Topic: Claw Machines: a category of gambling? - page 2. (Read 1247 times)
Would've categorized claw machines as gambling if only the machines weren't rigged or anything like that, and it just so happens that this is what's happening with claw machines, it doesn't give you the reward no matter how good you are because the claw has been rigged by the owner, it's not the same at how the casinos rig their games, they rig it based on mathematical principle and that the odds are always against you even in the natural state of things but in claw machines, the rigging is not natural, it's created by someone so you think that you can win something from it. Maybe that aspect of claw machine can be debated as the reason why it's considered gambling but I'm going to stand by it and say it's not.
I've played the claw machine before. To me, they're entertainment machines. It's not right to call them gambling machines. But for some people, these machines turn into addiction like gambling. Some people spend a lot of money on these machines. I don't want to call them gambling machines, but I know that for some people they are no different from gambling.
Also, I have a memory of these machines. One day I played one of these machines to win a little pink bear for my girlfriend. I didn't win, but my girlfriend played after me and she won. I don't know if these machines are for entertainment or gambling, but I lost both times.
I do not know, to me those machines are clearly a form of gambling even if the people behind them may argue against it, and my reasoning is very simple, if you use your money to buy a product and you have a 100% chance of getting your product or your money back in the case there was an issue with it, then that is a simple transaction, however if you use your money for the possibility of getting something, whether that something is a monetary reward or some other prize, then regardless of whether your skill matters or not, this is a form of gambling. Also, I have a memory of these machines. One day I played one of these machines to win a little pink bear for my girlfriend. I didn't win, but my girlfriend played after me and she won. I don't know if these machines are for entertainment or gambling, but I lost both times.
I've played the claw machine before. To me, they're entertainment machines. It's not right to call them gambling machines. But for some people, these machines turn into addiction like gambling. Some people spend a lot of money on these machines. I don't want to call them gambling machines, but I know that for some people they are no different from gambling.
Also, I have a memory of these machines. One day I played one of these machines to win a little pink bear for my girlfriend. I didn't win, but my girlfriend played after me and she won. I don't know if these machines are for entertainment or gambling, but I lost both times.
Also, I have a memory of these machines. One day I played one of these machines to win a little pink bear for my girlfriend. I didn't win, but my girlfriend played after me and she won. I don't know if these machines are for entertainment or gambling, but I lost both times.
I mean we are splitting hairs here. Is playing arcade games for tickets where you can hand in for prizes gambling? Probably not. If you play a game and win a prize it's just that, a game. I mean I guess if there is money in the claw machine possibly but I would consider that more a game in which you can win something if played correctly. There is no real other player, or house.
In addition to this, Even 3rd party game providers like slot games doesn’t disclose their source code for the games which is why there’s no way to verify the fairness of the game. They are considered as gambling not because fairness is available but rather people risk money in exchange for a chance to win.
Talking about fairness, it is something that is difficult to achieve in gambling and people will do anything to win. Both game providers and players have something in common because what they are looking for is victory, so verifying fairness is something that is difficult for us to achieve.
People who gamble don't look at the fairness factor, but as you said, they think that risking money in gambling can give them a chance to win. Despite the fact that gambling is more about luck and not every time we are in a favorable condition.
Absolutely correct mate, fairness in gambling isn't distributed uniformly. All casino and gambling always make the winning possibility minimal, so that they can make more profit while giving you the hope of making huge wins. One of the best advertising strategy use by gamble developers is the ability to make available huge wins that can be won using a small stack, but in real sense it would be very difficult to make that win, and that's why gamblers keep trying their lucks.The company behind the claw machine is smart for making a eye catching design, usually for more of the youths. However luck is just the basic explanation to the outcome, of any gambling game and not skill.
if they would be getting sufficient amount into those coins that would be put up into the slot. Its business as we do all know on which this kind of program will really be that just normal. People would really be trying out their luck with these machines at the same time that they would really be having that thrill on the time that they would really be trying to get those stuffs on the machine.Its true that the primary target out of these machines are those young people who are really that believing that they could easily get those stuffs without any problems and this what makes money with those operators.
In addition to this, Even 3rd party game providers like slot games doesn’t disclose their source code for the games which is why there’s no way to verify the fairness of the game. They are considered as gambling not because fairness is available but rather people risk money in exchange for a chance to win.
Talking about fairness, it is something that is difficult to achieve in gambling and people will do anything to win. Both game providers and players have something in common because what they are looking for is victory, so verifying fairness is something that is difficult for us to achieve.
People who gamble don't look at the fairness factor, but as you said, they think that risking money in gambling can give them a chance to win. Despite the fact that gambling is more about luck and not every time we are in a favorable condition.
Absolutely correct mate, fairness in gambling isn't distributed uniformly. All casino and gambling always make the winning possibility minimal, so that they can make more profit while giving you the hope of making huge wins. One of the best advertising strategy use by gamble developers is the ability to make available huge wins that can be won using a small stack, but in real sense it would be very difficult to make that win, and that's why gamblers keep trying their lucks.The company behind the claw machine is smart for making a eye catching design, usually for more of the youths. However luck is just the basic explanation to the outcome, of any gambling game and not skill.
True, many people don't know that the grip strength can be tweaked, so that it is loose for x amount of rounds.
This way even if the player aligns it perfectly with the target, the prize will fall prematurely before being delivered to the hole.
So two factors play and contribute to the winning chance: (1) grip strength and (2) positioning. Basically, whether or not the player is skilled, there is still randomness in the game.
This way even if the player aligns it perfectly with the target, the prize will fall prematurely before being delivered to the hole.
So two factors play and contribute to the winning chance: (1) grip strength and (2) positioning. Basically, whether or not the player is skilled, there is still randomness in the game.
Exactly. I personally don't think that the grip strength can be tweaked in real time, but I'm sure the thing is designed the way that the grip is very weak and can easily lose the prize at any moment.
they said that the claw force would be strong enough when it reached the specified number of coins.
So it will be quite strong when many coins are inserted, but it will only happen in 1 chance.
Everything has been arranged in such a way that it is not easy to pinch a doll or other types of claw machines.
claw grip strength would really be that somewhat changes on the time that it would really be that getting that sufficient coin amount. Its impossible that they wont really be setting out that kind of threshold
because if there's no one would be able to get then it would really be surely considered to be a scam machine.
Is it considered gambling? For me it would really be that rather to be that an entertainment thing than on gambling. You do know that you are paying up something to get a reward like stuffed toys or other
items but of course there would really be a catch.
Absolutely 100% they are. Just like most gambling the house is stacked against you, and they're cheating, but you do have the chance to win money, even bitcoin lol..like - https://www.youtube.com/shorts/bIQmooFB9fg and another lol https://www.youtube.com/shorts/SwgqQXZ2BtE
Even those coin push machines are considered a form of gambling, and you can even win bitcoin doing so with these lol ( though I don't condone the cheating)- https://youtu.be/Y-cGfaPUXNQ?si=AtVeW94A4CuwBGL8 and a few others https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5_sbDsreyM , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xhBq0sbHOI
No different than playing bingo, or credit card roulette when out to eat for dinner with friends...if you're risking something with the potential to win more, break even or lose, it's all a gambling game.
Even those coin push machines are considered a form of gambling, and you can even win bitcoin doing so with these lol ( though I don't condone the cheating)- https://youtu.be/Y-cGfaPUXNQ?si=AtVeW94A4CuwBGL8 and a few others https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5_sbDsreyM , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xhBq0sbHOI
No different than playing bingo, or credit card roulette when out to eat for dinner with friends...if you're risking something with the potential to win more, break even or lose, it's all a gambling game.
True, many people don't know that the grip strength can be tweaked, so that it is loose for x amount of rounds.
This way even if the player aligns it perfectly with the target, the prize will fall prematurely before being delivered to the hole.
So two factors play and contribute to the winning chance: (1) grip strength and (2) positioning. Basically, whether or not the player is skilled, there is still randomness in the game.
This way even if the player aligns it perfectly with the target, the prize will fall prematurely before being delivered to the hole.
So two factors play and contribute to the winning chance: (1) grip strength and (2) positioning. Basically, whether or not the player is skilled, there is still randomness in the game.
Exactly. I personally don't think that the grip strength can be tweaked in real time, but I'm sure the thing is designed the way that the grip is very weak and can easily lose the prize at any moment.
they said that the claw force would be strong enough when it reached the specified number of coins.
So it will be quite strong when many coins are inserted, but it will only happen in 1 chance.
Everything has been arranged in such a way that it is not easy to pinch a doll or other types of claw machines.
In addition to this, Even 3rd party game providers like slot games doesn’t disclose their source code for the games which is why there’s no way to verify the fairness of the game. They are considered as gambling not because fairness is available but rather people risk money in exchange for a chance to win.
Talking about fairness, it is something that is difficult to achieve in gambling and people will do anything to win. Both game providers and players have something in common because what they are looking for is victory, so verifying fairness is something that is difficult for us to achieve.
People who gamble don't look at the fairness factor, but as you said, they think that risking money in gambling can give them a chance to win. Despite the fact that gambling is more about luck and not every time we are in a favorable condition.
~snip~
It's not a game of skill, many people in this thread said it, and I agree with them. It's an illusion that the creators of this game bore in mind when they were making it. It would be a game of skill, more or less, if after you captured the prize it were guaranteed that you'll get it. Unfortunately, we all know that more often than not it's not the case.
It's not a game of skill, many people in this thread said it, and I agree with them. It's an illusion that the creators of this game bore in mind when they were making it. It would be a game of skill, more or less, if after you captured the prize it were guaranteed that you'll get it. Unfortunately, we all know that more often than not it's not the case.
I have seen people winning prizes at some claw machines, so it is possible.
Of course some machines might be rigged, as every machine is different. But in theory, it should be possible to win.
No one is saying winning is not possible
I'd myself won on claw machines couple of times in the past. I was just saying "it's not a game of skill". Slots are also not a game of skill, but that doesn't mean you can't win on them. I won more than $200 several times staking only 20 cents, and some lucky people win millions.~
True, many people don't know that the grip strength can be tweaked, so that it is loose for x amount of rounds.This way even if the player aligns it perfectly with the target, the prize will fall prematurely before being delivered to the hole.
So two factors play and contribute to the winning chance: (1) grip strength and (2) positioning. Basically, whether or not the player is skilled, there is still randomness in the game.
Exactly. I personally don't think that the grip strength can be tweaked in real time, but I'm sure the thing is designed the way that the grip is very weak and can easily lose the prize at any moment.
It is not considered to be gambling because the element of fairness is absent due to the owner of the machine being able to adjust its sensitivity any time they wish. Customers have no way of knowing beforehand that it is rigged against them, you just have to assume that it might be. There is no way to come up with odds of actually getting a prize, but the odds can be zero in some cases.
For games of luck, participants are betting with variables that they are familiar with. With these rigged games, however, you are going in entirely blind, not knowing whether you are flushing money away.
For games of luck, participants are betting with variables that they are familiar with. With these rigged games, however, you are going in entirely blind, not knowing whether you are flushing money away.
Its actually a game of luck, we cannot completely take that for gambling because it has many things that point at the way its been played not to be like that of gambling games, as you have pointed out, it is just for the people to all try their best and make use of the opportunity to se if they can win any physical material, money or items from them by playing or trying their luck.
In addition to this, Even 3rd party game providers like slot games doesn’t disclose their source code for the games which is why there’s no way to verify the fairness of the game. They are considered as gambling not because fairness is available but rather people risk money in exchange for a chance to win.
Anything that involves risking money for a chance to gain is considered as gambling even though it’s probably fair or not. Actually, being rigged games is more gambling since it’s more hard or impossible to win on this game depending on the casino setup.
-cut-
Personally i don't see them as gambling because they are proven to be rigged many times, so i would classify them as scams.
Personally i don't see them as gambling because they are proven to be rigged many times, so i would classify them as scams.
But you have heard stories that casinos scam their customers. With surprised KYC before withdrawal for example. Yet I believe you do gamble anyway. Even if claw machines are scam, they are kind of a soft scam
They wont scam you for thousands or millions. And you will get a prize in the end with some persistence, while it will take hell of a time and luck to win jackpot even if you are super persistent. As a light form of gambling, claw machines does not require special licenses to operate. What I say, that even if they are scam, nobody cares as long as they get their plushie Because every company that's handling money for their customers is a financial institution, and financial institutions are obligated by law to follow regulations, if they themselves want to keep on cashing out their profits.
Pure, no fiat-money crypto casinos have avoided these regulations in the past, because crypto wasn't regulated. But now when transactions are becoming taxable in majority of the 1st world, that changes.
Smaller casinos might flow under a radar, and not every casino is so strict about it, as KYCing everyone is a costly operation. But always expect a KYC, like you were (not) expecting spanish inquisition.
It is not considered to be gambling because the element of fairness is absent due to the owner of the machine being able to adjust its sensitivity any time they wish. Customers have no way of knowing beforehand that it is rigged against them, you just have to assume that it might be. There is no way to come up with odds of actually getting a prize, but the odds can be zero in some cases.
For games of luck, participants are betting with variables that they are familiar with. With these rigged games, however, you are going in entirely blind, not knowing whether you are flushing money away.
For games of luck, participants are betting with variables that they are familiar with. With these rigged games, however, you are going in entirely blind, not knowing whether you are flushing money away.
Its actually a game of luck, we cannot completely take that for gambling because it has many things that point at the way its been played not to be like that of gambling games, as you have pointed out, it is just for the people to all try their best and make use of the opportunity to se if they can win any physical material, money or items from them by playing or trying their luck.
Yeah, I agree with this.
There is a legal distinction between games of just randomness and games of skill.
If you have randomness then it's basically a casino and you need a license, but if it is a skill based game, then it's just a form of entertainment, like a fair for example.
There is a legal distinction as you mentioned.
There is a legal distinction between games of just randomness and games of skill.
If you have randomness then it's basically a casino and you need a license, but if it is a skill based game, then it's just a form of entertainment, like a fair for example.
There is a legal distinction as you mentioned.
Why then loot boxes does not require license, when they all are about randomness?
At amusement parks I saw claw machines with candies where "each game is a win" rule was set. Even though it makes random almost zero, there is a timer and little kid is given 99 seconds to grab his prize. Not every kid is agile and in stress situation can get a candy in 99sec. Can this be considered as gambling? Does this require license? What about underaged gambling?
~snip~
But, it's an arcade game or at least that's how it has been in the legal terms which is why everyone is allowed to play using claw machines especially kids.
We can say the claw machine is rigged and all but still it needs skill to press down the button at the right second to get the rewards. Moreover it's not addictive that we correlated with the term gambling.
But, it's an arcade game or at least that's how it has been in the legal terms which is why everyone is allowed to play using claw machines especially kids.
We can say the claw machine is rigged and all but still it needs skill to press down the button at the right second to get the rewards. Moreover it's not addictive that we correlated with the term gambling.
Yeah, I agree with this.
There is a legal distinction between games of just randomness and games of skill.
If you have randomness then it's basically a casino and you need a license, but if it is a skill based game, then it's just a form of entertainment, like a fair for example.
There is a legal distinction as you mentioned.
...I do not really see how claw machines could be classified as an arcade, in a regular arcade you put a coin in the machine and then you play for as long as your skill allows it, claw machines do not really follow this formula and are way closer to what you could see in a slot machine, so at least to me they are without a form of gambling and one that I do not find to be entertaining at all, while at the same time the prizes that you can get are often stuff that you would not even buy directly on your own.
But, it's an arcade game or at least that's how it has been in the legal terms which is why everyone is allowed to play using claw machines especially kids.
We can say the claw machine is rigged and all but still it needs skill to press down the button at the right second to get the rewards. Moreover it's not addictive that we correlated with the term gambling.
Do you consider this a category of gambling game? What are the chances on long run? Skills matter, or do you have to be lucky, nevertheless?
Never! This cannot be considered gambling because certainly the factor that exists for you to win the prize is not skill: It is just the machine's profit.
As long as the machine has not received a pre-defined amount of bets, it will not release your prize even if you are super skilled.
Many ignorant people also talk about "strategies" to win, but this is a myth.
The only way to win money is to sit for a few hours near a machine and just watch other people playing... find out what the machine's pattern is (amount of bets before releasing the prize), count the moves and be ready to bet only when the next prize release is close.
Ok!? This is not a gambling game.
In some other country, claw machine game is considered as illegal game, they even ban it as it is considered as gambling. It just that we are used to see it most of the time as one of the activities to give enjoyment to kids especially in malls, amusement parks, etc, but the fact that it has an element of gambling and can also be addictive for some, this should be considered as gambling.
Do you consider this a category of gambling game? What are the chances on long run? Skills matter, or do you have to be lucky, nevertheless?
Never! This cannot be considered gambling because certainly the factor that exists for you to win the prize is not skill: It is just the machine's profit.
As long as the machine has not received a pre-defined amount of bets, it will not release your prize even if you are super skilled.
Many ignorant people also talk about "strategies" to win, but this is a myth.
The only way to win money is to sit for a few hours near a machine and just watch other people playing... find out what the machine's pattern is (amount of bets before releasing the prize), count the moves and be ready to bet only when the next prize release is close.
Ok!? This is not a gambling game.
A few months ago, I even found it in my brother's shop.
Claw machines like this have been set so that claws are not easy to grip dolls, so more experiments will be done to try to take dolls.
Believe it or not, according to some people or according to technicians, there are several techniques that can be done such as swinging the claw and then dropping it or waiting until the claw time ends, or before the claw drops automatically.
I tried everything but some did fail, but sometimes with the swing technique I can pick up some dummy with a lot of trying.
If this is said to be gambling, maybe it could be like that because there will be an addictive effect to keep trying and trying again until you get a doll.
Claw machines like this have been set so that claws are not easy to grip dolls, so more experiments will be done to try to take dolls.
Believe it or not, according to some people or according to technicians, there are several techniques that can be done such as swinging the claw and then dropping it or waiting until the claw time ends, or before the claw drops automatically.
I tried everything but some did fail, but sometimes with the swing technique I can pick up some dummy with a lot of trying.
If this is said to be gambling, maybe it could be like that because there will be an addictive effect to keep trying and trying again until you get a doll.
Claw machines come under the arcade games category not really under gambling but for the sake we can say we spent a penny to take that call. Claw machines are rigged but users who has skills know how to make use of it, like you said swinging technique is one of the effective method to get the prize but we don't really play for the prize but just to experience it right?
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