Topic: Is taxation theft? - page 11. (Read 75978 times)
For me i dont think if taxation is theft because this is made by the government for so many reasons, not for fraud or any illegal purposes.
I believe, yes! And crypto seems to be one of the options to equalize the situation.
It sure is, cause if it weren't, most people in most countries would have a lot higher standards of living and better infrastructure, etc., etc.
Is there a way out of it? I don't know...
Is there a way out of it? I don't know...
Governments enable collusion, especially in the US, by making entry into a market more difficult. Either through regulations, permits, expensive legal hoops to jump through, etc.
Imagine you have a car design that is better and cheaper than all current cars sold. You build the car in your garage and want to start selling and scaling up to full production of these cars. Do you really think you could just set up a factory and start selling them? No. The amount of regulations required to become a car manufacturer is insane. It's almost as if the 3 or 4 auto manufacturers in the country are paying politicians or something. Tesla tried to do it on their own but had to play ball and pay off the government to get to the point of being able to sell cars.
Almost every other industry has permits, required certifications and schooling, etc. These are not for any useful purpose other than keeping out competition.
I currently live in French Polynesia where there are only 3 banks. No new banks can be created due to the amount of regulation requirements to open one. So the 3 banks set the prices on various things very high. It costs about 20% to exchange dollars to francs. And of course, only the banks are allowed to exchange currencies due to government regulations. If there were no government intrusion into money exchanges you'd have people at the airport charging 2-3% just standing there waiting as people get off the plane. You'd have your taxi driver exchanging cash for you. I'd be able to set up a bitcoin exchange here, an ATM at the airport. But it's not allowed.
That makes sense. I guess you sort of have to be a powerhouse already to break into most industries and shake them up. I mean, if you have a lot of money and your main goal is to disrupt an industry, it sounds doable. I can certainly see how it would be more beneficial to have more freedom in starting new businesses. Sometimes it's amazing how deep things go in the government. There are so many restriction at every turn. Probably the only thing I like about spending time in the US is it's competition. You can feel that business are truly competing and competing smart. The leads to better prices for customers and higher quality services.Imagine you have a car design that is better and cheaper than all current cars sold. You build the car in your garage and want to start selling and scaling up to full production of these cars. Do you really think you could just set up a factory and start selling them? No. The amount of regulations required to become a car manufacturer is insane. It's almost as if the 3 or 4 auto manufacturers in the country are paying politicians or something. Tesla tried to do it on their own but had to play ball and pay off the government to get to the point of being able to sell cars.
Almost every other industry has permits, required certifications and schooling, etc. These are not for any useful purpose other than keeping out competition.
I currently live in French Polynesia where there are only 3 banks. No new banks can be created due to the amount of regulation requirements to open one. So the 3 banks set the prices on various things very high. It costs about 20% to exchange dollars to francs. And of course, only the banks are allowed to exchange currencies due to government regulations. If there were no government intrusion into money exchanges you'd have people at the airport charging 2-3% just standing there waiting as people get off the plane. You'd have your taxi driver exchanging cash for you. I'd be able to set up a bitcoin exchange here, an ATM at the airport. But it's not allowed.
It does go deep, not just in government but in promises that go back generations.
They say that the countries that advance the fastest are those that just had a revolution and are starting from scratch. They have a clean slate and can move forward as a country without the baggage of backroom deals made decades ago.
Tax in itself isn't really a bad thing. I actually feel it goes a long way to help improve lives of resident citizens. But what really gets on my nerves is when governments try to find ways and means of ripping people off all in the name of tax collection. Take for instance a country like Ghana, you pay quite a lot to be able to import a car into the country but surprisingly, the government there has decided to charge a luxury vehicle tax. You pay taxes for vehicles with over 3.0ltrs engines every year on top of what was spent during importation. How on earth do you determine à car to be luxurious purely from the engine capacity? That to me is plain cold stealing.
The answer is:
Whatever my tax funded school taught me.
Whatever my tax funded school taught me.
No, I do not think that way. First, governments need money to build roads, schools and hospitals. One way to get that money is to tax businesses and people. When you leave in developed countries, you know that the quality of the infrastructures is good. People in poor countries will not be able to say the same. It is a fact. Infrastructures in those countries are really bad and even some do not have decent hospitals. There, governments do not earn enough tax money. For that reason, the quality of public service is a shame. Secondly, taxation helps us build a better society. Not everybody is rich. Well, wealthy people can help others by paying some extra taxes. All this is good, biblical and wise. I see nothing wrong with the system.
What you say makes sense. Thanks!
Well first off sir, society won't run without taxes. Taxes are basically the oil that makes the government and civilization run--no matter how smoothly or roughly, but it makes it work.
Answering your question, well I believe it depends on the situation. If the government uses the taxes for what it's meant to be used for (i.e. healthcare, infrastructure, education, insurance, roads and highways) then it is not theft.
However, we know there lots of corrupt politicians out there who take advantage of the system for their selfish needs. When people like them are put into power, then that is when taxation becomes theft.
But to conclude, my point is we -society- can never survive without taxes. It is not a matter of choice--it is there and will always be there. The real problem is how to make it useful for all of us and not let corrupt politicians have their way.
Answering your question, well I believe it depends on the situation. If the government uses the taxes for what it's meant to be used for (i.e. healthcare, infrastructure, education, insurance, roads and highways) then it is not theft.
However, we know there lots of corrupt politicians out there who take advantage of the system for their selfish needs. When people like them are put into power, then that is when taxation becomes theft.
But to conclude, my point is we -society- can never survive without taxes. It is not a matter of choice--it is there and will always be there. The real problem is how to make it useful for all of us and not let corrupt politicians have their way.
It can be both ways if the goverment isnt corrupt and the money goes to right places than its good thing to pay tax offcourse,but if tax is use for personal greed of several individuals that can manipulate with it then its robbing your own people and i think in the world we still have a lot of corrupt countrys that use that tax money for opposite things than to improve their standards of country
No, taxes are been imposed on every citizen of every nation as to enable the government to provide the basic social amenities to the citizens and also to invest in international trades, importation of foreign goods for the betterment of the citizens of the nations. but is quite unfortunate that reverse is the case, in the sens that most of our leaders chooses to embezzle the taxes paid by the citizens instead of using the resources to achieve the goals by which the taxes are paid for.
Two things we can all count on: death and taxes
taxation isnt theft, it is a civic responsibility a citizen owe to his country, state and province, but multiple taxation can be considered extortion.
Thanks again for the detailed response. Oligopoly was a new word for me. I can see that it's more or less the same as a monopoly, but it's just when a small group of companies have "monopoly" over a market, rather than just one. You talk about governments enabling collusion. How does this happen? Aren't there actually laws against price collusion? I think your farm example. That does make sense to me. Why wouldn't that be possible in today's market? On the other hand, a road as long as your farm land may not be that useful. People would still have to continue on the other road. The big company could just not build on-ramps and off-ramps to the farmers road. They'd also have to have a tolling system that could cut that portion of the roads out of what the drivers pay.
Governments enable collusion, especially in the US, by making entry into a market more difficult. Either through regulations, permits, expensive legal hoops to jump through, etc.
Imagine you have a car design that is better and cheaper than all current cars sold. You build the car in your garage and want to start selling and scaling up to full production of these cars. Do you really think you could just set up a factory and start selling them? No. The amount of regulations required to become a car manufacturer is insane. It's almost as if the 3 or 4 auto manufacturers in the country are paying politicians or something. Tesla tried to do it on their own but had to play ball and pay off the government to get to the point of being able to sell cars.
Almost every other industry has permits, required certifications and schooling, etc. These are not for any useful purpose other than keeping out competition.
I currently live in French Polynesia where there are only 3 banks. No new banks can be created due to the amount of regulation requirements to open one. So the 3 banks set the prices on various things very high. It costs about 20% to exchange dollars to francs. And of course, only the banks are allowed to exchange currencies due to government regulations. If there were no government intrusion into money exchanges you'd have people at the airport charging 2-3% just standing there waiting as people get off the plane. You'd have your taxi driver exchanging cash for you. I'd be able to set up a bitcoin exchange here, an ATM at the airport. But it's not allowed.
No, I do not think that way. First, governments need money to build roads, schools and hospitals. One way to get that money is to tax businesses and people. When you leave in developed countries, you know that the quality of the infrastructures is good. People in poor countries will not be able to say the same. It is a fact. Infrastructures in those countries are really bad and even some do not have decent hospitals. There, governments do not earn enough tax money. For that reason, the quality of public service is a shame. Secondly, taxation helps us build a better society. Not everybody is rich. Well, wealthy people can help others by paying some extra taxes. All this is good, biblical and wise. I see nothing wrong with the system.
It sure is, but do you have any suggestions as to how we can legally protect ourselves from it? That would be just great, wouldn't it?
If you don't subscribe to the "social contract" philosophy, then consequently, it is theft.
Yeah, it sounds more like a theft to me to, but what are other ways to get money to the government budget for public works? Just feeling confused... a little...
Personally, I do feel it is theft, I never consented to any taxation. I feel that this video helps explain the video quite well https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGMQZEIXBMs
Your video made me think a little different. Let me share my ideas on the subject a little later, I need some time to get my thoughts together...
But thanks for sharing!
Well, if we look up the word "theft," we'll notice it means 'dishonestly taking something that belongs to someone else and keeping it (or stealing, i.e. taking something without the permission or knowledge of the owner and keeping it).'
The key words here are without the permission or knowledge , which contradicts the process of taxation. I mean, you know that they are taking the money from you, but on the other hand, they never ask you for permission or whether or not you are willing to do so
So, it's a theft only by half and only providing you're not willing to do so. If you are, then it isn't a theft at all, IMHO.
The key words here are without the permission or knowledge , which contradicts the process of taxation. I mean, you know that they are taking the money from you, but on the other hand, they never ask you for permission or whether or not you are willing to do so
So, it's a theft only by half and only providing you're not willing to do so. If you are, then it isn't a theft at all, IMHO.
Look up the word tax:
Well, if we look up the word "theft," we'll notice it means 'dishonestly taking something that belongs to someone else and keeping it (or stealing, i.e. taking something without the permission or knowledge of the owner and keeping it).'
The key words here are without the permission or knowledge , which contradicts the process of taxation. I mean, you know that they are taking the money from you, but on the other hand, they never ask you for permission or whether or not you are willing to do so
So, it's a theft only by half and only providing you're not willing to do so. If you are, then it isn't a theft at all, IMHO.
The key words here are without the permission or knowledge , which contradicts the process of taxation. I mean, you know that they are taking the money from you, but on the other hand, they never ask you for permission or whether or not you are willing to do so
So, it's a theft only by half and only providing you're not willing to do so. If you are, then it isn't a theft at all, IMHO.
If you are willing, it isn't taxation. It is donation.
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