Topic: ★ ZEIT ★ [COMMUNITY & KNIGHTS] [ULTRA LOW INFLATION] [MICRO-PAYMENTS] - page 160. (Read 1009360 times)

Sorry kiklo, but growing a 1 cent  company into a $1  company is completely another pair of shoes than going from $100 to $10k, although it is a hundred fold growth each time. We cannot compare ourselves to Bitcoin and I am not asking that (btw., also choosing the Mt.Gox bubble as a starting point of your comparison would always show that Bitcoin is performing badly. Let's keep it unbiased). I believe we both agree what I am asking in the core of my post (not that I am only criticising for the sake of it): we need to find the ways to get more new people involved into ZEIT. That should be one of our main goals for the next years. I remember in one of the first Knights meetings about a year ago, we were discussing about getting more involved into the social media. that wasn't that bad idea after all, and I think we should bring it back to start with. Second issue, I believe we need to bring more life into Knights forum, as this body is somehow not very active recently. we are approaching the new time window for Knight applications so at least in theory there is plenty to talk about. We are competing with 600 (or more) coins, as you correctly stated, and we need to show why we are different and worth attention. Just 'being there' does not sell that well.

Edit:
PS. One more thing. You have to be careful when comparing 'market caps', as there is very important factor at play - inflation. Even with the price staying at the same level for the entire year our market cap growths by the value of inflation. That is 20% in the year 2. (of course, that is the maximum value when all coins are staking each time). That means you would have to deduct the value of the inflation from the market cap value to get the net value growth in order to compare it with a non-PoS coin.

I compare us to the other Alts, who in comparison have all lost value last year.
You want to compare us to BTC early years when they were competing with no one else but their own coin for most of those years.
We are competing with over 600 coins including BTC whose has many years head start. 

But here is what I see when compared to BTC,
Nov 2013 BTC was $1250 apiece ,  Jan 2016 BTC is $390 apiece
Average MK was       ~8,163,067,765 on July 7th, 2014
Average MK NOW is ~5,918,518,213  Jan 2016
In normal performance standards , that is a HUGE failure!

Now ZEIT , I will ignore the peaks, since they mean nothing to you, but stick with the average
Average MK was        ~$28,386 Jul-Oct 2014
Average MK NOW is ~$150,000 Jan 2016

BTC MK has a loss of a little over 2 billion US Dollars
ZEIT MK is 5 times more than what it was.

Can you really not see how we will overtake them in time?

Now if you really just want more community involvement,
Hey, start throwing stuff out that you want done , with ideas on how to do it.

 

FYI:
BTC already has Millionaires behind it.
AT ZEIT we are on a shoe string budget and we still outperformed BTC MK performance in the past two years. 

Steve, thanks for your voice, as I believe you hit the nail in the head. My point goes very much in line with what you are saying: we have a fantastic coin and the dev behind it, we have even 14 Knights to support and take care of the coin well-being, yet it hardly translates into any new users by the means that are measurable in the market volumes. What I said is, that we simply need more activity among us Knights and more actions to encourage new users to ZEIT. We need to prove that this fuzz about being Knight really means something positive for the coin.

Continuing kiklo's fantastic parallel with the child, myself being a parent too, I would say: it is very hard to be objective when talking about your own child and you need to have some objective metrics to see if your kid is progressing as it is foreseen for its age. Therefore if your kid, despite of having 18 months is not yet crawling, is not yet walking at the age of two, is not yet speaking at the age of four, you need to take it to a specialist to get some help. You cannot just wait it out, hoping that he/she will eventually work it out by her-/himself. Translating it into our world: in the objective metric such as price at volume (not just price alone, as you have seen with the most recent example, having mere 55LTC buys you the whole one side of the market on a low volume exchange, which is very deceiving) we need to check if we are progressing after a given period of time. One year means a lot in crypto (Bitcoin is mere six years around) and thus I believe it is fair to check how we compare to ourselves from one year ago. And it is fair to conclude that we didn't progress much in 2015. Meaning, as ZEIT ambassadors, we will need to improve our actions in 2016.

1   LionOfNarnia
2   Rent_A_Ray
3   Kiklo
4   Steve
5   Vavarin
6   Newra
7   Podizzle
8   GregofDoom
9   Ebolansk
10   CapSER2.0
11   Solarion
12   CoinQuest
13   Atronite
14   Uki

all Knights are entitled to a start up TALK account
just PM ... any staked coins I am willing to buy back and pay in Zeit
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/talk15bitcointalk-est2014yr4-btc-864994

------

interesting core concept.
i would suggest pick ONE
focus on getting an exchange running in that country that can settle (take and send payment) via old world banking systems
tie to quoted rate of exchange to the android wallet
bingo! you will have basically become a 2-way pegged form of payment in that nation

eventually each nation will have a unique coin that provides this service
already you can trade ALTs and hold CNY, JPY, $, RUR, THB more coming online
but those are exchange house accounts

what is needed is a nubit/tether coin that is de facto a unit of measure for a specie of fiat (or commodity)

http://dumbwill.com/cults/

That happens later, price stabilization has to happen 1st.

 

Kiklo my man, you are a man of many great ideas! Zeit would definitely be the perfect way to send money back to Mehico. But how can we market that, is the question?

Also, I posted a few things on our official forum. Maybe you can take a look. We do need to get that forum active again. Maybe updating some information there would be a good start. I think the last update was when we were on version 2.0.1.2, so it is a little dated.

One point of future interest for SouthXchange

The Mexican population in the US sends vast amounts of money back to their families still in Mexico.
I believe last count it was ~$21.6 Billion US Dollars per year .

Once the price of ZEIT has a stable floor that can not be broken, it would be the perfect tool , to replace the money order services that most currently use.
Oddly enough most of the US Mexican population has a huge distrust of banks and mainly use cash, imagine that. 

 

I agree with you, kiklo. And I honestly do believe that many people just do not equate interest earned in staking as profit, especially when they keep their focus on the satoshi value associated with the coin. They don't see the big picture. All they see is they may have minted 100,000 Zeit, but that 100,000 Zeit is still only worth 1 satoshi each. Some people just can't seem to wrap their minds around the fact that they just got those 100,000 Zeit FOR FREE! (FYI, uki, I'm not referring to you when I say that. I know you know the deal since you are a knight. I just didn't want you to think I was talking about you.  )

And as for the Cryptsy thing, I was talking more about the fact that many of us were using Cryptsy exclusively in our transactions and some got burned badly when they "got hacked" or whatever their excuse was.

Thanks for correcting me about SouthXchange. I honestly didn't know there has been that much transaction there. I don't check coinmarketcap daily, but each time I have in the past few months, there was always $0 24 hour volume for them. I used YoBit some, but honestly, the fact they have set minimums for making transactions or withdrawals was a bit of a turn off for me. I'm not a power player on the exchanges by any means, and if I want to trade a few Doge or satoshis I get from faucets and only have enough to buy 5000 Zeit or so, I want to be able to do that AND withdraw it to my wallet since I do NOT leave coins on exchanges. I'm going to start using SouthXchange for a while since they seem to be a really good exchange.

Zeit on, homies!

It is hard to attract investors if they see no potential for making a profit.

Considering the ZEIT interest is free from staking and can be sold without deducing from the principle amount,
if people can't see the profit in that , I really don't know what to say.

SouthXchange has had a few time where their entire ZEIT/ LTC sell walls were wiped out,
the Cryptsy incident had really nothing to do with us, but there greedy attempts to act like a fractional reserve.
And to be honest , looking at all of the coin prices now, it feels like they were manipulating the markets for their own profit.
Some markets were manipulated higher, and personally believe they were manipulating the ZEIT Market Lower to game the system to get more LTC at our expense. I mean you got 60 million Zeitcoins in sell walls and you can't pay out 5000 zeitcoins in withdrawals, cryptsy was doing us dirty, maybe just to keep our price lower so they could buy cheap zeitcoins on the other exchanges for their withdrawals.

Main Rule on Exchanges
Never Leave more on an exchange than what you are willing to lose.

As far as the current exchanges,
Cryptopia caters more to the English speaking populace
Yobit caters more to the Russian & Chinese speaking populace
SouthXchange caters more to the Spanish speaking populace

As interest in Russian & Chinese & Spanish culture grow for virtual currencies, you will see their volume grow as well.

 

FYI:
Our Current exchanges are not delisting maniacs like Bittrex & CCEX.
Also both ZEIT Markets were in SouthXchange Top 10 list, no real worries there.

   Right,

A guy from Minnesota was visiting 1 time, the temp was ~30 degress and all of the east coast people below the mason dixon line were freezing and bundled up where we could barley move, the Minnesota Guy was only wearing Shorts and a T-Shirt .  


 

Zeit Recap


Next official ZeitKnight registration in March 2016.

New members have to pass the test of Proof of ZeitKnight. Link Below.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=487814.msg10461974;topicseen#msg10461974

After they Pass the test , this happens.
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.10324746

To the best of my knowledge
The original dev was only around for a few months in 2014 and attempted to get the zeitgeist movement to support zeitcoin by attending one of their meetings and contacting their management.  Zeitgeist movement management basically rebuked him and wanted nothing to do with any virtual coin at that time.
Upon that , the original dev left not long after , Rent_a_Ray stepped up and became the dev and has been ever since.
Like most original devs that left, his real id was unknown to the community.

So basically there never have been any real connections between the Zeitgeist movement and the Real ZEIT movement, which is basically the current ZEIT Kights & community. The ZEIT Knights have no interest in partnering with the management of the zeitgeist movement.
Each year for 1 month New ZEIT Knights can join , next post contains that info.
List of Current Knights that Joined in 2015
1   LionOfNarnia
2   Rent_A_Ray
3   Kiklo
4   Steve
5   Vavarin
6   Newra
7   Podizzle
8   GregofDoom
9   Ebolansk
10   CapSER2.0
11   Solarion
12   CoinQuest
13   Atronite
14   Uki

 

Please could the founder contact me via private message.  Zeitcoin has been included in the book I have begun.  I have heard that inspiration came from the Zeit Movement?  The thread I created last year is:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/cryptocurrency-the-alt-ernative-second-edition-vote-985422

I look forward to hearing from you. 

I can understand where uki is coming from. Now, I'm no math or economics whiz by any means, so I don't know what this "hitting 1 trillion for an hour or two" is all about. But I don't think the frustration lies in the fact that we haven't hit the $1 mark yet. Let's be realistic, we have a max of, what is it? 99 billion coins? The $1 mark will be a very long time coming. I think the frustration lies in the fact that we are approaching 2 years of age and have barely spent any time above the 1 satoshi mark.

We have a lot of great qualities like a well developed and maintained wallet, fast transactions, a small but strong community, and are consistently on ths top 100 on coinmarketcap. What we are lacking in is investors. The knights are long term investors and we concern ourselves with the health of the network. But, like it or not, we will need a balance of long and short term investors, just like all of the other high performing coins. It is hard to attract investors if they see no potential for making a profit. Hate to say it, but it's the truth.

Someone mentioned recently that we need to be more active on our Zeit forum and on the reddit forum. I agree with that. I will start using the forum more often. I don't know much about reddit because I've never used it.

One other thing to mention is yes, we are listed on three exchanges, and they all three seem to be good exchanges. But the thing I've noticed is that the majority of our 24 hour volume has been on Cryptopia. SouthXchange has seen no real volume at all. How long will it take before they see no profit with Zeit and delist us? We need to spread our coins between the three. The last thing we need is another Cryptsy incident and have people losing millions of coins.

My 2 cents. Take it for what it's worth.

AMAZING project Kiklo

Really hope it works out.

Just wanted to throw in a reminder for the Knights that 'Tithing Time' is nearly upon us again. I'll leave it to Mighty Ray to confirm the donation addy & timescale but all knights should get ready to send 10% of their 'minting profits' for the year to support the projects we already have going.

For me, that's ~ 3.6 million Zeit.

To the 'East Coast Snowmen' out there -

Ya know even the Canadians are laffin' at you right now?

East Coast thoughts of the Day
 





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJUFTm6cJXM

 

IMO , hitting 1 trillion mark even for an hour or two,
Was Spectacular and put many in a good mood, this is a long road we're on.
Constant worry about the next step because ZEIT is not = to a $1 yet , is not a healthy mindset, and will work against us.
We'll get there in time.  

We've got to enjoy ourselves a little bit so we don't fall into a depressed spiral like the other coin communities.

ZEIT Facts
Technically Our Coin is Stable with better performance than most other coins.
We've had No Downtime of our network, in fact no major incidents come to mind, other coins have been offline Multiple times.
(The Truest Testament to Ray's Amazing Talents)
Our Block Explorers are stable, We have 3 excellent exchanges that have been very stable.
Payment options for vendors.
Fudders or hostile takeovers don't happen here like in other forums, because they know the Knights would stand against them.
Technically we have become a very strong coin network.


ZEIT Future
I have a very secretive nature, so maybe I have not shared enough of what I am thinking and that lack of openness is causing your concerns.
We need to decrease the amount of coins on the exchanges so our price will rise and more people will become interested in joining, some for Knighthood and some for just profit motives.
In December , I began designing an investment system that will over time remove coins from the exchanges, decrease the available supply to increase the price of the remaining coins. One Reason is the Global Exchange Rates, in the US & Europe , our Fiat currency is much greater than some others, this can be an advantage, in the following way, Either thru the investment system or thru an effort by the Knights once our numbers reach 100 or so, we can make sure that there will always be a buy order of 1 satochi on each of our markets, So that Anyone that wants to sell their ZEIT will always be able too.
Where a US or Europe user selling their ZEIT interest for a US $1 profit only see a buck , a citizen of india would receive  67.579000 Rupee ,
Japanese Yen 118.74 , or Indonesian Rupiah 13873 of profit , which would definitely help them .
Now considering economics as more of these users from these low exchange countries grow , it decreases the available supply even more, which will raise the price even for our US & Europe users until we hit that magic $1 mark, then reverse our efforts and do our level best to keep the price from going even higher.
AS ZEIT becomes a Truly Global coin as it was meant to be and all of the Knights sell 10% of their earn staking from their 100 million to keep the price of ZEIT from going over a $1 and using it for Charitable works.  


US Dollar                             1.00 USD    
Indian Rupee                      67.579000    
Malaysian Ringgit                   4.271504    
Japanese Yen                    118.740000
Chinese Yuan Renminbi       6.579400    
Argentine Peso                      13.700000    
Botswana Pula                      11.621552
Brazilian Real                        4.093000    
Bruneian Dollar                        1.429585
Bulgarian Lev                        1.811150    
Canadian Dollar                        1.412375    
Chilean Peso                    715.200012    
Chinese Yuan Renminbi      6.579400
Colombian Peso               3309.000000
Croatian Kuna                       7.103449    
Czech Koruna                     25.010300    
Danish Krone                        6.906590
Emirati Dirham                       3.672550    
Hong Kong Dollar              7.796700    
Hungarian Forint           288.285000    
Icelandic Krona             130.999790    
Indonesian Rupiah     13873.000000    
Iranian Rial                 30184.123151    
Israeli Shekel                       3.982180    
Kazakhstani Tenge            360.598160    
Libyan Dinar                       1.386500
Lithuanian Litas                       3.197638
Malaysian Ringgit               4.271504    
Mauritian Rupee             36.099376    
Mexican Peso                     18.449650    
Nepalese Rupee           104.125000    
New Zealand Dollar            1.540595    
Norwegian Krone            8.742500
Pakistani Rupee         104.924968
Philippine Peso          47.734087
Polish Zloty                 4.135200    
Qatari Riyal                 3.641349    
Romanian New Leu         4.197848    
Russian Ruble             78.147895    
Saudi Arabian Riyal       3.751750    
Singapore Dollar                1.429585    
South African Rand        16.470020    
South Korean Won      1197.700000    
Sri Lankan Rupee      144.442085    
Swedish Krona                 8.597000
Taiwan New Dollar       33.560000    
Thai Baht                   36.020966    
Trinidadian Dollar       6.434903    
Turkish Lira               3.003749    
Venezuelan Bolivar       6.349606    


FYI:
For some of these countries , we will need an android based electrum wallet with servers,
did find a service that was offering that for $600 per year, once we have 100 Knights, that is only $6 a year per knight to expand ZEIT coverage thru out the world where it will become the Global Medium for exchanging service & products & resources.

 

Kiklo, I am not from the generation that believes in perpetuum mobile, in the first place.
I believe that if we, as Knights, are responsible for the well-being of this project, we should constantly question ourselves whether we are doing a good job and verify it with some reasonable metrics. That is, in fairness, the sense of the question I asked. I gave an example of a fair metric to check our performance in the last year time frame, which taking into account the lifetime of Bitcoin so far, is a reasonable and relatively long-term one. And, to my understanding, we shouldn't clap ourselves in the backs, saying how fantastic year it was. It was not. And the valid question is, what shall we do to make the next year better?

Very well said Kiklo, very well said!
Fred

UKI,

Your Generation's level of Patience is measured in minutes & days.
So a year or 3 feels like forever to you.

Trust me , when you hit your 80s , you realize it all went by a lot faster than you dreamed.
And the only things of Real Value took Many Years to Cultivate.

like the child that first has to crawl , then walk, before they can RUN like the Wind,
it is no Different for ZEIT ,
The ZEIT Knights support our Child Coin ZEIT , until he can run and make this world a better place.
This challenge is not a simple task , it will test your Resolve, and you must have the Will & Faith to see it thru to the completion.

Thinking back to my children, the 1st time they stood up on their own, (no they could not even make it across the room without falling down),  
But that moment showed growth and will always stick in my memory as a turning point, because it was not long before they were running all over the place.


Old Saying ,
Why do we fall?
So we can learn how to pick ourselves up.