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Topic: (Closed) Butter Bot!: Premier Bitstamp, and BTC-E EMA Trading Platform (Closed) - page 22. (Read 274808 times)

member
Activity: 111
Merit: 10
Wassup?
Ok.  I got a few coins that I've been holding for about 8-9 months now and I'm just starting to realize how much money I could have made if I'd been trading the whole time.  I've just got the trial version of the Butter Bot software and I'm gonna load a small amount into it during the trial period until I can figure out how it works and how to maximize profits.  I'm pretty good at predicting market trends and reading charts, but I just don't have the time anymore.  In the current stagnant market environment that we're in right now can someone give me some settings to start with.  I read the ones that were recommended when I got the bot, but those were written when market volatility was thru the roof. 

The portion I really don't understand is the buy and sell thresholds.  Is that the maximum amount of my balance that can be risked for the given period?  Someone who's been using this thing for a while help me out here please. 

Peace,

Readyrmca

In order for butterbot to execute an order, the EMAs have to cross and stayed crossed for two consecutive intervals. So let's assume you are using a 1 hour time frame. For a buy order to execute, the fast EMA will need to cross over the slow EMA and be higher than the slow EMA at the close of hour one and hour two. If you set a tick offset, say -10 minutes for instance, then the fast EMA will have to be higher than the slow EMA at 10 minutes before the hourly candle closes for two consecutive candles.

Buy threshold 1 is the first threshold. Say you set it at .15%. The fast EMA will have to cross up over the slow EMA AND with a value .15% or higher than the slow EMA, else it is considered meaningless.
Buy threshold 2 is the second threshold. Say it is set at .3%. The fast EMA will have to cross up over the slow EMA AND with a value .3% or higher than the slow EMA, else it is considered meaningless.

Buy threshold one must be satisfied followed by buy threshold 2 in order to execute an order.

Say your EMAs cross, but the fast EMA is only .12% higher than your slow EMA. Your first threshold won't trigger. If price then shoots up the next hour, and at the next candle close your fast EMA is .35% above your slow EMA, it won't execute a buy order yet, because your first threshold wasn't triggered by the initial cross of only .12%. This cross of .35% will satisfy your first threshold and if the next candle closes above .3%, the bot will then execute a buy order.

I hope this helps.

I know I did not ask this question but it really helps a lot for me. Thanks.
Actually I had a follow up question, if you don't mind. So is this the reason why many people have negative values as threshold one (like -50), so then this threshold will always be met, and then it just looks at threshold 2? Can you also please help me understand why using a large negative value is necessary, why can we not just use zero, for example.
Thanks again.

I use 0 for a buy threshold 1 value and .05 as a sell threshold 1 value, so I'm not 100% sure about the negative value.

However, the likely scenario is that a high negative value, say -50% will negate the principal of having a first buy threshold because the EMA's are virtually always going to be within 50% of each other. Therefor, threshold 1 is constantly met, and you could assume that if the EMA's cross your buy threshold 2 value, that the order will execute within one interval after the cross as opposed to taking two intervals after the cross if you had a "0" or positive value for buy threshold 1.

The reason for using a high negative instead of using 0 would be to execute orders with more sensitivity. Personally, I'm a fan of two thresholds to rule out quick jumps.

This would be the logical explanation, however, I have no experience using negative values, so maybe somebody else can chime in here if they have experience using negative values in their trading.

Well I'm using -50 on both threshold1 and my bot doesn't trade since 3 days ago... is it normal?

What is your second threshold, what time interval are you using, are you currently holding BTC, USD, or both, and what exchange are you using? These factors will all determine whether or not it is normal that your bot hasn't traded in 3 days.

Taking out the first value doesn't have much effect on how often your bot will trade, but more on WHEN your bot will trade. It's very rare that having a positive threshold 1 will result in a trade not executing while having a negative threshold 1 will result in triggering a trade. The difference is that the trade will execute one interval earlier with a high negative threshold.

The only time having a high negative threshold 1 would result in a trade while having a positive or neutral threshold 1 wouldn't is a situation of a flash crash that rebounds before two intervals pass.

Im using this now
And i'm currently holding USD

hero member
Activity: 715
Merit: 500
Ok.  I got a few coins that I've been holding for about 8-9 months now and I'm just starting to realize how much money I could have made if I'd been trading the whole time.  I've just got the trial version of the Butter Bot software and I'm gonna load a small amount into it during the trial period until I can figure out how it works and how to maximize profits.  I'm pretty good at predicting market trends and reading charts, but I just don't have the time anymore.  In the current stagnant market environment that we're in right now can someone give me some settings to start with.  I read the ones that were recommended when I got the bot, but those were written when market volatility was thru the roof. 

The portion I really don't understand is the buy and sell thresholds.  Is that the maximum amount of my balance that can be risked for the given period?  Someone who's been using this thing for a while help me out here please. 

Peace,

Readyrmca

In order for butterbot to execute an order, the EMAs have to cross and stayed crossed for two consecutive intervals. So let's assume you are using a 1 hour time frame. For a buy order to execute, the fast EMA will need to cross over the slow EMA and be higher than the slow EMA at the close of hour one and hour two. If you set a tick offset, say -10 minutes for instance, then the fast EMA will have to be higher than the slow EMA at 10 minutes before the hourly candle closes for two consecutive candles.

Buy threshold 1 is the first threshold. Say you set it at .15%. The fast EMA will have to cross up over the slow EMA AND with a value .15% or higher than the slow EMA, else it is considered meaningless.
Buy threshold 2 is the second threshold. Say it is set at .3%. The fast EMA will have to cross up over the slow EMA AND with a value .3% or higher than the slow EMA, else it is considered meaningless.

Buy threshold one must be satisfied followed by buy threshold 2 in order to execute an order.

Say your EMAs cross, but the fast EMA is only .12% higher than your slow EMA. Your first threshold won't trigger. If price then shoots up the next hour, and at the next candle close your fast EMA is .35% above your slow EMA, it won't execute a buy order yet, because your first threshold wasn't triggered by the initial cross of only .12%. This cross of .35% will satisfy your first threshold and if the next candle closes above .3%, the bot will then execute a buy order.

I hope this helps.

I know I did not ask this question but it really helps a lot for me. Thanks.
Actually I had a follow up question, if you don't mind. So is this the reason why many people have negative values as threshold one (like -50), so then this threshold will always be met, and then it just looks at threshold 2? Can you also please help me understand why using a large negative value is necessary, why can we not just use zero, for example.
Thanks again.

I use 0 for a buy threshold 1 value and .05 as a sell threshold 1 value, so I'm not 100% sure about the negative value.

However, the likely scenario is that a high negative value, say -50% will negate the principal of having a first buy threshold because the EMA's are virtually always going to be within 50% of each other. Therefor, threshold 1 is constantly met, and you could assume that if the EMA's cross your buy threshold 2 value, that the order will execute within one interval after the cross as opposed to taking two intervals after the cross if you had a "0" or positive value for buy threshold 1.

The reason for using a high negative instead of using 0 would be to execute orders with more sensitivity. Personally, I'm a fan of two thresholds to rule out quick jumps.

This would be the logical explanation, however, I have no experience using negative values, so maybe somebody else can chime in here if they have experience using negative values in their trading.

Well I'm using -50 on both threshold1 and my bot doesn't trade since 3 days ago... is it normal?

What is your second threshold, what time interval are you using, are you currently holding BTC, USD, or both, and what exchange are you using? These factors will all determine whether or not it is normal that your bot hasn't traded in 3 days.

Taking out the first value doesn't have much effect on how often your bot will trade, but more on WHEN your bot will trade. It's very rare that having a positive threshold 1 will result in a trade not executing while having a negative threshold 1 will result in triggering a trade. The difference is that the trade will execute one interval earlier with a high negative threshold.

The only time having a high negative threshold 1 would result in a trade while having a positive or neutral threshold 1 wouldn't is a situation of a flash crash that rebounds before two intervals pass.
member
Activity: 111
Merit: 10
Wassup?
Ok.  I got a few coins that I've been holding for about 8-9 months now and I'm just starting to realize how much money I could have made if I'd been trading the whole time.  I've just got the trial version of the Butter Bot software and I'm gonna load a small amount into it during the trial period until I can figure out how it works and how to maximize profits.  I'm pretty good at predicting market trends and reading charts, but I just don't have the time anymore.  In the current stagnant market environment that we're in right now can someone give me some settings to start with.  I read the ones that were recommended when I got the bot, but those were written when market volatility was thru the roof.  

The portion I really don't understand is the buy and sell thresholds.  Is that the maximum amount of my balance that can be risked for the given period?  Someone who's been using this thing for a while help me out here please.  

Peace,

Readyrmca

In order for butterbot to execute an order, the EMAs have to cross and stayed crossed for two consecutive intervals. So let's assume you are using a 1 hour time frame. For a buy order to execute, the fast EMA will need to cross over the slow EMA and be higher than the slow EMA at the close of hour one and hour two. If you set a tick offset, say -10 minutes for instance, then the fast EMA will have to be higher than the slow EMA at 10 minutes before the hourly candle closes for two consecutive candles.

Buy threshold 1 is the first threshold. Say you set it at .15%. The fast EMA will have to cross up over the slow EMA AND with a value .15% or higher than the slow EMA, else it is considered meaningless.
Buy threshold 2 is the second threshold. Say it is set at .3%. The fast EMA will have to cross up over the slow EMA AND with a value .3% or higher than the slow EMA, else it is considered meaningless.

Buy threshold one must be satisfied followed by buy threshold 2 in order to execute an order.

Say your EMAs cross, but the fast EMA is only .12% higher than your slow EMA. Your first threshold won't trigger. If price then shoots up the next hour, and at the next candle close your fast EMA is .35% above your slow EMA, it won't execute a buy order yet, because your first threshold wasn't triggered by the initial cross of only .12%. This cross of .35% will satisfy your first threshold and if the next candle closes above .3%, the bot will then execute a buy order.

I hope this helps.

I know I did not ask this question but it really helps a lot for me. Thanks.
Actually I had a follow up question, if you don't mind. So is this the reason why many people have negative values as threshold one (like -50), so then this threshold will always be met, and then it just looks at threshold 2? Can you also please help me understand why using a large negative value is necessary, why can we not just use zero, for example.
Thanks again.

I use 0 for a buy threshold 1 value and .05 as a sell threshold 1 value, so I'm not 100% sure about the negative value.

However, the likely scenario is that a high negative value, say -50% will negate the principal of having a first buy threshold because the EMA's are virtually always going to be within 50% of each other. Therefor, threshold 1 is constantly met, and you could assume that if the EMA's cross your buy threshold 2 value, that the order will execute within one interval after the cross as opposed to taking two intervals after the cross if you had a "0" or positive value for buy threshold 1.

The reason for using a high negative instead of using 0 would be to execute orders with more sensitivity. Personally, I'm a fan of two thresholds to rule out quick jumps.

This would be the logical explanation, however, I have no experience using negative values, so maybe somebody else can chime in here if they have experience using negative values in their trading.

Well I'm using -50 on both threshold1 and my bot doesn't trade since 3 days ago... is it normal?
hero member
Activity: 715
Merit: 500
Ok.  I got a few coins that I've been holding for about 8-9 months now and I'm just starting to realize how much money I could have made if I'd been trading the whole time.  I've just got the trial version of the Butter Bot software and I'm gonna load a small amount into it during the trial period until I can figure out how it works and how to maximize profits.  I'm pretty good at predicting market trends and reading charts, but I just don't have the time anymore.  In the current stagnant market environment that we're in right now can someone give me some settings to start with.  I read the ones that were recommended when I got the bot, but those were written when market volatility was thru the roof.  

The portion I really don't understand is the buy and sell thresholds.  Is that the maximum amount of my balance that can be risked for the given period?  Someone who's been using this thing for a while help me out here please.  

Peace,

Readyrmca

In order for butterbot to execute an order, the EMAs have to cross and stayed crossed for two consecutive intervals. So let's assume you are using a 1 hour time frame. For a buy order to execute, the fast EMA will need to cross over the slow EMA and be higher than the slow EMA at the close of hour one and hour two. If you set a tick offset, say -10 minutes for instance, then the fast EMA will have to be higher than the slow EMA at 10 minutes before the hourly candle closes for two consecutive candles.

Buy threshold 1 is the first threshold. Say you set it at .15%. The fast EMA will have to cross up over the slow EMA AND with a value .15% or higher than the slow EMA, else it is considered meaningless.
Buy threshold 2 is the second threshold. Say it is set at .3%. The fast EMA will have to cross up over the slow EMA AND with a value .3% or higher than the slow EMA, else it is considered meaningless.

Buy threshold one must be satisfied followed by buy threshold 2 in order to execute an order.

Say your EMAs cross, but the fast EMA is only .12% higher than your slow EMA. Your first threshold won't trigger. If price then shoots up the next hour, and at the next candle close your fast EMA is .35% above your slow EMA, it won't execute a buy order yet, because your first threshold wasn't triggered by the initial cross of only .12%. This cross of .35% will satisfy your first threshold and if the next candle closes above .3%, the bot will then execute a buy order.

I hope this helps.

I know I did not ask this question but it really helps a lot for me. Thanks.
Actually I had a follow up question, if you don't mind. So is this the reason why many people have negative values as threshold one (like -50), so then this threshold will always be met, and then it just looks at threshold 2? Can you also please help me understand why using a large negative value is necessary, why can we not just use zero, for example.
Thanks again.

I use 0 for a buy threshold 1 value and .05 as a sell threshold 1 value, so I'm not 100% sure about the negative value.

However, the likely scenario is that a high negative value, say -50% will negate the principal of having a first buy threshold because the EMA's are virtually always going to be within 50% of each other. Therefor, threshold 1 is constantly met, and you could assume that if the EMA's cross your buy threshold 2 value, that the order will execute within one interval after the cross as opposed to taking two intervals after the cross if you had a "0" or positive value for buy threshold 1.

The reason for using a high negative instead of using 0 would be to execute orders with more sensitivity. Personally, I'm a fan of two thresholds to rule out quick jumps.

This would be the logical explanation, however, I have no experience using negative values, so maybe somebody else can chime in here if they have experience using negative values in their trading.
sr. member
Activity: 350
Merit: 253
Does anybody have experience with this bot or EMA trading in sideways markets? If so, is there any advice you could offer? How did you change your strategy to stay afloat and not get chopped up?

My trading account is at about -0.05%. I'm having to talk myself out of turning the bot off and trading manually until the market starts showing action, but I'm wondering more each day if I should break my #1 rule and trade outside of the plan.

I think a lot of us are feeling that way. I resist the urge, because I know, just from experience, that the moment I put it on manual, something major will happen while I'm away from my computer.  Shocked  If there's a good strategy for a market like this, I'd like to hear it too, but really, I think it's mostly just a matter of keeping your update intervals on the higher, safe end (1 or even 2 hours) and nothing silly with the moving averages (no 3/9 kind of stuff). Just keep the number of trades low until action picks up.
hero member
Activity: 715
Merit: 500
Does anybody have experience with this bot or EMA trading in sideways markets? If so, is there any advice you could offer? How did you change your strategy to stay afloat and not get chopped up?

My trading account is at about -0.05%. I'm having to talk myself out of turning the bot off and trading manually until the market starts showing action, but I'm wondering more each day if I should break my #1 rule and trade outside of the plan.
hero member
Activity: 715
Merit: 500
Ok.  I got a few coins that I've been holding for about 8-9 months now and I'm just starting to realize how much money I could have made if I'd been trading the whole time.  I've just got the trial version of the Butter Bot software and I'm gonna load a small amount into it during the trial period until I can figure out how it works and how to maximize profits.  I'm pretty good at predicting market trends and reading charts, but I just don't have the time anymore.  In the current stagnant market environment that we're in right now can someone give me some settings to start with.  I read the ones that were recommended when I got the bot, but those were written when market volatility was thru the roof. 

The portion I really don't understand is the buy and sell thresholds.  Is that the maximum amount of my balance that can be risked for the given period?  Someone who's been using this thing for a while help me out here please. 

Peace,

Readyrmca

In order for butterbot to execute an order, the EMAs have to cross and stayed crossed for two consecutive intervals. So let's assume you are using a 1 hour time frame. For a buy order to execute, the fast EMA will need to cross over the slow EMA and be higher than the slow EMA at the close of hour one and hour two. If you set a tick offset, say -10 minutes for instance, then the fast EMA will have to be higher than the slow EMA at 10 minutes before the hourly candle closes for two consecutive candles.

Buy threshold 1 is the first threshold. Say you set it at .15%. The fast EMA will have to cross up over the slow EMA AND with a value .15% or higher than the slow EMA, else it is considered meaningless.
Buy threshold 2 is the second threshold. Say it is set at .3%. The fast EMA will have to cross up over the slow EMA AND with a value .3% or higher than the slow EMA, else it is considered meaningless.

Buy threshold one must be satisfied followed by buy threshold 2 in order to execute an order.

Say your EMAs cross, but the fast EMA is only .12% higher than your slow EMA. Your first threshold won't trigger. If price then shoots up the next hour, and at the next candle close your fast EMA is .35% above your slow EMA, it won't execute a buy order yet, because your first threshold wasn't triggered by the initial cross of only .12%. This cross of .35% will satisfy your first threshold and if the next candle closes above .3%, the bot will then execute a buy order.

I hope this helps.
newbie
Activity: 18
Merit: 0
Ok.  I got a few coins that I've been holding for about 8-9 months now and I'm just starting to realize how much money I could have made if I'd been trading the whole time.  I've just got the trial version of the Butter Bot software and I'm gonna load a small amount into it during the trial period until I can figure out how it works and how to maximize profits.  I'm pretty good at predicting market trends and reading charts, but I just don't have the time anymore.  In the current stagnant market environment that we're in right now can someone give me some settings to start with.  I read the ones that were recommended when I got the bot, but those were written when market volatility was thru the roof. 

The portion I really don't understand is the buy and sell thresholds.  Is that the maximum amount of my balance that can be risked for the given period?  Someone who's been using this thing for a while help me out here please. 

Peace,

Readyrmca
member
Activity: 111
Merit: 10
Wassup?
yeh, time to make some money!
sr. member
Activity: 390
Merit: 250
*************
Announcement
*************

Just to let everyone know we have some nice surprises in store for the coming weeks; including LTC, and some other goodies in the bag Smiley.

All free upgrades for current subscribers as usual Smiley.

Pablo.

LTC!LTC!LTC! Smiley
I'm so excited!
legendary
Activity: 1183
Merit: 1000
*************
Announcement
*************

Just to let everyone know we have some nice surprises in store for the coming weeks; including LTC, and some other goodies in the bag Smiley.

All free upgrades for current subscribers as usual Smiley.

Pablo.
sr. member
Activity: 350
Merit: 253
Anyone having any luck over the last week or so on BTC-E? I can't find any settings that won't result in losses right now. Lots of ups and downs, but all evened out by EMA.

No luck here also. I'm pretty new in all this so i don't know if this is due to my inexperience, different market conditions, or something else.
I just hope that the marked did't fundamentally changed for EMA trading. Even thou the bot had only loosing trades in last 10 days i hope in the month time it will be positive.

I don't think you'll have much luck finding a winning strategy in this market. EMA works best at moving in and out of trends, so when the market moves sideways like this, and doesn't stick to any one direction for more than 24-48 hours, it's basically just taking tiny gains and tiny losses here and there. Until we actually develop a trend again, it's ....  Undecided

I'd suggest setting a longer update interval to avoid trading on noise, just forget about it for the next week, and start trading dogecoins. Some much needed excitement in this dull, dull, bitcoin market.
member
Activity: 111
Merit: 10
Wassup?
Anyone having any luck over the last week or so on BTC-E? I can't find any settings that won't result in losses right now. Lots of ups and downs, but all evened out by EMA.

No luck here also. I'm pretty new in all this so i don't know if this is due to my inexperience, different market conditions, or something else.
I just hope that the marked did't fundamentally changed for EMA trading. Even thou the bot had only loosing trades in last 10 days i hope in the month time it will be positive.

How much times does your bot trade per day?
newbie
Activity: 1
Merit: 0
Anyone having any luck over the last week or so on BTC-E? I can't find any settings that won't result in losses right now. Lots of ups and downs, but all evened out by EMA.

No luck here also. I'm pretty new in all this so i don't know if this is due to my inexperience, different market conditions, or something else.
I just hope that the marked did't fundamentally changed for EMA trading. Even thou the bot had only loosing trades in last 10 days i hope in the month time it will be positive.
newbie
Activity: 44
Merit: 0
Anyone having any luck over the last week or so on BTC-E? I can't find any settings that won't result in losses right now. Lots of ups and downs, but all evened out by EMA.
full member
Activity: 190
Merit: 100
I haven't downloaded and upgraded to the new version yet. Just wondering if everything is going smoothly with it and if all bugs (if any?) have been worked through?

Thanks for any comments or observations you make.

Smiley



No bugs, all good.
hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
Are you like these guys?
I haven't downloaded and upgraded to the new version yet. Just wondering if everything is going smoothly with it and if all bugs (if any?) have been worked through?

Thanks for any comments or observations you make.

Smiley

sr. member
Activity: 319
Merit: 250
Can we get verification if manual date settings will be added to the backtesting? Not asking when it will be added, just that it is on the short list of feature enhancements.
sr. member
Activity: 350
Merit: 253
im new to bot-trading and want to ask you guys if its worth spending time on that topic?

are there ppl that really make constant profits with this bot, considering the bot + exchange fees?

thx

This seems to be asked a lot. Did you download the demo? All you need to do is run the backtesting function to see how the bot performs over a given period of time, and whether or not it would be profitable. If you trade with a large amount (ie. more than 2 or 3 BTC) you do need to factor in "slippage" to a small degree with the calculations, but otherwise it gives a pretty fair picture of what your profits would be in USD.
sr. member
Activity: 350
Merit: 253
Is there a way to incorporate bitcoinwisdom into butterbot for the charts?  So we could see exactly what the bot see's?  I've watched bitcoinwisdom and see the lines cross and its never traded when it's supposed to.  Its always delayed and drives me crazy.  I stopped watching it because I'm at least 30 minutes behind on the trades with 1 hour setup on butterbot, so when the bot should trade to make a profit, it instead waits and sells at a lower value than when the lines indicate it should have. This is with having - numbers in the first trade and sell slots.  I'm very interested in the TSL settings.. With those settings does the bot essentially operate as a high frequency trading bot selling at 2% loss and buying at 2% gains?  Seems more reliable than the crapshoot 1 hour sometimes might conscider nope just kidding trade settings right now.

Mine always trades exactly how it's configured to. Of course Pablo has the final say on this, but I don't see any reason to incorporate BitcoinWisdom into the software... I often have it loaded in my browser and watch as the EMA lines cross, and it coincides very accurately with the bot.

Perhaps your bot is "delayed" because you are using buy/sell thresholds? My bot doesn't sell until at least one hour after lines have crossed, because backtesting shows that prices tend to rebound once the period of panic (which usually coincides with lines crossing) occurs. Also, what is your tick offset? Butter Bot only polls the market and makes a buy/sell decision on the tick offset, so it would be unlikely that you would ever see an action taken the moment a line crosses on BitcoinWisdom, unless the update timer is set really low, like 1 minute.

TSL sounds good in theory, but when it triggers, it sells your position and takes you completely out of the game. Volatility swings of 2% are not that uncommon, so you could potentially have your position sold due to some "noise" while you're asleep, and then wake to find the price much higher but you'd be sitting on the sidelines. I avoid it for that reason, and much has been written in this thread about it, and why it tends to be unprofitable. But you're free to experiment with it however you'd like, which is what's so fun about this bot Smiley

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