Author

Topic: [XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency - page 1314. (Read 4670643 times)

legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
it's worth taking into account that all of the alts that are privacy centered have taken a massive beating lately (dark, bbr, btcd, etc).

(Almost) all the alts that aren't privacy centered have been taking a massive beating lately too, and Bitcoin too.

Crypto bear market.
legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
If I may play devil's advocate for a moment....

Why should anyone besides criminals care about a non-transparent blockchain?  I can imagine that a big holder wouldn't want their big holdings potentially traced back to them whenever they send coins.  Any other (practical, non-philosophical) reason?

Please post your bank and credit card statements.

legendary
Activity: 2268
Merit: 1141
If I may play devil's advocate for a moment....

Why should anyone besides criminals care about a non-transparent blockchain?  I can imagine that a big holder wouldn't want their big holdings potentially traced back to them whenever they send coins.  Any other (practical, non-philosophical) reason?


Still think the coin emission is going to hurt more than most people think - but while it's low it's possible to accumulate.  IF this turns out to be a legitimate altcoin with litecoin market cap then you're looking at $20 per coin.  I don't think it's going to happen overnight but I give it a 1 in 3 chance of happening eventually if someone else doesn't blow the anon PoW market away with a completely new coin.

What coin emission issue is this?

There was a great post about it on reddit, but I can't find it anymore. A few things that I can remember are:

-Suppose you get a pay raise, every other employee of the company could see this with a transparant chain. On top of that, most people are not comfortable with revealing there salary. With a transparant chain this would be easy to look up.
-Everyone gets to see where (if your adress is known) how much you spend on which things.

There were some other things there, but can't exactly remember it. Maybe some people could extend this topic a bit more.

A transparant chain would be good for monitoring government expenditures, but for normal people a non-transparant chain would be much better. It is basicly like cash. Y

A bit relevant as well: http://www.ted.com/talks/glenn_greenwald_why_privacy_matters
sr. member
Activity: 700
Merit: 250
If I may play devil's advocate for a moment....
Why should anyone besides criminals care about a non-transparent blockchain?  I can imagine that a big holder wouldn't want their big holdings potentially traced back to them whenever they send coins.  Any other (practical, non-philosophical) reason?

It's been debated a lot already.
Without privacy there is no democracy nor freedom. Simple as that.

All the people claiming that they have nothing to hide are ALL LYING.
Hundred of experiments have proven that people behave submissively and are much more easy to control when feeling being watched.

Start with this :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nineteen_Eighty-Four



people who think that privacy doesn't matter are misinformed/ignorant and don't fully understand the whole spectrum of the issue.
"I've got nothing to hide" is a dangerous mantra that contradicts itself as people who use it are still walking with their clothes on and use doors in their house, keys etc.. Privacy is the very essence of capitalism!
legendary
Activity: 1256
Merit: 1009
Quote
Without privacy there is no democracy nor freedom. Simple as that.

Democracy & freedom are actually at odds with each other on a certain level.  I *think* transparency lends itself to democracy more than freedom in allowing the masses to take away the rights of the individual.
hero member
Activity: 742
Merit: 500
fungibility is also a serious issue.
besides that:

I live in the western world in one of the most sophisticated democracies with very high standards regarding rule of law etc. - we probably never need btc or xmr.

BUT

If you live in a corrupt state where the state is confiscating without serious reasoning maybe the citizens should get the possibility for something which is not that easy to link or to confiscate.

With the recent development of bitcoin I think it will not be bitcoin which solves this niche, it will get regulated, controlled and transparent - that is all fine for me but it is obvious that it can be abused by corrupt governments if you do not live in a great country like I do.

I had long discussion with friends about the privacy issue regarding moral doubts:

I came to the following conclusion: if an individual does something bad he will get his punishment by the constitutional state - but who punishes a (constitutional) state which behaves badly? Despotism can only be fought by peoples who have the freedom to choose. 
legendary
Activity: 2142
Merit: 1131
If I may play devil's advocate for a moment....
Why should anyone besides criminals care about a non-transparent blockchain?  I can imagine that a big holder wouldn't want their big holdings potentially traced back to them whenever they send coins.  Any other (practical, non-philosophical) reason?

It's been debated a lot already.
Without privacy there is no democracy nor freedom. Simple as that.

All the people claiming that they have nothing to hide are ALL LYING.
Hundred of experiments have proven that people behave submissively and are much more easy to control when feeling being watched.

Start with this :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nineteen_Eighty-Four
legendary
Activity: 1372
Merit: 1000
If I may play devil's advocate for a moment....

Why should anyone besides criminals care about a non-transparent blockchain?  I can imagine that a big holder wouldn't want their big holdings potentially traced back to them whenever they send coins.  Any other (practical, non-philosophical) reason?


Still think the coin emission is going to hurt more than most people think - but while it's low it's possible to accumulate.  IF this turns out to be a legitimate altcoin with litecoin market cap then you're looking at $20 per coin.  I don't think it's going to happen overnight but I give it a 1 in 3 chance of happening eventually if someone else doesn't blow the anon PoW market away with a completely new coin.

What coin emission issue is this?
legendary
Activity: 1256
Merit: 1009
Are there any serious contenders for decentralized anonymous transactions besides the other Cryptonotes?
Not yet. Zerocash maybe in the future, but we will have to see how that is received once it exists. Also, a Cryptonote-like BTC side chain might exist someday.

Agree. Apart from Zerocash, nothing.
All others coins named "anonymous" are nothing more than a copy of Bitcoin with a mixer.
You can use the mixer directly with Bitcoin : https://bitmixer.io/


is it just us circlejerking? I can hardly understand why this is not more widely accepted.

this is in my opinion the only really existing niche - all other things can probably be done with bitcoin in the future.

also that sidechains can offer privacy is only half true - you still have to send them to the sidechain and also have to get them out of the chain.

it's worth taking into account that all of the alts that are privacy centered have taken a massive beating lately (dark, bbr, btcd, etc).

Still think the coin emission is going to hurt more than most people think - but while it's low it's possible to accumulate.  IF this turns out to be a legitimate altcoin with litecoin market cap then you're looking at $20 per coin.  I don't think it's going to happen overnight but I give it a 1 in 3 chance of happening eventually if someone else doesn't blow the anon PoW market away with a completely new coin.
sr. member
Activity: 700
Merit: 250
Anyone think this is the bottom?

I think about 0.50EUR could be the bottom. I'm buying.

this price is already, I think this is the end of this coins Undecided


many here might say that this is only the beginning.
sr. member
Activity: 382
Merit: 250
Anyone think this is the bottom?

I think about 0.50EUR could be the bottom. I'm buying.

this price is already, I think this is the end of this coins Undecided
hero member
Activity: 742
Merit: 500
Is there an ETA for Zerocash?

Nothing firm. Various dates have been thrown around, some of them already passed.

Quote
Is Monero development stalled?  I last checked in here quite a while ago and we were pining for an official GUI back then same as now.

No it isn't stalled, but some priorities were shifted a bit toward security auditing and hardening. In the second most recent Missives it was explained that GUI development had resumed and a new test builds should be available soon.



development for non-techies seems to be slow. I understand little of that but see the complexities.

economically a death of xmr does make no sense, no matter what aspect I use.
legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
Is there an ETA for Zerocash?

Nothing firm. Various dates have been thrown around, some of them already passed.

Quote
Is Monero development stalled?  I last checked in here quite a while ago and we were pining for an official GUI back then same as now.

No it isn't stalled, but some priorities were shifted a bit toward security auditing and hardening. In the second most recent Missives it was explained that GUI development had resumed and a new test builds should be available soon.

legendary
Activity: 2142
Merit: 1131
Are there any serious contenders for decentralized anonymous transactions besides the other Cryptonotes?
Not yet. Zerocash maybe in the future, but we will have to see how that is received once it exists. Also, a Cryptonote-like BTC side chain might exist someday.
Agree. Apart from Zerocash, nothing.
All others coins named "anonymous" are nothing more than a copy of Bitcoin with a mixer.
You can use the mixer directly with Bitcoin : https://bitmixer.io/
is it just us circlejerking? I can hardly understand why this is not more widely accepted.
this is in my opinion the only really existing niche - all other things can probably be done with bitcoin in the future.
also that sidechains can offer privacy is only half true - you still have to send them to the sidechain and also have to get them out of the chain.

You have to understand that 99% of altcoin are just pump&dump aiming to make some scammer rich.
You don't need any tech for that, just a nice logo some technical words in big letters and that's it.

As you said, sidechain of Bitcoin are dependent on Bitcoin so it cannot be truly anonymous.
If I send X coins on a side chain, I get back X coins. It is the same problem with mixing.
legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
All others coins named "anonymous" are nothing more than a copy of Bitcoin with a mixer.
You can use the mixer directly with Bitcoin : https://bitmixer.io/

Agree.

Quote
also that sidechains can offer privacy is only half true - you still have to send them to the sidechain and also have to get them out of the chain.

This is true unless the side chain becomes very popular and has good security. In that case people can routinely use the sidechain without needing to go to/from Bitcoin.

hero member
Activity: 742
Merit: 500
Are there any serious contenders for decentralized anonymous transactions besides the other Cryptonotes?
Not yet. Zerocash maybe in the future, but we will have to see how that is received once it exists. Also, a Cryptonote-like BTC side chain might exist someday.

Agree. Apart from Zerocash, nothing.
All others coins named "anonymous" are nothing more than a copy of Bitcoin with a mixer.
You can use the mixer directly with Bitcoin : https://bitmixer.io/


is it just us circlejerking? I can hardly understand why this is not more widely accepted.

this is in my opinion the only really existing niche - all other things can probably be done with bitcoin in the future.

also that sidechains can offer privacy is only half true - you still have to send them to the sidechain and also have to get them out of the chain.
legendary
Activity: 1372
Merit: 1000
Is there an ETA for Zerocash?

Is Monero development stalled?  I last checked in here quite a while ago and we were pining for an official GUI back then same as now.
sr. member
Activity: 700
Merit: 250
Anyone think this is the bottom?

I think about 0.50EUR could be the bottom. I'm buying.
hero member
Activity: 794
Merit: 1000
Monero (XMR) - secure, private, untraceable
I'm accepting XMR and BTC for freelance programming and services.
My oDesk freelancer profile: https://www.odesk.com/o/profiles/users/_~016dd695b0c5edba31/
About me: http://changetheworldwork.com/about-me/

We could use trusted escrow for the transactions.
legendary
Activity: 2142
Merit: 1131
Are there any serious contenders for decentralized anonymous transactions besides the other Cryptonotes?
Not yet. Zerocash maybe in the future, but we will have to see how that is received once it exists. Also, a Cryptonote-like BTC side chain might exist someday.

Agree. Apart from Zerocash, nothing.
All others coins named "anonymous" are nothing more than a copy of Bitcoin with a mixer.
You can use the mixer directly with Bitcoin : https://bitmixer.io/
Jump to: