Its almost as if your example involved some Marxist principals at work...
Marx doesn't believe in working for your capital. The state shall provide.
Topic: Is taxation theft? - page 4. (Read 75995 times)
Marx doesn't believe in working for your capital. The state shall provide.
When I was in Saigon there was free market enterprise just about anywhere (apparently the government didn't regulate the shit out of everything). There was no storefront that you passed that didn't have a business.
One old lady literally only had a pot and a bunson burner with a couple of very small plastic tables and chairs.
She cooked an amazing meal on the street corner for very cheap (about $2 for a meal that filled me up).
If you think you need someone else in order to have a job to live, you're doing it wrong.
One old lady literally only had a pot and a bunson burner with a couple of very small plastic tables and chairs.
She cooked an amazing meal on the street corner for very cheap (about $2 for a meal that filled me up).
If you think you need someone else in order to have a job to live, you're doing it wrong.
Its almost as if your example involved some Marxist principals at work...
When I was in Saigon there was free market enterprise just about anywhere (apparently the government didn't regulate the shit out of everything). There was no storefront that you passed that didn't have a business.
One old lady literally only had a pot and a bunson burner with a couple of very small plastic tables and chairs.
She cooked an amazing meal on the street corner for very cheap (about $2 for a meal that filled me up).
If you think you need someone else in order to have a job to live, you're doing it wrong.
One old lady literally only had a pot and a bunson burner with a couple of very small plastic tables and chairs.
She cooked an amazing meal on the street corner for very cheap (about $2 for a meal that filled me up).
If you think you need someone else in order to have a job to live, you're doing it wrong.
This graphic says it all but the logic mostly generated by the capitalists class who are the ones "stealing" the surplus value in the first place.
Labor is voluntary.
This is where you are wrong
It's not like people desire to eat, they must eat or they die, thus biological slavery brings people to forced labor
You don't have to work for someone else to eat though. You can work for yourself. And you have choices of who to work for and for how much. Taxation does not leave that choice.
What do you mean by "you can work for yourself"
I'm hired = I get paid $1500 monthly salary
I work for "myself" = I get paid $1500 for a month of work
If others must pay for your labor, you are still subjected to the very same reality, you don't get paid more by yourself...the invention Gary Kildall sold to Bill Gates for $50k formed the foundation of Microsoft's billionaire empire. Taxation is the fee that the rich should pay for the resources he exploits and makes profits from and those taxes should be used to help everyone not to buy guns.
This is because the others have ammassed the capital and you don't have the capital. The easy way around this would be to provide capital for people to work for themselves if they choose. Submit a business plan and get capital. Simple as that. At that point, you have a society where working for others is not mandatory.
And government already provides capital to large companies. We just call it infrastructure, subsidy, economic stimulus, or "creating jobs".
Taxes on the wealthy are simply passed on to the people who buy products and service from the rich. Taxing the rich is really taxing the people again.
The rich is not alone on the market, if he raises the prices someone else will sell for lower
All that is, is, rich fighting against rich. People don't need the products of the rich. The land was made for everyone. The reason the rich are rich is, they have used the media to sell the people on the idea that they can provide their services better and cheaper than the people can make the same products and services.
However, when the people are being forced into taxation - which is simply a method that the rich use to force the people to buy more - it may not be beneficial for the people to accept the products of the rich any longer.
The beginnings of shutting out taxes are happening right now through the PMA (private membership association). A PMA is an organization that is private, thereby being outside the authority of government which exists to regulate the public... something like you and your spouse and your grandparents trading among yourselves without interference from government.
It may not have started yet, but when PMAs get to the point where they use crypto to barter among themselves, within their organizations, they will gradually squeeze government money and taxation right out of the picture. More and more people will join, just to avoid taxes. Being private, they will write it up in their rules that government cannot tax their trading... because government is public, not private.
I'm sure that government and the wealthy see this coming, and that they are doing everything they can to fight it. But for starters, Youtube search on "private membership association." Watch the top 3 videos. The flop of the greedy money system and taxes is coming.
This graphic says it all but the logic mostly generated by the capitalists class who are the ones "stealing" the surplus value in the first place.
Labor is voluntary.
This is where you are wrong
It's not like people desire to eat, they must eat or they die, thus biological slavery brings people to forced labor
You don't have to work for someone else to eat though. You can work for yourself. And you have choices of who to work for and for how much. Taxation does not leave that choice.
What do you mean by "you can work for yourself"
I'm hired = I get paid $1500 monthly salary
I work for "myself" = I get paid $1500 for a month of work
If others must pay for your labor, you are still subjected to the very same reality, you don't get paid more by yourself...the invention Gary Kildall sold to Bill Gates for $50k formed the foundation of Microsoft's billionaire empire. Taxation is the fee that the rich should pay for the resources he exploits and makes profits from and those taxes should be used to help everyone not to buy guns.
Taxes on the wealthy are simply passed on to the people who buy products and service from the rich. Taxing the rich is really taxing the people again.
The rich is not alone on the market, if he raises the prices someone else will sell for lower
This graphic says it all but the logic mostly generated by the capitalists class who are the ones "stealing" the surplus value in the first place.
Labor is voluntary.
This is where you are wrong
It's not like people desire to eat, they must eat or they die, thus biological slavery brings people to forced labor
You don't have to work for someone else to eat though. You can work for yourself. And you have choices of who to work for and for how much. Taxation does not leave that choice.
What do you mean by "you can work for yourself"
I'm hired = I get paid $1500 monthly salary
I work for "myself" = I get paid $1500 for a month of work
If others must pay for your labor, you are still subjected to the very same reality, you don't get paid more by yourself...the invention Gary Kildall sold to Bill Gates for $50k formed the foundation of Microsoft's billionaire empire. Taxation is the fee that the rich should pay for the resources he exploits and makes profits from and those taxes should be used to help everyone not to buy guns.
Taxes on the wealthy are simply passed on to the people who buy products and service from the rich. Taxing the rich is really taxing the people again.
This graphic says it all but the logic mostly generated by the capitalists class who are the ones "stealing" the surplus value in the first place.
Labor is voluntary.
This is where you are wrong
It's not like people desire to eat, they must eat or they die, thus biological slavery brings people to forced labor
You don't have to work for someone else to eat though. You can work for yourself. And you have choices of who to work for and for how much. Taxation does not leave that choice.
What do you mean by "you can work for yourself"
I'm hired = I get paid $1500 monthly salary
I work for "myself" = I get paid $1500 for a month of work
If others must pay for your labor, you are still subjected to the very same reality, you don't get paid more by yourself...the invention Gary Kildall sold to Bill Gates for $50k formed the foundation of Microsoft's billionaire empire. Taxation is the fee that the rich should pay for the resources he exploits and makes profits from and those taxes should be used to help everyone not to buy guns.
This graphic says it all but the logic mostly generated by the capitalists class who are the ones "stealing" the surplus value in the first place.
Labor is voluntary.
This is where you are wrong
It's not like people desire to eat, they must eat or they die, thus biological slavery brings people to forced labor
You don't have to work for someone else to eat though. You can work for yourself. And you have choices of who to work for and for how much. Taxation does not leave that choice.
This graphic says it all but the logic mostly generated by the capitalists class who are the ones "stealing" the surplus value in the first place.
Labor is voluntary.
This is where you are wrong
It's not like people desire to eat, they must eat or they die, thus biological slavery brings people to forced labor
But that has nothing to do with the question of the actual act of taxation being theft or not.
Yes, it has a lot to do.
Well, legally taxation is not classified as theft, obviously.
However, the need to always repay more to serve the debt is a reason for the government to rack even more taxes in, etc.
And they have to make it, otherwise it's "default" and game over. Really ?
Maybe this is not the case in the USA, but in France, debt interest repayments match ~100% of the income tax income for the govt.
And we fire nurses and close down hospitals ? There is a protest soon against the recent tax surges on gas and fuel.
More and more people are on brink of bankruptcy, cannot make ends meet, but we pay more and more just as an interest.
That's insane.
Cut the leeches, pay taxes to fund the national services etc, but please do not use our democracies to transfer wealth massively from population to a few pockets.
Legally not considered theft...but if it looks like a duck and sounds like a duck...it's likely a duck. If someone takes money by force...that would be theft.
Image if George and Jim both independently take money from someone at gunpoint in the street. George then takes the money and goes buys some cigarettes and booze. Jim takes the money and puts it toward setting up an educational foundation supporting underprivileged children.
Which one stole the money?
But that has nothing to do with the question of the actual act of taxation being theft or not.
Yes, it has a lot to do.
Well, legally taxation is not classified as theft, obviously.
However, the need to always repay more to serve the debt is a reason for the government to rack even more taxes in, etc.
And they have to make it, otherwise it's "default" and game over. Really ?
Maybe this is not the case in the USA, but in France, debt interest repayments match ~100% of the income tax income for the govt.
And we fire nurses and close down hospitals ? There is a protest soon against the recent tax surges on gas and fuel.
More and more people are on brink of bankruptcy, cannot make ends meet, but we pay more and more just as an interest.
That's insane.
Cut the leeches, pay taxes to fund the national services etc, but please do not use our democracies to transfer wealth massively from population to a few pockets.
Where does the money go ? To repay an out of control debt, never ending, always growing, debt.
Taxation is a necessary thing, but in it's current form it's a sentence against the global population.
Taxation is a necessary thing, but in it's current form it's a sentence against the global population.
Interest on the debt is now the #4 spending item (behind Elderly Welfare, Poor Healthcare and National Offense).
So ya...they steal your money to pay interest on the ever growing debt. Eventually all of your taxes will be going toward just paying interest.
But that has nothing to do with the question of the actual act of taxation being theft or not.
if properly handled by the government,there is no problem with me helping the society because i will also bennifited by it. using public structures like bridges and roads. but if it is corrupted we have a different story.
Taxation is theft if your government officials are corrupt and are using it for themselves.
This graphic says it all but the logic mostly generated by the capitalists class who are the ones "stealing" the surplus value in the first place.
edit* trying to make this smaller
edit* trying to make this smaller
Nice try. This one seems more accurate to me in that way :
Where does the money go ? To repay an out of control debt, never ending, always growing, debt.
Taxation is a necessary thing, but in it's current form it's a sentence against the global population.
The major thing about taxes is, they give us the best government that money can buy. It's kinda like that old TV series, "Elliot Ness and the Untouchables," where corruption was being cleaned up because some government guys wouldn't take the money. Too bad they didn't know that taxation causes and often is, corruption.
I think its not especially when we see that there are progress in our country. Like building different new roads, reconstructung it amd giving help. For those people who are in need. But if we see that we continue paying tax and we cannot see any action by the government then I can say it is being theft because there no development that was happening in one country.
Taxation is theft depending on how your government is going to make use of the funds!
Jump to: