icebreaker I think it is very unsavory of you to present the events re: Poloniex and busoni's reaction out of context.
Here's the full chat log for people who might be interested in the complete picture:
http://pastebin.com/aMKwQcHR
trading was frozen for less than 2 minutes btw...
I trust in the capability of my esteemed Monero community to build their own opinion and not run around with pitchforks and torches screaming SCANDAL.
Topic: [XMR] Monero Speculation - page 1272. (Read 3314316 times)
Yes. Breaking the consensus and social covenant in Ethereum over a failed contract is the real issue here. I mean did Bitcoin fork over, pirateat40, MtGox, Silkroad in favor of the US Government, the Silkroad seizure against the US Government, etc.? No, No, No, No, ...
This also begs the question: Are all failed Ethereum contracts reversed or just those too big to fail?
Of course in Monero such selective shenanigans would be impossible because the censor would not know which transaction(s) to reverse, undo etc.
This also begs the question: Are all failed Ethereum contracts reversed or just those too big to fail?
Of course in Monero such selective shenanigans would be impossible because the censor would not know which transaction(s) to reverse, undo etc.
It's tempting to make the point in ETH/DAO implosion discussions that if ETH was fungible it would be impossible to even consider the possibility of blacklisting "stolen" coins.
But it's better to let DAOists figure that out for themselves.
Also relevant to our fun "I TOLD U SO LOL" fun:
Dash is DigitaltrASH.
Why? Because of this:
Smooth's Razor®
Why? Because of this:
Only systems that are structurally incompatible with fraud don't suffer from the overhang of potential fraud.
Smooth's Razor®
Professor l33th4x0r and LeastAuthority warned DAO about stalking attacks and called for a deployment moratorium, yet were overruled/ignored:
http://hackingdistributed.com/2016/06/17/thoughts-on-the-dao-hack/
No way in hell do these clowns deserve a bailout.
Ever desireless, one can see the mystery.
Ever desiring, one can see the manifestations.
-Laozi
Ever desiring, one can see the manifestations.
-Laozi
Yes. Breaking the consensus and social covenant in Ethereum over a failed contract is the real issue here. I mean did Bitcoin fork over, pirateat40, MtGox, Silkroad in favor of the US Government, the Silkroad seizure against the US Government, etc.? No, No, No, No, ...
This also begs the question: Are all failed Ethereum contracts reversed or just those too big to fail?
Of course in Monero such selective shenanigans would be impossible because the censor would not know which transaction(s) to reverse, undo etc.
This also begs the question: Are all failed Ethereum contracts reversed or just those too big to fail?
Of course in Monero such selective shenanigans would be impossible because the censor would not know which transaction(s) to reverse, undo etc.
Satoshi remaining anonymous and disappearing from Bitcoin turns out to be a very smart move. When things go right everybody wants it to be 'decentralized' (being able to have it's own piece of the pie). But when things go south all of the sudden action is demanded from it's founder.
Now imagine some government or three letter agency demanding changes or reversals. No thank you. It is so powerful to realize this is technically impossible for Monero.
Good news, everyone!
/u/biglambda, the comedy genius who created intheoreum.org, is rage-quitting ETH and joining Team Mustang!
He should be a good fit for Monero Mountain's thriving neckbearded turbo nrrd community, as his occupation is reportedly writing HPC compilers.
Soon there will be dozens of us. DOZENS!1!!
/u/biglambda, the comedy genius who created intheoreum.org, is rage-quitting ETH and joining Team Mustang!
He should be a good fit for Monero Mountain's thriving neckbearded turbo nrrd community, as his occupation is reportedly writing HPC compilers.
Quote from: https://np.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/4ojpx7/i_wont_be_upgrading_my_miner_to_fix_the_dao_and/
I won't be upgrading my miner to fix the DAO and here is why. self.ethereum
submitted 13 hours ago * by biglambda
I've been mining ETH since the Olympic test net and I believe in the Ethereum blockchain. This "hack" is within consensus and the results of the hack should stand on the blockchain because /u/vbuterin is not my character Bob
If this happened on the Bitcoin blockchain, the blockchain would give zero fucks about a contract regardless of it's size. And in fact in order for "crypto law" to be a possibility, the consensus must stand. The right solution for DAO holders is to negotiate with the hacker to return the funds by allowing them to keep a percentage of the stolen coins without repercussions. If you rollback the blockchain you compromise the integrity of the entire Ethereum experiment and the value of the Ether token.
Once my miner is forked off the network, I will build a Monero client and continue mining.
submitted 13 hours ago * by biglambda
I've been mining ETH since the Olympic test net and I believe in the Ethereum blockchain. This "hack" is within consensus and the results of the hack should stand on the blockchain because /u/vbuterin is not my character Bob
If this happened on the Bitcoin blockchain, the blockchain would give zero fucks about a contract regardless of it's size. And in fact in order for "crypto law" to be a possibility, the consensus must stand. The right solution for DAO holders is to negotiate with the hacker to return the funds by allowing them to keep a percentage of the stolen coins without repercussions. If you rollback the blockchain you compromise the integrity of the entire Ethereum experiment and the value of the Ether token.
Once my miner is forked off the network, I will build a Monero client and continue mining.
Soon there will be dozens of us. DOZENS!1!!
Yes. Breaking the consensus and social covenant in Ethereum over a failed contract is the real issue here. I mean did Bitcoin fork over, pirateat40, MtGox, Silkroad in favor of the US Government, the Silkroad seizure against the US Government, etc.? No, No, No, No, ...
This also begs the question: Are all failed Ethereum contracts reversed or just those too big to fail?
Of course in Monero such selective shenanigans would be impossible because the censor would not know which transaction(s) to reverse, undo etc.
Don't you just love default privacy features?
Good news, everyone!
/u/biglambda, the comedy genius who created intheoreum.org, is rage-quitting ETH and joining Team Mustang!
He should be a good fit for Monero Mountain's thriving neckbearded turbo nrrd community, as his occupation is reportedly writing HPC compilers.
Soon there will be dozens of us. DOZENS!1!!
/u/biglambda, the comedy genius who created intheoreum.org, is rage-quitting ETH and joining Team Mustang!
He should be a good fit for Monero Mountain's thriving neckbearded turbo nrrd community, as his occupation is reportedly writing HPC compilers.
Quote from: https://np.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/4ojpx7/i_wont_be_upgrading_my_miner_to_fix_the_dao_and/
I won't be upgrading my miner to fix the DAO and here is why. self.ethereum
submitted 13 hours ago * by biglambda
I've been mining ETH since the Olympic test net and I believe in the Ethereum blockchain. This "hack" is within consensus and the results of the hack should stand on the blockchain because /u/vbuterin is not my character Bob
If this happened on the Bitcoin blockchain, the blockchain would give zero fucks about a contract regardless of it's size. And in fact in order for "crypto law" to be a possibility, the consensus must stand. The right solution for DAO holders is to negotiate with the hacker to return the funds by allowing them to keep a percentage of the stolen coins without repercussions. If you rollback the blockchain you compromise the integrity of the entire Ethereum experiment and the value of the Ether token.
Once my miner is forked off the network, I will build a Monero client and continue mining.
submitted 13 hours ago * by biglambda
I've been mining ETH since the Olympic test net and I believe in the Ethereum blockchain. This "hack" is within consensus and the results of the hack should stand on the blockchain because /u/vbuterin is not my character Bob
If this happened on the Bitcoin blockchain, the blockchain would give zero fucks about a contract regardless of it's size. And in fact in order for "crypto law" to be a possibility, the consensus must stand. The right solution for DAO holders is to negotiate with the hacker to return the funds by allowing them to keep a percentage of the stolen coins without repercussions. If you rollback the blockchain you compromise the integrity of the entire Ethereum experiment and the value of the Ether token.
Once my miner is forked off the network, I will build a Monero client and continue mining.
Soon there will be dozens of us. DOZENS!1!!
Yes. Breaking the consensus and social covenant in Ethereum over a failed contract is the real issue here. I mean did Bitcoin fork over, pirateat40, MtGox, Silkroad in favor of the US Government, the Silkroad seizure against the US Government, etc.? No, No, No, No, ...
This also begs the question: Are all failed Ethereum contracts reversed or just those too big to fail?
Of course in Monero such selective shenanigans would be impossible because the censor would not know which transaction(s) to reverse, undo etc.
Good news, everyone!
/u/biglambda, the comedy genius who created intheoreum.org, is rage-quitting ETH and joining Team Mustang!
He should be a good fit for Monero Mountain's thriving neckbearded turbo nrrd community, as his occupation is reportedly writing HPC compilers.
Soon there will be dozens of us. DOZENS!1!!
/u/biglambda, the comedy genius who created intheoreum.org, is rage-quitting ETH and joining Team Mustang!
He should be a good fit for Monero Mountain's thriving neckbearded turbo nrrd community, as his occupation is reportedly writing HPC compilers.
Quote from: https://np.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/4ojpx7/i_wont_be_upgrading_my_miner_to_fix_the_dao_and/
I won't be upgrading my miner to fix the DAO and here is why. self.ethereum
submitted 13 hours ago * by biglambda
I've been mining ETH since the Olympic test net and I believe in the Ethereum blockchain. This "hack" is within consensus and the results of the hack should stand on the blockchain because /u/vbuterin is not my character Bob
If this happened on the Bitcoin blockchain, the blockchain would give zero fucks about a contract regardless of it's size. And in fact in order for "crypto law" to be a possibility, the consensus must stand. The right solution for DAO holders is to negotiate with the hacker to return the funds by allowing them to keep a percentage of the stolen coins without repercussions. If you rollback the blockchain you compromise the integrity of the entire Ethereum experiment and the value of the Ether token.
Once my miner is forked off the network, I will build a Monero client and continue mining.
submitted 13 hours ago * by biglambda
I've been mining ETH since the Olympic test net and I believe in the Ethereum blockchain. This "hack" is within consensus and the results of the hack should stand on the blockchain because /u/vbuterin is not my character Bob
If this happened on the Bitcoin blockchain, the blockchain would give zero fucks about a contract regardless of it's size. And in fact in order for "crypto law" to be a possibility, the consensus must stand. The right solution for DAO holders is to negotiate with the hacker to return the funds by allowing them to keep a percentage of the stolen coins without repercussions. If you rollback the blockchain you compromise the integrity of the entire Ethereum experiment and the value of the Ether token.
Once my miner is forked off the network, I will build a Monero client and continue mining.
Soon there will be dozens of us. DOZENS!1!!
If Polo won't commit to them, I will be finding another exchange and encouraging others to do the same.
Centralized exchanges have their role and finding another one may the right call for you, but either way I would still encourage trying to build liquidity on bitsqaure. I've had offers on there at times but I was often alone on the order book and didn't get any fills. I'll continue to list when I have the opportunity to do so.
How solid is the Bitsquare platform? Does it rely on "smart" contracts?
Very solid, I have made a few trades on it. You need to get used to the interface and the trade mechanic. No smart contracts...but it does use multisig.
How long until it supports advanced features like margin trading? That is probably a way out. It needs more developers.
Is there a testnet version to try out? There may be a test net version, but the main net works fine.
Once Bitsquare is somewhat comparable/competitive feature-wise, I'd be happy to offer some XMR there at a discount, to coax volume away from the morally hazardous exchange under the command of ETH Fed Chairman Vitalik "Helicopter" Buterin.
One other thing: You have to keep the app running to see offers and keep the app running to keep your own offer alive.
Yeah that's the main reason I don't have offers open more often. I wish there was a command line version I could easily run on a server, and script up to notify my if a trade matches. Maybe there is but i missed it?
If Polo won't commit to them, I will be finding another exchange and encouraging others to do the same.
Centralized exchanges have their role and finding another one may the right call for you, but either way I would still encourage trying to build liquidity on bitsqaure. I've had offers on there at times but I was often alone on the order book and didn't get any fills. I'll continue to list when I have the opportunity to do so.
How solid is the Bitsquare platform? Does it rely on "smart" contracts?
Very solid, I have made a few trades on it. You need to get used to the interface and the trade mechanic. No smart contracts...but it does use multisig.
How long until it supports advanced features like margin trading? That is probably a way out. It needs more developers.
Is there a testnet version to try out? There may be a test net version, but the main net works fine.
Once Bitsquare is somewhat comparable/competitive feature-wise, I'd be happy to offer some XMR there at a discount, to coax volume away from the morally hazardous exchange under the command of ETH Fed Chairman Vitalik "Helicopter" Buterin.
One other thing: You have to keep the app running to see offers and keep the app running to keep your own offer alive.
I copied it from github but I don't know how to run the application?
You just install then run the app. (.exe)
If Polo won't commit to them, I will be finding another exchange and encouraging others to do the same.
Centralized exchanges have their role and finding another one may the right call for you, but either way I would still encourage trying to build liquidity on bitsqaure. I've had offers on there at times but I was often alone on the order book and didn't get any fills. I'll continue to list when I have the opportunity to do so.
How solid is the Bitsquare platform? Does it rely on "smart" contracts?
Very solid, I have made a few trades on it. You need to get used to the interface and the trade mechanic. No smart contracts...but it does use multisig.
How long until it supports advanced features like margin trading? That is probably a way out. It needs more developers.
Is there a testnet version to try out? There may be a test net version, but the main net works fine.
Once Bitsquare is somewhat comparable/competitive feature-wise, I'd be happy to offer some XMR there at a discount, to coax volume away from the morally hazardous exchange under the command of ETH Fed Chairman Vitalik "Helicopter" Buterin.
One other thing: You have to keep the app running to see offers and keep the app running to keep your own offer alive.
I copied it from github but I don't know how to run the application?
If Polo won't commit to them, I will be finding another exchange and encouraging others to do the same.
Centralized exchanges have their role and finding another one may the right call for you, but either way I would still encourage trying to build liquidity on bitsqaure. I've had offers on there at times but I was often alone on the order book and didn't get any fills. I'll continue to list when I have the opportunity to do so.
How solid is the Bitsquare platform? Does it rely on "smart" contracts?
Very solid, I have made a few trades on it. You need to get used to the interface and the trade mechanic. No smart contracts...but it does use multisig.
How long until it supports advanced features like margin trading? That is probably a way out. It needs more developers.
Is there a testnet version to try out? There may be a test net version, but the main net works fine.
Once Bitsquare is somewhat comparable/competitive feature-wise, I'd be happy to offer some XMR there at a discount, to coax volume away from the morally hazardous exchange under the command of ETH Fed Chairman Vitalik "Helicopter" Buterin.
One other thing: You have to keep the app running to see offers and keep the app running to keep your own offer alive.
If Polo won't commit to them, I will be finding another exchange and encouraging others to do the same.
Centralized exchanges have their role and finding another one may the right call for you, but either way I would still encourage trying to build liquidity on bitsqaure. I've had offers on there at times but I was often alone on the order book and didn't get any fills. I'll continue to list when I have the opportunity to do so.
How solid is the Bitsquare platform? Does it rely on "smart" contracts?
How long until it supports advanced features like margin trading?
Is there a testnet version to try out?
Once Bitsquare is somewhat comparable/competitive feature-wise, I'd be happy to offer some XMR there at a discount, to coax volume away from the morally hazardous exchange under the command of ETH Fed Chairman Vitalik "Helicopter" Buterin.
I was playing around with Bitsquare. Seems pretty solid. My problem is that I can't bear to part with any BTC or XMR. So it's hard for me to thoroughly test! 😉
Next resistance zone is around 270k.
That gap between 27 and 38 needs to be filled. If Polo won't commit to them, I will be finding another exchange and encouraging others to do the same.
Centralized exchanges have their role and finding another one may the right call for you, but either way I would still encourage trying to build liquidity on bitsqaure. I've had offers on there at times but I was often alone on the order book and didn't get any fills. I'll continue to list when I have the opportunity to do so.
How solid is the Bitsquare platform? Does it rely on "smart" contracts?
How long until it supports advanced features like margin trading?
Is there a testnet version to try out?
Once Bitsquare is somewhat comparable/competitive feature-wise, I'd be happy to offer some XMR there at a discount, to coax volume away from the morally hazardous exchange under the command of ETH Fed Chairman Vitalik "Helicopter" Buterin.
I'm still unsure whether it is the right time to buy Bitcoin to be able to buy more xmr. One thing is I have this strange feeling that Bitcoin is going to take a hit soon and also I'm still unsure about where I should buy from. I prefer the privacy aspect of localbitcoins, but it's so inconvinient. Does anyone here prefer to buy through bitsquare?
This resistance zone (230-235k) has broken for now, price has to get a bit higher to confirm though. Next resistance zone is around 270k. In addition, the 3d MACD flipped to green. Last time it flipped to green it preceded the rally from ~100k to ~430k.
If Polo won't commit to them, I will be finding another exchange and encouraging others to do the same.
Centralized exchanges have their role and finding another one may the right call for you, but either way I would still encourage trying to build liquidity on bitsqaure. I've had offers on there at times but I was often alone on the order book and didn't get any fills. I'll continue to list when I have the opportunity to do so.
I see no circumstance under which I would ever support asking for a halt in trading on a centralized exchange. Trading on the exchange is trading book entry claims on the exchange's wallet. Even in the extreme case of a rollback or other problem affecting wallets, traders can assess the impact that might have on the solvency of an exchange and trade accordingly. However, an exchange might on its own (or in discussion with other exchanges) decide to halt trading. That's their call, it is their platform after all.
If there were a problem with the blockchain affecting (or even possibly affecting) wallets, I would support asking for (and recommending) a halt to deposits/withdrawals until it was resolved.
During the initial stages of the 202612 attack exchanges may have stopped trading as we put out an general "red alert" until we actually figured out what was going on. Most decided to restart it but they kept wallet transactions on hold until bug was identified and the vulnerability deemed over.
With respect to the DAO, it wasn't even a bug in the coin at all. Ethereum devs acting in that capacity shouldn't have been involved nor should they have asked exchanges to do anything in my opinion, nor should any fork, hard or soft, be on the table at all. My other (perhaps more controversial) opinion on the matter is here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/there-was-no-dao-hack-1516067
Needless to say I will never support a fork or rollback or any other sort of meddling with coin ownership in Monero on the basis of an external incident that was not a flaw in the implementation of the coin itself (an example of the latter being the overflow bug in Bitcoin).
If there were a problem with the blockchain affecting (or even possibly affecting) wallets, I would support asking for (and recommending) a halt to deposits/withdrawals until it was resolved.
During the initial stages of the 202612 attack exchanges may have stopped trading as we put out an general "red alert" until we actually figured out what was going on. Most decided to restart it but they kept wallet transactions on hold until bug was identified and the vulnerability deemed over.
With respect to the DAO, it wasn't even a bug in the coin at all. Ethereum devs acting in that capacity shouldn't have been involved nor should they have asked exchanges to do anything in my opinion, nor should any fork, hard or soft, be on the table at all. My other (perhaps more controversial) opinion on the matter is here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/there-was-no-dao-hack-1516067
Needless to say I will never support a fork or rollback or any other sort of meddling with coin ownership in Monero on the basis of an external incident that was not a flaw in the implementation of the coin itself (an example of the latter being the overflow bug in Bitcoin).
I fully support the standards for halting trading, etc. you have described.
If Polo won't commit to them, I will be finding another exchange and encouraging others to do the same.
It's great XMR is going up so much, but right now we are printing money in a burning house.
Tristan needs to assure us there will be no repeat of yesterday's intolerable, arbitrary market intervention.
If Polo's solvency is not in danger, admins have no business changing the rules in the middle of the game to pick winners and losers.
That's how you get your ass sued so hard you end up in a wheelchair.
Do you know if Bitsquare has the ability to halt trading for a coin once it's listed?
It would be futile and self-defeating for Bitsquare devs to even try.
Such an action would voluntarily relinquish their network effect, as pissed off users would quickly fork the project and simply run Bitsquare Classic or whatever.
Where's primer-? 
Bad day for Ethereum. Vitalik did the right thing, miners make the final decision and so far there seems to be a consensus.
I haven't sold a single ether and i hold almost $500k usd worth (@ 0.028). I am more confident than ever that in 2-3 months, with Coinbase's support, we are to see a new ATH..
On another note, Monero pump looking better than ever! I'd love to see .003 soon!
This post must be a joke.
I laughed!
A shitload of seriously off topic shilling .
please delete
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