury.
It is known that Djokovic loves records and wants everyone to agree that he is the best and that is why he wants to win as many GS as possible.

Without competitive importance in terms of points, I am not sure whether Wimbledon in 2022 will be accepted as a regular GS, seems more like a revue tournament.
I don't see a reason why top players would bother about a tournament that has no weight, maybe it would really be best if all the players give up participating in it. In the end, politics and sport should never get mixed up together.

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Quote from: examplens on May 21, 2022, 08:41:58 AM

Quote from: buwaytress on May 21, 2022, 08:25:45 AM

Hands up here admitting I've got no idea how these points systems work, never have and now I'm trying to read it, doesn't seem very easy to understand. More important question for me is, do the players themselves really care though?

I thought titles are more important and sure, you lose points and rankings, but doesn't it affect everyone equally? Or is Djoko being targeted here?

P.S. The white was always silly to me.

of course, points and ranking are important. it's not the same if you run into a tournament from the first or 10th place, in the first rounds you get a privileged draw and some "easier" opponents.
Djokovic is very close to breaking the all-time record on top place, (currently Stefi Graff- 377 Weeks) I guess it's important for him. therefore he will suffer the greatest damage from this new ATP decision.

I believe that it is much more important for Djokovic to win Roland Garros and Wimbledon at this moment and thus surpass Nadal in the race for GOAT in tennis.
Unlike Australia, where Djokovic couldn't compete for well-known reasons, and his main rival Nadal used it well to win a record of 21 GS, this decision could now help Djokovic because one of his main Wimbledon rivals, Medvedev, will not be able to compete, and Nadal is also questionable due to the injury.
It is known that Djokovic loves records and wants everyone to agree that he is the best and that is why he wants to win as many GS as possible.

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Quote from: buwaytress on May 21, 2022, 08:25:45 AM

Hands up here admitting I've got no idea how these points systems work, never have and now I'm trying to read it, doesn't seem very easy to understand. More important question for me is, do the players themselves really care though?

It's fairly straightforward. It can get a bit messy with minor tournaments for lesser players, because only your best x (I forget how many) tournaments count towards your ranking. But generally, ranking can be summed up as:
- The further you get in a tournament, the more points you get.
- You get more points for bigger tournaments.
- Ranking points total is based on a rolling 12 months. Your ranking points at the start of May are your total points from May 2021 - Apr 2022; your ranking points at start of June 2022 are your total from June 2021 - May 2022, etc.

Yes, I think they care because seeding is based on your ranking.

Quote from: buwaytress on May 21, 2022, 08:25:45 AM

I thought titles are more important and sure, you lose points and rankings, but doesn't it affect everyone equally? Or is Djoko being targeted here?

It does affect everyone equally - no-one gets any points this year. It's just those that did better at Wimbledon last year will lose more ranking points when 2021 is dropped, because they won't get any points from doing well at Wimbledon this year to replace them. Djoko isn't being targeted, no.

Quote from: buwaytress on May 21, 2022, 08:25:45 AM

P.S. The white was always silly to me.

Yes, Wimbledon has always been a bit arrogant with stupid etiquette rules, and thinking they can do what they like, which is what they did with the ban on Russians. It's coming back to bite them a bit now though.

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Quote from: buwaytress on May 21, 2022, 08:25:45 AM

Hands up here admitting I've got no idea how these points systems work, never have and now I'm trying to read it, doesn't seem very easy to understand. More important question for me is, do the players themselves really care though?

I thought titles are more important and sure, you lose points and rankings, but doesn't it affect everyone equally? Or is Djoko being targeted here?

P.S. The white was always silly to me.

of course, points and ranking are important. it's not the same if you run into a tournament from the first or 10th place, in the first rounds you get a privileged draw and some "easier" opponents.
Djokovic is very close to breaking the all-time record on top place, (currently Stefi Graff- 377 Weeks) I guess it's important for him. therefore he will suffer the greatest damage from this new ATP decision.

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Hands up here admitting I've got no idea how these points systems work, never have and now I'm trying to read it, doesn't seem very easy to understand. More important question for me is, do the players themselves really care though?

I thought titles are more important and sure, you lose points and rankings, but doesn't it affect everyone equally? Or is Djoko being targeted here?

P.S. The white was always silly to me.

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Quote from: Trofo on May 21, 2022, 02:29:38 AM

Quote from: aoluain on May 21, 2022, 02:15:14 AM

I'm not sure why if the ATP are taking this move this year players lose points from last year,
my brain doesnt compute that?

It has nothing to do with the decision. Player's always loose points exactly 1 year after getting them. Proper way to say it is that players can't defend points from last year and Djoković won last year which is 2000 points less for him.

Yes, that's it exactly. Rankings are based on results over the last 12 months. This is what is meant when a player is said to be "defending" points. This is the difference between ranking (points over last 12 months) and the 'race', which is who is leading on points gained this calendar year... the race gives you a clearer indication of who is likely to be ranked number one at the end of the year.

Rankings: https://www.atptour.com/en/rankings/singles
Race: https://www.atptour.com/en/rankings/singles-race-to-turin

Scenario: It's 27 June 2022, and time for Wimbledon to start. Djokovic has 10,000 ranking points accumulated over the last year, from Wimbledon 2021 right up until yesterday, 26 June 2022*. 2,000 of these 10,000 points came from winning Wimbledon 2021. This means that in order to retain his 10,000 ranking points, he needs to win Wimbledon again. If he's only runner-up, he gains 1,200 points but loses the 2,000 from last year, so drops to 8,800 in total.

So no points for Wimbledon this year means that at the end of Wimbledon 2022, Djokovic loses his 2,000 points from winning in 2021 with no chance of replacing them, and in the scenario above drops from 10,000 ranking points in total, to 8,000.

*I think (but someone please correct me if I'm wrong) a few days either way doesn't matter, you don't drop Wimbledon 2021 points until Wimbledon 2022 has ended, even if it's a few days past the 12 months threshold

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Quote from: aoluain on May 21, 2022, 02:15:14 AM

I'm not sure why if the ATP are taking this move this year players lose points from last year,
my brain doesnt compute that?

It has nothing to do with the decision. Player's always loose points exactly 1 year after getting them. Proper way to say it is that players can't defend points from last year and Djoković won last year which is 2000 points less for him.

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Quote from: Trofo on May 20, 2022, 04:19:14 PM

Quote from: Joca97 on May 20, 2022, 03:41:28 PM

Quote from: Cnut237 on May 20, 2022, 01:35:51 PM

Breaking news!!!

Wimbledon: ATP Tour strips ranking points from Grand Slam over ban for Russians and Belarusians

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/61401519

This is a huge surprise, I thought the ATP would cave in and award full points, but it appears not. Of course this means amongst other things that Djokovic loses his 2,000 points from last year, without being able to defend them, and so is very likely to lose his number one ranking.

It remains to be seen what will happen on the women's side, but I'd imagine the WTA would follow suit. It would be very strange if the women got points and the men didn't.

For betting purposes it's probably irrelevant, all players will still want to win Wimbledon just as much, even with no points to play for.

I think it's a good decision. It would really skew the rankings if say Djokovic could score up to 2,000 points whilst his nearest challenger Medvedev was guaranteed 0 points just because of where he was born.

I honestly dont blame ATP for doing this,i blame wimbledon for going with the ban and this totally unfair from them. What if it was the otherway around it would never happen. Only sad thing if this is true is that Djokovic losses those 2000 points that will lose him the first place

I am actually glad this happened. Wimbledon always gave itself leave to do whatever they please. For instance that stupid rule that you have to play dressed in all white, including sneakers and soles of sneakers. I would love if couple of major players decided to skip it now that it does not bring points. That would give them something to think about in future.

I have to admit of all the crazy stuff we seen in Tennis world this past two year’s this was something I wasn’t expecting, and I wonder will the athletes be motivated during this tournament, hence we should factor this while selecting them for our wagers. @Trofo I don’t think the current player’s will break the dress code, except Djokovic because he’s shown that he can challenge the authority and with nothing to lose maybe he can break the dress code.

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Quote from: Trofo on May 20, 2022, 04:19:14 PM

Quote from: Joca97 on May 20, 2022, 03:41:28 PM

Quote from: Cnut237 on May 20, 2022, 01:35:51 PM

Breaking news!!!

Wimbledon: ATP Tour strips ranking points from Grand Slam over ban for Russians and Belarusians

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/61401519

This is a huge surprise, I thought the ATP would cave in and award full points, but it appears not. Of course this means amongst other things that Djokovic loses his 2,000 points from last year, without being able to defend them, and so is very likely to lose his number one ranking.

It remains to be seen what will happen on the women's side, but I'd imagine the WTA would follow suit. It would be very strange if the women got points and the men didn't.

For betting purposes it's probably irrelevant, all players will still want to win Wimbledon just as much, even with no points to play for.

I think it's a good decision. It would really skew the rankings if say Djokovic could score up to 2,000 points whilst his nearest challenger Medvedev was guaranteed 0 points just because of where he was born.

I honestly dont blame ATP for doing this,i blame wimbledon for going with the ban and this totally unfair from them. What if it was the otherway around it would never happen. Only sad thing if this is true is that Djokovic losses those 2000 points that will lose him the first place

I am actually glad this happened. Wimbledon always gave itself leave to do whatever they please. For instance that stupid rule that you have to play dressed in all white, including sneakers and soles of sneakers. I would love if couple of major players decided to skip it now that it does not bring points. That would give them something to think about in future.

Yes I agree with this move, the reasoning for doing this by the ATP and the statement by
the WTA aligns with my view

Quote

"The stance we are taking is about protecting the equal opportunities that WTA players
should have to compete as individuals,

I'm not sure why if the ATP are taking this move this year players lose points from last year,
my brain doesnt compute that?

As Trofo points out, Wimbledon has this silly rule of players having to adhere to the White
dress code, top players play for points and accolades, it would be interesting if some of them
skip this event but I'm not sure Djokovic will, the race is still on to collect as many GS's

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Quote from: aoluain on May 20, 2022, 01:22:37 AM

Quote from: Kemarit on May 19, 2022, 08:26:45 PM

I got Sousa +3.5 over against Ivashka at 1.90 and Sousa win in straight sets.

While Gasquet destroys Majchrzak also in 2 sets but i didn't bet on the handicap, but Gasquet easily covered it.

So it will be Ruud vs Opelka on semis and Sousa vs Gasquet on the other side. Not yet put my bet here, will mostly go with the handicap again, but we will see.

Yes Opelka v Ruud would have been a great final match up between two top seeds 4 and
2 respectively. Its impressive in its own right that Ruud carried his form through from
Rome so I'll bet on him again.

it was still Ruud over Opelka in just two sets. I thought that this will end up in three, but Ruud got the break in the second set and it didn't go in the tiebreak as compare to the the first set.

Quote from: aoluain on May 20, 2022, 01:22:37 AM

Its quite remarkable to see Gasquet performing so well right before his home tournament!

Yeah, but against Sousa, he play that bad, score 6-2,6-2. Sousa was playing high level tennis in tournament so I wouldn't be surprised if he pulled an upset.

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Quote from: Joca97 on May 20, 2022, 03:41:28 PM

Quote from: Cnut237 on May 20, 2022, 01:35:51 PM

Breaking news!!!

Wimbledon: ATP Tour strips ranking points from Grand Slam over ban for Russians and Belarusians

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/61401519

This is a huge surprise, I thought the ATP would cave in and award full points, but it appears not. Of course this means amongst other things that Djokovic loses his 2,000 points from last year, without being able to defend them, and so is very likely to lose his number one ranking.

It remains to be seen what will happen on the women's side, but I'd imagine the WTA would follow suit. It would be very strange if the women got points and the men didn't.

For betting purposes it's probably irrelevant, all players will still want to win Wimbledon just as much, even with no points to play for.

I think it's a good decision. It would really skew the rankings if say Djokovic could score up to 2,000 points whilst his nearest challenger Medvedev was guaranteed 0 points just because of where he was born.

I honestly dont blame ATP for doing this,i blame wimbledon for going with the ban and this totally unfair from them. What if it was the otherway around it would never happen. Only sad thing if this is true is that Djokovic losses those 2000 points that will lose him the first place

I am actually glad this happened. Wimbledon always gave itself leave to do whatever they please. For instance that stupid rule that you have to play dressed in all white, including sneakers and soles of sneakers. I would love if couple of major players decided to skip it now that it does not bring points. That would give them something to think about in future.

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Quote from: Cnut237 on May 20, 2022, 01:35:51 PM

Breaking news!!!

Wimbledon: ATP Tour strips ranking points from Grand Slam over ban for Russians and Belarusians

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/61401519

This is a huge surprise, I thought the ATP would cave in and award full points, but it appears not. Of course this means amongst other things that Djokovic loses his 2,000 points from last year, without being able to defend them, and so is very likely to lose his number one ranking.

It remains to be seen what will happen on the women's side, but I'd imagine the WTA would follow suit. It would be very strange if the women got points and the men didn't.

For betting purposes it's probably irrelevant, all players will still want to win Wimbledon just as much, even with no points to play for.

I think it's a good decision. It would really skew the rankings if say Djokovic could score up to 2,000 points whilst his nearest challenger Medvedev was guaranteed 0 points just because of where he was born.

I honestly dont blame ATP for doing this,i blame wimbledon for going with the ban and this totally unfair from them. What if it was the otherway around it would never happen. Only sad thing if this is true is that Djokovic losses those 2000 points that will lose him the first place

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Quote from: casperBGD on May 20, 2022, 01:54:28 PM

Djokovic would probably have hard time to stay no.1, in this case he need to win RG first and hope that competitors do not have great results on RG

Actually, he has 2,000 points to defend there anyway, so I think he's pretty much guaranteed to lose number one spot whatever happens. IIRC Medvedev went out in the quarters at RG last year, so doesn't have much to defend.

This site shows what the current rankings would look like if Wimbledon '21 points were stripped away:

Daniil Medvedev – 7800 points
Alexander Zverev – 6895 points
Novak Djokovic – 6660 points
Stefanos Tsitsipas – 5965 points
Rafael Nadal – 5525 points

... so weirdly, Wimbledon choosing to punish Russians by banning them means a Russian is likely to become world number one!

Edit: I think Djokovic definitely loses number one spot, he can't gain enough over Medvedev on 2021 points between now and Wimbledon to cover that deficit.

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Quote from: Cnut237 on May 20, 2022, 01:35:51 PM

~snip
For betting purposes it's probably irrelevant, all players will still want to win Wimbledon just as much, even with no points to play for.

I think it's a good decision. It would really skew the rankings if say Djokovic could score up to 2,000 points whilst his nearest challenger Medvedev was guaranteed 0 points just because of where he was born.

this is really something different and unexpected
to strip all points from Wimbledon due to this ban is good for those that cannot attend Wimbledon, but would skew competition for all the others
Djokovic would probably have hard time to stay no.1, in this case he need to win RG first and hope that competitors do not have great results on RG

maybe this is just a pressure on Wimbledon to strip ban, will be interesting to follow

Cnut237

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Breaking news!!!

Wimbledon: ATP Tour strips ranking points from Grand Slam over ban for Russians and Belarusians

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/61401519

This is a huge surprise, I thought the ATP would cave in and award full points, but it appears not. Of course this means amongst other things that Djokovic loses his 2,000 points from last year, without being able to defend them, and so is very likely to lose his number one ranking.

It remains to be seen what will happen on the women's side, but I'd imagine the WTA would follow suit. It would be very strange if the women got points and the men didn't.

For betting purposes it's probably irrelevant, all players will still want to win Wimbledon just as much, even with no points to play for.

I think it's a good decision. It would really skew the rankings if say Djokovic could score up to 2,000 points whilst his nearest challenger Medvedev was guaranteed 0 points just because of where he was born.

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at least according to Nike, it looks like Sinner will be a TOP performer... for the next 10 years! In fact, it is news these days that a huge contract has been signed (15 million euros per season for the next 10 years!)

https://www.ilfattoquotidiano.it/2022/05/19/jannik-sinner-per-la-nike-e-un-sicuro-campione-del-futuro-lo-blinda-con-un-contratto-faraonico-di-10-anni/6597739/

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Quote from: Trofo on May 20, 2022, 06:01:38 AM

Quote from: TravelMug on May 20, 2022, 03:07:28 AM

I think Gasquet winning Medvedev was enough for him to believed that he can still perform high level tennis and fought with the best thats' why he is now on the semifinals. He is 35 years old and we have seen his prime but maybe he still has some left in his tank in this tournament and perhaps he could upset and go to the finals and win this tournament.

Medvedev on clay is nowhere near his levels on other surfaces. I play against him every single time on clay. It was 3,2 on Gasquet in that match if I remeber correctly.

That being said I watched Gasquet a bit in his latest matches and he looks quite good. No chance of him winning against best players on clay but he should pass a couple of rounds in RG if he has ok oponnets. He is not a seeded player so he could get someone like Djoko or Alcaraz in first round and that is game over for him.

Yeah Medvedev is really bad on clay and im surprised always when i see him play. He is fast and good in defending i was thinking it was gonna be a huge advantage for him,but he is really bad if tennis was played on clay he wouldnt even be in top 100 of all the players in the world

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Quote from: Jating on May 19, 2022, 07:01:50 AM

Quote from: Trofo on May 19, 2022, 12:18:02 AM

Quote from: Kemarit on May 18, 2022, 07:30:01 PM

And I agree that Khachanov is like hot and cold in this season, very inconsistent and so it's kinda disappointing if you have bet on him and suddenly seeing his performance against Molcan in the first set.

Khachanov has always been that inconsistent type of player for me. Even when he is playing great there will come a match where he just disappears.

Did not watch him yesterday or had any bets, real life got super busy, but I had a bet on him against Simon in first round. Khachanov to win and under 20,5 @1.8 which passed super easy. That was my first time I saw that market on Sportbet and I hope they will keep it for the future.

True, one of the most inconsistent players we have.

I'm looking at Geneva Open quarter finals, I have Opelka -1.5 against Griekspoor. First set already and Opelka 4-2, score is 40-15 but Griekspoor is serving. So let's see if he can break and then serve for the match. Also have Casper Ruud to win against Kokkinakis next.

Yeah, won my parlay bet here @2.12 with handicap + ML win by Ruud.

I have Opelka +2.5 @1.75 against Ruud right now, it was a live betting. The score is tie 4-4 so the first set can go either way.

I'll probably skip the other semifinals match though as I can't watch it later. Best of luck to everyone.

Topic: Tennis League All Thread - page 270. (Read 202181 times)