[XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency - page 1314.

bigj

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Quote from: Wekkel on October 27, 2014, 11:03:31 AM

It's just price discovery. Earn your place in the crypto world with hard results and price will eventually rebound.

Never got so many totally cheap Monero coins in my life! My thanks go to Mr. Burns dumping all his coins because he's too old to understand Cheesy

Wekkel

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yes

It's just price discovery. Earn your place in the crypto world with hard results and price will eventually rebound.

smooth

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Quote from: shojayxt on October 27, 2014, 10:31:11 AM

Quote from: smooth on October 27, 2014, 10:12:01 AM

Quote from: rdnkjdi on October 27, 2014, 09:29:37 AM

it's worth taking into account that all of the alts that are privacy centered have taken a massive beating lately (dark, bbr, btcd, etc).

(Almost) all the alts that aren't privacy centered have been taking a massive beating lately too, and Bitcoin too.

Crypto bear market.

That pretty much sums it up. If you look at other coin threads you'll see the same talk about price. However, this latest decline in XMR price has been pretty substantial compared to other coins.

Compared to some yes. But over the past 30 days BTCD is down more, DRK is down less, so I don't think you can really attribute it to privacy-centered vs. others. Our ranking on coinmarket cap has slipped a bit (down to #14 now) but 11-20 are all pretty close in value, and the entire group has dropped about as much as we have (though the composition of the group has changed a little).

Nothing remarkable about the XMR price drop really, given the rest of the market. That's not to say I'm happy about it, but being realistic.

silencesilence

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I feel major WAR today.... after Monero Monday Missive!

shojayxt

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Quote from: smooth on October 27, 2014, 10:12:01 AM

Quote from: rdnkjdi on October 27, 2014, 09:29:37 AM

it's worth taking into account that all of the alts that are privacy centered have taken a massive beating lately (dark, bbr, btcd, etc).

(Almost) all the alts that aren't privacy centered have been taking a massive beating lately too, and Bitcoin too.

Crypto bear market.

That pretty much sums it up. If you look at other coin threads you'll see the same talk about price. However, this latest decline in XMR price has been pretty substantial compared to other coins. There is a significant amount of buy support, 364 btc on Poloniex but XMR will need to go down further to reach it.

If you look at most coins none of them are anywhere near their all time highs. Monero's chart is similar to other coins that steadily declined from their peak. There was too much hype surrounding Monero and cryptonote coins in general. The price was artificially inflated and driven up by many not wanting to miss out.

papa_lazzarou

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Quote from: smooth on October 27, 2014, 10:08:05 AM

Quote from: bitcoinrocks on October 27, 2014, 09:36:57 AM

If I may play devil's advocate for a moment....

Why should anyone besides criminals care about a non-transparent blockchain? I can imagine that a big holder wouldn't want their big holdings potentially traced back to them whenever they send coins. Any other (practical, non-philosophical) reason?

Please post your bank and credit card statements.

I was going to say that my life is none of your business. But this drives the point home even better. Touché!

mmortal03

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Quote from: smooth on October 27, 2014, 10:08:05 AM

Quote from: bitcoinrocks on October 27, 2014, 09:36:57 AM

If I may play devil's advocate for a moment....

Why should anyone besides criminals care about a non-transparent blockchain? I can imagine that a big holder wouldn't want their big holdings potentially traced back to them whenever they send coins. Any other (practical, non-philosophical) reason?

Please post your bank and credit card statements.

Exactly. Btw, conversations on this topic are great, and need to somehow be more emphasized to the average person, regarding why they might want to use Monero over (or alongside) Bitcoin.

smooth

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Quote from: rdnkjdi on October 27, 2014, 09:29:37 AM

it's worth taking into account that all of the alts that are privacy centered have taken a massive beating lately (dark, bbr, btcd, etc).

(Almost) all the alts that aren't privacy centered have been taking a massive beating lately too, and Bitcoin too.

Crypto bear market.

smooth

legendary

Activity: 2968

Merit: 1198

Quote from: bitcoinrocks on October 27, 2014, 09:36:57 AM

If I may play devil's advocate for a moment....

Why should anyone besides criminals care about a non-transparent blockchain? I can imagine that a big holder wouldn't want their big holdings potentially traced back to them whenever they send coins. Any other (practical, non-philosophical) reason?

Please post your bank and credit card statements.

dEBRUYNE

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Activity: 2268

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Quote from: bitcoinrocks on October 27, 2014, 09:36:57 AM

If I may play devil's advocate for a moment....

Why should anyone besides criminals care about a non-transparent blockchain? I can imagine that a big holder wouldn't want their big holdings potentially traced back to them whenever they send coins. Any other (practical, non-philosophical) reason?

Quote from: rdnkjdi on October 27, 2014, 09:29:37 AM

Still think the coin emission is going to hurt more than most people think - but while it's low it's possible to accumulate. IF this turns out to be a legitimate altcoin with litecoin market cap then you're looking at $20 per coin. I don't think it's going to happen overnight but I give it a 1 in 3 chance of happening eventually if someone else doesn't blow the anon PoW market away with a completely new coin.

What coin emission issue is this?

There was a great post about it on reddit, but I can't find it anymore. A few things that I can remember are:

-Suppose you get a pay raise, every other employee of the company could see this with a transparant chain. On top of that, most people are not comfortable with revealing there salary. With a transparant chain this would be easy to look up.
-Everyone gets to see where (if your adress is known) how much you spend on which things.

There were some other things there, but can't exactly remember it. Maybe some people could extend this topic a bit more.

A transparant chain would be good for monitoring government expenditures, but for normal people a non-transparant chain would be much better. It is basicly like cash. Y

A bit relevant as well: http://www.ted.com/talks/glenn_greenwald_why_privacy_matters

coinism

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Activity: 700

Merit: 250

Quote from: superresistant on October 27, 2014, 09:38:44 AM

Quote from: bitcoinrocks on October 27, 2014, 09:36:57 AM

If I may play devil's advocate for a moment....
Why should anyone besides criminals care about a non-transparent blockchain? I can imagine that a big holder wouldn't want their big holdings potentially traced back to them whenever they send coins. Any other (practical, non-philosophical) reason?

It's been debated a lot already.
Without privacy there is no democracy nor freedom. Simple as that.

All the people claiming that they have nothing to hide are ALL LYING.
Hundred of experiments have proven that people behave submissively and are much more easy to control when feeling being watched.

Start with this :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nineteen_Eighty-Four

people who think that privacy doesn't matter are misinformed/ignorant and don't fully understand the whole spectrum of the issue.
"I've got nothing to hide" is a dangerous mantra that contradicts itself as people who use it are still walking with their clothes on and use doors in their house, keys etc.. Privacy is the very essence of capitalism!

rdnkjdi

legendary

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Quote

Without privacy there is no democracy nor freedom. Simple as that.

Democracy & freedom are actually at odds with each other on a certain level. I *think* transparency lends itself to democracy more than freedom in allowing the masses to take away the rights of the individual.

nakaone

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fungibility is also a serious issue.
besides that:

I live in the western world in one of the most sophisticated democracies with very high standards regarding rule of law etc. - we probably never need btc or xmr.

BUT

If you live in a corrupt state where the state is confiscating without serious reasoning maybe the citizens should get the possibility for something which is not that easy to link or to confiscate.

With the recent development of bitcoin I think it will not be bitcoin which solves this niche, it will get regulated, controlled and transparent - that is all fine for me but it is obvious that it can be abused by corrupt governments if you do not live in a great country like I do.

I had long discussion with friends about the privacy issue regarding moral doubts:

I came to the following conclusion: if an individual does something bad he will get his punishment by the constitutional state - but who punishes a (constitutional) state which behaves badly? Despotism can only be fought by peoples who have the freedom to choose.

superresistant

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Quote from: bitcoinrocks on October 27, 2014, 09:36:57 AM

If I may play devil's advocate for a moment....
Why should anyone besides criminals care about a non-transparent blockchain? I can imagine that a big holder wouldn't want their big holdings potentially traced back to them whenever they send coins. Any other (practical, non-philosophical) reason?

It's been debated a lot already.
Without privacy there is no democracy nor freedom. Simple as that.

All the people claiming that they have nothing to hide are ALL LYING.
Hundred of experiments have proven that people behave submissively and are much more easy to control when feeling being watched.

Start with this :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nineteen_Eighty-Four

bitcoinrocks

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Activity: 1372

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If I may play devil's advocate for a moment....

Why should anyone besides criminals care about a non-transparent blockchain? I can imagine that a big holder wouldn't want their big holdings potentially traced back to them whenever they send coins. Any other (practical, non-philosophical) reason?

Quote from: rdnkjdi on October 27, 2014, 09:29:37 AM

Still think the coin emission is going to hurt more than most people think - but while it's low it's possible to accumulate. IF this turns out to be a legitimate altcoin with litecoin market cap then you're looking at $20 per coin. I don't think it's going to happen overnight but I give it a 1 in 3 chance of happening eventually if someone else doesn't blow the anon PoW market away with a completely new coin.

What coin emission issue is this?

rdnkjdi

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Quote from: nakaone on October 27, 2014, 08:39:17 AM

Quote from: superresistant on October 27, 2014, 08:29:19 AM

Quote from: smooth on October 27, 2014, 08:24:31 AM

Quote from: bitcoinrocks on October 27, 2014, 08:15:51 AM

Are there any serious contenders for decentralized anonymous transactions besides the other Cryptonotes?

Not yet. Zerocash maybe in the future, but we will have to see how that is received once it exists. Also, a Cryptonote-like BTC side chain might exist someday.

Agree. Apart from Zerocash, nothing.
All others coins named "anonymous" are nothing more than a copy of Bitcoin with a mixer.
You can use the mixer directly with Bitcoin : https://bitmixer.io/

is it just us circlejerking? I can hardly understand why this is not more widely accepted.

this is in my opinion the only really existing niche - all other things can probably be done with bitcoin in the future.

also that sidechains can offer privacy is only half true - you still have to send them to the sidechain and also have to get them out of the chain.

it's worth taking into account that all of the alts that are privacy centered have taken a massive beating lately (dark, bbr, btcd, etc).

Still think the coin emission is going to hurt more than most people think - but while it's low it's possible to accumulate. IF this turns out to be a legitimate altcoin with litecoin market cap then you're looking at $20 per coin. I don't think it's going to happen overnight but I give it a 1 in 3 chance of happening eventually if someone else doesn't blow the anon PoW market away with a completely new coin.

coinism

sr. member

Activity: 700

Merit: 250

Quote from: ZPserge on October 27, 2014, 09:22:24 AM

Quote from: coinism on October 27, 2014, 08:37:07 AM

Quote from: drawingthesun on October 27, 2014, 05:07:14 AM

Anyone think this is the bottom?

I think about 0.50EUR could be the bottom. I'm buying.

this price is already, I think this is the end of this coins Undecided

many here might say that this is only the beginning.

ZPserge

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Quote from: coinism on October 27, 2014, 08:37:07 AM

Quote from: drawingthesun on October 27, 2014, 05:07:14 AM

Anyone think this is the bottom?

I think about 0.50EUR could be the bottom. I'm buying.

this price is already, I think this is the end of this coins Undecided

nakaone

hero member

Activity: 742

Merit: 500

Quote from: smooth on October 27, 2014, 08:45:38 AM

Quote from: bitcoinrocks on October 27, 2014, 08:38:50 AM

Is there an ETA for Zerocash?

Nothing firm. Various dates have been thrown around, some of them already passed.

Quote

Is Monero development stalled? I last checked in here quite a while ago and we were pining for an official GUI back then same as now.

No it isn't stalled, but some priorities were shifted a bit toward security auditing and hardening. In the second most recent Missives it was explained that GUI development had resumed and a new test builds should be available soon.

development for non-techies seems to be slow. I understand little of that but see the complexities.

economically a death of xmr does make no sense, no matter what aspect I use.

smooth

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Quote from: bitcoinrocks on October 27, 2014, 08:38:50 AM

Is there an ETA for Zerocash?

Nothing firm. Various dates have been thrown around, some of them already passed.

Quote

Is Monero development stalled? I last checked in here quite a while ago and we were pining for an official GUI back then same as now.

No it isn't stalled, but some priorities were shifted a bit toward security auditing and hardening. In the second most recent Missives it was explained that GUI development had resumed and a new test builds should be available soon.

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