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Topic: [XMR] Monero Speculation - page 1622. (Read 3313576 times)

donator
Activity: 1274
Merit: 1060
GetMonero.org / MyMonero.com
December 12, 2015, 03:16:09 PM
I'm not going to speculate on the future of Ethereum ring signatures here. Monero already has a working system today - I think it will become more popular once we have more web services using it.

You don't even have a GUI, monero man-child developers (thats how Vitalik calls them) are useless. Way over 50% of hash rate are botnets.
It's dead Jim...  I'm still holding a decent amount (couple tens of thousands) but the first pump that comes along - I'm out.

Oh well, I guess I'd better copy-and-paste my comment from Reddit on the state of Ethereum:

Quote
On the topic of poor design:

- Vitalik has repeatedly eschewed and ignored commentary from researchers and plowed ahead with poor design decisions.

- Where he hasn't ignored the commentary, he has instead noted it and then layered complexity on top of the bad idea in order to make it workable (complexity is the enemy of secure cryptography and good system design).

- He also repeatedly fails to cite prior research / researchers, which I guess leads some to view him as more than he is, which in turn leads to an inherent trust in a poorly designed system.

- He uses mathematical notation in a completely incorrect manner in formal papers (some of which govern the very inner workings of Ethereum) such that mathematicians are unable to peer review the paper. If you can't understand what he's trying to express, how can you confirm if the concept is valid or the mathematical proof is correct?

- When the above is pointed out to him he (naively or foolishly or disingenuously) claims that the security of the model is "in the code" and not in the mathematical proofs. This bizarre world-view is only dangerous in light of the fact that the system has to at least protect its users somewhat.

On the topic of mismanagement:

- Instead of focusing on a single implementation they instead hired developers to build out at least 4 of the multiple implementations.

- The consequence of this was not only a breaking inter-implementation fork 6 months ago, but also has (as their security auditors put it) "testing needs...more complex than anything we've looked at before".

- They raised $18.4 million, which was almost entirely spent a year later. According to the blog post on the matter they have enough money to make it to June 2016, possibly a little beyond that. That is truly shocking, considering that Ethereum had the 4th highest crowd-funded project funds.

- Instead of biting the bullet and immediately beginning a systematic process of converting the majority of the funds raised into a store of value that would remain relatively stable for the 3-5 years it would take for the project to be built up, they kept the bulk of it in Bitcoin, resulting in a $9 million shortfall on their initial funding amount (when viewed in USD terms).

- Despite promising financial transparency with the money that had been raised, it took them over a year before they suddenly realised they actually needed to come through on that. A startup needn't make their financial activities public at all, but if that is the case then don't promise such transparency. Doing so, and then failing to deliver on that promise, points to incredible mismanagement by individuals that have no clue how to run or build up a company.
full member
Activity: 178
Merit: 100
December 12, 2015, 03:02:36 PM
I'm not going to speculate on the future of Ethereum ring signatures here. Monero already has a working system today - I think it will become more popular once we have more web services using it.

You don't even have a GUI, monero man-child developers (thats how Vitalik calls them) are useless. Way over 50% of hash rate are botnets.
It's dead Jim...  I'm still holding a decent amount (couple tens of thousands) but the first pump that comes along - I'm out.
A GUI isn't as important as a good back-end foundation.

How do you know over 50% of hash rate are botnets?

Even if the majority of miners were botnets, why would that be bad? Free security is still good security.
legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000
December 12, 2015, 02:59:08 PM
illodin, your comment did not add to the topic of the discussion and was deleted (along with the reply quoting it).

He was speculating on if and when another pump might happen. That's perfectly on-topic! Stop censoring speculation topics!
Monero has only seen pumps and dumps, it was never stable above 003 for longer than a couple of weeks. Perfectly on-topic to talk about when to expect another pump, IF EVER!
legendary
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
December 12, 2015, 02:48:33 PM
illodin, your comment did not add to the topic of the discussion and was deleted (along with the reply quoting it).

primer-, can you support that Vitalik actually said what you claimed he said? My intuition is that you can't, it was trolling and not an actual quote, so please stop.



I suggest not to FUD then so the pump has at least a chance of happening. I have a friend who has a friend who also still has some and wants to see one more pump.

legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000
December 12, 2015, 02:36:34 PM
I'm not going to speculate on the future of Ethereum ring signatures here. Monero already has a working system today - I think it will become more popular once we have more web services using it.

You don't even have a GUI, monero man-child developers (thats how Vitalik calls them) are useless. Way over 50% of hash rate are botnets.
It's dead Jim...  I'm still holding a decent amount (couple tens of thousands) but the first pump that comes along - I'm out.
full member
Activity: 178
Merit: 100
December 12, 2015, 02:31:29 PM
I honestly doubt that any crypto can "mimic" the cryptonote protocol in "a couple lines of code".  I believe you can't just mimic that sort of thing and there is a lot more that goes into Monero's code.  Though, I will disclose that I would have no idea what kind of things happen "under the hood" that the devs continually work on day in and day out.

Oh, yes  you can and they are already working on it (Vitalik himself is leading the team working on ring signatures contract!).
Vitalik already confirmed that ring signatures would never become part of the Ethereum protocol by default.
Source:

https://www.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/3tappe/early_alpha_monerolike_linkable_ring_signatures/cx4yz4t

So anyone wanting privacy would likely have a larger address set to mix with in Monero where mixing will be default in the protocol (0.9 release).

Why would it become a part of the protocol when a single dapp can do it...
I'm not going to speculate on the future of Ethereum ring signatures here. Monero already has a working system today - I think it will become more popular once we have more web services using it.
legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000
December 12, 2015, 02:14:18 PM
I honestly doubt that any crypto can "mimic" the cryptonote protocol in "a couple lines of code".  I believe you can't just mimic that sort of thing and there is a lot more that goes into Monero's code.  Though, I will disclose that I would have no idea what kind of things happen "under the hood" that the devs continually work on day in and day out.

Oh, yes  you can and they are already working on it (Vitalik himself is leading the team working on ring signatures contract!).
Vitalik already confirmed that ring signatures would never become part of the Ethereum protocol by default.
Source:

https://www.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/3tappe/early_alpha_monerolike_linkable_ring_signatures/cx4yz4t

So anyone wanting privacy would likely have a larger address set to mix with in Monero where mixing will be default in the protocol (0.9 release).

Why would it become a part of the protocol when a single dapp can do it...
legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000
December 12, 2015, 02:13:35 PM
I honestly doubt that any crypto can "mimic" the cryptonote protocol in "a couple lines of code".  I believe you can't just mimic that sort of thing and there is a lot more that goes into Monero's code.  Though, I will disclose that I would have no idea what kind of things happen "under the hood" that the devs continually work on day in and day out.

Oh, yes  you can and they are already working on it (Vitalik himself is leading the team working on ring signatures contract!).

But you can't just change the code without completely disrupting the Ethereum network.  This would require a hardfork, which now since it looks like Microsoft is a key player in Ethereum, Vitalik won't be able to just hard fork whenever he pleases.  Maybe he's testing it theoretically, but there's no way he's going to try and implement something like that very soon.  I would think that there is so much more that you and I would ever be able to understand with the code that goes into Monero and cryptonote in general. I mean hell, have you ever tried to read and understand what goes into RingCT?

https://github.com/ShenNoether/MiniNero/blob/master/RingCT0.4_copy.pdf

It's not so simple to just input "a couple lines of code" and then *BAM* you have everything working like Monero and Ethereum combined.

No hard fork my friend, Ethereum's blockchain runs its own programming language, Turing. Developers can create Ethereum contracts that mimic ANY other alt including monero.
You better read up on eth, you don't know the basics..
full member
Activity: 178
Merit: 100
December 12, 2015, 02:12:48 PM
I honestly doubt that any crypto can "mimic" the cryptonote protocol in "a couple lines of code".  I believe you can't just mimic that sort of thing and there is a lot more that goes into Monero's code.  Though, I will disclose that I would have no idea what kind of things happen "under the hood" that the devs continually work on day in and day out.

Oh, yes  you can and they are already working on it (Vitalik himself is leading the team working on ring signatures contract!).
Vitalik already confirmed that ring signatures would never become part of the Ethereum protocol by default.
Source:

https://www.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/3tappe/early_alpha_monerolike_linkable_ring_signatures/cx4yz4t

So anyone wanting privacy would likely have a larger address set to mix with in Monero where mixing will be default in the protocol (0.9 release).
hero member
Activity: 1874
Merit: 840
Keep what's important, and know who's your friend
December 12, 2015, 02:08:16 PM
I honestly doubt that any crypto can "mimic" the cryptonote protocol in "a couple lines of code".  I believe you can't just mimic that sort of thing and there is a lot more that goes into Monero's code.  Though, I will disclose that I would have no idea what kind of things happen "under the hood" that the devs continually work on day in and day out.

Oh, yes  you can and they are already working on it (Vitalik himself is leading the team working on ring signatures contract!).

But you can't just change the code without completely disrupting the Ethereum network.  This would require a hardfork, which now since it looks like Microsoft is a key player in Ethereum, Vitalik won't be able to just hard fork whenever he pleases.  Maybe he's testing it theoretically, but there's no way he's going to try and implement something like that very soon.  I would think that there is so much more that you and I would ever be able to understand with the code that goes into Monero and cryptonote in general. I mean hell, have you ever tried to read and understand what goes into RingCT?

https://github.com/ShenNoether/MiniNero/blob/master/RingCT0.4_copy.pdf

It's not so simple to just input "a couple lines of code" and then *BAM* you have everything working like Monero and Ethereum combined.
legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000
December 12, 2015, 01:56:25 PM
I honestly doubt that any crypto can "mimic" the cryptonote protocol in "a couple lines of code".  I believe you can't just mimic that sort of thing and there is a lot more that goes into Monero's code.  Though, I will disclose that I would have no idea what kind of things happen "under the hood" that the devs continually work on day in and day out.

Oh, yes  you can and they are already working on it (Vitalik himself is leading the team working on ring signatures contract!).
hero member
Activity: 1874
Merit: 840
Keep what's important, and know who's your friend
December 12, 2015, 01:52:26 PM
So can that be said about Ethereum/Ripple as well?  I think I'm still confused about what those coins are trying to provide... I know a lot of people think it's a credible system, and the fact that Microsoft is jumping on board with those cryptos (for whatever reason) makes it seem like it's the "next big thing" for people to invest.  All I know and have read on various news outlets is that they use it for their Azure cloud data base testing, but I don't understand why they need to invest with the Ethereum/Ripple protocol... what is so special about these cryptos?

Ethereum is bitcoin 2.0. In a few months ethereum will be able to mimic monero anonymity in a couple lines of code...



I honestly doubt that any crypto can "mimic" the cryptonote protocol in "a couple lines of code".  I believe you can't just mimic that sort of thing and there is a lot more that goes into Monero's code.  Though, I will disclose that I would have no idea what kind of things happen "under the hood" that the devs continually work on day in and day out.
legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000
December 12, 2015, 01:48:14 PM
So can that be said about Ethereum/Ripple as well?  I think I'm still confused about what those coins are trying to provide... I know a lot of people think it's a credible system, and the fact that Microsoft is jumping on board with those cryptos (for whatever reason) makes it seem like it's the "next big thing" for people to invest.  All I know and have read on various news outlets is that they use it for their Azure cloud data base testing, but I don't understand why they need to invest with the Ethereum/Ripple protocol... what is so special about these cryptos?

Ethereum is bitcoin 2.0. In a few months ethereum will be able to mimic monero anonymity in a couple lines of code...

hero member
Activity: 1874
Merit: 840
Keep what's important, and know who's your friend
December 12, 2015, 01:38:58 PM
So, I have been wondering... why does it seem like there is only interest in things like DASH and Ethereum on major bitcoin/crypto news sites?  I don't think I've ever seen a Monero price/development analysis article, but I see it a lot with sites like newsBTC. I think I'm still confused in general about Ethereum/ripple and it's relationship with Microsoft, but DASH seems to be getting all the news coverage in the cryptonote scene.

They probably have a relationship with various (cryptocurreny) media outlets. In other words, they probably paid them to release/write articles about them.

So can that be said about Ethereum/Ripple as well?  I think I'm still confused about what those coins are trying to provide... I know a lot of people think it's a credible system, and the fact that Microsoft is jumping on board with those cryptos (for whatever reason) makes it seem like it's the "next big thing" for people to invest.  All I know and have read on various news outlets is that they use it for their Azure cloud data base testing, but I don't understand why they need to invest with the Ethereum/Ripple protocol... what is so special about these cryptos?
legendary
Activity: 2268
Merit: 1141
December 12, 2015, 01:27:24 PM
So, I have been wondering... why does it seem like there is only interest in things like DASH and Ethereum on major bitcoin/crypto news sites?  I don't think I've ever seen a Monero price/development analysis article, but I see it a lot with sites like newsBTC. I think I'm still confused in general about Ethereum/ripple and it's relationship with Microsoft, but DASH seems to be getting all the news coverage in the cryptonote scene.

They probably have a relationship with various (cryptocurreny) media outlets. In other words, they probably paid them to release/write articles about them.
sr. member
Activity: 514
Merit: 258
December 12, 2015, 01:20:44 PM
So, I have been wondering... why does it seem like there is only interest in things like DASH and Ethereum on major bitcoin/crypto news sites?  I don't think I've ever seen a Monero price/development analysis article, but I see it a lot with sites like newsBTC. I think I'm still confused in general about Ethereum/ripple and it's relationship with Microsoft, but DASH seems to be getting all the news coverage in the cryptonote scene.

Dash is NOT a cryptonote-coin... Dash is overhyped and overmarketed, that's why they get much attention, lots of empty promises (masternode blinding) and now the evolution-thing... When push comes to shove the truth will reveal itself, and it won't be nice for dash-holders...

Best regards
legendary
Activity: 1484
Merit: 1002
Strange, yet attractive.
December 12, 2015, 01:16:34 PM
I'm posting this because most of the (new) people here, *possibly* didn't notice that the only STABLE alt at the moment when BTC hits new highs seems to be XMR. Either you get it - or you don't, I don't have the time to explain. Roll Eyes
hero member
Activity: 1874
Merit: 840
Keep what's important, and know who's your friend
December 12, 2015, 12:41:35 PM
So, I have been wondering... why does it seem like there is only interest in things like DASH and Ethereum on major bitcoin/crypto news sites?  I don't think I've ever seen a Monero price/development analysis article, but I see it a lot with sites like newsBTC. I think I'm still confused in general about Ethereum/ripple and it's relationship with Microsoft, but DASH seems to be getting all the news coverage in the cryptonote scene.
legendary
Activity: 1106
Merit: 1000
December 12, 2015, 08:25:39 AM

Edit: Here we go again: Over 13,000 unconfirmed transactions in Bitcoin with most of the blocks full. https://blockchain.info/unconfirmed-transactions

Can you also see unconfrimed xmr transactions?

Look at transaction pool http://chainradar.com/xmr/blocks
sr. member
Activity: 392
Merit: 250
December 12, 2015, 07:04:09 AM

Edit: Here we go again: Over 13,000 unconfirmed transactions in Bitcoin with most of the blocks full. https://blockchain.info/unconfirmed-transactions

Can you also see unconfrimed xmr transactions?
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