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Topic: [NEM] NEM -New Economy Movement - No Envy Movement - Updates+Discussion thread - page 459. (Read 661525 times)

member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
how often is this updated https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlidWok7hW0DdDZ0amZpM00wQXhrR2lJM3pCOGRhNFE#gid=0 ? I am not on there dispite my contribution:https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=440185.msg4886653#msg4886653
Thanks in advance!

Anyone have an answer to this Huh I did not get listed...
hero member
Activity: 617
Merit: 528
Whatever the plan is I suggest you make it quick Smiley Someone tossed this on to the Litecoin forums and the post was met with a rather cold Ponzi/Premine sentiment. Which is, in a sence, a very logical response from any non Belieber. By the rate this is going NEM will hit its 4000 stakeholder target in two weeks. By that time NEM will have collected +/- 200BTC (think its around 30BTC now). In order to keep the public opinion on your side you'll really need to show something soon.

Reference: LTC forum topic:

https://litecointalk.org/index.php?topic=14547.0
full member
Activity: 183
Merit: 100
TDTPJR-P5SGXY-UU2OS6-BPTUV4-NJYQFT-6CWYZP-IA2W
While I think it looks pretty good it does remind me a lot of another coin that is already out there...can't remember the name right now. If you browse the Announcement sub you'll sure stumble upon it tho.

ouh my goodness, that is not the smallest thread ..
if you remember the coin again, please post a link!
But its none of the coins that is on coinmarketcap, right?
hero member
Activity: 980
Merit: 1001
While I think it looks pretty good it does remind me a lot of another coin that is already out there...can't remember the name right now. If you browse the Announcement sub you'll sure stumble upon it tho.
full member
Activity: 183
Merit: 100
TDTPJR-P5SGXY-UU2OS6-BPTUV4-NJYQFT-6CWYZP-IA2W
hey guys!
(I hope its okay posting logos here?)
your feedback is needed.

should I continue to work on this?
what do you think could be improved?




my personal favourite:



kind regards,
upekha
Smiley
sr. member
Activity: 602
Merit: 268
Internet of Value
In an attempt to attract users who are relatively new to crypto-currency. I have set up a point-of-sale PAYPAL to NEM that I personally oversee: The way it works is that:

1. The new user contacts me via PM asking for a PayPal option
2. The new user sends me $ via Paypal (gift)
3. I send the required NXT to NEM account from my personal address 3231774856984709013
4. I give the new user the transaction id so he/ she can make a new account, make a post with that transaction id to reserve a stake (explicitly announcing this is paypal transaction as well)

Now this option is a way to help new users coming to NEM and cryptocurrency in general so it is not open to any users who can access NXT or BTC easily. I would generally ask for personal information and the reason why they cannot send NXT or BTC in.

So the address 3231774856984709013 would be exempt from sending address check.

I would prefer to not use this option for more than a total of 1000$ in transaction so let me know if you want to help and offer this type of service.
hero member
Activity: 980
Merit: 1001
Regarding the forging algorithm. Are we still exploring options to improve this over NXT?

I am convinced that the design of the forging algorithm is one of the major things that may convice people to invest in NEM!

For this I believe the goal of the forging concept should be:

1. To attract as many people as possible to invest in NEM (preferrably even small amounts)
2. To make NEM more than just an investment

Yeah I think thats absolutely the case!
And maybe also adjusting the fee-system.

I think one of the main reasons why people use bitcoin, is that it has so small transaction fees.
But is this even possible when NEM is supposed to be a PoS-currency?

bitcoin fees where low when bitcoin price was low - that's not the case anymore.
full member
Activity: 183
Merit: 100
TDTPJR-P5SGXY-UU2OS6-BPTUV4-NJYQFT-6CWYZP-IA2W
Regarding the forging algorithm. Are we still exploring options to improve this over NXT?

I am convinced that the design of the forging algorithm is one of the major things that may convice people to invest in NEM!

For this I believe the goal of the forging concept should be:

1. To attract as many people as possible to invest in NEM (preferrably even small amounts)
2. To make NEM more than just an investment

Yeah I think thats absolutely the case!
And maybe also adjusting the fee-system.

I think one of the main reasons why people use bitcoin, is that it has so small transaction fees.
But is this even possible when NEM is supposed to be a PoS-currency?
full member
Activity: 183
Merit: 100
TDTPJR-P5SGXY-UU2OS6-BPTUV4-NJYQFT-6CWYZP-IA2W
how about "New Equality Movement"?
hero member
Activity: 980
Merit: 1001
Hi,
As many of the people here; I miss the train of being early investor at NXT and, although I consider NXT a brilliant concept; I also think that coin distribution is, at least, weird. I guess, this is the main problem that we are seeing now. The market can be easily manipulated by early investors. That is the main reason why I get so enthusiastic when I noticed this initiative, and I haven't doubt to pay 400 NXT. I also created this account specially for that and I have no plans to create more accounts or being a sockpuppet.
I read that utopianfuture is working on it; but do you already have an estimation of how many stakeholders are we at this moment? I have the impression that there is a lot of enthusiasm and the fund raising process is progressing at great speed (in about 15 hours, I saw like 5-6 pages more of people inscribing it). Is this correct? Based on that, is there already any estimation of when the pool will be closed?

I think we should currently be around 2k stakes. Utopian said that 4k is the max but 3k would probably be ideal. I think the registration will close down mid feb because once those ads on reddit kick in we're going to have 4k in no time.
When the distribution will happen is another matter but I suspect utopian as usual "has a plan" Smiley

PS: This "having a plan" is totally becoming a thing here. Like "there's an app for that" Smiley
hero member
Activity: 980
Merit: 1001

Yes. The development team is currently having discussions around the forging algorithm. There are a few main considerations of any forging algorithm:
(1) Is it "fair"?
(2) How can people cheat it?
(3) Who will it encourage people to forge?

As long as the transparent forging isn't affected I think we can think about doing things differently. I always thought about taking the "age" of coins into account like I think peercoin does.
(1) Aging will reward coins that have most recently been transferred.
(2) One person transferring coins between N accounts.
(3) Only people with recently transferred coins will be encouraged to forge.


I think you missunderstood.
I mean the "oldest" coins should be more valuable in terms of forging power than "young" coins. So it should be the exact oposite of what you described.
If I have coins and I don't do anything with them for say a week I'm more likely to forge a new block than someone who has just transfered his coins. Once a coin has forged a block it's age is reset so that noone has an incentive to simply hoard his coins forever. Like I said I think that's the POS implementaion of PeerCoin i think.
member
Activity: 94
Merit: 10
Hi,
As many of the people here; I miss the train of being early investor at NXT and, although I consider NXT a brilliant concept; I also think that coin distribution is, at least, weird. I guess, this is the main problem that we are seeing now. The market can be easily manipulated by early investors. That is the main reason why I get so enthusiastic when I noticed this initiative, and I haven't doubt to pay 400 NXT. I also created this account specially for that and I have no plans to create more accounts or being a sockpuppet.
I read that utopianfuture is working on it; but do you already have an estimation of how many stakeholders are we at this moment? I have the impression that there is a lot of enthusiasm and the fund raising process is progressing at great speed (in about 15 hours, I saw like 5-6 pages more of people inscribing it). Is this correct? Based on that, is there already any estimation of when the pool will be closed?



   
sr. member
Activity: 299
Merit: 250
@utopianfuture

Here's an idea.  Use it as you wish.

Reserve some percentage of initial stake as a forging pool bounty.  Upon release of NEX, automate the account in which this is stored to generate transactions solely for the purpose of rewarding active forgers with fees.

Adds a bit of a 'proof-of-work' concept for rewarding those who participate in the network.

It also could give nice credit card style marketing, like "use NEM for X days with no fees."
sr. member
Activity: 299
Merit: 250
Regarding the forging algorithm. Are we still exploring options to improve this over NXT?

I am convinced that the design of the forging algorithm is one of the major things that may convice people to invest in NEM!

For this I believe the goal of the forging concept should be:

1. To attract as many people as possible to invest in NEM (preferrably even small amounts)
2. To make NEM more than just an investment

What do I mean by that:

Well I guess we can all agree that the forging algorithm of NXT does not attract the regular joes to the game. I believe this is  exactly what we should aim for with NEM because there are alot of regular joes  Cheesy  This would also make it a more stable currency compared to when the majority of users are investors that only aim to make money with it.
Once the currency has proved to be stable you will establish trust. I believe a lack of thrust is the major argument merchants still have against cryptocurrencies. (and obviously the legal grey area debate but this can not be countered by the design of NEM  Wink )
If we could make a concept that will attracht merchants (obviously this is long term thinking), I suppose this will benifit NEM hugely!

Please let's debate on this and share some thoughts.

Yes. The development team is currently having discussions around the forging algorithm. There are a few main considerations of any forging algorithm:
(1) Is it "fair"?
(2) How can people cheat it?
(3) Who will it encourage people to forge?

As long as the transparent forging isn't affected I think we can think about doing things differently. I always thought about taking the "age" of coins into account like I think peercoin does.
(1) Aging will reward coins that have most recently been transferred.
(2) One person transferring coins between N accounts.
(3) Only people with recently transferred coins will be encouraged to forge.

Also a forging rate ceiling at a given amount of coins would be good also, thus a forging rate a little more efficient until this ceiling, but it's probably too hard to implement.
We could put a cap on the maximum number of coins in an account that contribute to forging:
(1) Large accounts can be split up into smaller accounts, but they will have to pay fees to do so. So, this would be "fairer" than NXT.
(2) One person splitting up their accounts.
(3) Large account holders.

Or we could have unweighted forging where each account has equal forging power:
(1) Large accounts can be split up into smaller accounts, but they will have to pay fees to do so. So, this would be "fairer" than NXT.
(2) One person splitting up their accounts.
(3) Everyone or no one Smiley.

Or we could have forging bands where a certain level of coins would put you in a group.
For example, forging groups could be:
- Accounts > 4M
- Accounts [1M, 4M)
- Accounts [500K, 1M)
- Accounts [100K, 500K)
- Accounts [1K, 100K)
- Accounts [1, 1K)
Each subsequent block could come from a different group. Assuming less concentration at the top, that would encourage asset consolidation up to 4M and then a splitting of assets less than that.
(1) Bands with less accounts would be more desirable
(2) As people move to less occupied bands, the bands will reach an equilibrium where they all have ~ the same number of accounts
(3) Everyone or no one

It's just something I thought up of now, so I haven't fully thought it through.
sr. member
Activity: 299
Merit: 250
If I look at NXT right now there is only a brainwallet and I can't store it locally. If I wan't to forge I need to have my node running all the time.
What If I could store my wallet locally but it would also be accessible from other clients, as long as my node is running ? That way you would have an offline wallet, but you could make it accessible remotly if you need it to by runing your own node.

The client that I wan't to access my wallet from would then have to have my "home node" in his peers but that shouldn't be too much of a problem.

What is the benefit of this over a "brain" wallet? I assume your "home node" is your forging node, right? So, it will need to be online for forging. While you could add it to the peers lists of your clients, a hacker could add it to the peers lists of their clients too. So, I'm not sure if there is an advantage?
sr. member
Activity: 299
Merit: 250
Go with a wallet.dat setup for normal users.  Power users can click on the brain icon and enter in their own high-strength passphrase after being warned of the importance of a truly high-powered passphrase.

This sounds pretty similar to what Ripple does but better.
When you create a Ripple wallet you can choose the store it at Payward (brain) or only in your local browser (wallet.dat). What makes this worse than a real wallet.dat i.e. a local file is that as soon as you clear the browsers cache your wallet is gone Smiley

For the initial release, I'm thinking of supporting only a wallet.dat type setup. But, it should be easy enough to add "brain" wallet functionality around that in future iterations. Sound reasonable?
sr. member
Activity: 258
Merit: 250
DRAMA: Dumb Retards Asking More Attention
As you can see, I have a new bitcointalk account with no previous posts. I registered especially because of this threat and to eventually became a stakeholder. I had no need for a bitcointalk-account before because I usually never write anything in the inet.
After all the sockpuppet discussions I am not sure, that it is a good idea, to just send the 0.045 BTC and risk to be seen as a sockpuppet-account and eventually getting disquallified. So is it save to just send the BTC and post in the registration threat? What is happening with my 0.045 BTC if the dev decides I am just a sockpuppet-account?
 

Please excuse my probably bad english.

Don't worry!  Smiley

With the advertising on reddit most people will have new accounts as from now. That's the whole intention.
You will not be disqualified because you are a new user!

member
Activity: 64
Merit: 10
As you can see, I have a new bitcointalk account with no previous posts. I registered especially because of this threat and to eventually became a stakeholder. I had no need for a bitcointalk-account before because I usually never write anything in the inet.
After all the sockpuppet discussions I am not sure, that it is a good idea, to just send the 0.045 BTC and risk to be seen as a sockpuppet-account and eventually getting disquallified. So is it save to just send the BTC and post in the registration threat? What is happening with my 0.045 BTC if the dev decides I am just a sockpuppet-account?
 

Please excuse my probably bad english.
sr. member
Activity: 602
Merit: 268
Internet of Value

About the forging mechanism, here is my observation. NXT's forging incomes mainly go to big accounts with 5 millions or more, especially to a few of 30 million + accounts.
NEM won't have that kind of forging fee concentration thanks to the initial distribution design. I would suggest we stick with the traditional forging mechanism as in NXT as well as PPC. It would save us a lot of valuable times to invent a new forging mechanism that is not be gamed or attacked easily.


It's true about the concentration, so this may not be worth the effort.
So apart from the distribution design, are there any things we can do to make NEM more attractive than other coins ?   

Stay tuned. Development plan will be published in a week or so.
sr. member
Activity: 258
Merit: 250
DRAMA: Dumb Retards Asking More Attention

About the forging mechanism, here is my observation. NXT's forging incomes mainly go to big accounts with 5 millions or more, especially to a few of 30 million + accounts.
NEM won't have that kind of forging fee concentration thanks to the initial distribution design. I would suggest we stick with the traditional forging mechanism as in NXT as well as PPC. It would save us a lot of valuable times to invent a new forging mechanism that is not be gamed or attacked easily.


It's true about the concentration, so this may not be worth the effort.
So apart from the distribution design, are there any things we can do to make NEM more attractive than other coins ?   
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