Topic: HODL bitcoins, you can do it! Look at HODL camp map to build up strong hands - page 2. (Read 2939 times)

Well, that's the only thing that you can do about this kind of thing, it's not your money and they can survive. Seeing people reliant on trading for their daily expenses is like watching a those stunt drivers in circuses do deadly tricks and showmanship, they don't have to do it as there are other ways to do it but they do it anyway and you're in awe that they're risking their lives just to live another day of not starving. It's really difficult to make money with trading especially with a lot of retail investors and small traders losing a lot of money because they don't know how to do it and they're lacking in information to do informed decisions so that's double the admiration if you think about it, watching that computer all day without rest and having to rely on meager profit through scalping, you can only watch or listen in awe when you see this and when these traders tell you this kind of things that they're doing.

I am not good in math with that 10 year frame but sure it is going to be worth it with that journey if someone is able to invest $250/week or $1k/monthly. That's how it goes but I am also as well thinking about the itching side of the probable selling during that period and it might not reach that amount after 10 years. But the good thing with this is that guy that does accumulation weekly or monthly is still on the right path whether he's going to have some tough decision that he has decided to sell some. And as for that 5 year hypo guy, that's more likely what it is going to be with most people today but the consistency is one thing that's hard to maintain.

They are just fooling theirselves to get good gains by trading their bitcoins on daily basis since they cannot actually get passive results for it and might there's just huge chance for them to lost all bitcoins they have if sudden shift of momentum came like a unexpected correction will happen and they are not been prepared for it to happen.

That's why its better if they just use their money for accumulating since nothing more best decision to do that especially if they don't have enough knowledge on trading since for sure they can get more better profit results for hodl than trading. I know we can read a lot of hype stories about their trading gains but people need to understand that this is not consistent result also there's big chance to lose if they are not careful and became so greedy on taking some risky decisions on what they are trying to trade.

The first thing I want you to understand is that trading is not for everyone, secondly, trading is not as easy as most influencer makes it looks like, and if am not mistaken, it's only like 2% of traders that are making money from it out of 100% , so the earlier you realize it the better.

But when it comes to investing in Bitcoin through the DCA method, you don't need any skill before you invest, all you need is basic knowledge on how to be buying weekly or monthly, and a deeper knowledge on what it entails on how to hold effectively, by having a source of income and an emergency fund, and I can certain that, that is the perfect recipe for wealth building as long as you are a long term holder.

You are new to the forum, I don't know if you are also new to Bitcoin. Most of us starting from trading and got excited at the early stages especially during bull market when every buys almost instantly yield profits, we were so hyped with the euphoria of easy money. It was with time we realised that trading isn't an easy way of making money. I personally paid the price and wished I never followed that route. Today when I look at the volume of Bitcoin I had traded without holding any of them, I feel depressed and wished I could turn back the hands of time.  My only consolation is the fact that I I joined this forum, learnt about a method of investing in Bitcoin called DCA and started building my portfolio afresh. So I call my ordeal the price of learning.

If you are so engrossed in trading and you are really making good profit from it, I will encourage you to immediately set aside those profits in a separate wallet an hold them with long term in view. But if you know that trading is making you turn round the same cycle of profit/loss without any progress, then there is need to change your plans into holding Bitcoin instead of trading.

as also trading is just a way for those that are wealthy to make more money , don't be decieved that starting up with small capitals in trading you would be able to secure a good wealth ( though it may have worked for some individuals) but how certain is going to work for you also. The reason I don't advice anyone to go into trading expecially those are that are not financially stable, is because one may have a monthly pay job , with the interest of wanting to trade and invest at same time with his earnings. Inorder for such person to keep he would have to share his earning in different varieties, like some percentage for emergency funds ( for covering of expenses) , trading capital and some for investing. And as a low earner doing so would reduce your accumulation of bitcoin. And don't forget that in trading losses are inegligible (so sometime he may lose his capital in trading causing some set back) . That one need to prioritize in holding instead and forget about trading , when doing so he only have to keep some percentage for emergency funds and some for accumulating more bitcoin. In doing so he would be able to balance the system, making his accumulation more efficient and saving a better future for himself.
you are right, that why I won't encourage low coiners like myself to think of selling from their investment with the mindset of replacing it back, because one doing so how certain, would you buy back in a lower price. Because buying when the price low , is an advantage to have more quantities in your portfolio than buying when the price is high,  just  as you said one should focus on Accumulating so that as time goes he may get to point of having enough, and earn his self a reliable income.

I don't know because if we go by today's spot price, as I type this post (around $69k), then any of us would have had to have bought right around 7.25 BTC  in 2015 for $250 each, which would have been around $1,812, and then we would have had to hold onto those BTC through all the ups and downs between 2015 and now.

Another possibility would have had been to buy 2x, 3x or 4x that amount, and then we would have had more liberty to sell some of them along the way, yet still have at least 7.25 BTC remaining in our holdings today.

I was largely attempting to show the power of exponential growth rather than picking any specific quantity of BTC that should have had been accumulated, and so part of the power of exponential growth and compounding of value is that it folds upon itself to have way higher magnitude, so right now we are in the supra 256x phase with 8 doublings, and if we get over $128k,, then we will be into the 9th doubling of that same initial amount... so a lot of power comes from just holding and allowing for the doublings to take place.

Of course, guys who started later, would have fewer doublings, and maybe even guys who screw up their average cost per BTC would have fewer doublings as well.

I personally like to proclaim that my own costs per BTC are right around $1k, so I have already lost a couple of the earlier doublings, due to some of my own mistakes along the way.. so therefore in my own situation, I am more likely ONLY feeling the compounding of right around 6 doublings, which would be closer to around 64x rather than 256x... but that's o.k... each of us do our best, and sometimes, it may well be better to have more BTC and have higher costs per BTC rather than having a lower amount of BTC at cheaper costs per BTC... so the guy who spent $100k and got 100 BTC ($1k per BTC) is going to be better of than the guy who spent $10k and got 25 BTC ($400 per BTC).


March 2020 would have surely been a bad time to sell your BTC, unless you figured out your mistake and bought back soon thereafter, even if you figure out that you had made a mistake.

Part of the problem of selling too many BTC too soon is that it causes psychological problems involved in buying back in, so instead of having regrets, any of us should be making sure that we have enough BTC. and so right now, if you conclude that you don't have enough BTC, then the main solution to that is buying.. and yeah of course, you can have some plans in case the BTC price dips, but the main thing is to buy more BTC if your conclusion is that you do not have enough BTC... It can take a long time to build up any savings including a BTC portfolio, yet one of the advantages of BTC is that once you get to a point in which you have enough, then you can likely start to draw from them and have a reliable income, yet in the meantime, you have to get to that point of having enough prior to being able to start drawing from them.


It is good that if you started back up in 2022.. so yeah, keep going and keep building your BTC stash, even if it is just a modest amount of $100 per week or whatever you can do.. and at some point you may well end up concluding that you have enough BTC to start to feel comfortable starting to draw from it... .. so if your goal might be to get to $500k, then even in 10 years (the middle of 2034), 1.5 BTC may well be enough to have half a million of solid value, and you could probably start to draw upon it once you get to your target... I personally measure in regards to the bottom which I still consider to be the 200-WMA, but if you are continuing to build and you get more than 1.5 BTC in 10 years, then you might be able to start drawing from your BTC sooner than 10 years.  For example in the middle of 2029, then you would only need right around 3.35 BTC in order to have $500k as your bottom.. in which you could start to draw upon it (if a $500k bottom value were to be your goal).

That is half a million to this date? started at 250$  in 9 years , that is how I regret my past selling specially when I got bad in gambling and when I starter to wake up from my mistakes here is the pandemic that I need to take all my funds out.
but yeah since 2022 I started to recover again and now those mistakes will never happen again.
thank you for reminding us how grateful we are being in Bitcoin investing.

Living off of your trades is one thing, yet one of the important things about bitcoin is that it is a great investment vehicle.

So if a guy is able to live off of trading and live a regular life, while at the same time having enough left over that he is able to save between 5% and 25% of his income into bitcoin, then he is doing even better because he is saving for a future - otherwise, he is going to be working his whole life and never getting anywhere.. so I am not sure if that would be a very good way to live... and so yeah, sure how are you going to measure the matter in terms of comparing to other kinds of work that he might be able to do.

Let's say that he generally could get work for $4k per month, and so his expenses might be $3k, so then he ends up investing $1k per month and/or $250 per week into bitcoin.  Historically we could look this up to see how many bitcoin he would have had after 5 years or 10 years of investing in that kind of a way.  A guy who trades might be skimming off value to live, but then he also might be building his investment capital so that he is able to work with more and more capital the longer that he is trading, the more investment capital he is able to build up... But then is he putting that capital at risk?  probably.  The trader has a mentality to always be putting his capital to work, and so maybe a question of success would be how much is his investment capital growing, and is it growing at a similar rate as someone who had been able to have a regular job and to put aside $250 per week for the past 10 years.

My Hypothetical 2 guy has right around 115 BTC after 10 years of investing $250 per week into BTC, which surely is not a bad place to be.  Is the trader going to beat hypothetical 2 guy?  and hypothetical 5 guy shows that $250 per week would have resulted in around 5 bitcoin up until now if his investment timeline had been for 5 years.


An overwhelming majority of regular people are going to be way better off by just investing into bitcoin regularly rather than trying to trade it.

Yes, there is atom of truth in the claim that being a trader is the way to riches because trading will enable one to have a better understanding of the system which is the major factor that will enhance the riches. In otherwise, trading can also have some disadvantage when the prerequisite skill is not well conceive and develop, for one to be a good trader and make riches out of it there must be unprecedented determination and consistency as well as endurance and dedication.

I also do admire those people that have been completely reliant to Bitcoin in all means of their survival. Like how? through trading or any other tasks that they're paid to do so. But if it's with trading, I'd say that it's kind of hard to survive with it and be wholly reliant on it having no other source of living. But I know the fact that there are traders, full time, that can make as much as they can but with the perspective of not a trader or just do it casually, it's truly hard.

exactly, And this where reserve funds comes in , if you are the type that is always waiting for the dip before thinking of accumulating bitcoin. Such individual may endup not accumulating any at all, because the dip you're hoping for may not happen. So in order to avoid such you must set aside a reserve funds in case if any may occur (dip) , while you keep accumulating Bitcoin with DCAing strategy. Because in investing one need to be flexible and always prepared.

the only people that would be in panicky now are those who trade with their bitcoin inorder to gain short-term profits. While those who are holding are not bothered with such drop in price, but how they can go around stashing more bitcoin, yeah lately bitcoin has being being trying to beat  $73k , so if check market chart you would see that bitcoin as made some attempt in beating that price range of $73k so this drop in price is just another correction for Bitcoin to gather some strength to beat the recent ATH which is Around $73k so I don't see any reason to panic, and also my mind as already set for long-term investment so I don't take this as anything worth panicky.

I personally like the idea of continuing to buy that would supplement HODLing rather than mere HODLing...

But, yeah each time you buy more BTC, you add a new date to the HODL of those particular coins.

So you end up with a bunch of coins with differing purchase dates and so then differing levels of profitability, and of course, depending on your accounting, you can treat them separately, you can average them out or you can account for them in both ways to figure out your options regarding the coins... and surely feeling better to be profitable rather than now being profitable, yet from my point of view there can be a lot more value in terms of having the value compound upon itself over a longer period or maybe through a quick price run up, so there could be temptations based on volatility to try to take advantage of some of the price run ups - including that guys need to be careful not to sell too many of their coins too soon based on their perception of short term profits that might not be as great as longer term profits that let the coins ride for longer periods and to experience more and more compounding of value effects... which leads into the power of exponentials that sometimes can be difficult to appreciate.

If you look at BTC prices since 2015, you can see that currently, we have had right around 8 doublings in BTC prices, yet that also show 256x increase in the actual BTC price.. so the doublings have compounding effects on the value of our BTC holdings that are quite powerful, even though exponential growth is not so apparent through our tendencies to think about value growth in more linear ways and so we frequently will fail to appreciate the exponential way of considering the matter.



That is part of the problem of daily spending and not holding a decent portion of your BTC aside.. you might get a bunch of short term profits, but you may well lose out on the longer term value compounding because you are in and out and spending it on a regular basis.  Of course, we do want there to be some spending of bitcoin in order to have various ways to have ways to liquidate BTC, even that if people want bitcoin, the some of us still want to have avenues to spend our bitcoin, even if we might be spending only small portions at any given time, and surely some guys will be doing spend and replace.


Fuck shitcoins and trading.. that is a distraction.. .to the extent that shitcoins are even on topic in this thread... and maybe trading might be more potentially topical because it is a contrast to hodl, so sure some guys here might consider that they might be able to play BTC's price waves, yet at the same time the HODL camp map shows that BTC prices tend to become profitable with time, so why risk trading if you are already good chances of being profitable with the mere passage of time?


You seem to not know what is a dump.

In the last day or two we have had right around a 11.111111% correction if we count from the local top of $73,794 and the current local bottom of $65,569, and right now as I type this post we are bouncing around $68,400-ish.

There is nothing unusual about any of that, and anyone who is investing into bitcoin whether newbie or longer term bitcoiner, should already realize that the BTC price does not go straight up, even though sometimes there might be long periods in which it goes up a lot, but there could also be long periods in which it goes down a lot, and so each of us should have systems in place (in which we continue to mostly hold our bitcoin) in order to deal with periods of UP and DOWN that cannot always be known.. especially in the short term... even though we likely can anticipate long term trends to continue to be up.. . which is part of the rationale to continue to hold BTC and to accumulate it no matter the BTC price direction, especially if you are a no coiner, a low coiner, or you perceive yourself to not have enough BTC.

We have surely been in an up cycle since our bottom of $15,479 in November 2022, yet we might not have had realized that we are in an uptrend until much later (maybe not even being sure until sometime after October 2023).. and so if the trend is going to change at some point in time from UP to down, we might not realize when the trend is going to change, so part of the question can be attempting to figure out how to treat your BTC holdings during so much volatility that is almost inevitable in bitcoinlandia, and if you don't have enough BTC what you should do about buying BTC, which likely if you don't have any BTC, then the ONLY way to prepare for up is to buy some.  

If you don't have any BTC and you think that your best strategy is to wait for further down in order to buy some, then you are not prepared for up, and you are ONLY preparing for down, which might not end up happening, then what are you going to do?  Buy higher?  Over the years, we have seen a lot of folks who think that they are preparing to get into bitcoin by waiting for prices to go down, and a lot of those people keep waiting, fail to act, so they end up not being prepared for the up that ended up happening.

If you have some BTC, but you feel that you don't have enough, you are not in as bad of a position as the no coiner because you have some preparation for UP, but if you believe that you don't have enough BTC, then you likely need to buy rather than wait.. and sure, you do not have to buy with whatever cash reserves that you have.  Managing your cash reserves and the various methods of buying BTC is another story, in which DCA, lump sum and buying on dips are the three accumulation strategies that can be exercised separately or in combination.

Which way you believe the BTC price might be going is ONLY one of the factors to consider when figuring out your own situation, and so of course, figuring out your own financial and psychological situation in regards to bitcoin is also important if you want to have bitcoin to play potentially significant role in your life - especially since we seem to still be in the relatively early stages of the greatest wealth transfer known to mankind  from no coiners and low coiners to coiners, so each of us should prefer to be on the receiving end if possible, and surely some people in the world have more disposable/discretionary income than others in order to buy some bitcoin, and bitcoin still provides benefits to the no coiners and low coiners by providing a more fair system, yet I am sure anyone appreciates if he is able to experience some direct benefits from bitcoin too.. which comes from attempting to own as much as you can without over doing it.. no one should want to end up having no coins or low coins because they over did it and they screwed up their investment into something that is nearly guaranteed (of course there are no guarantees) to return profits with the passage of time and the prudent, persistent, consistent and perhaps aggressive accumulation of coins.

Today the HODLING thing is under testing once again as the price of bitcoin is showing a big dump in price , dropping from ATH 73$k now at 67$k , that is 6k drop in 24 hours , does this mean there is a panicking happening ?
those who pretend to be Holder but when there is a red blood market is starting to sell out? 

You have a point there. Bitcoin is clearly an investment that can deliver returns faster than most other assets and investments and that is why we choose it. But many people always deny that they choose bitcoin to invest not because they want to get rich quickly. As you pointed out: there is no asset that can grow 10%, even 30%, 50% in a few months like bitcoin, so people who say they invest in bitcoin are not for the idea of getting rich quickly is a lie. But that doesn't mean bitcoin is a gamble that can make us rich overnight or in a few weeks. Bitcoin's fast speed means that it has a faster rate of return than other assets.

Truth i agree. Another fact is that not many persons are holding bitcoin for the long run, through highs and lows, good times and bad times even when people start panicking or start. selling because not everyone will actually believe in the currency as a viable technology. In my opinion every investor should be holding at least 0.1% of btc which is 10% of btc and enjoy the sweet ride in the bull run.

Before the bull run ends 1 btc might be equivalent to 4 btc previous in the previous years. Bitcoin has already than better than silver in the last decade and it will do more than Gold if gold doesn't take its place now. I believe it will hold its value more than fiat currency including the mighty dollar.

If they don't want to make their life hard they must eliminate the thoughts of trading altcoins since it will just give them a stress especially these tokens is usually so unpredictable and might they lose their money if they pick the wrong positions or just got FOMO on the tokens they bought.

But if they want to stay intact and get less stress then I guess going to invest on bitcoin for long term maybe best solution for them they just need to look up the price history of bitcoin and for sure they can able to know how big the potential of bitcoin to hold for much longer years. Data's about it is available online so if they could just read a lot of information about it then for sure that they can learn a lot from it and can able to do good decisions upon what's good investment for theirselves.

The price of bitcoin increases as the time passes so if someone hold it longer without selling it at any stage during fear will get huge profit. The profit from Bitcoin depends on the time of holding and it is based on the investors thoughts that how long he keeps his bitcoin.

Some people are also involved in trading with altcoins but they face troubles when the price suddenly goes down and altcoins also possess risk. Now a days one can easily buy and sell altcoins as price is regularly fluctuating and at the same time one can hold bitcoin so he can get profit from both trading and investment in current Bull season.