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Topic: Analysis - page 301. (Read 941563 times)

full member
Activity: 239
Merit: 100
December 08, 2013, 03:04:26 PM
As another noob to TA I'd like to know as well.

I keep looking at this
https://www.tradingview.com/e/M1ZPd859/
and wondering what's wrong with it.

To me it says $3000 by Jan is too bullish but $3000 by July is too bearish.. Undecided
Interesting, thanks for posting

Looking at that chart and going from historical EW counts, couldn't it be argued that the summer 2012 event was too small/insignificant to be considered a wave 1, and thus the latest spike was of wave 3, meaning we will see yet another rally before everything goes to shit? Like so:



A noob's take on lucif's doomsday prediction, would really appreciate any input from the more experienced traders here
sr. member
Activity: 285
Merit: 250
December 08, 2013, 02:47:30 PM
There was also a pennant formed 12/5 to 12/6 ending at 1000 on bitstamp just before the drop to 540. It would therefore seem likely that the pennant forming now could end in another drop. If so and 540 is taken out that would be three waves down, which according to EW as I read it would confirm a bear market has begun. Then expect two waves up ending in a bull trap. The longer we stabilize at ~700 the better outlook for bulls IMO. Thoughts?
hero member
Activity: 722
Merit: 500
December 08, 2013, 01:52:08 PM
Due to waves I have bought back in at these beautiful $700 prices and await the final euphoric spike due to push us above $3000 in late January.
What makes you think this will happen?

As another noob to TA I'd like to know as well.

I keep looking at this
https://www.tradingview.com/e/M1ZPd859/
and wondering what's wrong with it.

To me it says $3000 by Jan is too bullish but $3000 by July is too bearish.. Undecided
full member
Activity: 239
Merit: 100
December 08, 2013, 01:09:16 PM
Due to waves I have bought back in at these beautiful $700 prices and await the final euphoric spike due to push us above $3000 in late January.
What makes you think this will happen? Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you are incorrect, I would just like to know your reasons for drawing this assumption. I'm still very much learning TA (all thanks to lucif btw, I really appreciate you showing me the world of black magic that is technical analysis!), but by my accounts wave 5 should be past now, and what we are witnessing is a crash with an estimated bottom of $400-500 (or if lucif is correct, and we are in for a 2011-style prolonged bear-market, then I guess towards $50-100, but I won't even begin to speculate on that).

I originally expected wave 5 to spike to $2.4-3.6k, but as you say, news are the gusts of wind that bring the domino pieces down, and while this time of year the wind came a bit early it still seems to have succeeded in its task.

I also see a pennant forming right now, which from what I've learned of traditional TA should mean we go down more. But then again for all I know it could mean trend reversal in the world of bitcoin Cheesy

legendary
Activity: 3766
Merit: 5146
Whimsical Pants
December 08, 2013, 12:09:17 PM
Ferdinand’s assassination was not the cause of WWI.
Due to waves I have bought back in at these beautiful $700 prices and await the final euphoric spike due to push us above $3000 in late January.

What if WWI has already begun?
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
December 08, 2013, 12:08:30 PM
Where is the money gonna go then.  Markets crash, gold temporarily down and picks up quite quickly.  When markets crash and value starts flying into USD for a brief time then I guess, asking Im new to market behavior just studying the 2008 crash for info.  Then the funds go where, I cant see why they would stay in USD, metals rallying seems reasonable, or are we looking at a situation where people are going to be trying to find a way to buy something to eat, which is the only type of situation that would seem to warrant btc crashing over the next couple years.

Im quite bullish on btc but like to keep an open mind, its obviously POSSIBLE that bitcoin crashes, and I understand that news follows large market cycles, and EW to a lesser extent.  Still, retroactive EW application to these first few years of btc, EW failure rate has got to be quite high given the circumstances, or at least, likely to be a lot less reliable then if were looking at 70 years of gold pricing...

I dont want to dismiss anything outright, and Masterluc you obv dont have to defend anything, youre giving your opinion so thanks for doing that at least.  Do you not think you should dig a bit deeper into the possibility you may be wrong though.  Even if youre out of btc for now.
newbie
Activity: 51
Merit: 0
December 08, 2013, 05:37:23 AM
I don't make trading decisions based on news )) Never, ever. News follow waves, not visa versa.

If you scroll back topic you will see first warning from me was previous higher high overlap from China on 01 Dec. Sold there about 70%. Second confirmation I got when price hit negative BB zone on China 05 Dec. This is outstanding. Sold all other coins on rebounce. Then hourly sma200 was failed on retest from bottom. This insured me completely. And I wrote about bubble end.

No  mystery here. TA and observance.


Wholeheartedly agree. As Lucif says, news follows waves. The predominant shapes found in speculative markets reveal themselves regardless of news, and news stories are but the tiny gusts of wind that knocks down the first domino. The chart patterns repeat themselves nearly perfectly regardless of the news that is the catalyst.

Coinbase lawsuit didn't cause the $140-$70 crash. It was due to happen. Gox ddos did not cause the $266-50 crash. It was building up for weeks. Only when the dominoes have been setting up in the correct position can they fall down perfectly from that gust of wind.

Ferdinand’s assassination was not the cause of WWI.


Due to waves I have bought back in at these beautiful $700 prices and await the final euphoric spike due to push us above $3000 in late January.
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1070
December 08, 2013, 04:25:52 AM
Have a look at 2008. Gold DOWN, stocks DOWN.



Sigh. Gold was down temporarily on the initial shock of the crisis. Gold did not fall anywhere close to the rate the stock market did. Gold corrected more quickly and then went up much more rapidly.

Later as the stock market improved steadily Gold reached it's top and started going back down.

How anyone can suggest precious metals are not an investment hedge against economic crisis is amazing.

N12
donator
Activity: 1610
Merit: 1010
December 08, 2013, 04:21:53 AM
Have a look at 2008. Gold DOWN, stocks DOWN.

sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
December 08, 2013, 03:26:29 AM
Masterluc.  I've never followed your trading advice and don't trade bitcoin, people here seem to enjoy you.

Just wondering, as someone who enjoys the mental exercise of the interplay, esp with bitcoin now in the fray, disregarding the EW count etc, fundamentally, why would you think bitcoin will sink with the markets when they inevitably crash likely in 2014, why wouldn't that have the opposite effect, and take bitcoin along with gold and silver potentially?
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1070
December 08, 2013, 03:16:14 AM
I am indifferent.  
Then just GTFO.

Don't be angry at me. You asked me if I was happy. I said I was indifferent. Meaning, your answer wasn't going to upset me.

All I asked for was a little clarification. I guess, from you answer, you don't have it or want to share it. Fine. Your choice. I wont ask again.
legendary
Activity: 938
Merit: 1013
December 08, 2013, 03:11:01 AM
I am indifferent. 
Then just GTFO.
legendary
Activity: 3108
Merit: 1531
yes
December 08, 2013, 02:42:07 AM
This will be the hardest days of Bitcoin. It must proof itself to become mainstream worthy or sink into the dustbin. Its going to be more about fundamentals the next period than speculation.
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1070
December 08, 2013, 02:14:26 AM
Long and painful decline. Are you happy?

I am indifferent. Are you just a trader? Or do you have a belief in the long term viability of btc? Why, not at least short the downtrend?
legendary
Activity: 938
Merit: 1013
December 08, 2013, 02:13:02 AM
Long and painful decline. Are you happy?
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1070
December 08, 2013, 02:09:33 AM
waveaddict, thanks for observations. Actually main trading decisions were on patterns you pointed to.

Masterluc,

I think I derailed the thread a bit. It was not my intention. My real intention was to get clarification on your long term projections for btc. Any you care to share in more detail?

edit:  I am also curious why you dont short on the downtrend. Especially if you believe it is a short/mid term trend?
legendary
Activity: 938
Merit: 1013
December 08, 2013, 01:58:23 AM
waveaddict, thanks for observations. Actually main trading decisions were on patterns you pointed to.
hero member
Activity: 574
Merit: 506
December 07, 2013, 07:15:06 PM
Quote
Because the institutions that I consider big money - like Goldman Sachs - dont even own bitcoin. Yet.
I have different information about GS and Bitcoin.

Ok. So where are we going from here?  Did you call $400 as the bottom of this down cycle? Or are you really holding fiat to 2016?
dude just stop, understand there people will have money and they need to lose a large portion of that money so the market can move on


Ok, I fear i am coming across of some sort of random antagonist in this thread. So let me clarify...

I have read back on all of masterluc's analysis and for the most part its highly impressive, cohesive and has tracked my sentiments much more time than not. So mad respect there.

However, his latest prediction that we are entering a multi-year bear market is based on the EW theory that he is extrapolating on a logarithmic chart since the beginning of BTC on the markets.

Luc's short term predictions are awesome.

But here is what I believe is happening with this long term prediction. First, we have to suppose that the EW theory is the correct theory to judge BTC long term growth chart. It very well may not be. In fact, there is a really good chance that its not. There is a strong argument that the EW theory for BTC and the S-curve adoption graph are incompatible with each other.

So, I think what is happening with masterluc, is that he is stuck to a EW theory. Now that theory says we are going down for a long time. This flies in the face of the adoption curve and what we are seeing in the REAL world with adoption, eco-system, etc. So Luc has to justify a possible scenario that would make this seemingly ridiculous theory seem plausible. So he answers to this that the stock market is a bubble and when that pops it will spiral effect BTC to the downside. Although this statement flies in the face of what we have seen from investment commodities during stock market down turns.

Now, I guess if the entire US system failed then BTC could be down for several years.

But suggesting that the US economy and/or the stock market will create the EW theory scenario is, in my opinion, simply a concoction of masterlucs imagination.

It´s funny, that you are trying to deconstruct thinking of another person to prove him wrong, when he was repeatedly proven right by the market. Unlike you.
hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
December 07, 2013, 07:02:32 PM
EW works very good for every market? false. People make false EW readings ALL THE TIME. Even the founder of EW theory says it does not work all the time.

And if you think Gold prices go up when there is confidence in the economy and stock market and go down during times of fear, then YOU need to read history a little bit more.

Making false EW readings does not mean that EW failed. If EW was straight forward and precise, it wouldn't be a theory.

I'm not even going to respond to your second statement because you clearly have not looked at a commodity chart in a long time. People flee commodities and stocks and flock towards cash and bonds during market downturns. The only exception would be during a highly inflationary period which we are not in.

ORLY? So gold did not go up during the last stock downturn and financial banking crisis?

No, gold fell from ~1000 to ~650 during the 2008 banking crisis.

Oil went from $150 to $40

Copper went from 4.2 to 1.2

etc...

"But that aside, I ask only this --> if we hit new ATHs for bitcoin within the next year, what does that say about Luc's wave theory?"

Nothing. EW helps traders gauge risk. All Luc is saying is that a very large motive count could be considered complete and that it would be foolish to not take, at least, some profit from a longer term viewpoint. Profiting from EW is all about expanding gains and limiting loses from likely and unlikely scenarios. EW is not about figuring out an absolute EW count and sticking with it no matter what. If a wave movement that contradicted lucs scenario occurred, luc would obviously change his analysis.  
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1070
December 07, 2013, 06:56:12 PM
EW works very good for every market? false. People make false EW readings ALL THE TIME. Even the founder of EW theory says it does not work all the time.

And if you think Gold prices go up when there is confidence in the economy and stock market and go down during times of fear, then YOU need to read history a little bit more.

Making false EW readings does not mean that EW failed. If EW was straight forward and precise, it wouldn't be a theory.

I'm not even going to respond to your second statement because you clearly have not looked at a commodity chart in a long time. People flee commodities and stocks and flock towards cash and bonds during market downturns. The only exception would be during a highly inflationary period which we are not in.

ORLY? So gold did not go up during the last stock downturn and financial banking crisis? And it hasn't been going down for a while now as the stock market hits ATHs?

I obviously wasn't talking about oil or corn or toothpaste. I was talking about precious metals.

And your explanation of EW not working is priceless. Since it has all these different waves there can be 1500 examples of how it fits or doesn't, leaving us to cherry pick which ones we give it credit for.

But that aside, I ask only this --> if we hit new ATHs for bitcoin within the next year, what does that say about Luc's wave theory?
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