ASICMiner BE300S Samples Arrived, <0.2W/G Achieved at Board Level - page 4.

Meech

hero member

Activity: 924

Merit: 1000

Quote from: wpgdeez on January 19, 2015, 01:51:58 PM

Quote from: philipma1957 on January 19, 2015, 07:48:59 AM

Quote from: jdany on January 19, 2015, 07:40:47 AM

I understand squeezing the competition.
We just witnessed the squeeze for the last 10 months.

When your next competitor is charging $342 for a product that is less efficient, why would you price your product at $250?
I don't think there are going to be enough rounds of these chips to keep weeding out competitors before you can enjoy a little harvesting.

Maybe I misunderstood your comment.
Maybe you were just saying you could lower your pricing down to $250 and still make money.

But, please. Cheap hashing power isn't going to do anyone any good.
Pricing war.
Difficulty into the stratosphere.
Investors make shit returns.

In a nut shell cheap mining gear killed off LTC. Gridseed blades were 3000 usd and ltc was 34 usd . gridseed blades dropped to 150 usd and ltc is 2 dollars.
If AM puts out a .33 watt 1.5th miner for 250 usd Shipped it will only serve to lower the price of BTC.
BTC diff-Price ratio is fucked up as it is. I can not see the btc network working much longer without demand for the coins lifting price up and over the 500 dollar mark.

Miners didn't kill the price of LTC the market did.

True. Little to none adoption of Ltc is hurting its value. But it is also designed to stay within btc ratio which it is.

wpgdeez

hero member

Activity: 728

Merit: 500

Quote from: philipma1957 on January 19, 2015, 07:48:59 AM

Quote from: jdany on January 19, 2015, 07:40:47 AM

I understand squeezing the competition.
We just witnessed the squeeze for the last 10 months.

When your next competitor is charging $342 for a product that is less efficient, why would you price your product at $250?
I don't think there are going to be enough rounds of these chips to keep weeding out competitors before you can enjoy a little harvesting.

Maybe I misunderstood your comment.
Maybe you were just saying you could lower your pricing down to $250 and still make money.

But, please. Cheap hashing power isn't going to do anyone any good.
Pricing war.
Difficulty into the stratosphere.
Investors make shit returns.

In a nut shell cheap mining gear killed off LTC. Gridseed blades were 3000 usd and ltc was 34 usd . gridseed blades dropped to 150 usd and ltc is 2 dollars.
If AM puts out a .33 watt 1.5th miner for 250 usd Shipped it will only serve to lower the price of BTC.
BTC diff-Price ratio is fucked up as it is. I can not see the btc network working much longer without demand for the coins lifting price up and over the 500 dollar mark.

Miners didn't kill the price of LTC the market did.

bbxx

hero member

Activity: 728

Merit: 500

cryptoshark

Quote from: CanaryInTheMine on January 19, 2015, 01:32:14 PM

Quote from: RoadStress on January 19, 2015, 01:16:20 PM

Quote from: windpath on January 19, 2015, 09:17:27 AM

That price would be appealing today, hate to ask the question with the impossible answer, but when will they be available?

April if I remember correctly!

Hopefully April, as depressed btc price can be a bit of an issue since factory needs to be paid in fiat

April or May

if price of btc will be <200$ this time
miners will be not sellable in large quantities
maybe for hobbist

newIndia

legendary

Activity: 2226

Merit: 1052

Quote from: philipma1957 on January 19, 2015, 07:48:59 AM

Quote from: jdany on January 19, 2015, 07:40:47 AM

I understand squeezing the competition.
We just witnessed the squeeze for the last 10 months.

When your next competitor is charging $342 for a product that is less efficient, why would you price your product at $250?
I don't think there are going to be enough rounds of these chips to keep weeding out competitors before you can enjoy a little harvesting.

Maybe I misunderstood your comment.
Maybe you were just saying you could lower your pricing down to $250 and still make money.

But, please. Cheap hashing power isn't going to do anyone any good.
Pricing war.
Difficulty into the stratosphere.
Investors make shit returns.

In a nut shell cheap mining gear killed off LTC. Gridseed blades were 3000 usd and ltc was 34 usd . gridseed blades dropped to 150 usd and ltc is 2 dollars.
If AM puts out a .33 watt 1.5th miner for 250 usd Shipped it will only serve to lower the price of BTC.
BTC diff-Price ratio is fucked up as it is. I can not see the btc network working much longer without demand for the coins lifting price up and over the 500 dollar mark.

I think it is a really bad idea to compare the BTC price dynamics with LTC or any other ALT. The factors determining BTC price is much more than just difficulty or the cost of miners, which is not the case for LTC.

CanaryInTheMine

donator

Activity: 2352

Merit: 1060

between a rock and a block!

Quote from: RoadStress on January 19, 2015, 01:16:20 PM

Quote from: windpath on January 19, 2015, 09:17:27 AM

That price would be appealing today, hate to ask the question with the impossible answer, but when will they be available?

April if I remember correctly!

Hopefully April, as depressed btc price can be a bit of an issue since factory needs to be paid in fiat

RoadStress

legendary

Activity: 1904

Merit: 1007

Quote from: windpath on January 19, 2015, 09:17:27 AM

That price would be appealing today, hate to ask the question with the impossible answer, but when will they be available?

April if I remember correctly!

MichaelBliss

hero member

Activity: 526

Merit: 500

Quote from: johnyj on January 19, 2015, 12:33:53 PM

That is what I'm worrying about, with endless price war, the one that can stand many years of loss is the one with bank loan support, so eventually banks will take over all the mining chips business

Unless the major chip makers make an alliance like OPEC, they will be take over by banks one by one, but unfortunately bitcoin is free to mine for anyone, not like OPEC countries which have geographic access limitation

In fact, knc is most likely to be already running on a large sum of bank loans, so that they can operate in a loss for at least a couple of years

Banks don't lend money to unprofitable businesses. It's not their job to support years of losses through loans and they certainly wouldn't do that for Bitcoin mining businesses - something which banks have yet to warm up to!

All of that aside, a loan is just that - it's meant to be repaid. What mining hardware manufacturer could afford to take a couple of years of losses, with any hope of repaying them (plus interest) from future profits?

VC funding is similar in this regard; it's not there to cover losses.

btcshiner

full member

Activity: 478

Merit: 125

I for one would like to be able to get good gear at that priced shipped. I really did not like the tube I bought and was glad that caused me to skip the prism.
This price point with stated hashing rate and power consumption might bring me back to try another AM product.

MrTeal

legendary

Activity: 1274

Merit: 1004

Quote from: philipma1957 on January 19, 2015, 07:48:59 AM

In a nut shell cheap mining gear killed off LTC. Gridseed blades were 3000 usd and ltc was 34 usd . gridseed blades dropped to 150 usd and ltc is 2 dollars.
If AM puts out a .33 watt 1.5th miner for 250 usd Shipped it will only serve to lower the price of BTC.
BTC diff-Price ratio is fucked up as it is. I can not see the btc network working much longer without demand for the coins lifting price up and over the 500 dollar mark.

There's no reason to think cheap mining gear would cause the price of BTC to go down. LTC might have gone down in price with cheap hardware, but that's more than likely a coincidence.

johnyj

legendary

Activity: 1988

Merit: 1012

Beyond Imagination

Quote from: jdany on January 19, 2015, 07:40:47 AM

I understand squeezing the competition.
We just witnessed the squeeze for the last 10 months.

When your next competitor is charging $342 for a product that is less efficient, why would you price your product at $250?
I don't think there are going to be enough rounds of these chips to keep weeding out competitors before you can enjoy a little harvesting.

Maybe I misunderstood your comment.
Maybe you were just saying you could lower your pricing down to $250 and still make money.

But, please. Cheap hashing power isn't going to do anyone any good.
Pricing war.
Difficulty into the stratosphere.
Investors make shit returns.

That is what I'm worrying about, with endless price war, the one that can stand many years of loss is the one with bank loan support, so eventually banks will take over all the mining chips business

Unless the major chip makers make an alliance like OPEC, they will be take over by banks one by one, but unfortunately bitcoin is free to mine for anyone, not like OPEC countries which have geographic access limitation

In fact, knc is most likely to be already running on a large sum of bank loans, so that they can operate in a loss for at least a couple of years

HarmonLi

sr. member

Activity: 350

Merit: 250

Honest 80s business!

Quote from: friedcat on January 18, 2015, 01:09:12 AM

24 chip (6 chip chain x 4) test result posted.
The mosfets and big capacitors are safely removed due to the constant workload of BE300.

Results:

273.60GH/s | 0.38W/G
176.64GH/s | 0.31W/G
155.04GH/s | 0.27W/G
118.56GH/s | 0.26W/G

With more accurate control on the variance between chips we could in principle gain less power consumption in advance.

Good to hear this update. The power draw is still higher than single-chip solutions, but looking good, still. Any news on the expected mass delivery of first BE300-final chips?

ujka

hero member

Activity: 630

Merit: 500

There is this post, not official, and I don't know who the poster is (tutorialvideo)
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.10123817

Quote

The expected date of first batch is April 10 to April 30. Potential delay will be notified three months ahead.
Hashrate per device and power consumption:
Normal mode - 1.0TH/s guaranteed. 1.6TH/s maximum. 0.25-0.27W/G.
Turbo mode - 1.2TH/s guaranteed. 2.0TH/s maximum. 0.30-0.33W/G.

this is a update

windpath

legendary

Activity: 1258

Merit: 1027

Quote from: friedcat on January 19, 2015, 03:16:07 AM

Quote from: philipma1957 on January 18, 2015, 11:30:18 PM

Okay 155 gh x .27 = 42 watts once you figure psu in 47 watts .

lets say 5x =

775gh at 235 watts on the low clock.
1365gh at 576 watts on the high clock .
this is a 120 chip design.

right now I can buy the sp20 for under 400 usd.

It will do 970gh at 450 watts

the s-5 will do 1300gh on overclock at 676 watts cost shipped right now is 342 usd if you have a coupon.

For a 120 chip AM to be worth buying it needs to come out soon and be cheap.
At least the board did decently (not .2 watts) more like .3 or .33 watts.
The sp20 can do .46 via underclock.

Price of 120 chip design should be in principle at 230-250 usd w/o the PSU.

If the mid-term future Bitcoin price allows significant quantity, the end-game price can be below 200 usd.

That price would be appealing today, hate to ask the question with the impossible answer, but when will they be available?

philipma1957

legendary

Activity: 4256

Merit: 8551

'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: jdany on January 19, 2015, 07:40:47 AM

I understand squeezing the competition.
We just witnessed the squeeze for the last 10 months.

When your next competitor is charging $342 for a product that is less efficient, why would you price your product at $250?
I don't think there are going to be enough rounds of these chips to keep weeding out competitors before you can enjoy a little harvesting.

Maybe I misunderstood your comment.
Maybe you were just saying you could lower your pricing down to $250 and still make money.

But, please. Cheap hashing power isn't going to do anyone any good.
Pricing war.
Difficulty into the stratosphere.
Investors make shit returns.

In a nut shell cheap mining gear killed off LTC. Gridseed blades were 3000 usd and ltc was 34 usd . gridseed blades dropped to 150 usd and ltc is 2 dollars.
If AM puts out a .33 watt 1.5th miner for 250 usd Shipped it will only serve to lower the price of BTC.
BTC diff-Price ratio is fucked up as it is. I can not see the btc network working much longer without demand for the coins lifting price up and over the 500 dollar mark.

valkir

legendary

Activity: 1484

Merit: 1004

Really nice Friedcat

Wondering do you have a estimated date for the release ? Grin

jdany

hero member

Activity: 644

Merit: 500

Inspired

I understand squeezing the competition.
We just witnessed the squeeze for the last 10 months.

When your next competitor is charging $342 for a product that is less efficient, why would you price your product at $250?
I don't think there are going to be enough rounds of these chips to keep weeding out competitors before you can enjoy a little harvesting.

Maybe I misunderstood your comment.
Maybe you were just saying you could lower your pricing down to $250 and still make money.

But, please. Cheap hashing power isn't going to do anyone any good.
Pricing war.
Difficulty into the stratosphere.
Investors make shit returns.

J4bberwock

hero member

Activity: 840

Merit: 1000

Quote from: friedcat on January 19, 2015, 03:16:07 AM

Quote from: philipma1957 on January 18, 2015, 11:30:18 PM

Okay 155 gh x .27 = 42 watts once you figure psu in 47 watts .

lets say 5x =

775gh at 235 watts on the low clock.
1365gh at 576 watts on the high clock .
this is a 120 chip design.

right now I can buy the sp20 for under 400 usd.

It will do 970gh at 450 watts

the s-5 will do 1300gh on overclock at 676 watts cost shipped right now is 342 usd if you have a coupon.

For a 120 chip AM to be worth buying it needs to come out soon and be cheap.
At least the board did decently (not .2 watts) more like .3 or .33 watts.
The sp20 can do .46 via underclock.

Price of 120 chip design should be in principle at 230-250 usd w/o the PSU.

If the mid-term future Bitcoin price allows significant quantity, the end-game price can be below 200 usd.

Does that mean you'll sell the chips for a sub 1200$ for 1000 price?
If the answer is yes, I may be interesed to buy a few samples at sample price when they will be available

friedcat

donator

Activity: 848

Merit: 1005

Quote from: philipma1957 on January 18, 2015, 11:30:18 PM

Okay 155 gh x .27 = 42 watts once you figure psu in 47 watts .

lets say 5x =

775gh at 235 watts on the low clock.
1365gh at 576 watts on the high clock .
this is a 120 chip design.

right now I can buy the sp20 for under 400 usd.

It will do 970gh at 450 watts

the s-5 will do 1300gh on overclock at 676 watts cost shipped right now is 342 usd if you have a coupon.

For a 120 chip AM to be worth buying it needs to come out soon and be cheap.
At least the board did decently (not .2 watts) more like .3 or .33 watts.
The sp20 can do .46 via underclock.

Price of 120 chip design should be in principle at 230-250 usd w/o the PSU.

If the mid-term future Bitcoin price allows significant quantity, the end-game price can be below 200 usd.

philipma1957

legendary

Activity: 4256

Merit: 8551

'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: friedcat on January 18, 2015, 01:09:12 AM

24 chip (6 chip chain x 4) test result posted.
The mosfets and big capacitors are safely removed due to the constant workload of BE300.

Results:

273.60GH/s | 0.38W/G
176.64GH/s | 0.31W/G
155.04GH/s | 0.27W/G
118.56GH/s | 0.26W/G

With more accurate control on the variance between chips we could in principle gain less power consumption in advance.

Okay 155 gh x .27 = 42 watts once you figure psu in 47 watts .

lets say 5x =

775gh at 235 watts on the low clock.
1365gh at 576 watts on the high clock .
this is a 120 chip design.

right now I can buy the sp20 for under 400 usd.

It will do 970gh at 450 watts

the s-5 will do 1300gh on overclock at 676 watts cost shipped right now is 342 usd if you have a coupon.

For a 120 chip AM to be worth buying it needs to come out soon and be cheap.
At least the board did decently (not .2 watts) more like .3 or .33 watts.
The sp20 can do .46 via underclock.

Since I have owned every AM miner I will buy it just to fuck with it. Hurry up with one.

pak13

member

Activity: 112

Merit: 10

Kudos on what looks to be a promising miner! Thank you for being transparent in the process.

Topic: ASICMiner BE300S Samples Arrived, <0.2W/G Achieved at Board Level - page 4. (Read 66456 times)