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Topic: Why do Atheists Hate Religion? - page 211. (Read 901343 times)

legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
February 10, 2016, 09:33:55 AM
Kiss


Notice the words "new theories." Theories are fun, intriguing things that might be great ideas, but are not known to be facts. People can invent theories all day long.

You mean like theory of gravity. LOL...

The existence of a force that we call gravity is not a theory. The theory part has to do with what exactly gravity is.

Smiley

If you try to "prove gravity" all you can do is show that, locally to you, things tend to move from up to down.

This doesn't "prove" gravity, since your experiences in the past can't be considered predictive unless you have a theory to explain why we might expect gravity to act the same way in the future, and this is why there are no "science facts".



Since the force of gravity is universal in everything that we have experience with, and since the only way to overcome it takes effort and force, gravity is a law.



The "Law of Gravity" is a theory, not a fact. If we find information that this is in some way wrong, we'll change it to make it correct.




Again, the force that we call gravity is a law. Why? Because there is no place where we do not see its force acting. The theory exists regarding how gravity works, and what it is made from, etc.

Newton's law of gravitational force can be seen here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newton%27s_law_of_universal_gravitation. When this article says that Newton's law of gravity was suspended by Einstein's theory of general relativity, this means that the law of gravity was suspended in the minds of a whole bunch of people (scientists) who would rather look at non-fact than fact.

Theory, until proven factual, is fiction. Law is factual. The problem with many areas of science is that the scientists are accepting non-fact over fact. Thus, science itself is following a form of devolution, just like all of human-kind.

Smiley
donator
Activity: 2058
Merit: 1007
Poor impulse control.
February 10, 2016, 09:06:41 AM
Kiss


Notice the words "new theories." Theories are fun, intriguing things that might be great ideas, but are not known to be facts. People can invent theories all day long.

You mean like theory of gravity. LOL...

The existence of a force that we call gravity is not a theory. The theory part has to do with what exactly gravity is.

Smiley

If you try to "prove gravity" all you can do is show that, locally to you, things tend to move from up to down.

This doesn't "prove" gravity, since your experiences in the past can't be considered predictive unless you have a theory to explain why we might expect gravity to act the same way in the future, and this is why there are no "science facts".



Since the force of gravity is universal in everything that we have experience with, and since the only way to overcome it takes effort and force, gravity is a law.



The "Law of Gravity" is a theory, not a fact. If we find information that this is in some way wrong, we'll change it to make it correct.


legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
February 10, 2016, 09:02:05 AM

The less you understand, the greater your faith...


I knew we'd get some truth out of you sooner or later!

Basically, what you are saying is - the more you understand, the less you need faith...

I agree completely... the more educated a person becomes, the less they believe silly superstitions...

Since science proves the existence of God, atheists have great faith.

Smiley

Wow.

Just Wow.

Take this sentence, repeat it to scientists, and watch them laughing so strong you'll probably kill them!
That's dangerous to say something like that you know?

Actually, scientists know that God exists. They simply often don't want to be reminded of it. Rather, they attempt to prove that He doesn't exist.

I suppose that I can't blame them for seeking every avenue that they can to find some little piece of evidence that God doesn't exist. They are honorable enough to want to make absolutely sure before they make the statement that He DOES exist.

The question is, when they find out that God exists in factual ways that dispel their every doubt about it, will they still continue to say that he doesn't?

Smiley
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
February 10, 2016, 08:55:47 AM
Atheists don't really hate religion. They are simply deeply envious of religious people. Why is this? Because they lover their atheism, and instinctively know that they are going to Hell because of it. They are jealous of the religious who are going to Heaven. So, it isn't hate. It is deep envy.

BTW, Atheists do not believe in any of it.  Be it heaven, God, hell, evil spirits, angels etc.  So stop saying we want to go to heaven.

Good point here... I'm certainly not jealous of heaven...

I don't understand how streets paved with gold is supposed to be tempting... if it's everywhere, it must be worthless, right?

Also, gold is soft... it will develop ruts in no time... I'll probably be the guy who has to re-pave that shit every week...

If you think the pope-mobile is ridiculous, wait til you see the Jesus-mobile try to stop on slippery gold streets... he'll cause a 20-angel pileup...

Heaven sounds like it will need a lot of maintenance already, and I only know 1 "fact" about it... gold streets...



The less you understand, the greater your faith... generally. In your case, your lack of understanding blinds you to the faith you live by.

Smiley

LOOOOOOOOOOOOL

Ok so this is even insulting for Christians BADecker!

Please stop talking or at least stop pretending you represent the believers. Cause I feel it extremely insulting! The more you understand, the greater your faith! Because the more you understand, the more perfection you see in the Universe, and the more you can tend to support your beliefs (it can be to have faith in God or to believe there is nothing).

I don't blame you for feeling insulted.

The more you understand, the more you can see which of your beliefs are true and which are false. If you maintain your false beliefs in the face of understanding, you prove that your faith is extremely strong... strong to be able to stand up against the truth.

In this thread, I have shown the proof that God exists, over and over. Atheists in this thread attempt to ignore the truth in favor of their false religion of atheism... with the truth of God staring them right in the face. Such great faith!

I hope that God strengthens my faith in the things that He tells me, things that I don't understand even though I understand that He exists, so that He will be pleased with my faith, and I will find a place in Heaven where I can dwell in joy and glory with God forever.

Smiley
hero member
Activity: 840
Merit: 529
February 10, 2016, 08:55:30 AM

The less you understand, the greater your faith...


I knew we'd get some truth out of you sooner or later!

Basically, what you are saying is - the more you understand, the less you need faith...

I agree completely... the more educated a person becomes, the less they believe silly superstitions...

Since science proves the existence of God, atheists have great faith.

Smiley

Wow.

Just Wow.

Take this sentence, repeat it to scientists, and watch them laughing so strong you'll probably kill them!
That's dangerous to say something like that you know?
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
February 10, 2016, 08:47:43 AM

The less you understand, the greater your faith...


I knew we'd get some truth out of you sooner or later!

Basically, what you are saying is - the more you understand, the less you need faith...

I agree completely... the more educated a person becomes, the less they believe silly superstitions...

Since science proves the existence of God, atheists have great faith.

Smiley
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
February 10, 2016, 08:46:13 AM
Kiss


Notice the words "new theories." Theories are fun, intriguing things that might be great ideas, but are not known to be facts. People can invent theories all day long.

You mean like theory of gravity. LOL...

The existence of a force that we call gravity is not a theory. The theory part has to do with what exactly gravity is.

Smiley

If you try to "prove gravity" all you can do is show that, locally to you, things tend to move from up to down.

This doesn't "prove" gravity, since your experiences in the past can't be considered predictive unless you have a theory to explain why we might expect gravity to act the same way in the future, and this is why there are no "science facts".



Since the force of gravity is universal in everything that we have experience with, and since the only way to overcome it takes effort and force, gravity is a law.

The theories about gravity have to do with how it is made and what it is made of.

Why are you trying to show that you have more ignorance than you really have?

Smiley
hero member
Activity: 826
Merit: 500
Join @Bountycloud for the best bounties!
February 10, 2016, 06:48:27 AM
Atheists don't really hate religion. They are simply deeply envious of religious people. Why is this? Because they lover their atheism, and instinctively know that they are going to Hell because of it. They are jealous of the religious who are going to Heaven. So, it isn't hate. It is deep envy.

BTW, Atheists do not believe in any of it.  Be it heaven, God, hell, evil spirits, angels etc.  So stop saying we want to go to heaven.

Good point here... I'm certainly not jealous of heaven...

I don't understand how streets paved with gold is supposed to be tempting... if it's everywhere, it must be worthless, right?

Also, gold is soft... it will develop ruts in no time... I'll probably be the guy who has to re-pave that shit every week...

If you think the pope-mobile is ridiculous, wait til you see the Jesus-mobile try to stop on slippery gold streets... he'll cause a 20-angel pileup...

Heaven sounds like it will need a lot of maintenance already, and I only know 1 "fact" about it... gold streets...



The less you understand, the greater your faith... generally. In your case, your lack of understanding blinds you to the faith you live by.

Smiley

LOOOOOOOOOOOOL

Ok so this is even insulting for Christians BADecker!

Please stop talking or at least stop pretending you represent the believers. Cause I feel it extremely insulting! The more you understand, the greater your faith! Because the more you understand, the more perfection you see in the Universe, and the more you can tend to support your beliefs (it can be to have faith in God or to believe there is nothing).
sr. member
Activity: 476
Merit: 252
February 10, 2016, 04:25:35 AM
Kiss


Notice the words "new theories." Theories are fun, intriguing things that might be great ideas, but are not known to be facts. People can invent theories all day long.

You mean like theory of gravity. LOL...

The existence of a force that we call gravity is not a theory. The theory part has to do with what exactly gravity is.

Smiley

If you try to "prove gravity" all you can do is show that, locally to you, things tend to move from up to down.

This doesn't "prove" gravity, since your experiences in the past can't be considered predictive unless you have a theory to explain why we might expect gravity to act the same way in the future, and this is why there are no "science facts".



You're globally right but you don't have to prove it locally. Well of course it all depends on how you call it locally xD

But gravity is also perfect to explain the mouvement and trajectory of any Galactic piece of rock. So it's a bit more than demonstrating that locally it goes up to down. Even if in a very literal way you're right it more or less al goes down to that ^^
hero member
Activity: 798
Merit: 722
February 10, 2016, 01:19:14 AM

The less you understand, the greater your faith...


I knew we'd get some truth out of you sooner or later!

Basically, what you are saying is - the more you understand, the less you need faith...

I agree completely... the more educated a person becomes, the less they believe silly superstitions...
donator
Activity: 2058
Merit: 1007
Poor impulse control.
February 10, 2016, 01:12:27 AM
 Kiss


Notice the words "new theories." Theories are fun, intriguing things that might be great ideas, but are not known to be facts. People can invent theories all day long.

You mean like theory of gravity. LOL...

The existence of a force that we call gravity is not a theory. The theory part has to do with what exactly gravity is.

Smiley

If you try to "prove gravity" all you can do is show that, locally to you, things tend to move from up to down.

This doesn't "prove" gravity, since your experiences in the past can't be considered predictive unless you have a theory to explain why we might expect gravity to act the same way in the future, and this is why there are no "science facts".

legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
February 10, 2016, 12:30:15 AM


Notice the words "new theories." Theories are fun, intriguing things that might be great ideas, but are not known to be facts. People can invent theories all day long.

You mean like theory of gravity. LOL...

The existence of a force that we call gravity is not a theory. The theory part has to do with what exactly gravity is.

Smiley
donator
Activity: 2058
Merit: 1007
Poor impulse control.
February 10, 2016, 12:21:48 AM
Again, evolution is theory. Theory means that it is not necessarily fact. Thus you can't factually say that the human mind has evolution behind it. However, the things that I have been showing you regarding science FACT, prove that there is great Intelligence behind the making of mankind and everything else.


There is no such thing as a "science FACT" . There are only theories with more or less evidence to back them up.
donator
Activity: 2058
Merit: 1007
Poor impulse control.
February 10, 2016, 12:19:05 AM
This brings us to entropy. Entropy at its base and core suggests everything is in dispersal mode. Everything is trying to diffuse itself evenly and equaly throughout all space/time. While there is much theoretical thinking about entropy, nobody has found anything that could be considered reverse entropy.

This is a misunderstanding of entropy. There are many examples of a local decrease in entropy, which would result in an increase in entropy elsewhere.

One of the main features that we see in complexity is, nothing that is more complex comes about because of, or from, something less complex. For example. A highly complex snowflake seems to come from a much less complex batch of water molecules. Yet, the conditions of temperature and air movements and dust in the air and solar energy, are actually way more complex than the snowflake that they form out of the less complex water.

This is another misunderstanding of entropy. While it may appear 'simple' to you, a snowflake is much lower entropy (more 'ordered') than the water vapour from which they form.

Summary:
* Entropy can decrease locally
* Complexity does not always correlate with entropy.





Before a farmer shoots grain into his granary the first time for the year, he sweeps the granary clean. Usually there is at least some dust, if not grain shells from the previous season. When he starts sweeping, the job is easy, because there is a lot of garbage to sweep up. But as he gets down to the last little bit, it becomes difficult, simply because there is so little left that he has to work at getting it all.

If you heat a chunk of iron up, and cool another chunk down, and then press the two together, the heat transfer is fast at first. But the closer the chunks get to being the same temperature, the longer it takes for the remaining heat difference to move.

Why would anyone think that entropy needs to remain at a constant throughout the universe? That isn't the point. The point is that entropy exists throughout the universe.

At any place that there seems to be reverse entropy somewhere in the universe, there is greater entropy in whatever caused the appearance of reverse entropy.

Smiley


And that is why more ordered things (eg snowflakes) can be created by less ordered things (water vapour, dirt particles). Whichever way you wish to describe complexity, more complex do come about because of, or from, something less complex.

legendary
Activity: 2702
Merit: 1468
February 09, 2016, 11:37:47 PM


Notice the words "new theories." Theories are fun, intriguing things that might be great ideas, but are not known to be facts. People can invent theories all day long.

You mean like theory of gravity. LOL...
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
February 09, 2016, 11:13:34 PM
Atheists don't really hate religion. They are simply deeply envious of religious people. Why is this? Because they lover their atheism, and instinctively know that they are going to Hell because of it. They are jealous of the religious who are going to Heaven. So, it isn't hate. It is deep envy.

BTW, Atheists do not believe in any of it.  Be it heaven, God, hell, evil spirits, angels etc.  So stop saying we want to go to heaven.

Good point here... I'm certainly not jealous of heaven...

I don't understand how streets paved with gold is supposed to be tempting... if it's everywhere, it must be worthless, right?

Also, gold is soft... it will develop ruts in no time... I'll probably be the guy who has to re-pave that shit every week...

If you think the pope-mobile is ridiculous, wait til you see the Jesus-mobile try to stop on slippery gold streets... he'll cause a 20-angel pileup...

Heaven sounds like it will need a lot of maintenance already, and I only know 1 "fact" about it... gold streets...



The less you understand, the greater your faith... generally. In your case, your lack of understanding blinds you to the faith you live by.

Smiley
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
February 09, 2016, 11:06:19 PM

You are confusing complexity with order.  You are jumping to the "God is the answer" too quickly.  But here we go:
Not at all. There are many things that can be added to the mix. I simply used complexity to get the understanding across. Complexity fits, but order does not. Why doesn't order fit? Because the greater the complexity, the less the evenness throughout, meaning the appearance of less order. But cause and effect are still acting on everything, meaning that there is complete order in the complex and the simple.



Everything that science has found in nature and the universe so far, has one or more causes that brought it into existence in the form that it exists in. In fact, the greater the scientist, the more he is out to find the "why's" of anything and everything.
Why does it exist? What caused it to exist this way? What are the causes that made it happen?

Answer: Yes.  Scientists study the why?

In fact, we are so into finding out the cause of things, that we can't even conceive of anything not having a cause. Everything has a cause, and the cause has a cause, and that cause has a cause, etc., etc.

Answer: Yes

This brings us to entropy. Entropy at its base and core suggests everything is in dispersal mode. Everything is trying to diffuse itself evenly and equaly throughout all space/time. While there is much theoretical thinking about entropy, nobody has found anything that could be considered reverse entropy.

Answer: Yes.  Entropy cannot decrease.

If entropy had existed forever, everything would have been dispersed and diffused long ago. But we know that this is not the case.

Answer: Entropy is a measure of randomness, or disorder.  This is where you are making a mistake.  Entropy could be increasing until universe exists.
There is no randomness or disorder. Cause and effect are acting perfectly. We are so extremely remote in our ability to see most of the complexity, that we use the randomness idea to try to guess things about the complexity. Quantum Mechanics is simply glorified probability. Probability has to do with randomness, and the only reason we use it is because we can't see the complexity. The thing we call randomness is not really randomness at all. It is glorified guesswork.


Our universe was created 14 billion years ago, entropy is increasing ever since.  Not sure what your point is.
Nobody knows the age of the universe. Anybody who suggests that the universe is 14 billion years old, is basing it on theory or guesswork. Theory should not be considered fact until it is proven.


How do we know? Because complexity exists. Thus, entropy must have had a beginning... because it couldn't have existed forever. But we don't see anything that looks like a beginning of entropy. Check with science. Science says this.

Answer: I think you are confusing complexity with order.  Big-Bang theory is the best we can do to explain how it all started.
Again, cause and effect is acting throughout. Cause and effect keeps order throughout. Cause and effect keeps some of the order to be complex, and some of it to be simple.

Big Bang Theory might be the best theory we have. It is not fact. Until it is proven, it should be part of the realm of fiction. Even if Big Bang were proven to be possible, it still would not have been proven to exist.

IF, if, if, if Big Bang is true, then Big Bang is highly intelligent. Why? Because it caused throughout many ages of cause and effect, intelligence in mankind... in addition to seeing to it that the universe remained orderly through cause and effect for all this time. Starting to sound like God a little.



Complexity is the antithesis of entropy. Entropy is trying to break down complexity. Like as there must have been a beginning to entropy, that beginning must have had much higher complexity than we see around today.

Answer: Not really.  Entropy is a measure of randomness or disorder of the system.  Again it brings us to big-bang theory. Yes, in the beginning entropy was zero or close it it.
Actually, there is no randomness. Cause and effect don't allow for disorder. Because of the complexity, we in our inability, think that we see randomness. There isn't really randomness or disorder.



One of the main features that we see in complexity is, nothing that is more complex comes about because of, or from, something less complex.

Answer: Now, this is just not true.  Our bodies evolved from less complicated life forms.  Once AI takes off, you'll see how less complex life forms can create more complicated life forms.
Since entropy is a reduction in complexity, and since entropy acts throughout, only in the face of a reducing of complexity in one area, is there an increase in complexity in some other area. And the increase in complexity never reaches the height of complexity that was in the area of reduced complexity that created it.

The point is, there is no evidence that our bodies evolved, period. Even though there might be some form of operation called evolution, there is no clear method for going from the inanimate all the way to our bodies. But, even if we had a complete method, there is no way to determine if that was the thing that truly happened. Why not? There might be many other evolution methods... and the creation story might be right. This is why evolution is a theory. We simply don't know for sure.



For example. A highly complex snowflake seems to come from a much less complex batch of water molecules. Yet, the conditions of temperature and air movements and dust in the air and solar energy, are actually way more complex than the snowflake that they form out of the less complex water.

Answer: Not sure what you mean.  Snowflakes are formed by a natural process.
Snowflakes are simple water transformed into complex snowflakes. This looks like simplicity transforming into complexity. The reason why it is not simplicity transforming into complexity is, there are many complex processes causing simple water to form the complex snowflake.



The point is, there is something that is so extremely complex,

Answer: Prove it. You stated that there is something so extremely complex.  I ask you to prove it it exist.  Just because 14 billion years ago our universe
was started with near zero entropy does not mean God created it.  As a matter of fact, if God had interacted with our universe, his entropy would increase
the moment he put his nose into our universe.
Okay. Let's assume the theory of a 14 billion year old universe is correct. The intelligence of mankind is here, 14 billion years after the beginning. Whatever started the universe, took a handful of "gravel," and scattered it so that it would interact among itself to produce intelligence after 14 billion years.

Let's see you do that. Let's see any person do that. Intelligence is complex. No intelligence is simple. As we have been saying above, the only way to get complexity from something simple is to have something more complex cause it.

In addition, look at the vastness of universal complexity. Whatever scattered the materials of the universe at the beginning, to create such complexity through cause and effect, would be the expert pool/billiards player of all time.



that it could form the complexity of the mind of man,

Answer: Human mind is a process of millions of years of evolution.  No evidence that supernatural force was involved.  But there is strong physical evidence supporting evolution.
Again, evolution is theory. Theory means that it is not necessarily fact. Thus you can't factually say that the human mind has evolution behind it. However, the things that I have been showing you regarding science FACT, prove that there is great Intelligence behind the making of mankind and everything else.



using universal cause and effect, across multitudes of years, in the face of all-pervading entropy, that brought this whole "thing" into existence.

Answer: Big-bang started our universe.  Not sure what is your point.
Since Big Bang is theory, and theory is not fact until it is proven fact, believers in Big Bang have themselves a Big Bang of a religion.



From the review at the website you listed:
Quote
One of the few prominent scientists today to have crossed the chasm between science and popular culture, Krauss describes the staggeringly beautiful experimental observations and mind-bending new theories that demonstrate not only can something arise from nothing, something will always arise from nothing.

Notice the words "new theories." Theories are fun, intriguing things that might be great ideas, but are not known to be facts. People can invent theories all day long. But the facts:
1. cause and effect;
2. complex universe;
3. universal entropy;
when combined prove the existence of a "Thing" that matches the definition of God.

Smiley
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
February 09, 2016, 09:39:39 PM
This brings us to entropy. Entropy at its base and core suggests everything is in dispersal mode. Everything is trying to diffuse itself evenly and equaly throughout all space/time. While there is much theoretical thinking about entropy, nobody has found anything that could be considered reverse entropy.

This is a misunderstanding of entropy. There are many examples of a local decrease in entropy, which would result in an increase in entropy elsewhere.

One of the main features that we see in complexity is, nothing that is more complex comes about because of, or from, something less complex. For example. A highly complex snowflake seems to come from a much less complex batch of water molecules. Yet, the conditions of temperature and air movements and dust in the air and solar energy, are actually way more complex than the snowflake that they form out of the less complex water.

This is another misunderstanding of entropy. While it may appear 'simple' to you, a snowflake is much lower entropy (more 'ordered') than the water vapour from which they form.

Summary:
* Entropy can decrease locally
* Complexity does not always correlate with entropy.





Before a farmer shoots grain into his granary the first time for the year, he sweeps the granary clean. Usually there is at least some dust, if not grain shells from the previous season. When he starts sweeping, the job is easy, because there is a lot of garbage to sweep up. But as he gets down to the last little bit, it becomes difficult, simply because there is so little left that he has to work at getting it all.

If you heat a chunk of iron up, and cool another chunk down, and then press the two together, the heat transfer is fast at first. But the closer the chunks get to being the same temperature, the longer it takes for the remaining heat difference to move.

Why would anyone think that entropy needs to remain at a constant throughout the universe? That isn't the point. The point is that entropy exists throughout the universe.

At any place that there seems to be reverse entropy somewhere in the universe, there is greater entropy in whatever caused the appearance of reverse entropy.

Smiley
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
February 09, 2016, 09:30:19 PM
Don't believe in good or anything like this unnatural and also consider religion as a problem and main trouble of the world.

The atheism religion caused more deaths in the 1900s than anything other than old age. Virtually all the governments that mass executed their own citizens were atheists.

Smiley
full member
Activity: 140
Merit: 100
February 09, 2016, 08:03:05 PM
Don't believe in good or anything like this unnatural and also consider religion as a problem and main trouble of the world.
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