Author

Topic: Evolution is a hoax - page 129. (Read 108046 times)

legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
December 24, 2017, 08:03:17 AM
God is the maker of all things, because all things are machines in one way or another.

Badecker would say that's impossible, since a god cannot make himself and can't be the effect (caused by) something else.

Take away god, all you have left is the theory of evolution - it hasn't be proven wrong yet in billions of scientific observations. 

Cool

Badecker contradicts himself all the time like:

Free will but also everything is determined.
Everything has a cause but god doesn't.
Scientific theories are not known to be true, asks me to prove something by telling him if there is a scientific theory of that something.

He is just going insane, I think.

Now you are simply talking fud.

The free will of man is only free will. It doesn't connect to mans' capabilities. God, who is outside of cause and effect, looks at mans' free will choices, and then goes back to the Beginning, and adjusts the universe, using cause and effect to change the universe according to the free will of mankind, and the objectives that He, God, has.

Cool
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
December 24, 2017, 05:15:25 AM
God is the maker of all things, because all things are machines in one way or another.

Badecker would say that's impossible, since a god cannot make himself and can't be the effect (caused by) something else.

Take away god, all you have left is the theory of evolution - it hasn't be proven wrong yet in billions of scientific observations. 

Cool

Badecker contradicts himself all the time like:

Free will but also everything is determined.
Everything has a cause but god doesn't.
Scientific theories are not known to be true, asks me to prove something by telling him if there is a scientific theory of that something.

He is just going insane, I think.
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
December 24, 2017, 05:13:06 AM

ROFL. What does that mean? You are saying that elements don't decay on their own or what's your argument here, I'm confused, you are just making things up now.

Well, of course, you're confused. That is the issue, or I wouldn't be responding to your confusion.

I'm saying that elements decay via cause and effect, just like everything else works through cause and effect. Is there a solid science theory that shows that elements don't decay by cause and effect? Cause and effect fits everything, because everything has action of some sort.

Cool

Yes? Quantum mechanics is a pretty solid theory that shows that LOL. The timing of the decay of a particular atom is random (to the best of our current knowledge). This is true for a lot of quantum mechanical effects and QM says they are unknowable. This is by the way much more important than finding the cause of a lot of meaningless things here on earth. Because if deep down, on a quantum level, things are truly random then a lot of things are actually truly random. Imagine atoms, if all their movements and actions are random then everything is random.

Again, until you prove that everything has a cause, you are wrong. (And even if radioactive decay has a cause, it still wont prove that everything has a cause)
member
Activity: 294
Merit: 10
December 24, 2017, 12:10:27 AM
I think everything in this world evolutes, we can see this with animals. So i don't think evolution is a hoax
Vod
legendary
Activity: 3668
Merit: 3010
Licking my boob since 1970
December 24, 2017, 12:05:47 AM
God is the maker of all things, because all things are machines in one way or another.

Badecker would say that's impossible, since a god cannot make himself and can't be the effect (caused by) something else.

Take away god, all you have left is the theory of evolution - it hasn't be proven wrong yet in billions of scientific observations. 

Cool
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1756
Verified Bernie Bro - Feel The Bern!
December 23, 2017, 11:40:30 PM

There is lots of evidence for it. It's just that the financial powers that be have gone the route of not being interested in someone developing on. But if it has been developed, it simply has not been advertised.

Cool

Or you could go with the real reason why we don't have a Scientific Theory of god which is clearly that such a Theory simply by nature can never pass the requirements of a Scientific Theory.

The vast majority of you posts are full of blatant bullshit, made up things from your crazy brain and flagrant misrepresentations.

I mean I get why your posts are full of that shit, it's literally all you have.

It's quite amusing to watch someone who has almost 0 understanding of the ACTUAL Scientific Theory of Evolution trying to argue against it.

You are so much like the Flat Earthers it's fucking creepy.

Go back to your incest filled, child killing, slavery manual written by warmongering goat herders that couldn't even fucking write at the time of supposed divination.

Leave science to people with an actual ability to think critically.

I don't blame you. Since your religion obviously doesn't include God, I can understand how you would be upset to find that God exists. But don't you want the truth? Consider:

Cause and effect, something that shows scientifically that everything is programmed to act the way it does within the whole universe, almost proves that God exists all by itself (C&E)!

You should study a little before you use defamatory statements.

This is the "Evolution is a hoax" thread. But I don't blame you for forgetting that part of this thread. Why not? It's so easy to realize that C&E proves God at the same time it disprove the evolution presented by evolution theory.

However, don't you want to find the real religion? Why would you continue with the foolish religion of evolution, and the foolish religion that doesn't have God in it? Think... so that you can live in reality rather than science fiction as you are living.

Cool

Answer the question:  WHAT WAS THE CAUSE OF GOD

Since according to you EVERYTHING has a cause...



First prove that God is a thing/a something/an everything. Once you prove that, then we can start to determine what God's cause might be. Up until then, we don't know that He needs a cause.

Cool

So you're saying he doesn't exist then. Thanks, I agree god is nothing!

Actually, that is your suggestion that God doesn't exist. When you consider the machine nature of the universe, and that machines have makers, God is the maker of all things, because all things are machines in one way or another.

So, you don't like God. What does that have to do with the fact that evolution is a hoax?

Cool

I neither like nor dislike god, personally I'm not able to like or dislike something that doesn't exist. 

Now take the whole machine universe out for a sec, stay on topic bud (I know you just love to through out the red herrings but focus for a sec), we were talking about C&E proving god and the bible making evolution a hoax.

You said EVERYTHING has a cause and effect.  Either god is something or nothing or supernatural and it's both. 

Now if you want to make the claim that it is nothing and something at the same time therefore he isn't subject to C&E then fine go ahead but understand now you're bringing the supernatural into it. 

Now that the supernatural is involved we can easily throw out every single argument you make as irrelevant, scientifically.  As such any claim you make about the validity of evolution must be subject to your belief system.

Either concede god is supernatural, which by definition takes science out of the equation and requires faith.
Or concede god is something which by your definition requires a cause and creates and endless loop of circular logic.
Or concede that we just don't actually know if there is a C&E for EVERYTHING.

If you want to run around telling people the earth is about 6000 years old and evolution is a hoax or any other horse shit you want, by all means go ahead that's your right.  But don't think for one second when you try and use supernatural to explain science that rational people wont laugh at your stupidity.

Now why is this relevant?  It's mostly young earth creationist and the religious community disputing things like the Theory of Evolution.  It is entirely fair to point out that that view requires a supernatural belief and incredible amount of faith.  Anyone reading the comments should know what agenda those kinds of people are pushing.

P.S  if you really think I'm OT here feel free to report me to the mods if they agree with you they will trash my posts and I won't care.



legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
December 23, 2017, 10:51:28 PM

There is lots of evidence for it. It's just that the financial powers that be have gone the route of not being interested in someone developing on. But if it has been developed, it simply has not been advertised.

Cool

Or you could go with the real reason why we don't have a Scientific Theory of god which is clearly that such a Theory simply by nature can never pass the requirements of a Scientific Theory.

The vast majority of you posts are full of blatant bullshit, made up things from your crazy brain and flagrant misrepresentations.

I mean I get why your posts are full of that shit, it's literally all you have.

It's quite amusing to watch someone who has almost 0 understanding of the ACTUAL Scientific Theory of Evolution trying to argue against it.

You are so much like the Flat Earthers it's fucking creepy.

Go back to your incest filled, child killing, slavery manual written by warmongering goat herders that couldn't even fucking write at the time of supposed divination.

Leave science to people with an actual ability to think critically.

I don't blame you. Since your religion obviously doesn't include God, I can understand how you would be upset to find that God exists. But don't you want the truth? Consider:

Cause and effect, something that shows scientifically that everything is programmed to act the way it does within the whole universe, almost proves that God exists all by itself (C&E)!

You should study a little before you use defamatory statements.

This is the "Evolution is a hoax" thread. But I don't blame you for forgetting that part of this thread. Why not? It's so easy to realize that C&E proves God at the same time it disprove the evolution presented by evolution theory.

However, don't you want to find the real religion? Why would you continue with the foolish religion of evolution, and the foolish religion that doesn't have God in it? Think... so that you can live in reality rather than science fiction as you are living.

Cool

Answer the question:  WHAT WAS THE CAUSE OF GOD

Since according to you EVERYTHING has a cause...



First prove that God is a thing/a something/an everything. Once you prove that, then we can start to determine what God's cause might be. Up until then, we don't know that He needs a cause.

Cool

So you're saying he doesn't exist then. Thanks, I agree god is nothing!

Actually, that is your suggestion that God doesn't exist. When you consider the machine nature of the universe, and that machines have makers, God is the maker of all things, because all things are machines in one way or another.

So, you don't like God. What does that have to do with the fact that evolution is a hoax?

Cool
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1756
Verified Bernie Bro - Feel The Bern!
December 23, 2017, 10:13:46 PM

There is lots of evidence for it. It's just that the financial powers that be have gone the route of not being interested in someone developing on. But if it has been developed, it simply has not been advertised.

Cool

Or you could go with the real reason why we don't have a Scientific Theory of god which is clearly that such a Theory simply by nature can never pass the requirements of a Scientific Theory.

The vast majority of you posts are full of blatant bullshit, made up things from your crazy brain and flagrant misrepresentations.

I mean I get why your posts are full of that shit, it's literally all you have.

It's quite amusing to watch someone who has almost 0 understanding of the ACTUAL Scientific Theory of Evolution trying to argue against it.

You are so much like the Flat Earthers it's fucking creepy.

Go back to your incest filled, child killing, slavery manual written by warmongering goat herders that couldn't even fucking write at the time of supposed divination.

Leave science to people with an actual ability to think critically.

I don't blame you. Since your religion obviously doesn't include God, I can understand how you would be upset to find that God exists. But don't you want the truth? Consider:

Cause and effect, something that shows scientifically that everything is programmed to act the way it does within the whole universe, almost proves that God exists all by itself (C&E)!

You should study a little before you use defamatory statements.

This is the "Evolution is a hoax" thread. But I don't blame you for forgetting that part of this thread. Why not? It's so easy to realize that C&E proves God at the same time it disprove the evolution presented by evolution theory.

However, don't you want to find the real religion? Why would you continue with the foolish religion of evolution, and the foolish religion that doesn't have God in it? Think... so that you can live in reality rather than science fiction as you are living.

Cool

Answer the question:  WHAT WAS THE CAUSE OF GOD

Since according to you EVERYTHING has a cause...



First prove that God is a thing/a something/an everything. Once you prove that, then we can start to determine what God's cause might be. Up until then, we don't know that He needs a cause.

Cool

So you're saying he doesn't exist then. Thanks, I agree god is nothing!
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
December 23, 2017, 10:04:48 PM

There is lots of evidence for it. It's just that the financial powers that be have gone the route of not being interested in someone developing on. But if it has been developed, it simply has not been advertised.

Cool

Or you could go with the real reason why we don't have a Scientific Theory of god which is clearly that such a Theory simply by nature can never pass the requirements of a Scientific Theory.

The vast majority of you posts are full of blatant bullshit, made up things from your crazy brain and flagrant misrepresentations.

I mean I get why your posts are full of that shit, it's literally all you have.

It's quite amusing to watch someone who has almost 0 understanding of the ACTUAL Scientific Theory of Evolution trying to argue against it.

You are so much like the Flat Earthers it's fucking creepy.

Go back to your incest filled, child killing, slavery manual written by warmongering goat herders that couldn't even fucking write at the time of supposed divination.

Leave science to people with an actual ability to think critically.

I don't blame you. Since your religion obviously doesn't include God, I can understand how you would be upset to find that God exists. But don't you want the truth? Consider:

Cause and effect, something that shows scientifically that everything is programmed to act the way it does within the whole universe, almost proves that God exists all by itself (C&E)!

You should study a little before you use defamatory statements.

This is the "Evolution is a hoax" thread. But I don't blame you for forgetting that part of this thread. Why not? It's so easy to realize that C&E proves God at the same time it disprove the evolution presented by evolution theory.

However, don't you want to find the real religion? Why would you continue with the foolish religion of evolution, and the foolish religion that doesn't have God in it? Think... so that you can live in reality rather than science fiction as you are living.

Cool

Answer the question:  WHAT WAS THE CAUSE OF GOD

Since according to you EVERYTHING has a cause...



First prove that God is a thing/a something/an everything. Once you prove that, then we can start to determine what God's cause might be. Up until then, we don't know that He needs a cause.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1756
Verified Bernie Bro - Feel The Bern!
December 23, 2017, 09:22:30 PM

There is lots of evidence for it. It's just that the financial powers that be have gone the route of not being interested in someone developing on. But if it has been developed, it simply has not been advertised.

Cool

Or you could go with the real reason why we don't have a Scientific Theory of god which is clearly that such a Theory simply by nature can never pass the requirements of a Scientific Theory.

The vast majority of you posts are full of blatant bullshit, made up things from your crazy brain and flagrant misrepresentations.

I mean I get why your posts are full of that shit, it's literally all you have.

It's quite amusing to watch someone who has almost 0 understanding of the ACTUAL Scientific Theory of Evolution trying to argue against it.

You are so much like the Flat Earthers it's fucking creepy.

Go back to your incest filled, child killing, slavery manual written by warmongering goat herders that couldn't even fucking write at the time of supposed divination.

Leave science to people with an actual ability to think critically.

I don't blame you. Since your religion obviously doesn't include God, I can understand how you would be upset to find that God exists. But don't you want the truth? Consider:

Cause and effect, something that shows scientifically that everything is programmed to act the way it does within the whole universe, almost proves that God exists all by itself (C&E)!

You should study a little before you use defamatory statements.

This is the "Evolution is a hoax" thread. But I don't blame you for forgetting that part of this thread. Why not? It's so easy to realize that C&E proves God at the same time it disprove the evolution presented by evolution theory.

However, don't you want to find the real religion? Why would you continue with the foolish religion of evolution, and the foolish religion that doesn't have God in it? Think... so that you can live in reality rather than science fiction as you are living.

Cool

Answer the question:  WHAT WAS THE CAUSE OF GOD

Since according to you EVERYTHING has a cause...

legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
December 23, 2017, 08:14:17 PM

There is lots of evidence for it. It's just that the financial powers that be have gone the route of not being interested in someone developing on. But if it has been developed, it simply has not been advertised.

Cool

Or you could go with the real reason why we don't have a Scientific Theory of god which is clearly that such a Theory simply by nature can never pass the requirements of a Scientific Theory.

The vast majority of you posts are full of blatant bullshit, made up things from your crazy brain and flagrant misrepresentations.

I mean I get why your posts are full of that shit, it's literally all you have.

It's quite amusing to watch someone who has almost 0 understanding of the ACTUAL Scientific Theory of Evolution trying to argue against it.

You are so much like the Flat Earthers it's fucking creepy.

Go back to your incest filled, child killing, slavery manual written by warmongering goat herders that couldn't even fucking write at the time of supposed divination.

Leave science to people with an actual ability to think critically.

I don't blame you. Since your religion obviously doesn't include God, I can understand how you would be upset to find that God exists. But don't you want the truth? Consider:

Cause and effect, something that shows scientifically that everything is programmed to act the way it does within the whole universe, almost proves that God exists all by itself (C&E)!

You should study a little before you use defamatory statements.

This is the "Evolution is a hoax" thread. But I don't blame you for forgetting that part of this thread. Why not? It's so easy to realize that C&E proves God at the same time it disprove the evolution presented by evolution theory.

However, don't you want to find the real religion? Why would you continue with the foolish religion of evolution, and the foolish religion that doesn't have God in it? Think... so that you can live in reality rather than science fiction as you are living.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1756
Verified Bernie Bro - Feel The Bern!
December 23, 2017, 08:07:02 PM

There is lots of evidence for it. It's just that the financial powers that be have gone the route of not being interested in someone developing on. But if it has been developed, it simply has not been advertised.

Cool

Or you could go with the real reason why we don't have a Scientific Theory of god which is clearly that such a Theory simply by nature can never pass the requirements of a Scientific Theory.

The vast majority of you posts are full of blatant bullshit, made up things from your crazy brain and flagrant misrepresentations.

I mean I get why your posts are full of that shit, it's literally all you have.

It's quite amusing to watch someone who has almost 0 understanding of the ACTUAL Scientific Theory of Evolution trying to argue against it.

You are so much like the Flat Earthers it's fucking creepy.

Go back to your incest filled, child killing, slavery manual written by warmongering goat herders that couldn't even fucking write at the time of supposed divination.

Leave science to people with an actual ability to think critically.
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1756
Verified Bernie Bro - Feel The Bern!
December 23, 2017, 07:50:08 PM

ROFL. What does that mean? You are saying that elements don't decay on their own or what's your argument here, I'm confused, you are just making things up now.

Well, of course, you're confused. That is the issue, or I wouldn't be responding to your confusion.

I'm saying that elements decay via cause and effect, just like everything else works through cause and effect. Is there a solid science theory that shows that elements don't decay by cause and effect? Cause and effect fits everything, because everything has action of some sort.

Cool

So what is the cause of god?
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
December 23, 2017, 07:08:59 PM

ROFL. What does that mean? You are saying that elements don't decay on their own or what's your argument here, I'm confused, you are just making things up now.

Well, of course, you're confused. That is the issue, or I wouldn't be responding to your confusion.

I'm saying that elements decay via cause and effect, just like everything else works through cause and effect. Is there a solid science theory that shows that elements don't decay by cause and effect? Cause and effect fits everything, because everything has action of some sort.

Cool
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
December 23, 2017, 07:07:53 PM

Most mutations are neutral. Nachman and Crowell estimate around 3 deleterious mutations out of 175 per generation in humans (2000). Of those that have significant effect, most are harmful, but the fraction which are beneficial is higher than usually though. An experiment with E. coli found that about 1 in 150 newly arising mutations and 1 in 10 functional mutations are beneficial (Perfeito et al. 2007).

You missed the part about cause and effect directing the mutations coming into being. This means that they don't really even fit the definition of mutation, even though they are something not normally seen.

Cool

When you prove that everything has a cause, which you haven't yet I will agree with you.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
December 23, 2017, 07:05:37 PM

Well you said that all the scientific evidence for evolution would fit better for creation so why don't we have a creation theory if what you said it's true?

If there isn't any creation theory, it's because no scientist made one up, yet. We both know that the body of science writing is so great, that we don't know that there isn't any creation theory.

Cool

Yet you believe they made a hoax one but the one that's real, has no scientific theory? Makes sense to me Cool

Didn't I just say that there isn't any creation theory that we know of? Can't you read?

Cool

''that we know of'' What you mean, that we know of. There isn't one because there is not even 1 single piece of evidence for it lmao.

There is lots of evidence for it. It's just that the financial powers that be have gone the route of not being interested in someone developing on. But if it has been developed, it simply has not been advertised.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
December 23, 2017, 07:03:40 PM

Most mutations are neutral. Nachman and Crowell estimate around 3 deleterious mutations out of 175 per generation in humans (2000). Of those that have significant effect, most are harmful, but the fraction which are beneficial is higher than usually though. An experiment with E. coli found that about 1 in 150 newly arising mutations and 1 in 10 functional mutations are beneficial (Perfeito et al. 2007).

You missed the part about cause and effect directing the mutations coming into being. This means that they don't really even fit the definition of mutation, even though they are something not normally seen.

Cool
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
December 23, 2017, 07:02:31 PM
I never heard anybody knit-pick a topic as much as you. The teensy-eensy bit of lab work that shows that evolution just might possibly exist, has been caused by scientists setting it all up to find what they were looking for. That exact causation defies evolution theory about random mutations.

There is absolutely nothing in nature that has ever been observed that has ever been proven to be part of evolution. Everything in nature that seems to be scientific evidence for evolution, scientifically fits creation better.

Evolution is a hoax.

Cool

What about the peppered moth during the industrial revolution?


What about it? Until you show that there is pure random in the mix somewhere, all you are saying is that the moth was programmed into nature this way, by cause and effect, no matter what caused it. This is completely opposite evolution theory that depends on random mutations.

Cool

I already did, radioactive decay, until you prove there isn't pure random all you are saying is bullshit.

And I already showed you that when scientists make new elements that decay, they have created radioactive decay in the lab. Cause and effect.

Cool

ROFL. What does that mean? You are saying that elements don't decay on their own or what's your argument here, I'm confused, you are just making things up now.
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
December 23, 2017, 07:00:46 PM

Well you said that all the scientific evidence for evolution would fit better for creation so why don't we have a creation theory if what you said it's true?

If there isn't any creation theory, it's because no scientist made one up, yet. We both know that the body of science writing is so great, that we don't know that there isn't any creation theory.

Cool

Yet you believe they made a hoax one but the one that's real, has no scientific theory? Makes sense to me Cool

Didn't I just say that there isn't any creation theory that we know of? Can't you read?

Cool

''that we know of'' What you mean, that we know of. There isn't one because there is not even 1 single piece of evidence for it lmao.
hero member
Activity: 1624
Merit: 645
December 23, 2017, 06:59:54 PM
I never heard anybody knit-pick a topic as much as you. The teensy-eensy bit of lab work that shows that evolution just might possibly exist, has been caused by scientists setting it all up to find what they were looking for. That exact causation defies evolution theory about random mutations.

There is absolutely nothing in nature that has ever been observed that has ever been proven to be part of evolution. Everything in nature that seems to be scientific evidence for evolution, scientifically fits creation better.

Evolution is a hoax.

Cool

What about the peppered moth during the industrial revolution?


What about it? Until you show that there is pure random in the mix somewhere, all you are saying is that the moth was programmed into nature this way, by cause and effect, no matter what caused it. This is completely opposite evolution theory that depends on random mutations.

Cool

But even if there were random mutations, the odds are very great that beneficial random mutations would be far fewer in number than detrimental mutations. Their cumulative effect would be overcome by the detrimental mutations, and by the vast amount of places where no mutations occur, that they would be destroyed long before they could advance into some kind of evolution change.

Survival of the fittest would destroy the beneficial changes in just the same way that evolutionists try to use them to show evolutionary advances, but even more, because there are way few beneficial changes compared with detrimental changes and no changes. In fact, a beneficial mutation has not really been observed ever. There is no way to logically suggest beneficial mutations could survive, even if we could find one.

Cool

Most mutations are neutral. Nachman and Crowell estimate around 3 deleterious mutations out of 175 per generation in humans (2000). Of those that have significant effect, most are harmful, but the fraction which are beneficial is higher than usually though. An experiment with E. coli found that about 1 in 150 newly arising mutations and 1 in 10 functional mutations are beneficial (Perfeito et al. 2007).

The harmful mutations do not survive long, and the beneficial mutations survive much longer, so when you consider only surviving mutations, most are beneficial.

Beneficial mutations are commonly observed. They are common enough to be problems in the cases of antibiotic resistance in disease-causing organisms and pesticide resistance in agricultural pests (e.g., Newcomb et al. 1997; these are not merely selection of pre-existing variation.) They can be repeatedly observed in laboratory populations (Wichman et al. 1999). Other examples include the following:
Mutations have given bacteria the ability to degrade nylon (Prijambada et al. 1995).
Plant breeders have used mutation breeding to induce mutations and select the beneficial ones (FAO/IAEA 1977).
Certain mutations in humans confer resistance to AIDS (Dean et al. 1996; Sullivan et al. 2001) or to heart disease (Long 1994; Weisgraber et al. 1983).
A mutation in humans makes bones strong (Boyden et al. 2002).
Transposons are common, especially in plants, and help to provide beneficial diversity (Moffat 2000).
In vitro mutation and selection can be used to evolve substantially improved function of RNA molecules, such as a ribozyme (Wright and Joyce 1997).

Whether a mutation is beneficial or not depends on environment. A mutation that helps the organism in one circumstance could harm it in another. When the environment changes, variations that once were counteradaptive suddenly become favored. Since environments are constantly changing, variation helps populations survive, even if some of those variations do not do as well as others. When beneficial mutations occur in a changed environment, they generally sweep through the population rapidly (Elena et al. 1996).

High mutation rates are advantageous in some environments. Hypermutable strains of Pseudomonas aeruginosa are found more commonly in the lungs of cystic fibrosis patients, where antibiotics and other stresses increase selection pressure and variability, than in patients without cystic fibrosis (Oliver et al. 2000).

Note that the existence of any beneficial mutations is a falsification of the young-earth creationism model (Morris 1985, 13).
Jump to: