Bitfury: "16nm... sales to public start shortly" - page 25.

leowonderful

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Bitcoin FTW!

Quote from: dogie on March 29, 2016, 09:14:08 AM

Quote from: leowonderful on March 29, 2016, 09:06:30 AM

Quote from: dogie on March 29, 2016, 04:19:08 AM

Quote from: QuintLeo on March 29, 2016, 04:09:57 AM

I suspect Bitmain is having their current fire sale in the hope of getting their money back out of the BM1385 chips they've already bought before they become almost worthless due to next-gen miners blowing them out of the water - and I have some doubt that Bitmain was expecting Bitfury to go public on THEIR next-gen chip much less start pushing it to anyone OTHER than huge farms.
I get the strong impression Bitmain's answer to the new bitFury chip hasn't even taped out yet, or taped out recently enough they aren't going to have a new miner available before the halfing - leaving them rather behind the curve on what should prove to be THE most important ASIC generation in Bitcoin mining history (other than perhaps the original generation gear).

Pretty much none of this fits with previous Bitmain action or logic.

I still agree with QuintLeo, the BM1385 chip has been possibly the worst chip Bitmain has ever developed besides the BM1382 for ROI + profit.

You're saying that from a miner's perspective, not Bitmain's perspective though. Your finances and success are not their finances and success.

True, the S3 was a bandwagon miner (people heard about the success of the S1)and it was possibly one of their bestsellers. S5 not as much, because the bandwagon died when people heard about the S3's fail. S7 seems to be another bandwagon miner as the roi is crap, but people are buying it up pretty fast. Overall the popularity of Bitmain miners has remained stable as people are leaving and hopping on the bandwagon at a equal speed.

Finksy

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Quote from: dogie on March 29, 2016, 09:14:08 AM

You're saying that from a miner's perspective, not Bitmain's perspective though. Your finances and success are not their finances and success.

Then as a result, their success with this chip has come at the expense of their customers' losses (read: anyone who bought Batch 1-7). Class acts indeed...

dogie

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Quote from: leowonderful on March 29, 2016, 09:06:30 AM

Quote from: dogie on March 29, 2016, 04:19:08 AM

Quote from: QuintLeo on March 29, 2016, 04:09:57 AM

I suspect Bitmain is having their current fire sale in the hope of getting their money back out of the BM1385 chips they've already bought before they become almost worthless due to next-gen miners blowing them out of the water - and I have some doubt that Bitmain was expecting Bitfury to go public on THEIR next-gen chip much less start pushing it to anyone OTHER than huge farms.
I get the strong impression Bitmain's answer to the new bitFury chip hasn't even taped out yet, or taped out recently enough they aren't going to have a new miner available before the halfing - leaving them rather behind the curve on what should prove to be THE most important ASIC generation in Bitcoin mining history (other than perhaps the original generation gear).

Pretty much none of this fits with previous Bitmain action or logic.

I still agree with QuintLeo, the BM1385 chip has been possibly the worst chip Bitmain has ever developed besides the BM1382 for ROI + profit.

You're saying that from a miner's perspective, not Bitmain's perspective though. Your finances and success are not their finances and success.

leowonderful

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Bitcoin FTW!

Quote from: dogie on March 29, 2016, 04:19:08 AM

Quote from: QuintLeo on March 29, 2016, 04:09:57 AM

I suspect Bitmain is having their current fire sale in the hope of getting their money back out of the BM1385 chips they've already bought before they become almost worthless due to next-gen miners blowing them out of the water - and I have some doubt that Bitmain was expecting Bitfury to go public on THEIR next-gen chip much less start pushing it to anyone OTHER than huge farms.
I get the strong impression Bitmain's answer to the new bitFury chip hasn't even taped out yet, or taped out recently enough they aren't going to have a new miner available before the halfing - leaving them rather behind the curve on what should prove to be THE most important ASIC generation in Bitcoin mining history (other than perhaps the original generation gear).

Pretty much none of this fits with previous Bitmain action or logic.

I still agree with QuintLeo, the BM1385 chip has been possibly the worst chip Bitmain has ever developed besides the BM1382 for ROI + profit. S3s (BM1382) hardly profited with the difficulty rises even though the hop from BM1380 with more hashpower and efficiency was enormous. I knew this day was coming for bitmain, because there had to be a new chip coming out, and it just so happened to be before the halving. The only thing stopping Bitmain from using old S4 rackmounts and placing BM1385s on them and slapping on a "Antminer S8" sticker on is the fact that most people know:
1. the halving is coming
2. this gear is gonna be crap in 2 months.
BM1385s were a great improvement and it had to have happened eventually, so hopefully we can move past this and get BM1385s over with after the halving.

Finksy

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Quote from: sidehack on March 29, 2016, 08:15:33 AM

I know you like to make snappy retorts, but they're a lot more effective when you elaborate and actually explain the point.

Methinks he relishes in that time between single-sentence answers and annoyed condescending explanations to feel better than us peasants.

sidehack

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Curmudgeonly hardware guy

I know you like to make snappy retorts, but they're a lot more effective when you elaborate and actually explain the point.

dogie

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Quote from: QuintLeo on March 29, 2016, 04:09:57 AM

I suspect Bitmain is having their current fire sale in the hope of getting their money back out of the BM1385 chips they've already bought before they become almost worthless due to next-gen miners blowing them out of the water - and I have some doubt that Bitmain was expecting Bitfury to go public on THEIR next-gen chip much less start pushing it to anyone OTHER than huge farms.
I get the strong impression Bitmain's answer to the new bitFury chip hasn't even taped out yet, or taped out recently enough they aren't going to have a new miner available before the halfing - leaving them rather behind the curve on what should prove to be THE most important ASIC generation in Bitcoin mining history (other than perhaps the original generation gear).

Pretty much none of this fits with previous Bitmain action or logic.

QuintLeo

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People have finally wised up to the fact that the S7 is not going to achieve RoI unless you have VERY VERY cheap electric - and that has always been the case, and that fact just keeps getting worse and worse (unless the current lull in hashrate climb manages to last about 3 months LONGER than I currently expect).

I suspect Bitmain is having their current fire sale in the hope of getting their money back out of the BM1385 chips they've already bought before they become almost worthless due to next-gen miners blowing them out of the water - and I have some doubt that Bitmain was expecting Bitfury to go public on THEIR next-gen chip much less start pushing it to anyone OTHER than huge farms.
I get the strong impression Bitmain's answer to the new bitFury chip hasn't even taped out yet, or taped out recently enough they aren't going to have a new miner available before the halfing - leaving them rather behind the curve on what should prove to be THE most important ASIC generation in Bitcoin mining history (other than perhaps the original generation gear).

There's also the BW.com/LKetc second-gen chip for them to worry about, the question of WHEN Innosilicon will release the A3 (which in theory could be literally ANY DAY NOW)....

carlosmnk

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Quote from: krisgt30 on March 28, 2016, 09:16:43 AM

IMO Bitfury has completely missed the window on their opportunity to capitalize and take market share away from Avalon and Bitmain. These chips will now be insignificant by the time they are available to the public. By now, surely both competitors have had their hands on bitfury chips and have been able to perform r&d to come up with comparable chips. The spikes Antminer has seen in their pools signifies either an upcoming model ready for sale, or a massive test and flush of current inventory to make room for models about to hit live environment testing. I am fairly new to the bitcoin world, but have been in the IT space for 10 years and have seen this firsthand more times than I can count.

I think Bitfury wanted to delay the hashrate cracy rising last months (nov-dec), and they achieved their goal (most of us are waiting for them). Bitmain did a counter-attack against Bitfury lowering their S7 to a very cheap levels (so we are waiting new stuff). Meanwhile, Bitfury can recover their investment in their last MW mining centers (opened a few months before) and now they are ultimate the design of their last chip: a 16nm. At this point, we are waiting for the latest news. I'm thinking seriously to wait until the halving to make my next movement... Shocked

I still cannot understant why the hashrate is stable since last month or so... Huh

Nobody is buying the S7?? People is switching off their old miners??

Biodom

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Quote from: krisgt30 on March 28, 2016, 09:16:43 AM

IMO Bitfury has completely missed the window on their opportunity to capitalize and take market share away from Avalon and Bitmain. These chips will now be insignificant by the time they are available to the public. By now, surely both competitors have had their hands on bitfury chips and have been able to perform r&d to come up with comparable chips. The spikes Antminer has seen in their pools signifies either an upcoming model ready for sale, or a massive test and flush of current inventory to make room for models about to hit live environment testing. I am fairly new to the bitcoin world, but have been in the IT space for 10 years and have seen this firsthand more times than I can count.

This is correct, plus they are price dumping S7 and sucking out all demand if bitfury was to introduce something now.

krisgt30

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IMO Bitfury has completely missed the window on their opportunity to capitalize and take market share away from Avalon and Bitmain. These chips will now be insignificant by the time they are available to the public. By now, surely both competitors have had their hands on bitfury chips and have been able to perform r&d to come up with comparable chips. The spikes Antminer has seen in their pools signifies either an upcoming model ready for sale, or a massive test and flush of current inventory to make room for models about to hit live environment testing. I am fairly new to the bitcoin world, but have been in the IT space for 10 years and have seen this firsthand more times than I can count.

philipma1957

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'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: dogie on March 28, 2016, 02:15:17 AM

Quote from: dmwardjr on March 27, 2016, 08:43:31 PM

If you think about it, eBay will be inundated with S7's beginning in May. That's going to drive the price of them down tremendously. They may go as little as $300 each in May or June on eBay. I honestly think you stand a better chance of making more money buying bitcoin at current price and sell it close to the right time on a potential pump and dump.

Maybe, although we said exactly the same thing for S5s and those who bought them early and just held them made a killing even on moderate power costs. There is also the tertiary market of people with negligible power costs to whom S7s are still valuable and may create an artificial floor in S7 prices.

yes this is a good point. I am in that position with the solar array with buysolar.

We have 12 -16kwatts of 'free' power and we have 8 avalon 6's and 1 s-7 = 28th at 8.3 kwatts

so I could buy 4 s-7s now and just add 18th gets us to 46th at 14kwatts .

Then just mine until we get a deal on the newer gear I think I may buy the 4 s-7's in the next day or so.

mavericklm

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So we look for s9 because bitfury nada, nix, potato!?!?

Gyrsur

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Bitcoin Legal Tender Countries: 2 of 206

this is also a reason why mass adoption of Bitcoin is delayed. a lot of Bitcoin companies are NOT REPUTABLE.

dogie

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Quote from: dmwardjr on March 27, 2016, 08:43:31 PM

If you think about it, eBay will be inundated with S7's beginning in May. That's going to drive the price of them down tremendously. They may go as little as $300 each in May or June on eBay. I honestly think you stand a better chance of making more money buying bitcoin at current price and sell it close to the right time on a potential pump and dump.

Maybe, although we said exactly the same thing for S5s and those who bought them early and just held them made a killing even on moderate power costs. There is also the tertiary market of people with negligible power costs to whom S7s are still valuable and may create an artificial floor in S7 prices.

dmwardjr

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Technical Analyst/Trader

Quote from: AleScamHole on March 27, 2016, 07:22:25 PM

Quote from: GSpgh on March 27, 2016, 07:19:18 PM

Quote from: punin on January 17, 2016, 03:18:24 AM

Quote from: mavericklm on January 16, 2016, 09:38:49 PM

in the other thread it was April!

tomorrow it will be February!

Engineering chips are going to integrators already in February. So for a skilled and fast integrator I would say late march is possible. April is 100%.

late march isnt happening is it?

so april then? but no price or specs or anything yet?

or should i just load up on cheap s7 and forget this?

may be your best best, but don't count BMT to not have a trick up their sleeve before or close to halving (0.1 chips)

That's what I'm thinking as well. It's just too damn risky. I can see if you already have cheap power costs at $0.06 or less with little or no rent at all to pay and you already have the PSU's, PDU's and PCI-e cords with breakout boards. However, I would plan on selling them to people on eBay who are ignorant of a block halving approaching by the end of May or early June.

If you think about it, eBay will be inundated with S7's beginning in May. That's going to drive the price of them down tremendously. They may go as little as $300 each in May or June on eBay. I honestly think you stand a better chance of making more money buying bitcoin at current price and sell it close to the right time on a potential pump and dump. You can make 30 to 80 percent on your bitcoin purchase with less stress of paying for power, rent, peripherals, etc... that go along with purchasing more S7's.

That's my two cents...

EDIT: If Bitmain had them up for sale at $380 each after coupon, I think they would have better luck.

AleScamHole

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Don't you looooooove how offensive my name sounds?

Quote from: GSpgh on March 27, 2016, 07:19:18 PM

Quote from: punin on January 17, 2016, 03:18:24 AM

Quote from: mavericklm on January 16, 2016, 09:38:49 PM

in the other thread it was April!

tomorrow it will be February!

Engineering chips are going to integrators already in February. So for a skilled and fast integrator I would say late march is possible. April is 100%.

late march isnt happening is it?

so april then? but no price or specs or anything yet?

or should i just load up on cheap s7 and forget this?

may be your best best, but don't count BMT to not have a trick up their sleeve before or close to halving (0.1 chips)

GSpgh

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Quote from: punin on January 17, 2016, 03:18:24 AM

Quote from: mavericklm on January 16, 2016, 09:38:49 PM

in the other thread it was April!

tomorrow it will be February!

Engineering chips are going to integrators already in February. So for a skilled and fast integrator I would say late march is possible. April is 100%.

late march isnt happening is it?

so april then? but no price or specs or anything yet?

or should i just load up on cheap s7 and forget this?

dropt

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Quote from: Finksy on March 27, 2016, 01:56:15 PM

Quote from: bitwitt on March 26, 2016, 11:03:35 PM

Quote from: dmwardjr on March 25, 2016, 10:39:21 PM

Quote from: Biodom on March 25, 2016, 10:13:15 PM

Quote from: adaseb on March 25, 2016, 07:50:00 PM

I think Bitfury is busy with ETH mining instead of releasing their new chip.

bitmain is doing to bitfury the same what they did to Spondoolies: price dumping to drive a competitor out of the market, then jack up the price on their own next gen as they did with S7.

I believe you're right. I can get a ton of S7's right now with coupons at $482 each + shipping. It's tempting, for sure but other things are holding me back from pulling the trigger. I would hate to spend $80K on S7's, only to have next generation come out within two months and end up regretting my purchase.

My gut is telling me to keep my bitcoin and be prepared to dump close to the right time when the potential pump and dump arrives soon. Then buy back in at a good price after the dump to accumulate more bitcoin. I think I would be better off increasing my bitcoin wallet by potentially 30 to 80 percent than to buy rigs at the moment.

What do you guys think?

I think your 10 step plan to be a Bitcoin millionaire has FAILED. 4000 posts and nothing to show for it.

Why don't you post from your actual account what you think instead of hiding behind this one like a pathetic coward? All you do is follow David around posting bullshit that nobody cares for, grow a pair and grow up.

That account is older than yours. For all you know that is his actual account.

Finksy

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Quote from: bitwitt on March 26, 2016, 11:03:35 PM

Quote from: dmwardjr on March 25, 2016, 10:39:21 PM

Quote from: Biodom on March 25, 2016, 10:13:15 PM

Quote from: adaseb on March 25, 2016, 07:50:00 PM

I think Bitfury is busy with ETH mining instead of releasing their new chip.

bitmain is doing to bitfury the same what they did to Spondoolies: price dumping to drive a competitor out of the market, then jack up the price on their own next gen as they did with S7.

I believe you're right. I can get a ton of S7's right now with coupons at $482 each + shipping. It's tempting, for sure but other things are holding me back from pulling the trigger. I would hate to spend $80K on S7's, only to have next generation come out within two months and end up regretting my purchase.

My gut is telling me to keep my bitcoin and be prepared to dump close to the right time when the potential pump and dump arrives soon. Then buy back in at a good price after the dump to accumulate more bitcoin. I think I would be better off increasing my bitcoin wallet by potentially 30 to 80 percent than to buy rigs at the moment.

What do you guys think?

I think your 10 step plan to be a Bitcoin millionaire has FAILED. 4000 posts and nothing to show for it.

Why don't you post from your actual account what you think instead of hiding behind this one like a pathetic coward? All you do is follow David around posting bullshit that nobody cares for, grow a pair and grow up.

Topic: Bitfury: "16nm... sales to public start shortly" - page 25. (Read 108641 times)