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Topic: Meanwhile in Ukraine... Revolution. - page 23. (Read 227070 times)

legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1002
August 22, 2014, 01:09:13 PM
It was strange day... I've met my old friend two days ago, I didn't talk with him during last year... I was surprised and disappointed a bit. I have no idea how they're doing this, but his rhetoric was identical with used by some maidan trolls. He used all typical cliches like "Putler", "europe will help us", etc.  He refused to answer any questions directrly through constant changing of subject. Besides this, I heared many interesting things about myself, like "you're a zombie and victim of propaganda", "fucking idiot putinist" etc.

NEWSFLASH: Outsider visits someone with personal experience, and is surprised when all that same propaganda that the insider has heard many times before is angrily dismissed as propaganda. Tomorrow, watch as a Spanish Catholic priest is appealed at the angry African's "rude behavior" after telling him that condoms should be avoided because AIDS is not a problem in Africa.

AIDS is the least of their problem in africa.
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
August 22, 2014, 12:56:27 PM
It was strange day... I've met my old friend two days ago, I didn't talk with him during last year... I was surprised and disappointed a bit. I have no idea how they're doing this, but his rhetoric was identical with used by some maidan trolls. He used all typical cliches like "Putler", "europe will help us", etc.  He refused to answer any questions directrly through constant changing of subject. Besides this, I heared many interesting things about myself, like "you're a zombie and victim of propaganda", "fucking idiot putinist" etc.

NEWSFLASH: Outsider visits someone with personal experience, and is surprised when all that same propaganda that the insider has heard many times before is angrily dismissed as propaganda. Tomorrow, watch as a Spanish Catholic priest is appalled at the angry African's "rude behavior" after telling him that condoms should be avoided because AIDS is not a problem in Africa.
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1014
August 22, 2014, 06:29:40 AM
Balthazar, your observation seems to resonate with the state of mind of the Germans in Hitler Germany, as demonstrated by one letter from home, found on the body of a dead soldier after Stalingrad battle. A line in there went something like this: "we all here are appalled at Russian audaciousness at continuing to resist."

By the way, a video worth watching (English subs). It's an appeal to the peoples of Europe from Novorossia:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b9_iWgVFmrQ

Also, interview with Putin's advisor Glazjov (subtitled). He is a very smart man, and the analysis he presents is much to the point of what is happening now. It's not about Ukraine, it never was:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cikvqdMRTTA
legendary
Activity: 3108
Merit: 1359
August 22, 2014, 05:15:08 AM
It was strange day... I've met my old friend two days ago, I didn't talk with him during last year... I was surprised and disappointed a bit. I have no idea how they're doing this, but his rhetoric was identical with used by some maidan trolls. He used all typical cliches like "Putler", "europe will help us", etc.  He refused to answer any questions directrly through constant changing of subject. Besides this, I heared many interesting things about myself, like "you're a zombie and victim of propaganda", "fucking idiot putinist" etc.

I was labeled like avatar of evil despite I haven't said anything about my own point of view, just asked him about his one and tried to criticize it. And the most strange thing here is that he considers such type of rhetoric as absolutely normal. He was very surprised when received GTFO suggestion after another Ad Hominem statement. And now, imagine that, he asking for help with squid configuration... After all that he have said before, it's just fucking amazing. %)

I didn't see previously known and rational thinking person. He shown a total absence of critical thinking, unconditional rejection of all argumentation, incredible degree of unprovoked agression, combined with constant Ad Hominem claims, and I can't recognize this person. Like I don't know him and never seen him before.

Maybe it's infection like rabies, who knows... But now I really think that we need a cure. This shit must be stopped.
member
Activity: 62
Merit: 10
August 22, 2014, 05:10:14 AM
it's crazy too see what's happening when i'm sitting safely in the usa not worring about any similar problems. it's scary just thinking about it.
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
August 22, 2014, 01:39:13 AM
This seems like your average proxy war over resources and prestige.

Partially yes. It's not helped by the conflicting history of the two territories. Ukraine views itself as always having been an independent nation, established way before Russia, and constantly fighting off invaders from Russia and Poland (who, by the way, often took Ukrainians into slavery), while Russia sees itself as having been formed from Ukraine, with Ukraine being the original part of Russia, and thus believes that Ukraine has always been part of Russia and should reunite with it (regardless of what its population wants).


Ukrainian National Guard POW testifies about Ukrainian war crimes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7raRDuFzmBQ

Wow. Confession under torture?
legendary
Activity: 992
Merit: 1000
August 21, 2014, 08:31:13 PM
Ukrainian National Guard POW testifies about Ukrainian war crimes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7raRDuFzmBQ
legendary
Activity: 992
Merit: 1000
August 21, 2014, 08:30:47 PM
This seems like your average proxy war over resources and prestige.

That, and attempting to install pre-emptive first-strike nuclear missile shield around Russia.
member
Activity: 76
Merit: 10
August 21, 2014, 07:05:46 PM
This seems like your average proxy war over resources and prestige.
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
August 21, 2014, 03:07:23 PM
Reposted from another author:

I received a link to this story few days ago and felt I had to share it with English-speaking community, so I took time to translate it.
Please take time to read and hopefully you will feel like sharing it in your circles.
*****************************************************************************
Hans de Borst, whose 17 year old daughter Elsemiek de Borst was killed in the shot down MH17 plane, wrote a letter addressed to Vladimir Putin, President of Russia:
"I thank you very much, Vladimir Putin, separatist leaders and Ukrainian government, for murdering my beloved and only daughter Elsemiek. She was 17. She wanted to become an architect.
Gentlemen, I hope you are proud to have killed my daughter and tomorrow you’ll be able to look in the mirror. I hope this letter will reach you, maybe in English, and, being intellectuals, you’ll be able to read it.
Thanks again. Best wishes.
Elsemiek’s father, Hans de Borst,
whose life is ruined."
Ukrainian citizen, Alexandra Kovalyova, wrote him a letter.
Dear Hans de Borst,
Perhaps you will never see this letter and perhaps this is even for the better.
I am very sorry that your daughter died in Boeing 777 downed by Russian terrorists over my country. Unlike Russia, my country never waged wars and lived through terrorist attacks. That’s why every death for us is a terrible shock. That’s why Ukrainians gather these days in front of the Embassy of Netherlands, bringing piles of flowers, candles and toys for killed children, for your daughter too. I know you must be thinking we cannot imagine your feelings now. You are right. But we are honest in our feelings.
My name is Alexandra, I live in Ukraine and when there’s a thunderstorm at night, I wake up in cold sweat, dreading that my town is being bombed.
You mentioned your daughter was 17 and she wanted to become an architect.
Please meet Sergey Nigoyan. He was 21 and the only son in his family. He has fallen the first victim of our ex-dictator Victor Yanukovich. After him there were 100 more, shot to death, blown up or burned. Many of them were the only sons, daughters, mothers and fathers. Their bodies were laid in a church right opposite my home. And when we were crying for justice, your European leaders were negotiating with the murderer Yanukovich. And when we were burying our dead, European leaders were demanding from Ukrainian opposition (who became government now and whom you are also addressing) to sign a peace treaty with Yanukovich and allow a murderer to stay in his presidential chair for another year. Our lives were of no value to your governments.
Do you know what it is like to have a neighboring country that treats you like their vassal? You may be even thinking yourself that Ukraine is Russia’s vassal. Your ancestors though knew well what it was like. But that was during Middle Ages, when your country fought for its independence from Spanish Empire. Too long ago for you to imagine what is happening now between Ukraine and Russia.
And you don’t have to. This is none of your business. It is for world politicians to deal with issues like that.
We thought so too.
When Putin annexed a part of Ukrainian territory, Crimean peninsula, we expected Western leaders to do what they had promised. Great Britain, USA and France in particular had signed a Budapest memorandum with Ukraine in 1994, according to which they had to ensure safety of my country. Having signed this memorandum, Ukraine surrendered all its nuclear weapons, because the safety of the country was now warrantied by Western powers. Had not West insisted on signing this treaty by Ukraine, it would still have nuclear power and Russia would had never dared to do what it did and no one would shoot down the plane with your daughter on board. But unfortunately Ukraine was honest and did everything according to the treaty, unlike European countries and USA, who have broken it with ease. USA and Great Britain did nothing but senseless talking, and France with its president Orland in the head not only broke the treaty, but did not stop selling its new warships to Russia, the aggressor country. Why so? Because it is good for business. As it was good for Europe to collaborate with Hitler in the 30s, feed him Poland and Czech Republic, forgive him Austria. And it was easy too, did not require turning consciousness on. I doubt you’d expect real justice from people like that.
When Putin started to move his terrorists into the Eastern regions of my country and provide them with heavy munition, politicians of the European Union did nothing to stop him. They urged my government to negotiate with Russian terrorists, who cut civilians open. And they also applied some sanctions that did not change a thing, some toy sanctions to pretend Europe was doing something.
Now, when Russia openly fires at Ukraine from its own territory, frau Merkel sits next to Putin ant the Soccer World Cup and shakes his hand. Did anyone tell you that now Russia is openly bombing Ukraine? Of course, not. Your media do not like to write about it. Why do you have to know that only few hundred kilometers away from EU a war is being waged full speed and the only sons and daughters of Ukrainian parents are dying now by thousands? Yesterday, on July 20, two Ukrainian school kids blew up on a mine installed by Russian terrorists. They were 15 and 16. You are not told about this because you don’t need to know that the country supplying you with oil and gas blows up Ukrainian kids. Ukrainian kids are not good for business, but gas and oil – very much so. Every time you fill your gas tank, remember that you may be filling it with fuel made of Russian oil. Every time you put a pot on a stove to cook your supper, you may be using Russian gas. These Russian oil and gas, that are so good for business, made European politicians turn away from not-so-good-for-business Ukraine, break their own international obligations and pretend nothing was happening for all these months.
I am not saying that Ukrainian government is innocent. After all in February this government, still being only an opposition, and under pressure from your European politicians still agreed to sign a shameful treaty with Yanukovich. And the fact that this treaty never went in effect is partially due to Ukrainian people, who simply did not allow this to happen.
So before you accuse Ukrainian government, maybe you consider including your European governments on the list of those responsible for your daughter’s death. After all, it is them who were holding backroom talks with Putin for all these months, it is them, who refused to listen, when Ukrainian government was shouting loud that Russia started the war. It is them, your politicians, made our government negotiate with pro-Russian terrorists, the armed ones, the same ones who shot down the Boeing with your daughter on board, your beautiful, gifted and happy Elsemiek. Are you expecting justice served? Do you believe your governments will be able to provide it? The same politician who shake hands with Putin? To tell you the truth, I have doubts.
I am in no way connected to Ukrainian politicians, government of business.
I cannot imagine the magnitude of your loss.
Most likely, you do not care about what I say.
I am simply a Ukrainian girl, who wakes up during a night thunderstorm in fear that her city is being bombed.
But still – I am very sorry.
Alexandra Kovalyova.
newbie
Activity: 12
Merit: 0
July 22, 2014, 05:49:28 PM
That´s right. Don´t trust the power of evil.
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1014
July 14, 2014, 03:22:29 AM

Well, US is playing a rough game right at Russia's front door. I don't see why Russia cannot play a gentle game at US' front door in return.  Grin
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1002
legendary
Activity: 1596
Merit: 1005
★Nitrogensports.eu★
July 12, 2014, 05:21:23 PM
i leave this interesting link here so use google to translate


TL;DR some Odessa victims got to talk on EU parliament and the EU parliament dint have the decency to listen to them

Since when parliament's job is to listen to every war victim or refugee? Of course they won't listen to them, they know what is going on with Ukraine right now, they don't care. Nothing's new here.
legendary
Activity: 938
Merit: 1000
chaos is fun...…damental :)
July 12, 2014, 04:49:38 PM
i leave this interesting link here so use google to translate


TL;DR some Odessa victims got to talk on EU parliament and the EU parliament dint have the decency to listen to them
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1014
July 12, 2014, 04:14:27 AM
The wording if "Ukraine signs EU pact that set off revolution" is misleading at best, because it was refusing to sign it that set off the protests and revolution in the first place.

Yes, right... the 1000 or so pro-EU protesters on Maidan clearly constituted the majority view of 48 million Ukrainians. And even those protests were then hijacked by Right Sector and US-sponsored competing oligarchs to perform a coup d'etat. The coup governments immediate act of revocation of the constitution that gave at least a minimum amount of right to Russian speaking population, had nothing to do with subsequent unrest. And, of course, after the Odessa massacre, people of Novorossia should have been sitting quietly an unarmed, waiting for when their turn to be burnt alive came.

In any case. Here are some statistics, collected by American Gallup:



Please, stop rewriting history even at this early stage.

PS: No one says that all West-Ukrainians are Nazis. They don't need to be, just like in Nazi Germany and its army most were not Nazis, but were either brainwashed or protecting their families from prosecution. In Ukraine the Nazi core is the Right Sector and their armed branch - National Guard, aided by various private punitive bandit battalions: Kolomojskij's "Ajdar", Ljashko's "Azov" (btw, Ljasko confirmed that half of his battalion consists of criminals, taken from prisons)...
legendary
Activity: 3276
Merit: 1352
Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
July 12, 2014, 12:21:04 AM
The wording if "Ukraine signs EU pact that set off revolution" is misleading at best, because it was refusing to sign it that set off the protests and revolution in the first place.

Also, as if the 70 years of Soviet rule wasn't enough to prove a point, no one should EVER trust anything from Russian media http://www.examiner.com/list/russia-s-top-20-lies-about-ukraine

and by extension, anything from the brainwashed Russian shills in this thread. This war that is going on in Ukraine can easily be blamed on Russia itself, for spreading such propaganda, and provoking paranoia and violence in those areas with lies about evil Ukrainian Nazis coming to get them.
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1014
June 27, 2014, 09:47:40 AM
Coup d'etat is a success. An oligarch who didn't want to sign the agreement got replaced by an oligarch, who is more willing.
But the coup has set off forces the consequences of which we do not quiet understand yet.
It's not over yet...
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