Topic: Buy the DIP, and HODL! - page 518. (Read 122897 times)

Well, that could be true.
For now under $30k is my benchmark for doing DCA but it does not mean after $30k not buying.
Buying will still be done but in this case maybe I will pay more attention to conditions whether it's from some news or indeed the right momentum to see whether or not I buy there, of course, hopefully the right price in my opinion.
The difference may lie when the price before $30k I bought without seeing anything either in the chart or the increase and decrease that occurred but for after $30k I will obviously consider several aspects before buying it because it can be considered that it is a strategy that I have always prepared from the beginning.
When talking about "over did it" of course even though this is bitcoin which is definitely profitable but we don't need to do that. Even if it is possible but we don't need to risk everything on the investment made because this can be detrimental to yourself. As much as we can in setting aside some funds from the rest of our daily needs is clearly the best thing for this condition.

I am not very comfortable with people cheering for down.. but surely, I cannot argue with the idea of taking advantage of down  - to the extent that any of us is really capable of recognizing and appreciating that we are currently down... which I believe that we are currently down.. but there are a lot of folks out there expecting and hoping for more down.. which may well end up being their mistake if they are not ongoingly and regularly buying at these prices, even if they have tight budgets, like you are suggesting to be the case for a lot of people (I cannot really argue with that either)... There are some folks who can easily afford to buy $250 per week, but they may or may not be doing it, and there are others who might struggle to invest $100 per week, and there are even others who might really have difficulties to scramble up $10 per week to invest into bitcoin, so of course, any kind of ongoing and persistent BTC accumulation strategy has to account for how much cashflow can be made available to invest regularly, aggressively and without over doing it.. including attempting to appreciate if we are still in a dip, which surely many of us longer time bitcoiners do consider any prices near or below the 200-week moving average (which is currently slightly above $25k) to be low in terms of current levels and also in terms of historical BTC price levels.


It seems fair to consider anything below $30k to be relatively low, but of course, what is "relatively low" is a moving target, so you have to assess your own personal financial and psychological circumstances in order to attempt to figure out if you have enough BTC or not... by the time we get to supra $30k levels, presuming that we get there.  If you are a young person and you have an ongoing income, there still may be justifications to continue to buy BTC above $30k, and for sure, a lot of the matter also has to do with how much BTC that you have already stashed, and surely if you "over did it" then you would be more justified to "stop for a while", but some people run into mistakes because they stop too early or even that they start to sell.. which surely we are not really talking about selling in this thread... which selling does include different considerations including considerations that you have already overly stacked and are sufficiently in profits and perhaps a few other personal circumstances.


Well, also if any of us might be considering 4-10 years down the road or longer, then we should not be giving too many shits about the next ATH and the possibility of selling at that point.

Not that I am against selling BTC, but there can be ways to consider BTC investing in longer time horizons that go way further out than 10 years, and maybe 20 years or 30 years or more, but then at the same time, there is a balancing factor, and some folks may well NOT have that many years in order to consider how they are investing into BTC... and how much they might want to get worked up about what their level of profits might be in the short term.. even though there are likely ways that small amounts of BTC can start to be shaved off as the BTC price goes up, but without really selling large portions, but selling small amounts in order to attempt to improve risk management and to insure for possible downside corrections.. there are also ways to front load the stacking of bitcoin (which seems to be what several members here are suggesting) in order to buy BTC now on an ongoing basis and to buy BTC in what seems to be a dip in order that they may feel that they do not need to buy as much when the BTC price goes up (presuming that it goes up) so that even if they are not selling on the way up, if the BTC price goes up, they would theoretically be allowing their fiat stash amount to build up in order that they would have more cash to buy on dips, in the event that the BTC price severely dips in the future.

It's never too late, but maybe they weren't buying on the low end. But what's the problem, I don't think there is because you and others can buy bitcoins anytime and at any price you want. As much as possible, that's just the best advice I have to share, but you have to be hold it and accept the risk for your investment to pay off in the long term.

$23K is not too late, the reason is we are still very far from bitcoin's previous ATH where currently bitcoin still maintains its decline at -66%.

Although a little late but it never hurts to enter at $23K, why did I say too late? because we know that before the current price increase, bitcoin had been hit by negative issues and the effects of an increase in interest rates by the FED, and causing the price of bitcoin to go down and even fall below $19K, but I actually see many of the members here are hesitant to enter the market at that time and many of us even believe that the price will go down more, but in fact now the price of bitcoin is actually returning to the bull path even though it's still not strong, but it's better to enter the market to buy bitcoin now and keep it for a period of time certain as you say before returning to regret when the price goes higher.

Agree with what you say. Even though in this case there are some people who say that it is starting to be high now, looking at the current price condition of $23k it is still very much worth it to buy even though some people might be waiting on the grounds of Buy the dip.

I personally still make my purchases and stick with the initial stance by continuing to buy every month until the price hits the new $30k I will stop there.
Regardless of whether there will be a decline or not I'm not too worried about it because indeed if there is still a decline it is also a blessing because I can buy more but if the price continues to rise then I will not waver with my choice until $30k is exceeded.

I present another debate. We may not know when the current bear market might last, BUT we know when the Golden Opportunities are to Buy the DIP, and HODL. We plebs have small/limited capital. It will definitely better for us if the time for Golden Opportunities are longer, giving us more time to accumulate Bitcoin.

You are correct that sometimes if you are just buying bitcoin regularly, you might not miss the extra money that you are putting into bitcoin, and after many years, the seemingly small amounts add up to a lot of value that you put in, and hopefully the value that you put in has either retained its value equal to other possible places that you could have invested it or even better if the value that you put in has gone up in value.. and going up in value has tended to be the case in bitcoin and seems that there are pretty decently high odds that the value will continue to go up in bitcoin.. so long as you are not overly anxious in regards to the timeline.

Another thing could be that you have a somewhat erratic cashflow, and you realize that you tend to have between $10 to $100 per week that you could invest into bitcoin, but some weeks the cashflow is very tight and other weeks you have some thing (goods or services) that you feel that you need to buy in a timely manner.. so you have discretion regarding whether to invest every single week.. and maybe while you continue to be somewhat focused on building the size of your BTC stash, you consciously make those kinds of allocation decisions on a weekly basis.. but as your stash gets larger and larger and larger  with the passage of time (hopefully), then you might decide that you only need (or want) to make those allocation decisions every two weeks or maybe once a month.

When I first got into bitcoin in late 2013, I am pretty sure that the whole of my first year in bitcoin, I was making allocation decisions on a weekly basis, but sometimes I would buy several times in the same week, even though I had an allowance that I had already set myself for each week, and I did consciously want to spend all of my self-imposed allowance every single week, and after the first year (late 2014 and going into early 2015) I was a bit less anxious about the whole matter about feeling that I needed to accumulate BTC every single week, and I relaxed how much I was focusing on making sure that I was accumulating BTC every single week. 

It seems also that even though I was more relaxed in 2015, 2016 and maybe the first month or two of 2017, I was still paying quite a bit of attention to bitcoin but not necessarily buying every single week - even though I might have had looked at my budget and considered the question of whether to buy more BTC every single week during that time.  It seems that there is a certain amount of personal discretion and variance in terms of even considering how you might be feeling that week, and let's say that you already spent more than 18 months accumulating BTC, and then you have several weeks that you have not bought any BTC, so you have some cash that has built up in your "allocated to bitcoin (or whatever else) savings" that is coming in on a weekly basis... and maybe that amount is $300 to $500 and so then you ask yourself whether you are going to buy bitcoin with that or if you are going to spend it on something that you had been considering for a while.... You know that you can do whatever you want, and you realize that you have already spent more than 18 months accumulating BTC, so you are not feeling pressure to use that money to buy BTC.. There is a certain level of liberation that comes with being empowered to decide to do whatever it is that you want with that extra $300 to $500 that you have had building up.. because partly you already know that your BTC stash is good, and you may well have already allocated higher amounts to BTC than you had thought that you were going to allocate, and because of the way that you overall investment portfolio is building (including the BTC portion), you have brought yourself more flexibility in regards to what you want to do with an extra $300-$500 that you might have sitting in your bank account... .. and maybe you contemplate the matter for a while, and you decide to do nothing with it, and with that decision to do nothing with the $300 to $500 extra that you have in your bank account, you realize that in 2 weeks, that amount is likely to be $500 to $700 and then you can reconsider at that time, and when you do decide to deploy all or some of the amount that you built up,  you do not even need to spend it all in one direction,  you can divide it up into portions that you allocate in 2 or 3 directions.


I don't disagree with any of this, but it is might be good to point out that someone who is new to investing might be in a very good position to allocate all of his/her investing to bitcoin, because s/he does not have any other investment.. and maybe s/he had been living with his/her parents, and just starting to work on building financial independence, so in that sense, when someone is starting to invest, there is not necessarily any need to diversify for the mere sake of diversification..    Fuck that nonsense.   There is nothing wrong with starting out with one investment (which could be bitcoin), and then working towards diversification once the one investment builds up in value..   Of course,  I am not suggesting 100% bitcoin, because there should always be an emergency fund and a contemplation of cashflow versus expenses in order to know how much can be invested into bitcoin, and bitcoin may well end up being the ONLY investment that someone starting into building his/her investment portfolio might have.

Of course, people might come to bitcoin with already existing investments such as owning index funds, property, commodities, collections of items, and surely some of the things that they own might not have a lot of value or maybe they have a part interest in some items that is not clear, but they can still attempt to calculate the value of those items as part of their quasi-liquid investment portfolio.. so let's say for example, you have a parent that owns a business and you are the ONLY heir to the business, and the business is not worth very much.. maybe it has products and it has debt, and if your parent dies, it will cost money to liquidate the business or to decide to continue to run it, and even though you might not be able to completely count the business in your ownership, you might still be able to assign a value to your ownership interest in the business that is greater than zero...but you might still want to be conservative in terms of how much value to assign to yourself because the value has not yet transferred to you and you have some difficulties even knowing for sure how much it is worth... You think that maybe the value of your interest in the business might be worth $10k, but you decide to be conservative and ONLY assign yourself a $3k value in that business in terms of your own accounting of the value of your currently existing quasi-liquid investment portfolio.

Of course, you have quite a bit of latitude in terms of attempting to evaluate what you believe is a fair value of your investment portfolio, and you have a lot of latitude in terms of figuring out how much you want to start out by allocating to bitcoin, and I start out with 1% to 25% as a starting range, just to help with attempting to give some kind of guidance that has some ways to make it concrete, so of course, there can be personal justifications that might cause my numbers to be wrong for any particular person, and even in the last 2-3 years that I have decided to up my recommendation from 1% to 10% to the new range of 1% to 25%, there is a bit of intentionality on my behalf in terms of suggesting that it is my belief that after March 2020, many of us should have come to realize that bitcoin is a much better investment (with a stronger investment thesis) as compared to pre-March 2020 times.  There have been some revelations about the world that more strongly show the strength of bitcoin's investment thesis, but also the fact that bitcoin went up in value, there may be some justification to being more aggressive/assertive in terms of making sure that a sufficient/adequate stake is established into bitcoin.. and another thing is that I changed my base investment number from $10 per week to $100 per week... and I know that my actual substantive number is a bit western salary oriented, so I am not trying to suggest that non-western salary people need to employ that $100 per week level of aggressiveness, and perhaps for some non-western salary people something between $10 to $50 might be the same..

Let's say that a western oriented person might have a base yearly salary that is in the $30k to $48k territory, and maybe a non western oriented person might have better odds of having something like $12k to $18k, so that would mean that the quantity of their disposable/discretionary income is quite likely going to be smaller too.. since they have less to work with, but surely life style choices can also affect how much disposable/discretionary income that any person can generate based on how they might choose to spend their money and even what kinds of activities that they choose to do in order to either spend their money or to increase their disposable/discretionary income levels.


I cannot disagree with any of this, yet I will still say that if you have a monthly paycheck, you are likely not buying all your monthly expenses for the whole month (especially something like food and transportation costs), even though you might have some expenses that are due on a monthly basis, so you can choose how much to allocate to BTC, and let's say that you have $2k per month coming in, and you have around $1k in known costs such as housing, food, transportation and entertainment, so you have a pretty decent idea about your budget and that you have an extra $1k that you can choose to invest.  Depending on where you are at in your bitcoin investment/allocation journey, you still might want to consider dividing whatever is your extra income into weekly parts... and yeah for sure you do not have to invest all of that right away, and maybe you divide some of it as DCA and some of it is held for buying on dips and some goes into replenish or build your cash emergency funds, and maybe you want to make sure that buy $50 per week of bitcoin no matter what, but you don't really want to spend the whole remainder of the $800, so you save that for buying on dips, other investments or even to make sure that you do not have extra expenses for the remainder of the month, but then once the new paycheck comes in, then you have an ability to have another $1k that is available, so any of the $800 from the earlier month could be spent towards the end of the month.. and my main point, is that you should feel that you have a lot of discretion, including the discretion to buy all of your BTC allowance with the whole $1k at the beginning of the month..

If you believe spending all of the $1k to buy BTC as soon as it comes in is the better choice for you, then no one is going to stop you from doing what you believe is best for you and your situation.... even though I had already stated that for many years I have been projecting out my cashflow and expenses for way more time in advance, and these days, I tend to project my cashflow and expenses out 16 to 24 months, I largely maintain a decently sized cushion within my cashflow projection, so that I can see how spending now or even projected spending one or two months in advance affects the remainder of the cashflow and the maintenance of the cushion... 

The short term cushion (such as 1-3 months) is way more important than the longer term cushion, because frequently we can find ways to iron out our cushion if we see that we have short-falls that are appearing out further than 3 months, but if we have shortfalls that are appearing in shorter timeframes of less than 3 months, we might start to feel that we are unduly putting stress on ourselves (financially and psychologically), so the way that I tend to spend money on BTC (or even to allocate to BTC) is based on having cushions that go beyond my flowing amounts, and sure those can be seen as spendable weekly or monthly.. or spendable immediately upon resolving that the cushion has been sufficiently/adequately calculated for the coming 3 months... and I am not even suggesting that cashflow/expenses might not change in the short term - and even after I had already decided to buy BTC with a certain quantity of money, then all of a sudden I find out that I have some extra expenses or maybe that I miscalculated some aspects of my cashflow, so for me usually the mistakes or the changes are not big enough to cause stress even though I might have to be more careful about my spending until the strained period passes.

That is the point so the statistics still brought us back to the origin of bitcoin cryptography and the final idea of invest what you can let go of for a king time, which is the message we have been preaching concerning Bitcoin as an investment which is better in the long-term basis rather than short-term market speculations.

-Considering Bitcoin's long-term gains that out the way its short-term speculation and how we are more than halfway price to the last all-time high, should be taken as an unpredictable asset so any amount you can effort a long-tetermmrm basis is ok.

Of course, $23K is a lower price than last year and also its last ATH.
We are still on a dip for 1 year TF where the percentage decline is still around 40%. Meanwhile, when compared to the last ATH, we are currently still on a dip with a higher percentage where it reaches 66%.

If you are looking to invest long term I think $23K is one area you can consider. Even if it's sideways, in my opinion the potential for short-term profit, for example for a 30-day period, is still very possible.

The fact that we don't have the knowledge of when the present bear market cycle will last and also when the next all time high will be even though there is speculation of the next all-time high after the next bitcoin haven when that will be uncertain but since the block size and reward will reduce it a pointer that Bitcoin will become more scarce thereby forcing it to supply to be limited this will ultimately increase the value.

-talking about buying the dip, the present bitcoin price is still considered a dip price for many who are big bag holders and that are ready to invest in Bitcoin for the long term.

Ser, I'm merely suggesting that the younger the person is and/or the less responsibility a person has, he/she can choose to take more risks in his/her life because a younger person, with no responsibility other than himself/herself can recover faster and be ready to take on another venture if the Golden Opportunity presents itself.

Truly successful people who have made it financially tell young plebs like us to take risks, and make mistakes while we are young, because TIME will never turn back. Probably because when a person reaches 40, it would be harder to take risks, especially if he/she has mouths to feed and people to shelter.

I have a responsibility to myself as well as my family because I'm not single anymore. I have several family members under my responsibility so I really had to adjust my budget to meet my family's needs and investment. It's not uncommon for me to save less in different months so that my budget doesn't seem consistent with the same amount at the end of each month.

I don't mind the amount of fiat I can save in a month on investments, but I do tend to think about how to stay consistent during inflation where I have to really manage my spending. Your idea tends to be true for those who are single, but for me and several other people who have dependents must be in a different case.

It means that I have taken advantage of the opportunity where in 2022 when the price was below $ 20k I continued to do my best to buy BTC because no one knows when the opportunity will come again so the way I did it was quite effective where I now have bitcoins in stock this feeling has started to grow for the accumulation that has been built so far, even though now the price is above $23K I think it is still good enough to buy regularly because I have made sure and am ready not to be greedy in the sense of buying bitcoin with all the money I have of course not in that way, there is a side where when you get money then there is a part to buy BTC.

Maybe beginners need from the initial 1% to 5% for their portfolio in bitcoin they initially try and after there is a reaction where beginners know the potential in BTC better then they will definitely increase their portfolio.
Unlike me who can be said to have known bitcoin for a long time I have to have an individual principle with 50% and above as my portfolio in BTC and some diversification in several other assets as a reserve to be more stable again, I will not be aggressive in this matter because I know my financial cash flow is not that big coming in but at least with a little bit of a hill it would be better than an aggressive word but pressing us to get into all of BTC, I need to manage according to my financial management.

Yeah DCA is the best way to accumulate BTC for a long time and be able to manage our finances regarding the income generated, and more clearly this will be more comfortable if we can't afford a week then we can do it monthly or even every two months depending on what we want but I think a lot people do it on a monthly basis where they after receiving a salary at the end of the month.

Psychologically it must be maintained and financially it must be stable to continue to measure inputs and expenses, all of which must be managed properly and find out where the weak points are if you are unable to influence it.

I in this context I do not agree because it will affect our mentality, if we risk more than the money we are willing to lose (whatever your condition & situation), I think it will cause panic and as we know when panic is within it will destroy the investment strategy that we have made so well.

Cite the report you mean to strengthen your reference, I don't know which report is the reason you speak like that, so that what you are talking about can be understood by other people, at least so you don't talk nonsense about the pope you mean. We all here know the potential future of bitcoin but in this thread we discuss what kind of strategy is listed in the title of this thread, everything related to and influencing the buying of bitcoins that we discuss in this thread.
So you need to pay attention to what is meant and what is related to the thread that the other person created before you reply

You (Wind_FURY) seem to be making a different point than indah rezqi, and maybe you are making a kind of argument about semantics in regards to 1) how to define what is "more than you can afford to lose" and 2) what kinds of measures can be taken (sacrifices made) in order to be more aggressive/assertive in regards to "buying the dip" and also saving on expenses.

My own definition of "more than you can accord to lose" would involve entering into some kind of an arrangement in which you have failed/refused to sufficiently cover your expenses or ending up having to sell some bitcoin at a later date because you over-did it... or maybe there is some other asset that you had not wanted to have to sell, but you are forced into such selling because you had bought to much bitcoin and had not sufficiently prepared.

By definition if you plan to move in with your parents or you choose to ONLY eat Ramen soup for the next year, then you are choosing in advance to take such measures; however, on the other hand if you end up getting forced to move in with your parents because you "over did it" or you have to sacrifice your diet because you "over did it" then those are not planned in advance.

Sure, there are several things that people might be "willing to allow" as their "back up plan" in case shit hits the fan.. and their investment moves against them, but by definition, personally, I would not consider those to be acceptable (even though others are going to be willing to make such sacrifices).. So, sure, there may well be some definitional quibbling going on here, and also sometimes life choices regarding how prudent (and preparing for the future) that anyone might be willing to be could end up with quite differing consequences, and some people might not end up homeless because of how much they chose to gamble, but they may well end up having a way less comfortable life later on in life because they over did their levels of aggressiveness and/or lack of preparedness at earlier times in life.

We can also rationalize where we got in life, such as if we are having to struggle with dead end jobs in our 50s, 60s and even into our 70s, while maybe some others start out in similar places and with similar resources, but pretty much have a life of relaxation in their 50s, 60s and 70s...

So there are ways to describe your situation in ways in which you had been wiling to live with the consequences (and even say "no regrets"), yet there are also ways to sufficiently prepare so that you are not taking those kinds of excessive risks.. which brings us back to definitional quibblings in regards to what seems to be excessive risks, and at one point in time, we do not necessarily know the consequences of our excessive risks.. which kind of gets me back to points that I made in my other post (and you responded to it)... hahahahaha.  All points (and all threads) are related.  Go figure.  


So fucking what?

What are you personally doing in regards to your supposedly positive views about bitcoin besides merely trolling one-liner bullshit platitudes about how bitcoin is a great investment.  

What are you adding to the conversation?  

Tell us about yourself and your own BTC accumulation practices.

Go on.  Give us something concrete to work with and about yourself (by the way, there is no need to give up any OPsec in order to describe these kinds of matters in regards to your relationship with bitcoin).  When did you first hear about bitcoin?  Have you ever bought any?  Do you think that the ONLY way to get involved in bitcoin is to get involved in bounty seeking programs or shitcoins or from your own point of view and practices/plans are there possibly other ways to get into bitcoin?  

Yes, This "Golden Opportunities" Bitcoin (BTC) has just taken everyone into the next bull market. The displacement from the accumulation zone mentioned in previous reports was the result of more than two months of accumulation by some whales. This is why I am also very confident about the future of bitcoin.

If you're single, with a stable job/a second job, with no other responsibilities for anyone else but yourself, then it could be considered that you can risk more than what you're willing to lose, especially when the current situation of the market is presenting us those "Golden Opportunities". It's also probably good to move back in with your parents temporarily to save more fiat to buy Bitcoin.

 

Long-term projections for bitcoin investing are very reasonable, but always set an amount you can afford to lose. Bitcoin is the best alternative to consider no matter what budget we have, but one shouldn't 100% go for it without considering about the risks. Bitcoin's long-term performance as an investment asset is to be expected to be good and work as we expect, but since the government is its main enemy we really have to recognize that they have the ability to prohibit us from investing or trading in the future.

Those are just some of the risks I think, but still bitcoin is the best investment choice compared to many other assets out there.

Yes, you could describe your investment target in terms of a timeline such as 4-10 years or longer, or you could choose certain price points that you would sell, such as you would sell certain portions of the BTC that you accumulated at various price points.

You could choose to invest large amounts that might even be 1% to 25% of your total investment portfolio (that is if you have an investment portfolio), and that would likely be a long-term oriented approach.

You could also decide to authorize yourself a certain budget (such as $1k or something), and then you have entry and exit points, and surely some of us longer term bitcoin investors consider the short term investors and traders to potentially be missing out on the possibilities of long term and life changing value.. and so it could take a while to convince regular people to consider bitcoin in terms of really having long term and life changing value potential - which is also probably part of the explanation that likely less than 1% of the total worlds population is invested into bitcoin, and even though we have hoarders and gamblers in bitcoin ,there are also a lot of folks who are already in bitcoin, but since they are a wee bit of a scaredy cat about bitcoin they are likely underinvested because they really have not studied bitcoin enough or come around to figuring out bitcoin's value proposition and/or figuring out some ways in which to strategize a long term investment approach that they are comfortable to employ in light of their own personal financial and psychological circumstances.

If you figure out some kind of a long-term bitcoin strategy, and even if you ONLY buy small amounts over the next 4-10 years, such as $100 per week or maybe even a smaller amount if you cannot afford $100 per week, like $10 per week, then perhaps if you are able to secure your bitcoin, you will end up seeing that your bitcoin performed quite well compared to anything else that you had invested in.. even if you might consider something like allowing the whole matter to play out for 20 years.. that is if you were to have such a potentially long investment timeline.

Because we don't know whether bitcoin can go down again or not, it is a dilemma if we wait for a decline to that point and at any time, if that doesn't happen, it will be a regret because we didn't buy it now. However, in this case greed can indeed dominate our minds, therefore it is important to control greed properly so that it does not interfere with the plans made in investing.

Of course, always buying during a downturn will not always be profitable, but in this case I need to underline if the strategy is carried out by short-term investors because they will always sell their bitcoins at the end of their investing session and take some for necessities even in a loss , but if for long-term investors such potential losses are not visible, let alone in a situation like now where bitcoin is far from its ATH.