Topic: [POT]PotCoin - Banking for the Legal Cannabis Industry ✦ ✦ ✦Grow With Us ✦ ✦ ✦ - page 187. (Read 920138 times)

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Where's my bong?

The thought often runs through my mind, about the functionality of potcoin in the future. That is what adds to the speculative nature of crypto in general. I think we will eventually be seeing a Visa coin and an AmEx coin. I think the major players will eventually swoop in as it could drastically lower the cost of doing business for them. Just a matter of figuring it all out, but that is a number of years away from here. Potcoin has a future. There are a lot of vendors accepting the coin, more and more each day. We also seem to get a decent amount of press coverage for a crypto that isn't btc. Will potcoin grow to btc status, i don't think 600 a coin is what anyone should expect.

Can we get the op updated with the new halving schedule, please 

Oh I know that feeling, and I said my peace and blocked him, and moved on. Life is so much better that way. He clearly has some sort of anti-potcoin agenda, if not more. Even his name betrays him: Vice Roy. It could be taken as 'viceroy', but with how he's acting, it's like he's former narc/vice, and he got super mad when I mentioned that. Dude needs to chill and just move on.


Absolutely agree with everything written by notabot, especially the quoted text.

Even when marijuana is wholly decriminalized in the US, potcoin can still have a use. There will still be folks using it.

Look at it this way, people still use checks.

Actually the wording I prefer is decriminalized, not legalized. It changes the onus to more accurately portray the truth in some parts of the world.

The real crime going on is young adults getting a criminal record for a joint which stays with them and lessens their chances of landing a decent job, and could dampen their chances of immigration or international travel. If you are in this situation you are able to get a pardon once in your life in many countries.

The really bad drug is alcohol (not that I'm against having a drink) - but look at the alcohol related incidents - violence, drunkenness, social and relationship issues. But hey that's OK because it's allowed. How about cigarettes - how many die each year from that?  And not a good way to go either.  

Then you get what I would call the bad drugs, the ones that mess up society, and I don't have to name them.

At one time in the US farmers were required to grow hemp, and it has been used since Egyptian times and probably even farther back for ropes and sails for ships. Hemp clothing lasts just about forever. Even the US Constitution was written on hemp paper. Hemp seed oil has many health benefits. And the whole premise of medical cannabis is based on case studies where it has been proven to be beneficial either to reduce side effects of drugs such as chemo, or as an alternative therapy in its own right. Even smoking it recreationally, what difference is that compared to drinking, cigarettes, or anti-depressants? Life is tough and stressful sometimes, if someone wants to smoke and it relaxes them, then I'd call that medicinal use. In fact this plant's history is weaved through cultures and time. You might say that going against every symbiotic relationship that exists with this plant on so many levels goes against the holistic good of humanity.

Potcoin not only must compete against cash,credit cards,mobile payments etc., it also competes against other cryptocoins.  I think making analogies between potcoin and bitcoin is flawed because bitcoin has many more supporters than potcoin.  Non-miners need a strong reason to use a niche cryptocoin such as potcoin.  Miners will use whatever coin they mine.

For example, bitpay.com can be used to accept bitcoin payments on a website.  But maybe they don't permit marijuana sales?
Someone could make a potcoin version of bitpay which would be exclusively for the marijuana industry.
This is just an example of how potcoin can, in some instances, be more useful than bitcoin.

I run some websites which process credit card payments to sell stuff.  Few months ago, I added the option to pay with BTC/LTC but it's an off-site option.  The buyer must send BTC/LTC (via wallet) and then email me.  Even though, so far, no one has paid me by cryptocoin,  I still leave that payment option on my sites as a way to promote cryptocoins.  From my personal experience, most people still have little interest/experience in paying with cryptocoins.  This will hopefully change as people are more often exposed to cryptocoins.

Perhaps marijuana buyers are different than the average person.  Maybe they don't want a marijuana related purchase to be permanently recorded on their credit card statement which might embarrass them or negatively affect them in the future.  Currently, I am mining potcoin and of course, anyone who mines potcoin would like to be able to buy stuff with our potcoins.  Just keep promoting these coins and eventually buyers/sellers will often use them .... I hope.

In case some of you don't know, banks are important for almost every business because credit/debit card payments are all processed through banks.  Without a bank account, you can not put cash in a bank and you also cant process credit/debit cards either.  You can process credit/debit payments through someone else's bank account (for example: paypal), but you wont be able to open your own credit card merchant account.  Almost forgot to mention, having a bank account can make it much easier to convert cryptocoin into fiat money.

I don't think that's necessarily true.

That's like saying without Silk Road, BTC is useless.  Potcoin will always have a place in the medical/recreational marijuana economy as long as people make sure it has a place.  Legal or not, Potcoin will have it's uses.

For instance... I can't buy MMJ with Potcoin yet, but I can sure as hell buy vapes and such.  Vapes aren't illegal, and yet I would use my coin to buy them.  I could use my credit card or cash when I order from places, but I'd rather use crypto.  I'm sure there are a lot of other people out there like me that think the same way.  As such, it's safe to assume that there are people out there that would rather pay for medical/recreational marijuana, and related goods, with Potcoin.  It's not just about banking, mate.  It's about a community coin that works for the community's wants and needs.

-Fuse

I am sure almost everyone is sick of reading about legal issues.
But I still have one more important thing to say.

If marijuana is ever 100% legal, then there will be very little need for potcoin.
The main reason for marijuana vendors to use bitcoins or potcoins or another digital currency is because vendors have difficulty opening and maintaining a credit/debit card merchant account and because of issues handling large sums of cash.  I am sure someone can post stories about a few banks which openly process payments for marijuana, but that's the exception and not the rule.  If you have no experience maintaining a high-risk merchant account, then please don't even comment.  Keeping an account open is not easy.  There are plenty of legal industries which are considered high risk and thus are shunned by visa/mastercard and various banks.  Any bank which accepts high risk merchants is probably a bank which has issues/problems.  Banks which are very successful don't want/need to work with legally risky merchants.  The bad banks are often desperate (or poorly managed or have other serious problems) and therefore choose to work with risky merchants or otherwise they may go bankrupt.  I know because I sell high risk items on-line and only the worst payment processors and worst banks will accept me.

As long as the marijuana industry continues to have legal issues which make it difficult for marijuana vendors to process payments, there will be opportunities for alternative payment systems such as potcoin.  If you want potcoin to become popular and valuable, then don't hope/pray for 100% legal marijuana.  100% legal marijuana = no need for potcoin

It is hard to not bite. One requires great self control. He is a master of his arts. The perfect blend of ignorance and stupidity. You can't help but wanna reach through the screen and slap him.

I do agree with you. Although the reddit and the actual potcoin forums, potcoinjoint.com are always open as well.

Just a reminder:



Also, I am giving out free cake and hugs to miners mining on CripToe.com!

-Fuse

What does this have to do with potcoin? There are forums to discuss marijuana and everything revolving around it. This isn't the one. That weirdo ViceRoy is just trying to kick up dust and ruin potcoin. Folks should stop responding to him and feeding him.

Feeding trolls is never good.

Likewise, you would be wrong to think that dispensaries in Colorado and Washington are legal.

"without the blessing of the state".  That's funny.  DEA does not need any blessing of any state.
In fact, DEA already has a division near Denver. Appears they are still doing arrests/seizures related to the controlled substance act.

http://www.justice.gov/dea/divisions/den/2014/den042814.shtml
"The superseding indictment includes an asset forfeiture allegation, which includes the firearms possessed by Diaz, and the money derived from the unlawful activity, namely the cultivation, manufacture and distribution of marijuana, a Schedule I controlled substance."

http://www.dailycamera.com/boulder-county-news/ci_24570303/feds-raiding-denver-area-marijuana-operations-including-couple
"Department of Justice spokesman Jeff Dorschner didn't provide details about the investigation, but he said he could state "unequivocally" that the actions were consistent with federal guidelines issued earlier this year that marijuana businesses operating in compliance with their states' laws and not tied to other criminal activity would not be targeted for enforcement."
"Boulder County Assessor's Office records show three marijuana-related businesses at that address: Swiss Medical Industries, Boulder Sweet Grass and Greenhill Investments. It was not clear whether all three businesses were the target of search warrants or just one or two."
"County records indicate all three hold licenses for marijuana grow operations; Greenhill also holds a license for manufacture of infused products."

Medical Marijuana Raids: A Thing of the Past?
http://www.cannalawblog.com/medical-marijuana-raids/

"As you can see, the Amendment says nothing about raids, arrests, crackdowns, or any of the myriad other evils so many commentators seem to believe the Amendment would fix. Rather, the Amendment weakly forbids expending federal funds to stop the implementation of state MMJ law. Sullum correctly points out that stopping implementation is a much different thing than stopping arrests or investigations:"
"…if the Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA) arrests a patient in Colorado for growing marijuana and the U.S. attorney prosecutes him, that does not, strictly speaking, ‘prevent’ that state from ‘implementing’ its law decriminalizing cultivation of cannabis for medical use. The DEA and the U.S. attorney are enforcing the federal ban on marijuana; they are not compelling Colorado to punish behavior its voters have decided to no longer treat as a crime."

I don't need to be able to cite a specific law to know that marijuana cannot be sent through the royal canadian post.  I pointed to an article where clearly doing such would be wrong.  Feel free to look up the code if you feel the need.

Further, selling seeds is illegal everywhere.

Further, you can argue whatever you want but you would be wrong to think what is going on in Colorado will end because a book in the library of congress includes wording that calls this experiment illegal.  The DEA is NOT coming into Colorado without the blessing of the state.  And they are no longer shutting down the bank accounts either, in fact new banks are coming online every day.

You must have missed this article: "Justice Dept. won't challenge state marijuana laws"
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/08/29/justice-medical-marijuana-laws/2727605/

By your logic, a business which pays local and state taxes, while not paying federal taxes, may be legal.
WRONG!  Even if the tax department sends you a letter which states "we won't bother you", it does not exempt you from existing tax rules/laws.
In general, a simple letter from an authority is not sufficient to legally exempt the recipient of that letter from existing laws.
Reason why the US department of justice does not interfere in Colorado marijuana businesses is because the attorney general was appointed by Pres. Obama who has instructed his subordinates to not interfere or reduce interference with illegal marijuana businesses.  If marijuana dispensaries obtained all US, state, and local permits and obeyed the terms of those permits, there would be little or no debate about legal issues.  There would be no risk of interference from federal authorities.

If US congress would remove Cannabis from the controlled substance act, then you could legitimately argue that US marijuana businesses are not legally required to obtain a US permit.
However, that has not happened.  At the US federal level, all that has happened is a momentary change in enforcement, not a fundamental change in legality.

Currently only a very small number of high risk banks are openly accepting marijuana businesses.  If state-regulated marijuana business were 100% legal, then all or almost all US banks would accept such businesses.  There are many entities in the US, such as hospitals, which work with controlled substances.  The difference between a hospital and a marijuana dispensary is that hospitals comply with all laws while, in general, dispensaries do not.  I never heard of a hospital which had problems opening a bank account because it prescribes and/or dispenses controlled substances.  Why? because, in general, hospitals normally comply with the US controlled substance act.

What do you know about cannabis laws in Canada?
Seems to me, both of us are ignorant about Canadian cannabis laws, yet you are so certain laws are violated.
Even though I know little about Canadian cannabis laws, my observation is the situation is similar to Colorado and Washington, which is, there seems to be a lack of law enforcement.

When you claim that Canadian cannabis merchants are violating laws, you ought to cite exactly which laws are being violated.
When you claim that a list of cannabis merchants are a cartel, you ought to explain why.  At least define "cartel".

Appears that this site is where US cannabis manufactures, distributers, and dispensaries can apply for a permit in regards to the US controlled substance act.

http://www.deadiversion.usdoj.gov/online_forms_apps.html

RiverRock should get a US permit if they want to be 100% legal.

River Rock's blog.

http://riverrockcompliancecorner.wordpress.com/2013/05/13/regulatory-and-criminal-options-in-medical-cannabis-control/

Federal Response

A review of the criminal law relating to marijuana leaves no room for doubt that state medical marijuana laws are of minimal consequence to federal courts and federal prosecutors. Notwithstanding, U.S. Attorneys are not without guidance and certain critical prosecutorial interests have been identified.(11) In practice, choice of forum remains a strategic and policy exercise predicated by enforcement priorities and political shifts.

Most recently in reaction to legitimate concerns expressed by many as to the direct or indirect effect of medical cannabis laws on youth, the Colorado U.S.Attorney has begun enforcement of 21USC § 860 (12) as it relates to the medical marijuana businesses exempted from the 1000 foot setback requirement of the CMMC.(13)

Despite federal supremacy, Coloradoʼs police powers to regulate the health, economic and social welfare of its people (14) are an important consequences of federal system. Though its powers are broad, the federal government cannot eliminate the independent lawmaking authority of states. No kind of conduct is categorically beyond the boundaries of state or federal jurisdiction. The overlapping power of state and federal government promotes plurality, dialogue and offers a myriad of criminal and regulatory options for medical marijuana control.

POT (Preloaded POTcard ) bought through Paypal...hell Yes!!
Awesome news yet again!

Banks ARE able to do business with dispensaries and they DO do business with dispensaries.  RiverRock has a bank account.  Only a few national banks are hesitant to take accounts, several banks in Denver have dispensary clients.

http://www.vegasinc.com/business/2014/jun/11/las-vegas-bank-eager-do-business-would-be-marijuan/

We all need to get down off the ledge. The legalization experiment in Colorado is in its infancy - the outcome is yet to be determined.

Could the DEA storm in, yes. Will they? Only after the experiment has gone obviously wrong and the systems and controls put in place in Colorado are in a state of failure and are ineffective. RiverRock can exist today because the citizens of Colorado have chosen to legalize. And even though the Federal Law is still in place the US Federal Government is not going to cross that bridge and encroach on states rights.

Banks are being held by completely ridiculous standards and expectations of proof and traceability. Standards that do not exist for other highly cash based businesses. In the meantime the experiment needs to play out and prove itself.  Once it proves to be efficient and proves the controls and process can be managed as designed, I can see where things will stabilize and banks will be able to do business with dispensaries like any other business.

 

Actually your interpretation is all wrong.  RiverRock and 500 other dispensaries in Colorado are exercising their right to civil disobedience.  Further, the Govenor of the state CONDONES this activity.  Further, the Department of Justice has SPECIFICALLY stated through a letter penned by David Cole that they will not interfere in our state regulated industry.  Further, the Republican led house recently voted to de-fund the DEA in all states where medical marijuana is legal.  Further, banks DO accept the accounts (per news releases linked to in this thread), there are several companies implementing token based systems using ATM machines and there is an effort within Colorado to provide co-op's as banks.

The seed dealers and weed mailers, on the other hand, are following no known law nor are they working within any type of government program or any type of regulating system.  These people, the outsiders, are what we insiders CONTINUE to call drug dealers.  In Colorado we follow laws and regulations.... this isn't some game.  RiverRock is NOT a criminal entity.

RiverRock is an illegal business in the United States, same as all other Colorado marijuana businesses which lack permission from federal authorities.  Tomorrow morning, the US drug enforcement agency can go to Colorado and Washington and start making arrests and seizures.  Only thing stopping them is in the current man in the white house.  Banks won't openly accept marijuana businesses because they know such businesses are currently illegal.