Topic: Economic Totalitarianism - page 91. (Read 345758 times)

Chile looks to be about 3 - 4X more expensive than Ecuador, and here you can see in one of the pics your neighbor is displaying the flag of Texas, lol:

https://www.airbnb.com/rooms/2175939?s=89pb

Thus clearly many foreigners going for the Chile option. Again prices will decline next year and every year until 2020 at least, so renting is a better option short-term.

Ecuador presents another opportunity. Put $25,000 in a bank account there (or spend it on land), and you can get permanent residency. Also this accrues towards citizenship. Ecuador is probably safer than Argentina. It is much more socialist and probably do not want to become a citizen there. But in terms of a short-term residency while waiting out the options for citizenship that might work for me. Especially filipinas can fly visa-free to Ecuador (and not to Chile, Argentina, and Paraguay).

I'd prefer to buy citizenship outright from Dominica or St. Kitts, than to take Paraguay citizenship.

Thus I might just be looking at a waiting period. I could wait out in the Philippines where I am already set up with a car and much lower expenses than even Ecuador. The only worry is getting trapped over here. As we move into the crazies. But I am probably overreacting and probably could make it through much of 2016 before needing to leave Philippines. That would give me more time to code uninterrupted.

It doesn't matter which poison you pick: it's still poison. (I.e., if you do that, you won't have done anything.)

Chile is another interesting option. I think we are looking realistically not at a perfect set of choices, thus we must select the least worst.

It is possible to stay in Chile as a tourist for 180 days a year. And foreigners can own land. The land is more expensive than on the other side of the Andes, but it is more of a first world country (but not entirely). Chile does have more risk of earthquakes, volcanos, and La Nina or El Nino excessive rainfall, thus mudslides or drought similar to California. But if one is looking for a step up in terms of modern and more well functioning government, than Chile offers a middle choice.

Also I read that if one prefers residency then it is really easy to obtain if you can prove you have sufficient income/funds and that new residents get a 3 year tax holiday on worldwide income. So this provides an option to live for 3 years without taking citizenship, then you could abandon residency after that.

http://allchile.net/chileforum/viewtopic.php?t=9214

http://ultimateguidetochile.com/expat/the-retirement-and-periodic-income-visa-a-step-by-step-guide-to-permanent-residency/

http://www.sovereignman.com/expat/great-residency-loophole-10944/

Also even if you do get citizenship in say Paraguay or Uruguay, you have no guarantee that these nations won't in the future tax worldwide income. The tax on $100,000 of income in Chile is 15.2%, although one can wonder if it will go higher when the global contagion hits because Chile is somewhat dependent on the copper exports.

Also we have to assume the world axis powers are going to within a decade or two succeed in creating some sort of worldwide tax. So any solution on tax is temporary. We will have needed to be well entrenched in an anonymous Knowledge Age by then.

It seems most important to have a 2nd citizenship option and thus the freedom to travel in this upcoming economic totalitarianism smashup. I don't want to be carrying only a 5 Eyes or EU country passport going into this chaos.

I don't really like the idea of reporting a birth in a S.A. country if I don't need to. You will learn that children and official marriage is one way the State can emasculate and control you.

For me, it seems the most workable plan will be to apply for residency in Paraguay to get the ball rolling on citizenship there. Then I can live on tourist visas where ever I want being careful not to form a residency by physical presence test else where, e.g. Chile, Argentina, and perhaps even forays to SE Asia and Australia/NZ.

Or I could instead locate myself near to Paraguay so I can readily proceed there to renounce US citizenship at any time, while working in the meantime on accumulating more capital to consider purchasing for example Dominica citizenship. So residency instead of tourist could be an option in Chile with this strategy.

Although the Philippines did ratify the UN Convention on Stateless Persons in 2011, I wouldn't want to become stateless here. As I said, Asia is a top-down run "taipan" model and Asians are obedient slaves. And to travel from Philippines not by commercial airline would be somewhat treacherous. At least in S.A., one can head many directions on foot or horseback if need be.

I like a strategy with multiple options so it is a buyers market (I can pick and choose and play the different options).

Thoughts?


P.S. For the first time, I actually had to put someone on ignore. It is against my ethics, but really I don't have the time and my eyes can benefit from less clutter. Sorry. I just can't have further discussions (even after we've all hinted to him to stop doing that hypertheoretical ideological babble in this thread) with a person who lives only in ideological philosophy. I wonder who pays for his food   Probably the socialist EU. Also I sense he is stalking me.

If its film should so enthrall you as to move you to physical procession, your plutocracy should not motivate you thereto through such wanton consumption.

Yeah minimize expenses for a year or two perhaps, so you can try to pour as much money as possible into gold and/or crypto at the coming low in Spring 2016. I don't know how such a move affects your income.

For second citizenship, the least expensive but slow way is probably Paraguay. Or you can just travel to S.A. and have your wife deliver another child there, then you both will become citizens. Again Paraguay and Uruguay are the two countries that don't tax worldwide income. Note all S.A. countries require mandatory military service on your child when he/she is 18 if your child is born in S.A.. Also apparently it is difficult to renounce Argentine citizenship (and perhaps also the others but Brazil seemed to be easier).

Moving to Pitcairn Island is another way to get 2nd citizenship with no taxes. Also any island in French Polynesia.

For $200,000+ it is possible to buy citizenship from Dominica.

The Paraguay citizenship without the delivery of a child there, will take more than 3 years but you won't need to reside there the entire time, just nearer to the end of the 3 year wait, you need to establish a business there and pay some local taxes to show you are sincere about citizenship. And need to learn fluent Spanish. The bearing a child option may be more practical given the urgency we face.

For me, I could just renounce for example in Paraguay or Uruguay and become stateless if I was in a rush. Then wait the 3 years to become a citizen. Australians can't renounce until they have 2nd citizenship, thus you need to move faster to a solution. Note Uruguay apparently only awards citizenship to married foreign couples so thus it is a non-option for me. I refuse to marry again (and I can't now as I am just separated and no divorce yet).

I've been looking for example at land for sale in Argentina. It ranges from as low as $400 per acre ($1000 per ha) for forested ranches > 1000 acres. Note there is a limit on land ownership for a foreigner of 2500 acres except in certain mountainous zones. At the 250 acres range, the prices jump to $1000 per acre. At 15 acres, the prices increase to $4000 per acre (ha = 2.47 acre). There is less expensive land in Paraguay, but apparently rebels have more political clout in Paraguay and Bush family bought huge tracts of land in Paraguay, so something smells fishy and risky to me. Prices will likely decline further as the world's demand for commodities declines in the contagion starting in October. The productive land is much more expensive than the land that is forested, thus clearly land prices are tied to world commodity markets.

Thus it is economically beneficial to purchase a land as a group and then subdivide it so as to economize cost and also to have like minded neighbors to gain economy-of-scale on security.

Any way, I think the threat of crime is nil on these rural areas assuming one institutes basic security such as perimeter warning systems and sufficient males with guns in the community. That is the reason for banding together. I really think some of us should pool our resources if we are in agreement.

S.A. just seems so much more realistic from a cost and tax and inept government perspective.

But then again, maybe renting and staying in a first world country is smarter. It is difficult to ascertain that yet, so that is why having both options is best. Uruguay has visa-free entry into Australia and NZ. But even as a Paraguay citizen, if one has sufficient wealth, they can still get a tourist visa for Australia and NZ.

Your reaction? Thoughts from others?

So my thinking is to remain flexible and to jettison my USA citizenship before the USA declares a state of war officially perhaps in 2018 and thus making renounciation impossible per the US Title code I quoted upthread. Hellary Slimeton rigged election dictatorship will lock the doors and throw away the keys. USA patriots will be stuck there in the land of 1000 paper cuts and 50 nuclear reactors, and potentially fighting the Chinese and Russians on USA soil. I don't know what is going to happen to the USA, but I don't want to be there (nor be forced home by a canceled passport) to find out.




Yeah I got that impression just from reading the different requirements for home schooling for different states (provinces) of Australia.

Wouldn't that also include NSW and Victoria as I hear Sydney and the Gold Coast are the worst and most expensive?


I would be very grateful if you could share this information with me asap. I may need to go to Australia for a fecal transplant and I'd really prefer to not go alone.


Is there no clever way you can transfer your retirement into for example a gold investment (at $700) and then extract gains? In the USA, there are custodian IRAs are something like that where you can invest in alternative assets. And also penalty fees for taking early dispersements, but you can at least do it.

No one is censoring you. We read. But we will ignore when it is too redundant or not adding to the aims of the thread. I am debating you on the theoretical economics over in the Martin Armstrong thread and I think it belongs over there because he is a macro economists guy. Or in the Economic Devastation thread. In this thread, per OROBTC's request, we should strive for ideas about practical solutions not ideological fancy.


Caves.

Anti-drone technology such as EMI disruption, etc.

Knowledge Age such that TPTB do not know whom to attack. They can just kill everyone then. Not very realistic for them though.

Look if even a 1000 of us are organized and anonymous, we can decide to get pissed off and make a direct attack on Obummer command & control locations. These bastards need to remember the knowledge creation advantage resides with the people and knowledge will be the greatest weapon.

I have refrained from real estate because of the noosebleed prices here, so I am not bogged down in one place.

I think I will begin looking into small coastal villages far away from any of the major cities, and a secondary citizenship.

Queensland is the biggest police state of all here, so I will probably head more towards South West/gulf area of OZ.

You mentioned upthread about filipinos being eligible for certain S.A citizenships?

They have recently changed the rules for tourist visas here, but increased the bond requirement for "high risk" tourists, my wife would know more about this & i'll ask her

Every cent I have been forced to put towards my retirement is likely going to evaporate, it took a huge hit in 07 and I cannot access it to prevent it's theft ( the government secured our super for themselves to rape and steal )

So I am serious about making the most out of this collapse as I possibly can.

(You should rather censor dissent than reconcile your beliefs thereto?   )

OROBTC, as I wrote in my reply to you in the MA thread, Paraguay is good for residency and citizenship, but not for living. Problems with the rebels in the Chaco area. Problems with drugs and crime infestation in the cities. Perhaps it is not as bad as the stories on the internet? (I remember stories on the internet of how bad it was in Mindanao, yet I've been here on and off for 25 years)

The way to live in S.A. is Paraguay citizenship and tourist living in Argentina. Or if you prefer substitute any tax haven citizenship for Paraguay, such as Dominica, Pitcairn island, etc..

If you want a place to escape from crime and do what ever you want (including your guns), then look for a Pacific island to buy. Some of us could pool our resources to do that if we were serious.

Yeah Australia looks like it is being taken over by the Communist Chinese as well, who are buying up the land. And they turned Wikileaks founder Assange over the USA. And they highly regulate guns which is so strange for a country that is mostly wide open farms. But Australia is more first world and safer than S.A. countries (and also incredibly expensive).

...

One of my correspondents (and her family) was from Australia having moved there after Rhodesia became Zimbabwe.  She wanted OUT of Oz for the reasons mentioned above: even greater Socialist tendencies than the USA.

She, last I heard, has settle on PARAGUAY!  Paraguay (which I visited once almost 30 years ago) is a very backwater place, but I thought it was rather tranquil.  I would bet it is CHEAP.  Paraguay's Eastern Chaco region has the cheapest biomass for sale on the planet. Lots of big & remote places (as in no decent road access) are on sale.  WATER is the main problem.  Lots of sun though, good for solar power.

PY is corrupt, but they all are in S. America.  Brazilians are starting to take over (by migration similar to Mexican informal invasion into the USA) the eastern part of the country.

If you want to be left alone, the Paraguayan Chaco is a place you can disappear.

Because Australia has ratified the UN Convention on Stateless Persons, then you can not renounce your Australian citizenship unless you are already a dual citizen:

https://www.border.gov.au/Forms/Documents/128.pdf

Whereas, USA citizens can renounce in an embassy and become stateless.

I just discovered this scary information for US citizens:

http://hodgen.com/relinquishing-u-s-citizenship-and-expatriation/


So if the USA declares war, we US citizens can no longer renounce our US citizenship for IRS tax purposes! Once the USA goes to war (in 2017), you are forever locked in to the USA!

You might want to find out if Australia has a similar clause in their renunciation law.

If you are already an Australian citizen, then I think you should stay there for the time being, but get a 2nd citizenship for your family in a jurisdiction that won't tax (won't require you to report) your foreign earned income. Then you can wait and see what happens, and if necessary you can flee using your 2nd citizenship and even renounce your Australian citizenship if it becomes absolutely necessary (hopefully not).

I can't see what NZ offers that is a significant advantage? The warmest is 24C but only 2 months of the year. Beautiful place to visit perhaps. If you need to flee Australia, then you need to flee NZ also. I was only in Brisbane and up the coast going North back in 1999 just the month before I lost my eye. I was warm enough for me.

Your strength is you are already an Australian citizen. I don't know if you already live in a rural area or can move out there. I'd be liquidating real estate now and moving to $usd (waiting for the coming low in crypto and gold) and renting. You could diversify in gold, crypto, and US stocks after Spring 2016. Then you will accumulate more than enough wealth to do what you need to do in the coming crisis.

Aren't there reasonably good private schools or quaint local community schools in the rural areas for your kids? While they are in elementary school that is probably fine. Before they hit middle school, you'd really benefit from not enrolling them in the city schools or perhaps by that time have found an entirely different country you like and they would be old enough to be more able to watch out for danger.

Hey if you've got a rural place I might come visit you and pay rent. Then you could come visit me if I end up in S.A.. Team work.

If you want to discuss 2nd citizenships, then PM me. Haven't we traded messages before? I've forgotten.

I am also interested in rural Australia, but I don't want to become a resident just now because I don't want an obligation to report my financials to Australia. So if I come to Australia, I want to be a visitor and renting short-term (3 - 6 months).

My problem is I don't know if I can get a tourist visa for my gf. Australia seems to make it very difficult for filipinos? I'd need to go talk to them at the Embassy in Manila. Perhaps they can accept some bond as a guarantee that the pinay will return and not work?

Yeah all of this I agree with, it was only a consideration to escape the western style totalitarianism, but that appears to be spreading there too.

Rural Australian areas have mostly escaped this for now, but Fabian style socialism has hijacked all sides of politics here, so a full fledged land grab by the state is a very real possibility in a crisis situation.

I need to think about this more carefully, because I do not want to stay here (in the city) or be stuck in a socialist, agenda 21 version of hell (herded out of a rural area like the chinese farmers)

I will look into South America, but staying here is not an option.

The changes accelerated as of 2010. It was as if someone flipped a switch and suddenly there was construction every where. I think it was the QE was ending up over here as foreign investment in corporate bond issues. It has made them overconfident and wanting to turn Philippines into a copy of America (I even see an occasional strip mall now).

I am exaggerating a bit and consider the Mayor of Davao is really the most extreme of all Mayors as far as putting more police on the streets. So perhaps other cities in the Philippines are less so. But I do literally see police every 500 - 1000 meters in the city. And checkpoints are becoming more frequent and random. And it is ridiculous that they have banned people with vision in only one eye from driving at night. That is an extreme overreaction to one car accident where a filipino without vision in one eye killed 3 kids in a car accident. That to me is indicative of totalitarian attitudes. "We can make a safer world if we violate the lives of innocent people". I walk in to renew my DL and suddenly I am told I can't drive at night (which for example I always need to do because that is the time when there is no traffic so I can quickly travel to my other location where Bitmessage runs because it doesn't function on the ISP at my nice rental house). I was told I could hire a filipino driver. Fuck that! I see the writing on the wall and I don't like the change. I'll still be visiting (and driving at night with the "international driver's license" I will obtain tomorrow hopefully) but not residing here too much longer.

Hey welcome to the Philippines. First we gouge your eye out, then after your 25 years of residence in our country, we take away your priviledge to drive because of the eye we took from you, so you can be forced to hire a filipino driver (who might be the one who conveniently drives you to the kidnappers one night).

Kidnappings were severe in the Philippines before the economy turned up and many laborers were exported overseas to work. With the global downturn, we might see that revert at least until 2020 when MA predicts Asia will bottom.

Education is horrendous in the Philippines. Don't subject your kids to it. I made that mistake.

If safety of your kids is a greater concern than their indoctrination by State education and socialism, then I'd agree Australia and NZ are better choices than any of the turd countries.

Home schooling in those countries is regulated.

For me, I'd want my kids to grow up with dangeradventure/rustic/rural and not be overly sheltered. I want them to be strong and understand the real world and receive a real world education. But that is just me. I am different than most people.

The Balikbayan 1 year visa is no big deal any more. You can get 6 months extensions now and up to 3 years before you need to travel out. And then you are not forced to travel with your filipina wife.

And why raise kids in the Philippines? Philippines is a hell hole. It is good for single men for obvious reasons. But for your children, why subject them to that. Maybe there is something positive to be said about the repressed conservative values here, yet then they will be watching all that sexy dancing and other inane TV shows. And indoctrinating them with lots of other nonsense at the schools which the kids rebel against. My kids went crazy when they hit the USA after being held back by the Philippines values.

And your wife's relatives will dominate you here. You need some separation to feel like you are still not just a "kano" white ivory trophy on the wall in the home.

I did consider the Philippines because I qualify for Balikbayan status, I would never have imagined the place turning into a police state (I was last there 6 years ago)
But I suppose these things can change rapidly.

I have no problem looking after myself, my only concern is the safety of my young kids, who become targets of kidnappings in turd world countries.

Australia (Tasmania) and NZ are both 5 Eyes countries. They tax residents foreigners all on their foreign income. You can expect them to be very proficient at implementing enslavement policies such as national biometric identification, fines for even a crack on your taillight, gun control, etc.. NZ is slightly better than Australia, but as you say not a warm climate if we do enter a Little Ice Age. I am very willing to go live in those countries for less than 6 months a year as a tourist, but why would you want to become a permanent resident? See the comments from Doug Casey in my prior post.

Australia and NZ are at the peak of their real estate booms, especially with the Chinese have been pouring money in to get it out of China. If had to wager a guess, then compared to buying BTC at the coming bottom $150 or less, then I would say real estate in those two countries will decline by a factor of no less than 3 as measured in BTC and I'd put good odds on a factor of 10 times. Meaning if you'd instead hold BTC (or even gold after the coming $700 low) for the next few years and rent, you'd be 3 - 10 times richer.

That is my guess. Anyone else want to share their guess or reasoning?

Someone had shared with me a link on hot NZ has these episodes of hot air North-westerlies, that make the local population miserable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nor%27west_arch

This turbulent weather can apparently mess with the human mood.

I am thinking I'd rather live in a place where the government is as corrupt as possible, because as Doug Casey says they are inefficient at messing with you. He says you have a near zero chance of a traffic stop in Argentina for example. On the downside, you have to protect yourself. I am not a weakling or a pussie who needs a nanny state to protect me. As I said, I could still travel any where I prefer, but I think here we are talking where to settle down a residence and tax jurisdiction. And where to bugout if the world goes F.U.B.A.R..

For example, in Argentina I've read that if you overstay your visa even for 10 years, you pay a fine and are not deported. Try that in any Asian country! Actually I did overstay a few years in the Philippines in the 1990s and I had to talk to the immigration commissioner for the entire country to get out of that trouble. And the Philippines is changing now and becoming more and more a police state. I'm ready to leave perhaps by 2016.

Articles of interest on South America:

http://ferfal.blogspot.com/2014/12/practical-shooter-released-from-jail.html

http://ferfal.blogspot.com/2014/11/bugging-out-ar15-vs-lever-action-rifle.html


http://ferfal.blogspot.com/2015/07/in-argentina-crime-does-pay-no-joke-it.html

http://ferfal.blogspot.com/2015/01/life-after-economic-collapse-same-only.html

http://ferfal.blogspot.com/2014/12/the-scarecrow-police-car.html

http://ferfal.blogspot.com/2014/11/rural-crime-keeps-getting-worse-what-do.html

http://ferfal.blogspot.com/2014/11/life-after-economic-collapse-same-only.html

http://ferfal.blogspot.co.uk/2012/01/why-didnt-i-move-to-estancia-cafayate.html

http://ferfal.blogspot.com/2014/09/being-careful-of-scams-charlatans-and.html

http://www.caseyresearch.com/articles/contrarian-view-argentina




Notice how Ferfal doesn't point out that Australia taxes all your income if you become a resident and contrast that with Doug Casey advice above, and note that Australia wants to own you:

http://ferfal.blogspot.com/2014/10/australia-should-you-bug-out-from-first.html

http://ferfal.blogspot.com/search/label/gauchos

I know of a story of a foreigner in I believe Argentina who was jailed for 10 years for killing a local when it was the local's fault for running a red light:

http://wikioverland.org/Peru#Driving_in_Peru

I am considering Tasmania or New Zealand, both places do get bitterly cold in winter though & I couldn't find any data from these areas for the previous mini ice age.

How low do you think real estate value will plummet from the current prices?

OROBTC asked me a serious question in MA thread about how to plan and I gave a serious answer perhaps a bit flippant.

I am seriously considering moving to a more sparsely populated area of the world. I can always travel to Asia as a tourist, but I think being in a very populated area is going to be risky as the downturn accelerates. I see police and checkpoints every 1 km here. New police academy recruits by dozens seen walking along the road. As the economy turns down here in Philippines, one will be squeezed between increasing regulations (the dumb asses here want to be like you in the West), the Asian top-down disrespect for minorities (e.g. where I live they have banned driving at night for handicapped people blind in one eye!), increased corruption and kidnappings as the economy turns down, increase petty theft and the filipino attitude of "bahala ka" (meaning it is your problem, I don't care) when they cut you off in the road, throw an object that hits you in the head, run you off the road while you are walking on the side of the road, etc.. I was here before and then during the Asian Crisis, so I saw how the place descended into a hell hole. It was during the peak of the Asian Crisis when everyone was so pissed off, that they attacked me and took my eye. Now I am handicapped because of them, and they want to take away my license to drive!

If anyone is serious about pooling resources in order to purchase and provide security for a safe haven ranch in a low population area that does not tax foreign residents on foreign income, then I am interested to talk with you.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_taxation#Individuals


I think who ever is serious about this needs to be thinking about making this a reality in 2016 or 2017 at the latest. I am thinking it may be better to rent and wait for clarity and the best deals (other than trophy pieces, real estate should decline in price, or at least relative to crypto price appreciation for next several years at least). Also a way to familiarize with new places before committing.

I can't speak to those who have family in a Western country that they can not leave. My mother refuses to leave the USA and I love her, but I can't allow that to rule my life. Long ago I realized that my life is my life, and my mother is very independent any way. If you've got kids and you've raised them to be very close to you, and they are too tied down in their jobs, then all I can suggest if you may decide you need to have a bugout plan B. At some point, they may lose their jobs and be ready to get-out-of-Dodge too. Diversification.

As for the role of the Knowledge Age and anonymous crypto-currency, this will affect each of differently depending on our skills and vocation. In my opinion, owning anonymous crypto-currency is going to be vital.

The anonymity and scaling issues I've basically solved. It is just a matter of implementation and then people following the instructions. As much as possible those procedures need to be automated and made dummy-proof. This will take some time, but not too long.

The main unsolved problem is how we can assure that the peer network of the crypto-currency can always function. I haven't started to tackle this problem yet. I think first one needs to have a lot of capital and then start to work on solutions, such a HAM and shortwave radio as backup for the existing internet infrastructure. These low bandwidth backups are why we will need a new design for the peer network such that all the transactions don't have to be relayed to the block chain in order to be confirmed. That is what my design accomplishes, so we'd already be ready for those communications improvements.

My plea is we need to stop competing over who was on first base and just accept that we need to implement what we need to implement. And get 'er done. We'll all benefit according to our contribution to the solutions we need. May the chips fall where they may according to a meritocracy.