Test Cricket Prediction and Discussion Thread [self - mod] - page 802.

Sithara007

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Quote from: eaLiTy on June 17, 2021, 11:25:51 AM

^^^^ So India finally going with two spinners which i did not expect but they wanted to take the opportunity to trouble the New Zealand weakness of playing spin and we can see whether this will pay off but there is one thing that is certain the India batting line up is stronger with the inclusion of Jadeja and Ashwin as the lower order is strong and Mohammed Shami and Jasprit Bumrah will open the bowling and Ishant Sharma the first change bowler, it will be really interesting to see who will be winning the toss.

I would consider Jadeja as a batsmen who can also bowl (and not the other way around). So India is essentially going with 4 bowlers (3 pace + 1 spin) and 7 batsmen. I don't see anything wrong with the XI that was announced. I am actually happy that Ishant was preferred instead of Siraj. Ishant is definitely a more experienced and skilled bowler. The only argument that goes against him is that his batting is not up to the mark. But when you consider slots for pace bowler, it is the bowling ability that needs to be considered.

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Quote from: JSRAW on June 15, 2021, 08:07:23 PM

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Ashwin and Jadeja are allrounders and capable of adding extra 40-50 runs on the scorecards together. Extra 50 runs down the order matters when you're up against the quality bowling lineup in case of any batting collapse. Let's see what happens.

I am surprised that India picked the team and included two spinners when the pitch would help the fast bowlers in the first three days as pet the curator who prepared the wicket, Ashwin and Jadeja will pack the tail end with batting power and the toss is going to be crucial and with two spinners in the team India might choose batting if they win the toss then only they can exploit the spinners in the final two days.

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Quote from: eaLiTy on June 17, 2021, 11:25:51 AM

India have strong batting line up but New Zealand have good bowlers in their squad. And both teams are also same if you compare it in the opposite way. New Zealand has taken new batsman Devon Conway in their squad. His batting performance was marvelous against England. They have also other qualitative batsman. Trent Boult, Tim Southee and Neil Wagner might create pressure on Indian batting line up with their great bowling skill. Actually there is no way to keep any team at upper level for the trophy. Both team will play with their best players.

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Quote from: eaLiTy on June 17, 2021, 11:25:51 AM

^^^^ So India finally going with two spinners which i did not expect but they wanted to take the opportunity to trouble the New Zealand weakness of playing spin and we can see whether this will pay off but there is one thing that is certain the India batting line up is stronger with the inclusion of Jadeja and Ashwin as the lower order is strong and Mohammed Shami and Jasprit Bumrah will open the bowling and Ishant Sharma the first change bowler, it will be really interesting to see who will be winning the toss.

India management has put together a very good team. New Zealand players are not accustomed to playing spin ball. If India can take this opportunity, they will be able to perform tremendously. Moreover, Jadeja and Ashwin are experienced batsmen. They will not disappoint the team management.

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^^^^ So India finally going with two spinners which i did not expect but they wanted to take the opportunity to trouble the New Zealand weakness of playing spin and we can see whether this will pay off but there is one thing that is certain the India batting line up is stronger with the inclusion of Jadeja and Ashwin as the lower order is strong and Mohammed Shami and Jasprit Bumrah will open the bowling and Ishant Sharma the first change bowler, it will be really interesting to see who will be winning the toss.

JSRAW

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India playing XI is out.

Vishnu.Reang

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^^^^ I am afraid that in the end it will come to a choice between Ravichandran Ashwin and Mohammad Siraj. Given the stats and recent form, I would go with Ashwin. For the pace bowling lineup, I would prefer Mohammad Shami, Ishant Sharma and Jasprit Bumrah. Now I am not sure whether Kohli would be OK with this. He may replace Ishant with Siraj, given that Ishant is a genuine tail end batsmen. But I would still prefer Ishant, as he is more suitable to the English conditions and has tons of experience.

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Quote from: Sithara007 on June 15, 2021, 10:10:34 PM

Quote from: JSRAW on June 15, 2021, 08:07:23 PM

Ashwin and Jadeja are allrounders and capable of adding extra 40-50 runs on the scorecards together. Extra 50 runs down the order matters when you're up against the quality bowling lineup in case of any batting collapse. Let's see what happens.

I agree on Jadeja, but Ashwin hasn't scored enough runs in SENA countries to get elevated to the "allrounder" category. But he is quite capable of building a partnership that can add 40-50 runs to the total. The question is whether they need two spinners, when the curator himself has said that the pitch is going to offer a lot of assistance to the pace bowlers. And Ashwin is someone who has historically performed poorly under such conditions. And among the pace bowlers, Siraj is the only one who has some batting capability.

Don't know if you follow Test cricket or not but since 2018 he's performing quite well with the bat in the SENA countries.

He's number 8 batsman and bowling all rounder so ofc he won't score 50 or 100 regularly like other batsmen or batting all rounders but he has 5 test tons under his belt. He did fairly good job in SA with couple of 30s +7 wickets in 2 games and don't forget recent match saving inning in Sydney + 12 wickets in 3 games. In last English tour his average was like 25 ish with the bat and took 11 wickets in 4 games, didn't bowl single bowl in 1 match because pacer finished the job, this seems good all round performance to me tbh.

If he manage to get 4 wickets and contribute 30-40 runs when batting at number 8 then would say it job well done, failure is part of the game, which can happen anytime but its fine too because atm he seems best bet for India considering his confidence is high due to recent success.

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Quote from: Iranus on June 16, 2021, 12:35:31 AM

Putting two spin bowlers in the squad on this pitch is nothing but nonsense. The pitch depends on the pace. India management needs to find someone who is a pace bowler and capable of batting fairly well. In this case, I agree with you, India can take Siraj in the team. And they can put a spin allrounder on the squad.

Yes.. this is a contentious issue. I am not in favor of including Ashwin, as he has performed poorly in overseas conditions. For the spin option, there is Jadeja. But then the question is whether India will be comfortable in going with 4 pacers + Jadeja? New Zealand are not very good against spinners and in case the match gets extended to the 4th or 5th day, then spinners may have some role to play. So the big question is whether they want to go with 4 pacers + Jadeja, or 4 pacers + 1 spinner (Ashwin) + Jadeja.

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Quote from: Sithara007 on June 15, 2021, 10:10:34 PM

Quote from: JSRAW on June 15, 2021, 08:07:23 PM

Ashwin and Jadeja are allrounders and capable of adding extra 40-50 runs on the scorecards together. Extra 50 runs down the order matters when you're up against the quality bowling lineup in case of any batting collapse. Let's see what happens.

I agree on Jadeja, but Ashwin hasn't scored enough runs in SENA countries to get elevated to the "allrounder" category. But he is quite capable of building a partnership that can add 40-50 runs to the total. The question is whether they need two spinners, when the curator himself has said that the pitch is going to offer a lot of assistance to the pace bowlers. And Ashwin is someone who has historically performed poorly under such conditions. And among the pace bowlers, Siraj is the only one who has some batting capability.

Putting two spin bowlers in the squad on this pitch is nothing but nonsense. The pitch depends on the pace. India management needs to find someone who is a pace bowler and capable of batting fairly well. In this case, I agree with you, India can take Siraj in the team. And they can put a spin allrounder on the squad.

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Quote from: JSRAW on June 15, 2021, 08:07:23 PM

Ashwin and Jadeja are allrounders and capable of adding extra 40-50 runs on the scorecards together. Extra 50 runs down the order matters when you're up against the quality bowling lineup in case of any batting collapse. Let's see what happens.

I agree on Jadeja, but Ashwin hasn't scored enough runs in SENA countries to get elevated to the "allrounder" category. But he is quite capable of building a partnership that can add 40-50 runs to the total. The question is whether they need two spinners, when the curator himself has said that the pitch is going to offer a lot of assistance to the pace bowlers. And Ashwin is someone who has historically performed poorly under such conditions. And among the pace bowlers, Siraj is the only one who has some batting capability.

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Quote from: ene1980 on June 15, 2021, 06:59:18 PM

Quote from: JSRAW on June 15, 2021, 05:23:13 PM

I wouldn't be surprise if they go with 3 seamer and 2 spinners, otherwise tail would start from the number 7. Our pacers are genuine tailenders. If they going with 4th seamer then it should be Siraj, no doubt about it.

The first three days in Southampton where the WTC final is scheduled the pitch will help the seam bowlers and usually that is how it is and taking that into consideration especially in the first 3 days of the match India might go with four pace bowlers and a spinner rather than going with two spinners. It all depends upon what the team management is planning and New Zealand might go with an all out pace attack.

Ashwin and Jadeja are allrounders and capable of adding extra 40-50 runs on the scorecards together. Extra 50 runs down the order matters when you're up against the quality bowling lineup in case of any batting collapse. Let's see what happens.

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Quote from: JSRAW on June 15, 2021, 05:23:13 PM

I wouldn't be surprise if they go with 3 seamer and 2 spinners, otherwise tail would start from the number 7. Our pacers are genuine tailenders. If they going with 4th seamer then it should be Siraj, no doubt about it.

The first three days in Southampton where the WTC final is scheduled the pitch will help the seam bowlers and usually that is how it is and taking that into consideration especially in the first 3 days of the match India might go with four pace bowlers and a spinner rather than going with two spinners. It all depends upon what the team management is planning and New Zealand might go with an all out pace attack.

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Quote from: Vishnu.Reang on June 15, 2021, 08:24:52 AM

^^^ OK.. so some of the quesitons have been answered. Washington Sundar will not be a part of the playing XI. The choice of spinner is going to be between Ravindra Jadeja and Ravichandran Ashwin (and there is a chance that both of them would be included in the XI). Wriddhiman Saha is the reserve keeper, so he is not going to be a part of the XI (unless Rishabh Pant gets injured). Some confusion still persists regarding the selection of the pace bowlers. Two out of the five needs to be dropped. IMO, it should be Siraj and Umesh.

I wouldn't be surprise if they go with 3 seamer and 2 spinners, otherwise tail would start from the number 7. Our pacers are genuine tailenders. If they going with 4th seamer then it should be Siraj, no doubt about it.

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Quote from: Swordsoffreedom on June 15, 2021, 10:39:48 AM

Two strong squads will play against each other. The Indian squad looks pace-dependent. And against a strong batting lineup like New Zealand, the Indian team needs experienced pace bowlers like Bumrah and Shami. We will be able to enjoy a very competitive match. It is very difficult to predict about this match. However, I hope New Zealand will win.

Well.. this is a very surprising comment. Actually the New Zealand team is more dependent on the pace bowlers. They have the best pace bowlers in the world, but they fare poorly in the spin bowling department. On the other hand, India has experienced spinners including Ashwin and Jadeja. And don't think that spin will have no role to play, as the match is taking place in England. Some of the analysts claim that the track will offer a lot of support for the spinners from the 3rd day onward. Someone like Ashwin should be able to take advantage of it.

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Quote from: JSRAW on June 15, 2021, 08:18:56 AM

Both teams announced their 15 men squad for the finals.

Two strong squads will play against each other. The Indian squad looks pace-dependent. And against a strong batting lineup like New Zealand, the Indian team needs experienced pace bowlers like Bumrah and Shami. We will be able to enjoy a very competitive match. It is very difficult to predict about this match. However, I hope New Zealand will win.

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^^^ OK.. so some of the quesitons have been answered. Washington Sundar will not be a part of the playing XI. The choice of spinner is going to be between Ravindra Jadeja and Ravichandran Ashwin (and there is a chance that both of them would be included in the XI). Wriddhiman Saha is the reserve keeper, so he is not going to be a part of the XI (unless Rishabh Pant gets injured). Some confusion still persists regarding the selection of the pace bowlers. Two out of the five needs to be dropped. IMO, it should be Siraj and Umesh.

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Both teams announced their 15 men squad for the finals.

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Quote from: Juggy777 on June 15, 2021, 04:07:05 AM

@Sithara007 I would rather pick Jadeja over Aswin because if India’s top order collapses then he can score some vital runs, and he can be handy with the ball. Furthermore even I’m confused about Rahane as he’s yet not justified his selections, but I feel he should be given one last chance to perform or perish from the starting lineup.

Rahane had too many failures and keeping him in the playing XI will be a big injustice to the emerging players. Regarding Ashwin, I am still confused. Obviously he is the most experienced spinner in the squad and I don't mind him getting a spot instead of Washington Sundar. But if the selection comes at the expense of Jadeja, then it gets more complicated. Because Jadeja is one of the most underrated players in the squad now, and he has rescued the team in a number of difficult situations.

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Quote from: Sithara007 on June 14, 2021, 10:03:38 PM

Quote from: SaShiRaJaVu on June 14, 2021, 06:59:17 PM

If Ashwin is in the team then Sundar and Jadeja will be in the bench, it is a difficult team selection which is good to have and i was surprised that you did not pick Rahane as an automatic selection. India should go with Bumrah, Shami and Siraj as the pace trio and they can really trouble any batting line up and i am really excited to see India play the finals.

Nothing is certain. Given the complete dominance Virat Kohli is having on the selection, I won't be surprised if he goes with two spinners - Ashwin and Sundar. And I would still prefer Ishant over Siraj, due to his experience. For me, Siraj is yet to prove himself on the international arena, despite a lot of hype surrounding him. I would rate Rahane as another overhyped player, and won't be surprised if he is overlooked for selection. His performance during the test series against England was very unsatisfactory.

@Sithara007 I would rather pick Jadeja over Aswin because if India’s top order collapses then he can score some vital runs, and he can be handy with the ball. Furthermore even I’m confused about Rahane as he’s yet not justified his selections, but I feel he should be given one last chance to perform or perish from the starting lineup.

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