Marketplace trust - page 12. | Bitcointalksearch.org

ndnh

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Quote from: tspacepilot on May 26, 2016, 01:14:25 PM

Right, and if you say "leaving trust" or "giving trust" it's really not clear whether you're trying to say that you left feedback or whether you added someone to your trust list. In fact, I think when most people say "giving/leaving trust" the mean the former (feedback) when it sounds more like the latter (added to trust list). Now mix this in with people asking how how the trust system works and you can hopefully see why it's confusing as hell. Basically, call it what it is and things will be easier: leaving/giving feedback vs adding/removing from trust list.

I get your entire point, except how giving/leaving trust sounds more like the adding to the trust list? I think all people who say giving/leaving trust mean feedback, never came across the other one.

Edit: may be like this:
Giving trust to X -> I trust X -> by adding him to my trust list?
Leaving trust to X -> Huh

Can't appear to mean anything other than leaving him a feedback..

I will try using feedback instead of trust. I knew trust wasn't the correct term to use, but I got stuck to it and didn't have any problems with that yet, so I just kept using it, just like I don't care about the grammar most of the times. Grin

Edit: If you ask me, newbies are like to use 'trust' than 'feedback'. Feedback can mean a lot of different things too. The link text reads Trust too, so it isn't really surprising that everyone new is like to use 'trust'.

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Quote from: ndnh on May 25, 2016, 01:16:57 PM

Quote from: DannyHamilton on May 25, 2016, 09:59:36 AM

Quote from: ndnh on May 25, 2016, 08:37:21 AM

I don't see the confusion. Giving trust always means giving trust feedback just shorter to type than giving feedback. What else can it mean?

It's not possible to give "trust feedback". It is only possible to give feedback. You have no control over whether that feedback is trusted or not.

Oh I see. The confusion is between "trust feedback" and "trusted feedback".

I am using trust feedback to mean feedback in the trust system - regardless of whether it is trusted or not. Something like in say Marketplace Trust Feedback.

Quote from: DannyHamilton on May 25, 2016, 09:59:36 AM

The person giving feedback can choose whether to give positive feedback or negative feedback.

Or neutral Grin

Right, and if you say "leaving trust" or "giving trust" it's really not clear whether you're trying to say that you left feedback or whether you added someone to your trust list. In fact, I think when most people say "giving/leaving trust" the mean the former (feedback) when it sounds more like the latter (added to trust list). Now mix this in with people asking how how the trust system works and you can hopefully see why it's confusing as hell. Basically, call it what it is and things will be easier: leaving/giving feedback vs adding/removing from trust list.

ndnh

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Quote from: DannyHamilton on May 25, 2016, 09:59:36 AM

Quote from: ndnh on May 25, 2016, 08:37:21 AM

I don't see the confusion. Giving trust always means giving trust feedback just shorter to type than giving feedback. What else can it mean?

It's not possible to give "trust feedback". It is only possible to give feedback. You have no control over whether that feedback is trusted or not.

Oh I see. The confusion is between "trust feedback" and "trusted feedback".

I am using trust feedback to mean feedback in the trust system - regardless of whether it is trusted or not. Something like in say Marketplace Trust Feedback.

Quote from: DannyHamilton on May 25, 2016, 09:59:36 AM

The person giving feedback can choose whether to give positive feedback or negative feedback.

Or neutral Grin

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Quote from: ndnh on May 25, 2016, 08:37:21 AM

I don't see the confusion. Giving trust always means giving trust feedback just shorter to type than giving feedback. What else can it mean?

It's not possible to give "trust feedback". It is only possible to give feedback. You have no control over whether that feedback is trusted or not.

The person giving feedback can choose whether to give positive feedback or negative feedback.

Then each user can choose whether to trust that feedback explicitly (through their own trust list) or implicitly (through the default trust list or a depth setting).

Therefore, each user individually is deciding for themselves whether or not to add trust to any given feedback.

ndnh

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Quote from: tspacepilot on May 24, 2016, 02:28:10 PM

Also, let's not call it "giving trust", it's already too confusing. Call feedback 'feedback'. Call putting someone on your trust list 'putting someone on your trust list'. This is what the interface calls it. If we are consistent in this, it may help these kinds of questions come up less often. I swear that half the confusion on this topic is because there's a trust list, a trust score, and when people give feedback they start calling that trust too.

I don't see the confusion. Giving trust always means giving trust feedback just shorter to type than giving feedback. What else can it mean?

Trust feedback = Trust = Feedback = Trust rating = Rating
Trust is still the shortest Grin

The problem as I see is just that most new members are unaware that
- a (personal) trust list exists,
- everyone's trust list is self + DefaultTrust by default,
- and the trust score they see is based on their own trust list and
- the trust score any other person sees is based on that person's trust list.

That should be all.

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Quote from: ndnh on May 24, 2016, 07:30:41 AM

That is right.

If you go to my profile you'd (or someone with Default Trust list) see 60: -0 / +7 but what I see is 76: -0 / +9 because my list is different.

Also if you give a negative trust to anyone, his trust score will go down (red, if it was near 0), because you trust yourself. But no one else will see a change.

Anyone who has added you to their trust list will see the change. Also, let's not call it "giving trust", it's already too confusing. Call feedback 'feedback'. Call putting someone on your trust list 'putting someone on your trust list'. This is what the interface calls it. If we are consistent in this, it may help these kinds of questions come up less often. I swear that half the confusion on this topic is because there's a trust list, a trust score, and when people give feedback they start calling that trust too.

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Quote from: wallet4bitcoin on May 23, 2016, 04:53:56 PM

Thanks Tspacepilot.

Whilst I do want my post count to increase in time, I was legitimately still confused so I appreciate you given me the benefit of the doubt & replying.
I now pretty much 99% understand the system. Huh

My confusion was just about who sees what now I do get it...

In a nutshell...
My trusted feedback score
is determined from my perspective by
a) whether a member is part of my trust network.

For others members' perspective
b) whether that member is part of their trust network.

Thanks again Grin

That is right.

If you go to my profile you'd (or someone with Default Trust list) see 60: -0 / +7 but what I see is 76: -0 / +9 because my list is different.

Also if you give a negative trust to anyone, his trust score will go down (red, if it was near 0), because you trust yourself. But no one else will see a change. This part is usually confusing for someone new to the forum and one guy even thought he made it to DT..

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Thanks Tspacepilot.

Whilst I do want my post count to increase in time, I was legitimately still confused so I appreciate you given me the benefit of the doubt & replying.
I now pretty much 99% understand the system. Huh

My confusion was just about who sees what now I do get it...

In a nutshell...
My trusted feedback score
is determined from my perspective by
a) whether a member is part of my trust network.

For others members' perspective
b) whether that member is part of their trust network.

Thanks again Grin

tspacepilot

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Quote from: wallet4bitcoin on May 23, 2016, 10:47:44 AM

1) Thanks I get that distinction now, so to clarify if someone leaves me trust then most people in default trust would see it as even if they do not have default trust themselves in the their trust list, then unless they ~member or ~default trust then as default trust will occur somewhere within depth 1-2 of their trust list then they would likely see that +1 trusted feedback on my Trust score?

2) Trust 1: -0 / +1
Does everyone on the forum see this first accumulative number (i.e 1:) or do the same rules apply as to the 3rd number?
ii) If it is not the same what are the viewing rules for this first trust score number?

Thanks for anyones input.

I'm not sure if you're really still unclear or if you're just trying to keep that post-count rising ...

If someone leaves you feedback (calling it trust is confusing), then that feedback will be visible as trusted feedback to people who have the person who left you the feedback in their trust lists. This is the essence of the system, you have a trust list, you trust the feedback of people on your list. It's a pretty simple concept. You can edit your list as you please, so can everyone else. Many people don't edit their lists, these people all see the same thing.

Same rules on (2), trusted feedback gets used to calculate those numbers. Which feedback is trusted depends on your trust list.

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Quote from: moneypot link=topic=211858.400

No, only people who have the person in their trust network. If someone leaves you trust, then such trust will apply to your trust score for anyone who has said person in their trust network.

Quote

1) Thanks I get that distinction now, so to clarify if someone leaves me trust then most people in default trust would see it as even if they do not have default trust themselves in the their trust list, then unless they ~member or ~default trust then as default trust will occur somewhere within depth 1-2 of their trust list then they would likely see that +1 trusted feedback on my Trust score?

2) Trust 1: -0 / +1
Does everyone on the forum see this first accumulative number (i.e 1:) or do the same rules apply as to the 3rd number?
ii) If it is not the same what are the viewing rules for this first trust score number?

Thanks for anyones input.

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Quote from: wallet4bitcoin on May 20, 2016, 11:47:54 AM

I'm a newbie still trying to get to grips with the trust system.
1: -0 / +1

Please can someone affirm/clarify my quesitons/assumptions below:

1) I assume that only those in the trust network of the person who left the feedback see the 3rd (+1) number?
So if someone in Default Trust left me feedback everyone in Default Trust would see that feedback?
2) Does this apply to the first number too 1:?
3) Where can I see other people's trust lists?

1) correct
1a) no, only people who have the person in their trust network. If someone leaves you trust, then such trust will apply to your trust score for anyone who has said person in their trust network.
3) you can add them to your trust list (and remove everyone else), and everyone in your level one of your trust network will be in their trust list. Be sure to change your trust list back after you have looked at the person's trust list.

wallet4bitcoin

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I'm a newbie still trying to get to grips with the trust system.
1: -0 / +1

Please can someone affirm/clarify my quesitons/assumptions below:

1) I assume that only those in the trust network of the person who left the feedback see the 3rd (+1) number?
So if someone in Default Trust left me feedback everyone in Default Trust would see that feedback?
2) Does this apply to the first number too 1:?
3) Where can I see other people's trust lists?

tspacepilot

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Quote from: hilariousandco on December 06, 2015, 04:58:06 PM

Quote from: phishead on December 06, 2015, 04:56:41 PM

Hey, so I didn't really read much of the previous posts on here because it's not that big of a deal, but since I'm trying to understand how the trust system works here on the forum I'll just go ahead and ask.

What makes a person a "trusted user" vs. a "non trusted user"? For example, I just made a successful trade with someone here on the forum, but under my trust it has no + marks by it, and only shows my review of the transaction the other person left under the "untrusted" user section.

Thanks in advance.

For someone to be trusted they need to have been added into the default trust list by someone. Once they do their feedback will show up as 'trusted' vs untrusted. If you're wondering how you actually get chosen to be put on there keep doing successful trades or leaving relevant feedback and someone may eventually add you onto their trusted list.

To be fair, this answer assumes a centralized viewpoint. The assumption here is that you have "default trust" on your trust list and that you won't be changing that. In fact, for someone to show up as "trusted" you simply put their name on your trust list. After that, feedback from them shows up in your trusted feedback section. People who aren't in your trust network show up as "untrusted" in your feedback page. Manipulating your trust list to include people who you actually trust and want there (may or may not be people on the default trust list) is your responsibility.

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Quote from: hilariousandco on December 06, 2015, 04:58:06 PM

Quote from: phishead on December 06, 2015, 04:56:41 PM

Hey, so I didn't really read much of the previous posts on here because it's not that big of a deal, but since I'm trying to understand how the trust system works here on the forum I'll just go ahead and ask.

What makes a person a "trusted user" vs. a "non trusted user"? For example, I just made a successful trade with someone here on the forum, but under my trust it has no + marks by it, and only shows my review of the transaction the other person left under the "untrusted" user section.

Thanks in advance.

For someone to be trusted they need to have been added into the default trust list by someone. Once they do their feedback will show up as 'trusted' vs untrusted. If you're wondering how you actually get chosen to be put on there keep doing successful trades or leaving relevant feedback and someone may eventually add you onto their trusted list.

Ohh, ok that makes a lot more sense now. Thanks.

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Quote from: phishead on December 06, 2015, 04:56:41 PM

Hey, so I didn't really read much of the previous posts on here because it's not that big of a deal, but since I'm trying to understand how the trust system works here on the forum I'll just go ahead and ask.

What makes a person a "trusted user" vs. a "non trusted user"? For example, I just made a successful trade with someone here on the forum, but under my trust it has no + marks by it, and only shows my review of the transaction the other person left under the "untrusted" user section.

Thanks in advance.

For someone to be trusted they need to have been added into the default trust list by someone. Once they do their feedback will show up as 'trusted' vs untrusted. If you're wondering how you actually get chosen to be put on there keep doing successful trades or leaving relevant feedback and someone may eventually add you onto their trusted list.

phishead

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Hey, so I didn't really read much of the previous posts on here because it's not that big of a deal, but since I'm trying to understand how the trust system works here on the forum I'll just go ahead and ask.

What makes a person a "trusted user" vs. a "non trusted user"? For example, I just made a successful trade with someone here on the forum, but under my trust it has no + marks by it, and only shows my review of the transaction the other person left under the "untrusted" user section.

Thanks in advance.

Chris!

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This is great for us newbies to better understand the trust system on here. I had to read it over a few times but I think I've got it now. Thank you very much!

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Quote from: DiamondCardz on November 20, 2015, 04:06:36 PM

What happened to this idea? Was this replaced by the Huh

calculation where the system isn't sure, or was this just forgotten about? Or was it scrapped entirely?

I did it for a short while, but it looked stupid so I changed it back to black.

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Quote from: theymos on May 21, 2013, 06:31:57 AM

Quote from: 🏰 TradeFortress 🏰 on May 21, 2013, 06:27:00 AM

Looks pretty cool, however I'm not confident that this will reduce the amount of scams going on. Newbies seems to trust other newbies no matter how fishy it is.

Later, I'm going to change the trust color of people with a trust score of 0 to light red. This will hopefully help.

What happened to this idea? Was this replaced by the ??? calculation where the system isn't sure, or was this just forgotten about? Or was it scrapped entirely?

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Quote from: 🏰 TradeFortress 🏰 on May 21, 2013, 06:27:00 AM

Looks pretty cool, however I'm not confident that this will reduce the amount of scams going on. Newbies seems to trust other newbies no matter how fishy it is.

Do you get a notification when someone trusts you?

Just checked the first comment user trust maybe you are the "worst" "lowest negative trust member"
-9999: -16 / +9
Warning: Trade with extreme caution!
And as we have seen the trust points are not showing the same because of the trust list preferences

Topic: Marketplace trust - page 12. (Read 83235 times)