MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering] - page 312.

ArticMine

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Quote from: Nagle on August 16, 2013, 12:07:15 PM

If Mt. Gox had "serious problems with the US Government", there would be press releases from DOJ or the SEC, news coverage, and possibly arrests.

I would consider the seizure of a Credit Union account by the US Department of Homeland Security to be serious problems with the US Government https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/mtgoxs-dwolla-account-in-the-usa-has-been-seized-by-the-dhs-205694

Quote from: Nagle on August 16, 2013, 12:07:15 PM

They have serious problems with CoinLab, which is suing them for good reasons.

I would rather not comment on the merits or lack thereof of a lawsuit before the courts. I will point out a thread back in March where I asked a series of mundane questions regarding compliance in Canada I received a prompt response from MTGox but no response to this day from Coinlab so I will let the reader be the judge here. https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1579776

Quote from: Nagle on August 16, 2013, 12:07:15 PM

They might have serious problems with some Tokyo banks. But even that is unlikely. If you have money, you can generally send it somewhere else. If you don't...

Mt. Gox had trouble at the US end, they'd probably be blocked from receiving money transfers. They're not. Somehow, the only things that don't work are things that take money away from Mt. Gox. That's very convenient for Mt. Gox.

I still believe the problems are regulatory and not financial.

sturle

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: OhShei8e on August 16, 2013, 04:38:12 AM

A national cheque is quite different from an international bank cheque.

Quit spreading lies. Any forum user should ignore posts coming from OhShei8e, as he is the only individual on the forums who incessantly supports Gox, and uses poor or irrelevant facts to back up his position. His information is false.

Eh? What OhShei8se writes is 100% true. I've received a cheque myself which couldn't be redeemed outside USSA (and possibly Canada). No bank in my country wanted it. Scammers.

I don't think national cheques exist in my country any more. Haven't seen one since the 80ies. Checked my bank's price list now, and hidden in some price list for special services I found a price for currency cheque. So it seems they do one kind of cheques. It is the second most expensive service in my bank's price list, after taking up a new loan. 85 USD. Recalling a currency cheque, in case it is lost in the mail, is the third most expensive service in my bank. (I wonder if this is what was previously called a "travellers cheque"?) Then there is a swiftcheque (same price), which is basically as SWIFT transfer to someone without a bank account. I suppose those will have the same limit as other SWIFT payments.

There are many kinds of cheques, and not all can be redeemed everywhere.

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Quote from: acoindr on August 16, 2013, 12:43:57 PM

I have a question. I've been reading through this thread and have seen everybody pissing on MtGox with fury over the situation. At the same time it seems people have multiple withdrawal requests for thousands of dollars.

Mt.Gox is a way to buy bitcoins.

As far as I know there have been no problems buying or transferring bitcoins. The only problem is withdrawing USD, which is obviously tied to the old existing banking system.

Now, I'm not saying Mt.Gox should not have offered withdrawal by wire service, but it seems to me if they didn't this problem wouldn't exist. In other words the people making all these USD withdrawal requests apparently were not truly interested in owning bitcoins, but in something different. So now that the system has jammed up everyone is in a temper. It seems to me Mt.Gox isn't the only entity responsible for the resulting situation of multitudes of people withdrawing thousands of USD, or am I missing something?

You're missing quite a bit.

vinne81

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Quote from: acoindr on August 16, 2013, 12:43:57 PM

I have a question. I've been reading through this thread and have seen everybody pissing on MtGox with fury over the situation. At the same time it seems people have multiple withdrawal requests for thousands of dollars.

Mt.Gox is a way to buy bitcoins.

As far as I know there have been no problems buying or transferring bitcoins. The only problem is withdrawing USD, which is obviously tied to the old existing banking system.

Now, I'm not saying Mt.Gox should not have offered withdrawal by wire service, but it seems to me if they didn't this problem wouldn't exist. In other words the people making all these USD withdrawal requests apparently were not truly interested in owning bitcoins, but in something different. So now that the system has jammed up everyone is in a temper. It seems to me Mt.Gox isn't the only entity responsible for the resulting situation of multitudes of people withdrawing thousands of USD, or am I missing something?

Everybody who thinks he should exchange his BTC for fiat should have the possibility to do so.

Besides, if everybody should be a true bitcoin believer, and not sell much (as you propose), then how could other people buy Bitcoins? There would be none for sale at MtGox.

vinne81

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Quote from: kodachrome on August 16, 2013, 11:11:12 AM

Is there a reason this thread is so long and no one else did this?

- I asked MTGOX to cancel my withdrawal via ticket, they did but no money refunded into Gox account, onto Chat, got the money in the Gox account via Chat support agent, bought BTC, withdrew BTC to Bitstamp, sold BTC instantly, withdrew funds via SEPA on Bitstamp - operation says its complete and I should know in 24hrs if the funds appear.

I was waiting 9 f'ing weeks on MTGOX to process the SEPA withdrawal but might have worked around them in about 30min. Didnt loose anything noticeable cash wise either and BitStamp seem to have a good site, flows that work and are based in Europe, all good things.

L2read, I just did this and wrote about it yesterday

acoindr

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I have a question. I've been reading through this thread and have seen everybody pissing on MtGox with fury over the situation. At the same time it seems people have multiple withdrawal requests for thousands of dollars.

Mt.Gox is a way to buy bitcoins.

As far as I know there have been no problems buying or transferring bitcoins. The only problem is withdrawing USD, which is obviously tied to the old existing banking system.

Now, I'm not saying Mt.Gox should not have offered withdrawal by wire service, but it seems to me if they didn't this problem wouldn't exist. In other words the people making all these USD withdrawal requests apparently were not truly interested in owning bitcoins, but in something different. So now that the system has jammed up everyone is in a temper. It seems to me Mt.Gox isn't the only entity responsible for the resulting situation of multitudes of people withdrawing thousands of USD, or am I missing something?

Nagle

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Quote from: ArticMine on August 15, 2013, 08:13:18 PM

I suspect it is two separate issues:
USD is by far the worse because no matter where or to whom it is going a USD wire will be routed through a US Bank, and MTGox has had some serious problems with the US Government.
Other currencies is more a question of getting additional banking partners, and addressing the serious load that the number of wires they send is having on their banking partners.

If Mt. Gox had "serious problems with the US Government", there would be press releases from DOJ or the SEC, news coverage, and possibly arrests. They have serious problems with CoinLab, which is suing them for good reasons. They might have serious problems with some Tokyo banks. But even that is unlikely. If you have money, you can generally send it somewhere else. If you don't...

Mt. Gox had trouble at the US end, they'd probably be blocked from receiving money transfers. They're not. Somehow, the only things that don't work are things that take money away from Mt. Gox. That's very convenient for Mt. Gox.

ArticMine

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Quote from: kodachrome on August 16, 2013, 11:11:12 AM

Is there a reason this thread is so long and no one else did this?

- I asked MTGOX to cancel my withdrawal via ticket, they did but no money refunded into Gox account, onto Chat, got the money in the Gox account via Chat support agent, bought BTC, withdrew BTC to Bitstamp, sold BTC instantly, withdrew funds via SEPA on Bitstamp - operation says its complete and I should know in 24hrs if the funds appear.

I was waiting 9 f'ing weeks on MTGOX to process the SEPA withdrawal but might have worked around them in about 30min. Didnt loose anything noticeable cash wise either and BitStamp seem to have a good site, flows that work and are based in Europe, all good things.

A lot of people are that is why the price on MTGox is 109.4940 USD and on BitStamp 97.8600 USD.

kodachrome

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Is there a reason this thread is so long and no one else did this?

- I asked MTGOX to cancel my withdrawal via ticket, they did but no money refunded into Gox account, onto Chat, got the money in the Gox account via Chat support agent, bought BTC, withdrew BTC to Bitstamp, sold BTC instantly, withdrew funds via SEPA on Bitstamp - operation says its complete and I should know in 24hrs if the funds appear.

I was waiting 9 f'ing weeks on MTGOX to process the SEPA withdrawal but might have worked around them in about 30min. Didnt loose anything noticeable cash wise either and BitStamp seem to have a good site, flows that work and are based in Europe, all good things.

OhShei8e

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Quote from: dserrano5 on August 16, 2013, 03:17:27 AM

Quote from: mp420 on August 15, 2013, 12:31:38 PM

Plus, it's down right impossible to cash any bank cheque in much of continental Europe. I have never seen a cheque with my own eyes. In Europe, electronic bank wires (even between banks) have traditionally been very low cost, and with the introduction of SEPA, they're free. Anything that involves paper is very expensive.

Spaniard here: I've been cashing out cheques at a monthly basis for a couple of years now.

A national cheque is quite different from an international bank cheque.

dserrano5

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Quote from: mp420 on August 15, 2013, 12:31:38 PM

Plus, it's down right impossible to cash any bank cheque in much of continental Europe. I have never seen a cheque with my own eyes. In Europe, electronic bank wires (even between banks) have traditionally been very low cost, and with the introduction of SEPA, they're free. Anything that involves paper is very expensive.

Spaniard here: I've been cashing out cheques at a monthly basis for a couple of years now.

vinne81

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Quote from: sturle on August 16, 2013, 01:56:15 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: vinne81 on August 15, 2013, 02:42:58 PM

I had withdrawals from about a month ago that went trough 10 days ago. Another withdrawal from just one day later in july is still in the queue. So either

1) They are not processing in order
2) They haven't processed *anything* since that particular day.

Quote from: sturle on August 13, 2013, 07:25:31 AM

14:19 <@MagicalTux> those wires are processed in received order, nothing else

Quoting out of context again. There are three types of wires via bank: SWIFT, SEPA and Japanese domestic transfers. vinne81 transferred EUR, which I assume is via SEPA (fastest with the exception of domestic transfers). MagicalTux was referring to SWIFT wires. The queues for the two are different, since there is a limit on number of transfers per day for SWIFT and amount per day and month for SEPA. I assume MtGox try to fill up their daily quota of SEPA volume by smaller transfers if the next one in the queue is too large to fit.

Please stop quoting out of context and talk about all wires as they were the same kind.

The only way for this to be true is that the last withdrawal of mine that DID go trough, was used to fill up the quota. It's certainly possible, but it means they still have a serious backlog. To summarize: 2 or 3 weeks my ass

Alonzo Ewing

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Does Mt Gox have a BTC withdrawal limit? (not USD, but BTC)

sturle

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: vinne81 on August 15, 2013, 02:42:58 PM

I had withdrawals from about a month ago that went trough 10 days ago. Another withdrawal from just one day later in july is still in the queue. So either

1) They are not processing in order
2) They haven't processed *anything* since that particular day.

Quote from: sturle on August 13, 2013, 07:25:31 AM

14:19 <@MagicalTux> those wires are processed in received order, nothing else

Quoting out of context again. There are three types of wires via bank: SWIFT, SEPA and Japanese domestic transfers. vinne81 transferred EUR, which I assume is via SEPA (fastest with the exception of domestic transfers). MagicalTux was referring to SWIFT wires. The queues for the two are different, since there is a limit on number of transfers per day for SWIFT and amount per day and month for SEPA. I assume MtGox try to fill up their daily quota of SEPA volume by smaller transfers if the next one in the queue is too large to fit.

Please stop quoting out of context and talk about all wires as they were the same kind.

ArticMine

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Quote from: YipYip on August 15, 2013, 07:35:03 PM

Let me ask what may be a stupid question...

(Please dont throw stones,,,stick are ok sortoff lolz )

Are all these withdrawl delays only for USD to US customers or is it across the board Huh

I suspect it is two separate issues:
USD is by far the worse because no matter where or to whom it is going a USD wire will be routed through a US Bank, and MTGox has had some serious problems with the US Government.
Other currencies is more a question of getting additional banking partners, and addressing the serious load that the number of wires they send is having on their banking partners.

YipYip

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Let me ask what may be a stupid question...

(Please dont throw stones,,,stick are ok sortoff lolz )

Are all these withdrawl delays only for USD to US customers or is it across the board Huh

zeroblock

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Quote from: sturle on August 15, 2013, 03:49:24 PM

My claim was:
Because it is amazingly easy to sell at or above MtGox rates just about everywhere, except on a few exchanges.

Quote

"I never used any of those." Then obviously you have no idea who makes up the Bitcoin marketplace.

A handful a day at Localbitcoins, one or two via email and and 10 to 30 via IRC. I doubt the other facilities process millions of dollars every day. The total order book at Bitstamp (bids) is only 1 million USD deep. Not able to support millions of dollars every day, unless you mean Zimbabwe dollars.

False. Please provide backups to your statements. BitStamp's volume yesterday (8/14) was $1,783,880.83. Would everyone quit using the damn order book as a comparison? Those orders can be canceled, they are transitory. Look at volume. Those were actualized transactions.

http://bitcoincharts.com/charts/bitstampUSD#rg60ztgSzm1g10zm2g25zv

Coinbase had $2.5 MM in transactions in February, we can safely say they are doing probably $10 MM a month (they did $15 MM in April), that would be $333,333 a day.

http://techcrunch.com/2013/05/27/bitcoin-2/

BTC-E $476,854.84 (8/14)

http://bitcoincharts.com/charts/btceUSD#rg60ztgSzm1g10zm2g25zv

BitPay lets assume $5 MM a month, or $166,667 a day

http://blog.bitpay.com/2013/04/bitpay-eclipses-silk-road-in-bitcoin.html

And don't forget BIPS, lets assume $5MM a month as well, or $166,667 a day

For a grand total of: $2,927,400 daily, excluding GOX and local transactions

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Quote from: dave111223 on August 05, 2013, 08:42:53 PM

Quote from: Rampion on August 05, 2013, 07:29:01 PM

Yep, good point. And BTW, why would the bank "reject" credits after holding them for a few days?

It's probably possible that funds sent via a bank transfer from a stolen account can be reversed, specially if the stolen report comes shortly after the transfer.

The modern banking system operates as a full recourse system. Nothing is irreversible. It is the exact polar opposite of bitcoin.

sturle

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: sturle on August 15, 2013, 01:54:19 PM

My claim was:

Quote from: sturle on August 15, 2013, 01:01:16 PM

Because it is amazingly easy to sell at or above MtGox rates just about everywhere, except on a few exchanges.

Believe me, it is.

You are absolutely wrong. I can't say that any more emphatically.

See my own offers. I sell at MtGox ask + 2.5%, and buy for MtGox bid - 1%. If it was difficult to sell at MtGox bid + 2.5%, I wouldn't sell 200 to 500 BTC a week at this price. Note my buy offer at MtGox bid - 1% as well. Not above MtGox price, but not very far from it either. When I can sell 200 to 500 BTC a week at this price, I consider it easy. My buy offer is high to keep liquidity high with domestic transfers. SEPA transfers to e.g. Bitstamp take suspiciously long time to get credited sometimes, and this can put me in a BTC liquidity squeeze in periods of high volume. (My primary goal is to offer a fast and painless way to exchange between BTC and NOK at goot rates, not making as much profit as possible.)

I think you are absolutely wrong, or perhaps you never even tried?

Quote

"I never used any of those." Then obviously you have no idea who makes up the Bitcoin marketplace.

Yes, I do. Those are quite small compared to MtGox.

Quote

oh but wait! You have a few very dumb buyers on localbitcoins that will be willing to buy a handful Bitcoins from you at a premium! Oh ya thats totally the right price! Not the millions of dollars a day processed through the other facilities!

A handful a day at Localbitcoins, one or two via email and and 10 to 30 via IRC. I doubt the other facilities process millions of dollars every day. The total order book at Bitstamp (bids) is only 1 million USD deep. Not able to support millions of dollars every day, unless you mean Zimbabwe dollars.

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