An obvious rigging of Sports. - page 2.

Silberman

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Quote from: STT on May 17, 2021, 04:17:02 PM

They have to find and prosecute such instances, often the sport itself is best self governed but to have a law is fairly important so there is some bite to such investigations and in order to pass the case onto police and lawyers to prosecute with. Unfortunately its a very tempting prospect especially at the ground level of the game where many players may never progress as far and as easily as taking money to make a bet come true.
That said courts dont have the unique expertise that players themselves do, the greatest deterrent is knowing your own group of players know exactly what you are doing and can take action against you for anything decidable even outside a law court; a law court will require proof beyond reasonable doubt where as a trade body or player union can decide a verdict by majority and is far quicker to punish easily I think.
Its the sports own best interests to self govern and ensure corruption does not take root and reduce investment by lack of integrity and belief in game results, without this much damage can occur and foreign leagues will take priority over a country's self grown talent.

This is important, the integrity of the game is incredibly important, those that are deciding to rig the games think they are being smart not realizing that each instance of the game being rigged gives the people more and more reasons to not care about the league and the sport anymore, which in return reduces their salary as well, it is as if they do not understand this simple fact, after all what it is the point to watch a sport competition if you know that you cannot trust the results at all.

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Quote from: mirakal on May 10, 2021, 07:00:50 AM

Quote from: Lorence.xD on May 10, 2021, 05:01:58 AM

~

I don't know if it's not illegal in some countries, but in the Philippines, that is illegal as that would enter into the anti-game-fixing which is punishable by the Law. This is the specific law that I'm talking about. https://www.chanrobles.com/presidentialdecrees/presidentialdecreeno483.html

Quote

PRESIDENTIAL DECREE No. 483 June 13, 1974

PENALIZING BETTING, GAME-FIXING OR POINT SHAVING AND MACHINATIONS IN SPORTS CONTESTS

What I am talking about regarding the special kinds of bets are those that are made in between two people. Some kind of a personal bet and I don't think that it is illegal plus even if it it's illegal, it's not like they are going to enforce it always.

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Quote from: freedomgo on May 17, 2021, 04:05:23 PM

Quote from: qwertyup23 on May 17, 2021, 02:46:23 PM

This is just very heartbreaking to see and watch especially when your countrymen is involved.

Obviously, those players and teams deserve to be absolutely prohibited from participating in future events held. The fact that they had the audacity to fake and rig such game speaks so much about their attitude in real life. They really thought they can get away with those lame attempts of shooting and rigging the game. This is not only insulting to the game of basketball, but also insulting to people as it adds prejudice to the image of Filipinos, in general.

Quote from: mirakal on May 10, 2021, 07:00:50 AM

I don't know if it's not illegal in some countries, but in the Philippines, that is illegal as that would enter into the anti-game-fixing which is punishable by the Law. This is the specific law that I'm talking about. https://www.chanrobles.com/presidentialdecrees/presidentialdecreeno483.html

Quote

PRESIDENTIAL DECREE No. 483 June 13, 1974

PENALIZING BETTING, GAME-FIXING OR POINT SHAVING AND MACHINATIONS IN SPORTS CONTESTS

This is very interesting to see that Marcos saw the need to create for a law (with his powers as both the President and as a legislator) that addresses game fixing. This also gives a blanket of security against people who abuse game-fixing as it is prohibited by law.

Good that the law was already created but the question, was there people who got convicted because of game-fixing, I mean the law is useless if it's not strictly implemented, it's easy to make a law but hard to implement it if the government does not have the will or of the government itself is corrupt.

That's how bad the law in the Philippines, we have a lot of laws but we have a problem in implementing them. The justice system is slow, and that makes these people to be more confident in breaking the law as they know they can still get away with it.

Quote

was there people who got convicted because of game-fixing,

I can't remember a person was jailed for game fixing, suspenstion is the maximum punishment or ban in sport AFAIK.

STT

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They have to find and prosecute such instances, often the sport itself is best self governed but to have a law is fairly important so there is some bite to such investigations and in order to pass the case onto police and lawyers to prosecute with. Unfortunately its a very tempting prospect especially at the ground level of the game where many players may never progress as far and as easily as taking money to make a bet come true.
That said courts dont have the unique expertise that players themselves do, the greatest deterrent is knowing your own group of players know exactly what you are doing and can take action against you for anything decidable even outside a law court; a law court will require proof beyond reasonable doubt where as a trade body or player union can decide a verdict by majority and is far quicker to punish easily I think.
Its the sports own best interests to self govern and ensure corruption does not take root and reduce investment by lack of integrity and belief in game results, without this much damage can occur and foreign leagues will take priority over a country's self grown talent.

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Quote from: qwertyup23 on May 17, 2021, 02:46:23 PM

This is just very heartbreaking to see and watch especially when your countrymen is involved.

Obviously, those players and teams deserve to be absolutely prohibited from participating in future events held. The fact that they had the audacity to fake and rig such game speaks so much about their attitude in real life. They really thought they can get away with those lame attempts of shooting and rigging the game. This is not only insulting to the game of basketball, but also insulting to people as it adds prejudice to the image of Filipinos, in general.

Quote from: mirakal on May 10, 2021, 07:00:50 AM

I don't know if it's not illegal in some countries, but in the Philippines, that is illegal as that would enter into the anti-game-fixing which is punishable by the Law. This is the specific law that I'm talking about. https://www.chanrobles.com/presidentialdecrees/presidentialdecreeno483.html

Quote

PRESIDENTIAL DECREE No. 483 June 13, 1974

PENALIZING BETTING, GAME-FIXING OR POINT SHAVING AND MACHINATIONS IN SPORTS CONTESTS

This is very interesting to see that Marcos saw the need to create for a law (with his powers as both the President and as a legislator) that addresses game fixing. This also gives a blanket of security against people who abuse game-fixing as it is prohibited by law.

Good that the law was already created but the question, was there people who got convicted because of game-fixing, I mean the law is useless if it's not strictly implemented, it's easy to make a law but hard to implement it if the government does not have the will or of the government itself is corrupt.

qwertyup23

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This is just very heartbreaking to see and watch especially when your countrymen is involved.

Obviously, those players and teams deserve to be absolutely prohibited from participating in future events held. The fact that they had the audacity to fake and rig such game speaks so much about their attitude in real life. They really thought they can get away with those lame attempts of shooting and rigging the game. This is not only insulting to the game of basketball, but also insulting to people as it adds prejudice to the image of Filipinos, in general.

Quote from: mirakal on May 10, 2021, 07:00:50 AM

I don't know if it's not illegal in some countries, but in the Philippines, that is illegal as that would enter into the anti-game-fixing which is punishable by the Law. This is the specific law that I'm talking about. https://www.chanrobles.com/presidentialdecrees/presidentialdecreeno483.html

Quote

PRESIDENTIAL DECREE No. 483 June 13, 1974

PENALIZING BETTING, GAME-FIXING OR POINT SHAVING AND MACHINATIONS IN SPORTS CONTESTS

This is very interesting to see that Marcos saw the need to create for a law (with his powers as both the President and as a legislator) that addresses game fixing. This also gives a blanket of security against people who abuse game-fixing as it is prohibited by law.

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Quote from: stadus on May 17, 2021, 05:58:32 AM

Quote from: arwin100 on May 16, 2021, 06:20:30 PM

But I don't think we can check someones bank account easily since there is bank secrecy law and you cannot check this as easy as you think.

Yes there is a bank secrecy law, but in the event of an investigation, the authorities could ask permission from the court, and if the court agrees, they will be given access to the record for the purpose of investigation, so if these people are cheating and they have unexplained money in their bank account, it can be used against them and they'll accuse of the case.

That's easy once the court order this and nothing can be hide, those who are in the list of suspected participants are no longer safe in keeping their assets. The law will surely trace them.

The access will serve as a good key to find more about this rigging activities, looking for those involve individuals should be more easy.

Lets hope the implementations of all the possible rules will be use to trace more about this issue.

stadus

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Quote from: arwin100 on May 16, 2021, 06:20:30 PM

But I don't think we can check someones bank account easily since there is bank secrecy law and you cannot check this as easy as you think.

Yes there is a bank secrecy law, but in the event of an investigation, the authorities could ask permission from the court, and if the court agrees, they will be given access to the record for the purpose of investigation, so if these people are cheating and they have unexplained money in their bank account, it can be used against them and they'll accuse of the case.

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Quote from: Wawa2013 on May 16, 2021, 04:47:41 PM

Quote from: Silberman on May 16, 2021, 04:29:47 PM

Quote from: stadus on May 13, 2021, 04:50:40 PM

Agree, it's hard to convict these people as they will surely not gonna admit they are trying to rig the game. Though it's obvious, they will only be accused of a crime if there's enough evidence, now the question is, what evidence will they use against these players to prove they are rigging the game?

Taking into account that we live in the digital age and that most people do not take their security seriously there could be a lot of evidence that could suggest that whoever is suspected of rigging the game, whether the players, coaches or referees were guilty of it, we will have a lot of evidence to prove it, it is similar to what couples go through it now, finding that your partner was cheating was harder in the past as you needed eyewitnesses, but now the only thing people need to do is to grab their smartphone and take a look at their messages and they can quickly find out if their partner is cheating or not.

It is fortunate that the development of technology has developed rapidly, so it is easier to find evidence of people involved in rigging the game.
There are many ways that can be used to get evidence, usually tapping a smartphone is the most effective way to get evidence. Because usually
there will be conversations about rigging the game. Can also check a suspect person's bank account, if there is a suspicious flow of funds it can
be investigated further. So I believe everyone involved in rigging the game should be caught and given the appropriate punishment.

Well maybe this one is been minimize as the technology has been rising many hi-tech camera now are been introduce that's why may something like this has been caught, but if you are a audience then yeah smart phone video will really help unto this since it could make the league viral on what they are doing and impose some penalties if they are proven that they do so.

But I don't think we can check someones bank account easily since there is bank secrecy law and you cannot check this as easy as you think.

Wawa2013

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Quote from: Silberman on May 16, 2021, 04:29:47 PM

Quote from: stadus on May 13, 2021, 04:50:40 PM

Agree, it's hard to convict these people as they will surely not gonna admit they are trying to rig the game. Though it's obvious, they will only be accused of a crime if there's enough evidence, now the question is, what evidence will they use against these players to prove they are rigging the game?

Taking into account that we live in the digital age and that most people do not take their security seriously there could be a lot of evidence that could suggest that whoever is suspected of rigging the game, whether the players, coaches or referees were guilty of it, we will have a lot of evidence to prove it, it is similar to what couples go through it now, finding that your partner was cheating was harder in the past as you needed eyewitnesses, but now the only thing people need to do is to grab their smartphone and take a look at their messages and they can quickly find out if their partner is cheating or not.

It is fortunate that the development of technology has developed rapidly, so it is easier to find evidence of people involved in rigging the game.
There are many ways that can be used to get evidence, usually tapping a smartphone is the most effective way to get evidence. Because usually
there will be conversations about rigging the game. Can also check a suspect person's bank account, if there is a suspicious flow of funds it can
be investigated further. So I believe everyone involved in rigging the game should be caught and given the appropriate punishment.

Silberman

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Quote from: stadus on May 13, 2021, 04:50:40 PM

Agree, it's hard to convict these people as they will surely not gonna admit they are trying to rig the game. Though it's obvious, they will only be accused of a crime if there's enough evidence, now the question is, what evidence will they use against these players to prove they are rigging the game?

Taking into account that we live in the digital age and that most people do not take their security seriously there could be a lot of evidence that could suggest that whoever is suspected of rigging the game, whether the players, coaches or referees were guilty of it, we will have a lot of evidence to prove it, it is similar to what couples go through it now, finding that your partner was cheating was harder in the past as you needed eyewitnesses, but now the only thing people need to do is to grab their smartphone and take a look at their messages and they can quickly find out if their partner is cheating or not.

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Quote from: Questat on May 14, 2021, 03:38:59 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on May 13, 2021, 11:25:00 PM

Quote from: freedomgo on May 13, 2021, 03:57:44 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on May 13, 2021, 03:53:46 AM

Quote from: Obito on May 12, 2021, 06:21:28 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on May 04, 2021, 11:40:53 AM

Quote from: Obito on May 04, 2021, 06:31:29 AM

~snip

The rigging and the corruption will not just happen in the low-level games because, in a high-level game, those things can happen without us know for sure, especially if many people contribute to that games.
People who often commit corruption will not think of being honest because they feel comfortable doing that thing many times and will not stop before getting caught.
Even if they get caught, they will not feel guilty for doing corruption because they do not have a shame to the public.
Being honest is hard, but that is worth it to do.

Yes it will be present in a high level league but it will be really difficult to pull the rigging off as there are millions of eyes watching and definitely out of those millions, there will be thousands that will notice the irregularities.

We hope that will not get rigging but I am not sure about that because they can search for a way to still rigging.
Maybe it will be eradicated in the future, especially if the committee can be honest and have the integrity to make sure the tournament can clean from the rigging.
But even if they watch the match, they will not directly know if that is not be rigged because that will show clearly for the audience.

Rigging in games will not completely be wiped out, as long as there's money involved, there are really people who are ready to commit a crime just to make money, and rigging in sports does not come with big punishment, so they will not hesitate in doing this.

I guess you are right. But we can hope that rigging in games can be reduced in the future, especially if more officers can work honestly with their jobs.
Besides having honest officers, the punishment system can be applied for the corrupt officers not to try to rig the game because they will get in jail.
If that happens, the corrupt officers or staff will not try to rig the game because they will end their careers in jail.
It is about how they can have dedication, integrity, and honesty in their jobs to prevent that thing from happening.

They would work honestly if the law will be very strict. In a corrupt country, you can expect that people are also corrupt, maybe not all of them but people who are in the position to commit an illegal activity just to make more money. They are greedy because they know they would not be jailed or if they will, it will not be a long jail time for them. It should all start with the law, then implement it strictly and we will never hear this kind of news.

If the law is very strict, there is no way for the officers to corrupt from many things because the risk, if they get caught, will be hard for them as they can get heavy punishment from the court.
Yes, maybe we see many corrupt officers in the corrupt country because they think it is easy to corrupt and get the hot money from many things.
They take it easy about the punishment because they know that the law is not too strict and will corrupt them.
I think it should start from the personal to be honest and not corrupt, even for just small things, because that can make them feel it is okay if they corrupt for small things.

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Quote from: traderethereum on May 13, 2021, 11:25:00 PM

Quote from: freedomgo on May 13, 2021, 03:57:44 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on May 13, 2021, 03:53:46 AM

Quote from: Obito on May 12, 2021, 06:21:28 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on May 04, 2021, 11:40:53 AM

Quote from: Obito on May 04, 2021, 06:31:29 AM

~snip

The rigging and the corruption will not just happen in the low-level games because, in a high-level game, those things can happen without us know for sure, especially if many people contribute to that games.
People who often commit corruption will not think of being honest because they feel comfortable doing that thing many times and will not stop before getting caught.
Even if they get caught, they will not feel guilty for doing corruption because they do not have a shame to the public.
Being honest is hard, but that is worth it to do.

Yes it will be present in a high level league but it will be really difficult to pull the rigging off as there are millions of eyes watching and definitely out of those millions, there will be thousands that will notice the irregularities.

We hope that will not get rigging but I am not sure about that because they can search for a way to still rigging.
Maybe it will be eradicated in the future, especially if the committee can be honest and have the integrity to make sure the tournament can clean from the rigging.
But even if they watch the match, they will not directly know if that is not be rigged because that will show clearly for the audience.

Rigging in games will not completely be wiped out, as long as there's money involved, there are really people who are ready to commit a crime just to make money, and rigging in sports does not come with big punishment, so they will not hesitate in doing this.

I guess you are right. But we can hope that rigging in games can be reduced in the future, especially if more officers can work honestly with their jobs.
Besides having honest officers, the punishment system can be applied for the corrupt officers not to try to rig the game because they will get in jail.
If that happens, the corrupt officers or staff will not try to rig the game because they will end their careers in jail.
It is about how they can have dedication, integrity, and honesty in their jobs to prevent that thing from happening.

They would work honestly if the law will be very strict. In a corrupt country, you can expect that people are also corrupt, maybe not all of them but people who are in the position to commit an illegal activity just to make more money. They are greedy because they know they would not be jailed or if they will, it will not be a long jail time for them. It should all start with the law, then implement it strictly and we will never hear this kind of news.

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Quote from: freedomgo on May 13, 2021, 03:57:44 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on May 13, 2021, 03:53:46 AM

Quote from: Obito on May 12, 2021, 06:21:28 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on May 04, 2021, 11:40:53 AM

Quote from: Obito on May 04, 2021, 06:31:29 AM

~snip

The rigging and the corruption will not just happen in the low-level games because, in a high-level game, those things can happen without us know for sure, especially if many people contribute to that games.
People who often commit corruption will not think of being honest because they feel comfortable doing that thing many times and will not stop before getting caught.
Even if they get caught, they will not feel guilty for doing corruption because they do not have a shame to the public.
Being honest is hard, but that is worth it to do.

Yes it will be present in a high level league but it will be really difficult to pull the rigging off as there are millions of eyes watching and definitely out of those millions, there will be thousands that will notice the irregularities.

We hope that will not get rigging but I am not sure about that because they can search for a way to still rigging.
Maybe it will be eradicated in the future, especially if the committee can be honest and have the integrity to make sure the tournament can clean from the rigging.
But even if they watch the match, they will not directly know if that is not be rigged because that will show clearly for the audience.

Rigging in games will not completely be wiped out, as long as there's money involved, there are really people who are ready to commit a crime just to make money, and rigging in sports does not come with big punishment, so they will not hesitate in doing this.

I guess you are right. But we can hope that rigging in games can be reduced in the future, especially if more officers can work honestly with their jobs.
Besides having honest officers, the punishment system can be applied for the corrupt officers not to try to rig the game because they will get in jail.
If that happens, the corrupt officers or staff will not try to rig the game because they will end their careers in jail.
It is about how they can have dedication, integrity, and honesty in their jobs to prevent that thing from happening.

stadus

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Quote from: Oasisman on May 13, 2021, 07:37:20 AM

Quote from: mirakal on May 10, 2021, 07:00:50 AM

I don't know if it's not illegal in some countries, but in the Philippines, that is illegal as that would enter into the anti-game-fixing which is punishable by the Law. This is the specific law that I'm talking about. https://www.chanrobles.com/presidentialdecrees/presidentialdecreeno483.html

Quote

PRESIDENTIAL DECREE No. 483 June 13, 1974

PENALIZING BETTING, GAME-FIXING OR POINT SHAVING AND MACHINATIONS IN SPORTS CONTESTS

Good find of information right there.
I guess there are always a legal implications in every country that is related to sports crime.
Match fixing/rigging is a form of fraud and bribery for the officials involved.
But the investigation for this will take time, and it's going to be pointless If they'll dig deeper on this case to catch all those who are involved. So, the best option to make was to penalize the players and coaching staff by paying a specific amount of money, or worse termination of professional license and lifetime ban from the league.
Imprisonment might not be possible for this case.

Agree, it's hard to convict these people as they will surely not gonna admit they are trying to rig the game. Though it's obvious, they will only be accused of a crime if there's enough evidence, now the question is, what evidence will they use against these players to prove they are rigging the game?

Silberman

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Quote from: Obito on May 12, 2021, 06:21:28 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on May 04, 2021, 11:40:53 AM

Quote from: Obito on May 04, 2021, 06:31:29 AM

~snip

The rigging and the corruption will not just happen in the low-level games because, in a high-level game, those things can happen without us know for sure, especially if many people contribute to that games.
People who often commit corruption will not think of being honest because they feel comfortable doing that thing many times and will not stop before getting caught.
Even if they get caught, they will not feel guilty for doing corruption because they do not have a shame to the public.
Being honest is hard, but that is worth it to do.

Yes it will be present in a high level league but it will be really difficult to pull the rigging off as there are millions of eyes watching and definitely out of those millions, there will be thousands that will notice the irregularities.

One would think that rigging high profile games is more expensive and they will be right but this could give the idea it happens less frequently but I doubt it, scammers go after the money and the biggest amount of money they can get is without a doubt on fixing big games and the bigger the game the better, so while it may seem unlikely many high profile games are probably fixed every year, also it is not like those people need to fix hundreds of games, if they can fix just a few matches each year and bet everything on the desired result they could become way richer in no time at all.

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Quote from: mirakal on May 10, 2021, 07:00:50 AM

I don't know if it's not illegal in some countries, but in the Philippines, that is illegal as that would enter into the anti-game-fixing which is punishable by the Law. This is the specific law that I'm talking about. https://www.chanrobles.com/presidentialdecrees/presidentialdecreeno483.html

Quote

PRESIDENTIAL DECREE No. 483 June 13, 1974

PENALIZING BETTING, GAME-FIXING OR POINT SHAVING AND MACHINATIONS IN SPORTS CONTESTS

Good find of information right there.
I guess there are always a legal implications in every country that is related to sports crime.
Match fixing/rigging is a form of fraud and bribery for the officials involved.
But the investigation for this will take time, and it's going to be pointless If they'll dig deeper on this case to catch all those who are involved. So, the best option to make was to penalize the players and coaching staff by paying a specific amount of money, or worse termination of professional license and lifetime ban from the league.
Imprisonment might not be possible for this case.

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Quote from: traderethereum on May 13, 2021, 03:53:46 AM

Quote from: Obito on May 12, 2021, 06:21:28 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on May 04, 2021, 11:40:53 AM

Quote from: Obito on May 04, 2021, 06:31:29 AM

~snip

The rigging and the corruption will not just happen in the low-level games because, in a high-level game, those things can happen without us know for sure, especially if many people contribute to that games.
People who often commit corruption will not think of being honest because they feel comfortable doing that thing many times and will not stop before getting caught.
Even if they get caught, they will not feel guilty for doing corruption because they do not have a shame to the public.
Being honest is hard, but that is worth it to do.

Yes it will be present in a high level league but it will be really difficult to pull the rigging off as there are millions of eyes watching and definitely out of those millions, there will be thousands that will notice the irregularities.

We hope that will not get rigging but I am not sure about that because they can search for a way to still rigging.
Maybe it will be eradicated in the future, especially if the committee can be honest and have the integrity to make sure the tournament can clean from the rigging.
But even if they watch the match, they will not directly know if that is not be rigged because that will show clearly for the audience.

Rigging in games will not completely be wiped out, as long as there's money involved, there are really people who are ready to commit a crime just to make money, and rigging in sports does not come with big punishment, so they will not hesitate in doing this.

traderethereum

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Quote from: Obito on May 12, 2021, 06:21:28 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on May 04, 2021, 11:40:53 AM

Quote from: Obito on May 04, 2021, 06:31:29 AM

~snip

The rigging and the corruption will not just happen in the low-level games because, in a high-level game, those things can happen without us know for sure, especially if many people contribute to that games.
People who often commit corruption will not think of being honest because they feel comfortable doing that thing many times and will not stop before getting caught.
Even if they get caught, they will not feel guilty for doing corruption because they do not have a shame to the public.
Being honest is hard, but that is worth it to do.

Yes it will be present in a high level league but it will be really difficult to pull the rigging off as there are millions of eyes watching and definitely out of those millions, there will be thousands that will notice the irregularities.

We hope that will not get rigging but I am not sure about that because they can search for a way to still rigging.
Maybe it will be eradicated in the future, especially if the committee can be honest and have the integrity to make sure the tournament can clean from the rigging.
But even if they watch the match, they will not directly know if that is not be rigged because that will show clearly for the audience.

Obito

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Quote from: traderethereum on May 04, 2021, 11:40:53 AM

Quote from: Obito on May 04, 2021, 06:31:29 AM

~snip

The rigging and the corruption will not just happen in the low-level games because, in a high-level game, those things can happen without us know for sure, especially if many people contribute to that games.
People who often commit corruption will not think of being honest because they feel comfortable doing that thing many times and will not stop before getting caught.
Even if they get caught, they will not feel guilty for doing corruption because they do not have a shame to the public.
Being honest is hard, but that is worth it to do.

Yes it will be present in a high level league but it will be really difficult to pull the rigging off as there are millions of eyes watching and definitely out of those millions, there will be thousands that will notice the irregularities.

Topic: An obvious rigging of Sports. - page 2. (Read 2439 times)