Topic: Economic Devastation - page 118. (Read 504811 times)

...its that the participants in statism (aka society run by government) all game the system for maximum short-term individual gain and there is no global (in the time domain, i.e. long-term) optimization feedback mechanism. This what the Petri dish analogy was about in my essay linked from the first (opening) post (i.e. "OP") of this thread.

Humans are not like ants, in that they have a large enough brain that they can function without the hive and thus human prioritize their self-interest.

If history show us anything, those other people have been living off of Greece as well (Germany v. Greece post-WWII). Greece wants a freebie like Germany got. Germany denies the freebie and wants Greece to honor austerity. Just a giant political circle jerk regarding "who fucked up." If anyone's to blame, it's the IMF, ECB and EC. They got greedy and what we have today is the results of that greed.

A relevant post about China that I made in November 2014:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.9438334

USA votes to tax and steal the internet (but they thought they were voting "for the Internet" dumb ass sheeople).

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/25/technology/path-clears-for-net-neutrality-ahead-of-fcc-vote.html

Decadence. USA to kill the goose that laid its golden eggs. High tech will run from the USA.

This doesn't surprise me at all. Everywhere you turn the state is taking it's share. It is going to be a painful 5 years ahead for the West.

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iamback discussed a very astute idea here recently (discussed last page).

I saw for myself what automation can do in Korea some three years ago in their ball bearing plants.  Not too long ago, ball bearing components were made/processed in a "one man, one machine" way.  Each bearing must go through many (50 - 100) steps before becoming a finished product.

Iljin of Korea has way-upped the stakes: I saw myself a "one woman, 20 machines" paradigm in a provincial city.  OK, yes, the Japanese have been doing this for sometime, but KOREA was the first time I had ever seen such an advanced bearing factory.  Robots and all.  This will help keep costs down for them.  CHINA is a real threat to the cost-basis of Korean products (and China is taking automation too).

I noticed something kind of similar with bitmixer.io, the guys I advertise for.  That service is highly automated, the payments are made automatically, I would think that their team has the mixing service running like a Tesla...

Further, I would speculate that writing software that helps make such tasks run automatically would be very useful, and very lucrative.  You already know that, iamback, but I had not much thought about this ideal until now.

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CoinCube, iamback, picolo

I should drop by this thread more often, a lot of good comments and subjects.   

I have added Martin Armstrong to my daily reading.  At a minimum, he is a font of ideas.

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Thanks iamback and CoinCube for the information on Norway.  They *seem* so secure to casual observers, I never knew that they face real longer-term weaknesses unless they get to work now to fix their finances.  Noe would be a good time for them to start.  Will they start soon?  I don't know, but usually no country starts doing anything until pushed hard.

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Civil forfeiture and related (red light cameras, etc.) are a b!tch.  All of these nasty .gov initiatives mean that each of us has to learn and practice financial jiu-jitsu just to protect what we have (not to mention what we may or not may be able to accumulate).

These risks of seizure of our assets (even if completely innocent of anything) mean having quiet assets (gold, even Bitcoin) is more important than the usual arguments.  Having BTC100 in a Ledger Nano, for example, means a certain freedom in that the +/- $23,000 would be easy to get past TSA en-route to "Plan B".

That's one of Bitcoin's greatest features: easy capital mobility.

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Greece looks like will be in the news for quite some time into the future.  Greece also looks like will be instructive to those of us willing to pay attention (Cyprus was instructive).

Yet, I do not think it will matter much exactly what happens to Greece if/when things get worse.  Greece cannot pay off its debts.  My guess is that NO ONE will loan them much money in the coming years.  The Greek people will suffer for their government's corruption (but electing those governments is at least in part their own fault too).

"Economic Devastation" is indeed an idea to keep thinking about.  + 1, CoinCube, for starting such a long-lasting thread.

Greece has been living off other people's works and savings for too many years.

Need to install a speed recording device on your car if you live in Western country, in order to avoid cops ticketing you for incorrectly estimating your speed:

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/truck-driver-films-argument-with-highway-patrol-officer-who-fined-him-after-estimating-his-speed-was-over-the-limit/story-fni0cx4q-1227235093322

This is what happens when government becomes the economy. They start bending the rules of "innocent until proven guilty" because their power becomes unavoidable, and their economic needs become insatiable. The cancer kills the host.

Greece could exit when the cancer has killed the host, i.e. when the sovereign bond market for Europe entirely collapses and the status quo can no longer continue (that which can't continue, stops). That would be consistent with my Petri dish theory and will also coincide with Armstrong's timing models.

I think Armstrong may (in another blog post) be referring to Greece exiting 8.6 years from when Greece marked the start of the last shift in the ECM.

Europe will Move Closer to Russia & Greece will Exit Euro
http://armstrongeconomics.com/2015/02/08/europe-will-move-closer-to-russia-greece-will-exit-euro/

Armstrong got this one wrong at least so far
"Greece will be forced to exit – that is just inevitable" - Martin Armstrong Feburary 8, 2015

Norway faces up to prospect of North Sea slowdown
http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/2/21061f38-b3d3-11e4-a6c1-00144feab7de.html#axzz3ScTYzX6z

The PostWar Decline in the Price of Silver 1920-1933 (pdf link)

From 1926-1929 Silver traded between 53 and 60 cents per ounce in New York.
In 1929 (onset of the Great Depression) the price for silver began to decline and went down steadily through 1930 reaching an all time low of 25 cents per ounce in New York in Feburary, 1931. During 1931 and 1932 the price stabilized at a new low level between 25 and 32 cents per ounce before reaching a new all time low in December 1932 of 24 cents.

It was not until 1933 (three years after the start of the great depression) that silver begain to rise in terms of depreciating American dollars.

Come over a month later we are 40 dollars plus below that. I wouldn't bet on a complete economic meltdown. But, hypothetically speaking, I could imagine Bitcoin prices, and gold for that matter, soaring in value when fiat collapses.

The Sovereign Debt crisis won't bottom until 2024 or so...

The citizenry I assume has become entitled, spoiled, overpriced. Humans don't readjust quickly from this state. They go kicking and screaming back to poverty, not willingly with foresight and planning. Socialism destroys humans.

I repeat my point from upthread that trajectory is more important.

P.S. Note I had edited my post to be less acrimonious but you quoted my flippant comment. Apologies. I guess I am feeling pressured today to get many things done. I need to head out to rent the better house. Worried about my finances and how to complete many tasks pronto. But health is strong today!

CoinCube, you know how to use Google to search my archives? (search site:bitcointalk.org ...)

Norway's savings is wiped out by their external debt:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.9862184

Sorry but large levels of socialism and taxation are never adaptable and always end up in massive failure. Norway has a 78% tax on oil revenue!

I found a figure of $160 billion for annual government expenses, but even if I was mistaken on that, my point remains valid that Norway is not fiscally strong. They have a huge socialism bill (that will worsen as their boomers retire) to pay dependent on revenues which can wither.

Like parallel construction, this is one of the new Intolerable Acts.  

King's Men and patriots will die settling the score for such affronts to the liberty of free people.

When the assassination markets are ready, the "awkward stage" will end and we will water the tree.