Topic: Trust system abuse / DT2 member Vod is provably dishonestly rating people - page 12. (Read 5840 times)

Because he can? I'm not speaking on his behalf but I don't think he exactly owes you an explanation for that question. I used to trust a person somewhat and I don't feel like trusting him anymore, I can always change my feedback from neutral to negative? It's completely fine to do that provided a valid reason is tagged along with it.(which seems to be the case here)

Thread is about to get derailed again.

Let's try to think of ways to improve trust system, and specifically DT system. I think adding more members to DT1 would help reduce abuse. E.g. then Vod would likely receive bunch of negative trust for lying in ratings, and for other untrustworthy behavior. Current(ly) DT members are largely afraid to do anything -- and I've heard this from several people who are either on DT or have been on DT. Also some non-DT users I've contacted are refraining to voice themselves in any way, largely because of the consequences that might happen in the form of trust system abuse. I've said this several times now, but it needs repeating.

Also we have this one example case of abuse, where Vod is abusing DT position against me.

Reminders:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.39588914
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.39447493
To get a proper view of what's happening, read this thread completely and follow links to get to the sources. Also read the reputation thread linked in OP.

Also reminding you of this, as some people seem to skip over it: Vod asked me to change my rating, threatening to otherwise red-rate me. I refused. He rated me red. He also started claiming I'm a scammer and a liar, when I'm provably neither. His ratings to me are absolutely dishonest -- not just "poor". Why are some people still thinking his ratings have something to do with some >2yr old auction, that Vod earlier commented by saying "I decided what you did wasn't untrustworthy"?

Vod does seem to have left retaliatory feedback and the PM conversation is definitely not helping Vod's side. I had asked Vod a question a few days ago but it was buried, thanks digaran, so Vod do answer this: Why did you change your feeback to Anduck from neutral to negative, is it because Anduck said he doesn't trust you, so you wanted to change it?

And DarkStar_, multiple counters are totally fine. If the rating you're countering is wrongly given, which does seem like the case here. And also this:

If a person can be tagged by multiple people for the same reason, such as a single scam instance or by being a scam buster, I don't see why multiple counters for one feedback shouldn't be allowed.

Or, and hear me out, we could do none of those things and continue to ignore you.

Honestly? no, however I hope that if you do remove your tags, Anduck could send a tip to my address, that's why I have added my segwit address in my signature. I'm not going to ask for money, he could totally ignore my efforts and you could also totally keep at what you are doing. I don't have any power here.

Note if you do remove your tags, I'll have no other choice than removing my tags on you, because I tagged you only for this case, removing the tags then would nullify the green trusts of actmyname and DS, so they will have to remove their green tags as well.

Then you could watch Anduck and tag him if he bids on his own auctions again.

Are you being paid to have me remove my red trust?   

That's a lie. You can not say all Mr. self declared, no licensed,  never own won a single case lawyer sir

Yes you are like that because you're a trust abuser, you would even counter legitimate red trust feedback to give free pass to scammers and would try to stop me from serving justice for the community. you also bought a DT2 account while the investigation was ongoing. you have no regards for other people and you want to call the shots around here.

Back to the topic, is there anybody else who'd like to counter Vod's feedback on Anduck? then Vod tags Anduck again and this thing could continue forever.
Vod I'm asking you once more, could you please forgive Anduck by giving him a chance and kindly remove both your red tags on him? be a man and set an example for us all, if you forgive people would see and learn from you, let people to learn something good and not just always to learn fighting and accusing.

Are you sure it's not because you're a belligerent fool?

Now a fair warning - your head might explode. I disagree with Vod that it's implied there can be only one counter rating. I think it's a gray area at best. If I felt it's necessary to counter a negative feedback I would do that (and have done so) without much regard for who else was or wasn't countering, just like I wouldn't base my other ratings on who else is doing it.

I certainly can see why you have so much negative trust.  :/

Yes you can do things on your own free will because you are not a slave at all. listen don, head of the chipmixer family, we're talking about people's reputation here, keep your free will to yourself and tag people based on factual evidence not just because you want to.


No people are not going to say anything because they're all a bunch of pussies, if you see Vod is saying something because he feels that you are both equal in power. though apparently Vod is scared of actmyname for some unknown reason, that's why he tagged him/her with green. people are not going to agree with me because then I'd win. that's why they would never agree on anything with me.

Can I not do things in my own free will?


That's a semi-fair point, but obviously you have a bit of bias. I don't state that I do not trust you though, just that I think your trust rating specifically on Anduck is poor.

Anyone else (not digaran) want to give an opinion on this?

I doubt it is stated anywhere, but it certain is implied...

The feedback was already countered.  You are basically stating you trust Anduck and you do not trust me., when in your words we were both guilty of the same thing.

Why do you keep bringing up money in trust discussions? Says a lot more about you than about your imaginary DT issues.

And then of course later:

Who told you to do that? if you are not providing any convincing reason, then you might as well start your own new business of countering feedbacks and ask for money outside of this forum. good business opportunities DT members have here and they say we are the village idiots.



Nonsense, I never said to pay money, I said ask Lauda what would be the cost, if cost is always equal to money for you then that's your problem.

No. My only communication with Anduck was back in September 12, 2016, when I let him know that his Electrum server was lagging behind. Let me guess, new Reputation thread now and you're going to somehow link an Electrum server from almost two years ago with bribery? Also, funny that this is coming from you because you were the one who suggested that someone contact Lauda and offer to pay to get their negative trust feedback removed.


Vod did not delete his rating; the old one is still there, so the new one has no effect (essentially a red colored neutral).

What rules have I made up exactly? I left direct quotes on how counter feedbacks can work, from theymos. You have provided "restrictions" without any sources.

Did Anduck pay you to counter Vod's feedback? maybe this is just a way for you guys to tag people just to get their money? if you are not going to provide a convincing reason as to why you are countering Vod's feedback, we could say that you are favoring Anduck, if your reason is just that Vod's feedback wasn't fair and Anduck didn't deserve it, then what happens to other people? for example:
Do I need to pay a DT member in order to have some counter feedbacks?
You seem to be the one making up your own rules and just expect us to trust you. Vod also tagged Anduck after 2 years, isn't that what theymos said to avoid doing? so we should consider Vod untrustworthy because he deleted his feedback and reposted it again to say "this guy turned to a scammer".

This whole case is because of Vod abusing Anduck, there are multiple red and green trust involved just because Vod felt he had the right to do whatever he wants and because nobody is stopping him, this will continue just like he countered your rating.

Vod's counter to mine does nothing; it's a red colored neutral as he already left a negative trust in the past. I would only recounter if he deleted his old rating, as that would be trying to game the system and I might leave them a negative trust. As per theymos:

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So because I do not find Anduck untrustworthy, that results in me becoming untrustworthy in Vod's eyes? He could argue that, but it wouldn't be a great argument. Not everyone has the same opinions, which helps keep the DT system (somewhat) decentralized.

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My say is that there is zero issue leaving multiple counters. Again, please provide a citation, even if it's grasping at straws that multiple counters are not allowed. I don't have to wait for theymos to tell me what to do, just like how I don't have to listen to you tell me what to do. What gives you the power to create new rules for DT members?

What happens to Vod here? he gets a free pass then? Vod also countered your green tag, how long are you going to play this game of tagging and countering the tag? this will only increase or decrease the trust scores artificially.

According to Vod, Anduck is a scammer, he should've tagged you for giving a free pass to a scammer but he is too much of a pussy to tag DT members, he is just a bully who would only bully non DT members.
Theymos is busy doing what admins do, moderating the trust system is on you DT members and when you are misusing your power, people are usually busy with their garbage posting businesses and don't have the time to get involved so you'd keep misusing the trust system, don't wait for theymos to tell you what is right and wrong, be a man and have your saying on the matters, though be fair and earn our trust and respect doing so.