Pages:
Author

Topic: BFL: Chips have shipped, on their way to US - page 12. (Read 25662 times)

member
Activity: 104
Merit: 10
February 12, 2013, 07:02:21 PM
#52
Josh has actually explained BFL's reasoning on doing it this way.  Essentially, it's that the people who ordered in the first two months are being compensated for not having their units before the block reward halved.  He maintains that customers who ordered later will be no more disadvantaged than they would have been had BFL delivered on time (because the block reward would have halved by the time they got their units and difficulty would have increased after the shipping of the first batch of orders anyway).

I read their reasoning, it still makes little sense, later customers were screwed just as much.

How are later customers not effected by BFL delaying 4 months? They would have had their ASIC already if they started shipping in October like they were supposed to. Because of their mistakes, there will now be hundreds of Avalon ASICs released before later customers even get their ASIC, thus increasing difficulty and costing them each money (maybe about 2 months of avalon-free network profits.)

EDIT: You guys are first two month order holders, making you biased. I on the other hand have no orders from BFL at the moment. If I was a later BFL customer I would be pissed.

Were you ordering in the confusion on day 1? No?  So you didn't understand the frenzy and worry that people had.  Everybody moved their $ into BTC so they could pay.  I didn't even bother to fuck around with Dwolla/MtGox which was having 1 month delays at some point.  I just paid a flat 209 BTC for an SC Single - which now is the equivalent of $25x208 - that's over $5k.  Sure many say you count the hedge, but at that time BTC was the only payment they said they would take on day #1.  After a couple days people were able to pay with wire payments but even that was confusing as to whether payment date or order date would count as purchase time.

I tried to get into the clusterfuck that was Avalon both times and failed.

Why not complain about those who mined thousands of coins with CPUs back in the day...
hero member
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
February 12, 2013, 04:34:24 PM
#51
I was typing this up as well, but it seems Repentance stated it better than I could Cheesy

For the record, I'm not necessarily endorsing it - just explaining it.  Obviously it's a scheme which only benefits those who order additional units from BFL before the vouchers expire, so people have to spend more money with BFL in order to receive any compensation.  It's a simple model from BFL's point of view and one which will stimulate more sales.

Quote
You guys are first two month order holders, making you biased. I on the other hand have no orders from BFL at the moment. If I was a later BFL customer I would be pissed.

No I'm not.  I think ASIC vendors are the only ones who'll benefit from the mining hardware arms race and miners themselves are going to just get locked into a vicious cycle of having to spend more and more money on hardware to retain the same share of the mining pie.  That's one reason I think the fanboy-ism is so ridiculous.  The arrival of ASICs will effectively lock many people out of mining and that has implications for Bitcoin as a whole.
legendary
Activity: 1484
Merit: 1026
In Cryptocoins I Trust
February 12, 2013, 04:29:37 PM
#50
Josh has actually explained BFL's reasoning on doing it this way.  Essentially, it's that the people who ordered in the first two months are being compensated for not having their units before the block reward halved.  He maintains that customers who ordered later will be no more disadvantaged than they would have been had BFL delivered on time (because the block reward would have halved by the time they got their units and difficulty would have increased after the shipping of the first batch of orders anyway).

I read their reasoning, it still makes little sense, later customers were screwed just as much.

How are later customers not effected by BFL delaying 4 months? They would have had their ASIC already if they started shipping in October like they were supposed to. Because of their mistakes, there will now be hundreds of Avalon ASICs released before later customers even get their ASIC, thus increasing difficulty and costing them each money (maybe about 2 months of avalon-free network profits.)

EDIT: You guys are first two month order holders, making you biased. I on the other hand have no orders from BFL at the moment. If I was a later BFL customer I would be pissed.
legendary
Activity: 1064
Merit: 1001
February 12, 2013, 04:26:13 PM
#49
Yea, those poor poor first two month customers... [...] I guess we better give them a discount on future products, that will fix the error.

Yeah, we definitely don't deserve any discounts after waiting 8 months and sitting through 3 (or was it 4..) postponements Roll Eyes

And..
Josh has actually explained BFL's reasoning on doing it this way.  Essentially, it's that the people who ordered in the first two months are being compensated for not having their units before the block reward halved.  He maintains that customers who ordered later will be no more disadvantaged than they would have been had BFL delivered on time (because the block reward would have halved by the time they got their units and difficulty would have increased after the shipping of the first batch of orders anyway).

This.

I was typing this up as well, but it seems Repentance stated it better than I could Cheesy
hero member
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
February 12, 2013, 04:23:41 PM
#48
Yea, those poor poor first two month customers... they get their ASIC 4 months ahead of later customers, and then get to mine at low difficulty before the network implodes on itself making a ton of money... I truly pity them. I guess we better give them a discount on future products, that will fix the error. The later customers are the ones getting screwed here, lol to give discounts to the first 2 months... those guys are going to make a killing anyways.....  Roll Eyes

Josh has actually explained BFL's reasoning on doing it this way.  Essentially, it's that the people who ordered in the first two months are being compensated for not having their units before the block reward halved.  He maintains that customers who ordered later will be no more disadvantaged than they would have been had BFL delivered on time (because the block reward would have halved by the time they got their units and difficulty would have increased after the shipping of the first batch of orders anyway).

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/984-%5Bcustomer-appreciation%5D-discount-early-orderers-5.html#post14252
legendary
Activity: 1484
Merit: 1026
In Cryptocoins I Trust
February 12, 2013, 04:11:37 PM
#47
Yea, those poor poor first two month customers... they get their ASIC 4 months ahead of later customers, and then get to mine at low difficulty before the network implodes on itself making a ton of money... I truly pity them. I guess we better give them a discount on future products, that will fix the error. The later customers are the ones getting screwed here, lol to give discounts to the first 2 months... those guys are going to make a killing anyways.....  Roll Eyes
legendary
Activity: 1064
Merit: 1001
February 12, 2013, 04:10:33 PM
#46
@CreativeX - you've been here long enough to know that this is how you're supposed to argue on the forums, don't 'cha know! Wink

I do know...I just refuse to conform. Cheesy Now if you'll excuse me I have an afternoon of ripping tags off pillows planned.

Good plan. I've been working on the mattress tags Cheesy

I do not believe a situation where one company has a monopoly would be good for BTC or me personally.

I completely agree. Was there ever a situation when a monopoly was good for a community or society (besides winning the board game, of course Cheesy)? Competition has a habit of driving innovation and lower costs.
legendary
Activity: 1890
Merit: 1003
February 12, 2013, 04:00:02 PM
#45
...but hey, don't let the facts get in the way.

@CreativeX - you've been here long enough to know that this is how you're supposed to argue on the forums, don't 'cha know! Wink

I do know...I just refuse to conform. Cheesy Now if you'll excuse me I have an afternoon of ripping tags off pillows planned.

just use the ignore button for this kind of scum...

...but then I wouldn't get to read what you write?!?

I loled at both the memes and your response. Facts so far are that neither company has really shipped their first batch and that we're (as a community) are greatly anticipating their shipments. Having said that, I really would like to see both companies succeed; having one source for mining gear is not preferably as it would leave too much power in the hands of the manufacturer. 
On that I think we can all agree on.
legendary
Activity: 1890
Merit: 1003
February 12, 2013, 03:55:50 PM
#44
The discounts on future orders for those who ordered in July and August have been announced.

Quote
First months orders will get 25% off a future order. (Order dates June 23rd - July 24th)
Second months orders will get 10% off a future order. (Order dates July 25th - August 25th)

The 25% and 10% apply up to the value of your original order(s).

Example 1: Original first month order for $1000 worth of equipment, next order for $1500 worth of equipment, get $250 off the order.
Example 2: Original second month order for $1000 worth of equipment, next order for $500 worth of equipment, get $50 off the order.

We are doing it this way to prevent abuse such as someone ordering a Jalapeno, then getting 25% off the next order and ordering a Mini Rig.

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/984-%5Bcustomer-appreciation%5D-discount-early-orderers-2.html#post14168
So much for "steep" discounts.

Next, they will say they aren't bumping the speed up to 80GH/s for the extra 45day wait period. (Like they did for the first 45 days)

I guess they came to their senses that if they gave a majority of their users a "real" steep discount, then they would have trouble covering the costs with Gen 2.
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
February 12, 2013, 03:07:54 PM
#43
...but hey, don't let the facts get in the way.

@CreativeX - you've been here long enough to know that this is how you're supposed to argue on the forums, don't 'cha know! Wink

I do know...I just refuse to conform. Cheesy Now if you'll excuse me I have an afternoon of ripping tags off pillows planned.

just use the ignore button for this kind of scum...

...but then I wouldn't get to read what you write?!?

I loled at both the memes and your response. Facts so far are that neither company has really shipped their first batch and that we're (as a community) are greatly anticipating their shipments. Having said that, I really would like to see both companies succeed; having one source for mining gear is not preferably as it would leave too much power in the hands of the manufacturer.

Agreed. While currently I've only a vested interest in one of the two vendors referenced above, I do not believe a situation where one company has a monopoly would be good for BTC or me personally.

Just the same the old adage still holds up, that if you repeat something that's false enough times it is eventually perceived as fact. Perhaps the editor of that pic is simply unaware that Avalon announced a $1999 price tag for batch 2 units long ago and that $1499 is actually a discount to that price, or that they had actually moved their shipping date up.
sr. member
Activity: 249
Merit: 250
February 12, 2013, 02:46:37 PM
#42
...but hey, don't let the facts get in the way.

@CreativeX - you've been here long enough to know that this is how you're supposed to argue on the forums, don't 'cha know! Wink

I do know...I just refuse to conform. Cheesy Now if you'll excuse me I have an afternoon of ripping tags off pillows planned.

just use the ignore button for this kind of scum...

...but then I wouldn't get to read what you write?!?

I loled at both the memes and your response. Facts so far are that neither company has really shipped their first batch and that we're (as a community) are greatly anticipating their shipments. Having said that, I really would like to see both companies succeed; having one source for mining gear is not preferably as it would leave too much power in the hands of the manufacturer. 
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
February 12, 2013, 08:56:48 AM
#41

That seems a bit revisionist.

Saying the first guy "screws up shipping" is being remarkably charitable to guy 1...to say the very least.

The second guy moved his shipping date up. The price was set to increase to $1999 long ago as I recall.

...but hey, don't let the facts get in the way.
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 100
February 12, 2013, 04:53:27 AM
#40
sr. member
Activity: 249
Merit: 250
February 12, 2013, 12:14:22 AM
#39
The discounts on future orders for those who ordered in July and August have been announced.

Quote
First months orders will get 25% off a future order. (Order dates June 23rd - July 24th)
Second months orders will get 10% off a future order. (Order dates July 25th - August 25th)

The 25% and 10% apply up to the value of your original order(s).

Example 1: Original first month order for $1000 worth of equipment, next order for $1500 worth of equipment, get $250 off the order.
Example 2: Original second month order for $1000 worth of equipment, next order for $500 worth of equipment, get $50 off the order.

We are doing it this way to prevent abuse such as someone ordering a Jalapeno, then getting 25% off the next order and ordering a Mini Rig.

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/984-%5Bcustomer-appreciation%5D-discount-early-orderers-2.html#post14168


+1 for BFL; I should make a two memes to celebrate this moment lol:


Top Line: Screw up shipping on Batch #1?

{insert picture of Avalon Pr0n}

Bottomr line: Raises the prices for Batch #2


Top Line: BFL Delays Batch 1 ASICS for chip redsign

[Insert pic of BFL_Josh with empty box]

Bottom Line: Still manages to cut prices for early adopters
(insert optional victory text) and delivers before the of Avalon batch #1
 
hero member
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
February 11, 2013, 11:56:06 PM
#38
The discounts on future orders for those who ordered in July and August have been announced.

Quote
First months orders will get 25% off a future order. (Order dates June 23rd - July 24th)
Second months orders will get 10% off a future order. (Order dates July 25th - August 25th)

The 25% and 10% apply up to the value of your original order(s).

Example 1: Original first month order for $1000 worth of equipment, next order for $1500 worth of equipment, get $250 off the order.
Example 2: Original second month order for $1000 worth of equipment, next order for $500 worth of equipment, get $50 off the order.

We are doing it this way to prevent abuse such as someone ordering a Jalapeno, then getting 25% off the next order and ordering a Mini Rig.

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/984-%5Bcustomer-appreciation%5D-discount-early-orderers-2.html#post14168
hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
February 11, 2013, 09:48:38 PM
#37
Have you even read the BFL forums  Huh

If ordered today,you may possibly recieve your unit by April or May (2-3 months)...............If they ship by late Feb  Roll Eyes

More entitlement mentality  Roll Eyes

That's a perfectly reasonable wait to me. I'll be happy if I can make 1 BTC/day with 60 GH/s.
I'm also looking to get one soon enough but I definitely think one should would wait until others have received a product irregardless of the profit margin.
legendary
Activity: 966
Merit: 1000
February 11, 2013, 09:09:51 PM
#36

So if i bought one today, I am waiting untill November? bull shit... they better drop that price by $300 if they think I am waiting 7 months for delivery of the products.

MFG costs should go down as time continues, or the Machines should have considerably more hashing power, or Power efficiency a year later.

Have you even read the BFL forums  Huh

If ordered today,you may possibly recieve your unit by April or May (2-3 months)...............If they ship by late Feb  Roll Eyes

More entitlement mentality  Roll Eyes


Yea, well, that's what they (BFL) are saying right now.  They also said they'd ship in October 2012.

Look back at the FPGA product's history.  They said it would ship around October 2011, and it ended up first shipping in March 2012.

Then it wasn't until November 2012 (after they quit taking orders) that they finally got all of the orders caught up:

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/blogs/bfl_jody/36-fpgas-through10-5-shipping-today.html
legendary
Activity: 1554
Merit: 1222
brb keeping up with the Kardashians
February 11, 2013, 06:09:15 PM
#35
Have you even read the BFL forums  Huh

If ordered today,you may possibly recieve your unit by April or May (2-3 months)...............If they ship by late Feb  Roll Eyes

More entitlement mentality  Roll Eyes

That's a perfectly reasonable wait to me. I'll be happy if I can make 1 BTC/day with 60 GH/s.
legendary
Activity: 2212
Merit: 1001
February 11, 2013, 05:38:18 PM
#34

So if i bought one today, I am waiting untill November? bull shit... they better drop that price by $300 if they think I am waiting 7 months for delivery of the products.

MFG costs should go down as time continues, or the Machines should have considerably more hashing power, or Power efficiency a year later.

Have you even read the BFL forums  Huh

If ordered today,you may possibly recieve your unit by April or May (2-3 months)...............If they ship by late Feb  Roll Eyes

More entitlement mentality  Roll Eyes
full member
Activity: 238
Merit: 100
February 11, 2013, 05:27:33 PM
#33
It would be GOD DAMN HILARIOUS if BFL have a dozen confirmed received ASICs and AVALON still only have 2.5 in the wild after "shipping"

Tongue

No what would be funnier that BFL with all their claims of chips being shipped to the U.S. found out that they never got shipped and they now have another 30 delay on the chips being shipped. LOL seeing you fools with your heads hung after 7-8 months of waiting. Fucking priceless.



They will still be installing tables in March...
Pages:
Jump to: